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Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Tortilla Maker posted:

I have a last name in my family tree of "Merinam". But this was a Spanish-speaking priest transcribing the name as he was hearing it.

For reference, he wrote "Turill" for what appears to be "Terrell".

Anyone have any suggestions on what English/Irish surname could possibly be close to "Merinam" in pronunciation? [Well, as close as Thu-reel is to Ter-rel]

Possibly Merin/Marin or Merina/Marina, if he was writing in Latin the -en and -am suffixes are latinization of Anglican names. Like Martinus for Martin and what have you. Google translate suggests Merino.

Here's a big ol' list of Latinized names and their Anglican counterparts.

quote:

Marriage can be slightly different: if the name ends in “a” the ending becomes “am”
Johannes nupsit Annam : John married Anne
Jacobus nupsit Brigittam : Jacob (James) married Bridget
(Yes, this is for Irish records but Catholic means universal so yay Latin).

Here's a list of Merin variations in Irish records, just for funsies.
How far back a record we talkin here?

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Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Powaqoatse posted:

Also I've been cleaning up a thing I wrote earlier, it's looking pretty spiffy even if I do say so myself.






This looks awesome by the way! Can I con bribe cajole you into doing a book for me too someday when I get organized enough to have all my poo poo together to publish it in some kind of format (lol nevar)?

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Powaqoatse posted:

Man, someone on geni.com has put up some really small low-res headshots of some of my direct ancestors that I don't have any photos of myself. I wrote her originally in 2014 asking for copies, and she told me she just moved and would get back to me when she'd settled in, but she hasn't :cry: :cry: I've checked back a couple of times since but I'm afraid she's blowing me off.

At least I've saved the crappy small photos but God I wish I could get the full sized ones.

Check pay sites like ancestry, chances are those aren't the only copies out there. I'll snag'm for you if they're available.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Nice! Let this be a lesson to others: PICK THOSE OLD PEOPLE BRAINS WHILE YOU'VE GOT THEM. Once they're gone a LOT of that knowledge is too. And while some of their brains might be going, the older the memories the sharper, it seems, so even the Alzheimer's riddled can be helpful (if a bit unreliable). And get a DNA sample while you're at it.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Everything seems to stop online after 1792 because in 1789 they stopped doing provinces (officially, unofficially everyone still used them, think everyone calling the Sears Tower in Chicago the Sears Tower still even after it was bought by whoever the hell bought it) and started calling them departments and changed all the boundaries because they thought their descendants jobs would be way too loving easy otherwise, lol joke's on you for having French ancestors who didn't have the good sense to relocate to the new world where overzealous Catholic priests kept copious records in multiple places that weren't overrun by wars every few decades.
See this helpful yet eye-crossing map:


Also 1792 is when civil records were mandated to be kept by the government. Not that the priests still weren't doing it in France, just the civil records were separate from the parish records after then so sometimes if you can't find a record in one place you can try in another, you may have to settle for only ever knowing the baptismal date instead of birthdate of said ancestor if the civil are gone though. Basically anything pre-1900 will be in the departmental archives and anything after will be in the whatever city hall and those will like as not NOT be online. Also records younger than 100 years are confidential except to direct line descendants. Those that survived World War II, World War I, The War of 1871, Napoleon's multiple back and forths... you get the drift.

Here's a link (hope you read French) that'll help you see which departments records are online by department.

You'll likely want to read this to start with, though its a bite dated what with no longer being able to order microfilm from the lds archives. The familysearch wiki is a great place to begin figuring out where to begin for whatever country/timeline/etc and what might be missing and why, and the familysearch.org website is where all their records will eventually end up.

So basically, if you don't know the province/department, canton, arondissement etc you need to figure those out. To do that, you need a community/village/place name (which will also change over the years because WHY NOT), then you need to know around the time said family was living there, THEN you need to check which arrondisement said community was a part of at the time you're looking at (which changed quite a bit over the years, let's just ignore Alsace-Lorraine for the moment because lol what a clusterfuck that place is, we'll just say I feel your pain as I have a Des Jardins who married into a German line and the name Moselle keeps coming up) THEN you can start digging through drunken half-literate priest handwriting in Old French which will occasionally switch to equally poor German if you're lucky ISN'T THIS HOBBY FANFUCKINGTASTIC I MEAN WHY DOESN'T EVERYONE WANT TO LEARN TWO DOZEN KEYWORDS IN TEN DIFFERENT LANGUAGES AND SPEND THEIR LIVES TRYING TO DECIPHER lovely ARCHAIC HANDWRITING.

Also, France doesn't allow genetic testing for recreational purposes so that's great too gently caress YOU FRANCE WHAT ARE YOU AFRAID OF NOT BEING AS GALLIC AS YOU THINK YOU ARE.

Sorry. I may have a bit of residual hostility for French research after having such a babystep easy time of it on the Canadian side.

Oracle fucked around with this message at 04:14 on Oct 8, 2017

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

They do that a LOT re: age. If he married a younger woman he might want to make himself look younger. Women who are older than their husbands will do that. Women who marry later in life (later being relative to the time) will do that. Some guys will age themselves up as they get older because everyone talks about the 100 year old man, not so much the 88 or 92 year old. If they had to be say 25 to claim a homestead in the West and they're only 18 who cares what's the difference I'm already 6'2" and been putting in a hard days' work in the fields since I was 15, stuff like that. Or they just plain didn't care as much about age because who can really remember when one of your fifteen kids was born especially if you're not literate and you have no reason to absolutely have to know how old they are.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Yay Sweden! Maybe I can finally figure out who the father was of my darn great-great-whatever grandfather.

Owlkill, you can check out this link:

quote:

Witnesses can be a valuable aid to linking a marriage to your family, but one thing to watch out for is that often a churchwarden would act as a witness when nobody else was available. This usually shows up by one named person witnessing many marriages or, as in the case above, by the addition of the title 'Clerk'. However, it can be misleading when the churchwarden had the same surname as your family and an easy way to check is to look at the next few pages of the book just to make sure that the witness is not the churchwarden.

Under Hardwick's Act, banns were made compulsory and licences were only valid for a specific church. From 1823, banns had to be read in both the bride and groom's parish where they were different. Addresses of residence in the marriage entry are rare before the early 1800s, and where shown can be misleading. Often one address for both parties was given so as to avoid the need to pay for two lots of banns - i.e. one in the groom's parish, and one in the bride's.

Basically anyone could be a witness, family members were common (siblings, aunts and uncles, godparents sometimes, in-laws, cousins, the parents of the bride and/or groom) but it could also be good friends or even whoever was standing around at the time, the clerk, person cleaning the church, whatever. Check that link out it may well help especially since most people got married within 15-30 miles of where they were born. Witnesses could also be minors. It was also common for the parish clerk and whoever else could actually sign their names to be witnesses to the witnesses, so to speak, i.e. I certify this X is so-and-so's mark. So sometimes you may have four witnesses' signatures.

Also knowing whether it was a marriage by license can help as well, as with a license record you know it was not their home parish they were getting married in. See here. People would do this who were traveling and met their spouse in a different place, or who wanted to avoid the cost of having banns read, or who were eloping. Also everyone was required to marry in a Church of England except Jews and Quakers, so if you're looking for a Catholic couple's marriage record before 1837 check in the nearest CofE.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Yeah I just saw that was going to say something. Of course its the weekend I have plans all weekend of COURSE it is.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

God I wish I could just waltz over to my local archives and find poo poo from the 1700s on my direct family line. Maybe if I lived in Canada I could pull that off. Oh for 5th ggpa to be my shortest line.

Anyway, Powaqoatse posts are why I encourage everyone to get DNA tested and get those results up on as many sites as you can think of, not just the one you tested on. FTDNA and MyHeritage have a lot more European members than ancestry does. I dunno bout 23&Me yet but I'm going to find out, I think.

There are a TON of Black Friday sales coming up next week, and the Monday after is known as Cyber Monday and there will deals on there too. DNA tests are going on sale (23&Me has a buy two for 49/ea and free shipping right now) Ancestry is usually on sale for 69 at this time, FTDNA usually follows suit, and either of those can be uploaded to GedMatch and MyHeritage. Ancestry can also be uploaded to FTDNA but not vice-versa (ancestry does not allow any uploads currently). 23&Me's newest test doesn't play well with gedmatch yet, but I think there's a beta version in the Tier I tools that works with it and it will trickle down to production eventually.

Links:
FTDNA $59 from now til New Year's
Ancestry DNA 69 dollars and free shipping, watch for Black Friday deals though.
23 And Me (49 dollars each for two or more, 199 for one and health reports)
My Heritage DNA $59

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Not the same just judging from the style of dress and the time frame it'd have to be. That drop shoulder style was early-mid-1860s (often referred to as Civil War style in the U.S.) Honestly it looks more like the same dress in the first picture especially with that rather distinctive necklace, unless that was a common part of some national dress that everyone wore that I am unaware of. Is it an original or do you know what the original was printed on (e.g. paper, tintype) That could help date it.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Also, all your DNA deals for Black Friday can be found here and that includes Canada Europe and Australian deals! 49 buck tests from FTDNA and 23&Me! Lowest price yet! Go see!!

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

God you make me feel like such a slacker. Some day I too will make all the data pretty and readable just like on Finding Your Roots in a big ol' binder.

In the meantime I was up til almost 3 last night trying to finish yet another McCarthy line, I swear the drat Sullivans/O'Learys/MacCarthy's all intertwine so drat much they must've all known each other back in Cork/Kerry, they MUST HAVE I WILL FIND YOU YOU ELUSIVE MICK BASTARDS STOP HIDING THERE'S LIKE 40,000 OF YOU IN THIS drat COUNTRY ALL FROM THE SAME COUNTY STOP NAMING ALL YOUR KIDS DENIS/CORNELIUS/MICHAEL/TIMOTHY/ELLEN/VARIATIONS ON MARY ANN!!

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Powaqoatse posted:

To be fair, I based most of my writeup on stuff I've found over the last 15 years of active genealogying. I just wanted to put some more stuff around the photos I had found so it wasn't just a sheet of paper. Started out adding a little tree to show the relationships, then decided to write up some curious details I had noticed & eventually it was 15 pages :)

But yeah I think that's a sound hypothesis. People who knew each other back home or came from the same area were way more likely to marry than marrying some random person who wasn't from the old count(r)y

Well I know its true for at least some of them based on records and wills, where one dude talks about how they all came over 20+ years ago as a group and then brought over brothers etc. Now if I could just find from exactly WHERE and exactly WHEN argh (and also if every 4th person didn't have the same name in the county and the baptismal record scans were legible and and and)

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Like early 1800s when records are scarce especially for poor Catholics (fire destroyed a lot of census records in Ireland during the Revolution). Also they all named their goddamn kids the same thing. Denis, Cornelius, Thomas, Timothy etc etc. And being Catholic they all had a bajillion kids to the point where they'd run out of names and use the SAME NAME AGAIN FOR ANOTHER KID BORN 20 YEARS AFTER THE FIRST ONE OF THAT NAME BECAUSE WHY THE HELL NOT. Like the guy wasn't even dead they just decided what the hell let's have another loving Cornelius.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Jaguars! posted:

Apparently a lot of Irish families followed this convention:
http://homepages.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~cregan/patterns.htm
It certainly makes for a lot of repetitive firstnames.

Yeah, Prussians had something similar only with the added bonus of a 'saint's name' that every kid of the same gender had as their first name. So it would appear every boy had the first name Johann and every girl was Maria. Then they'd do the mom's mom/dad's dad thing, throw in a few more names for good measure, and then let the kids pick which names they went by, which would of course never be what the priest wrote down or what was used legally, unless one wasn't paying attention and just wrote down whatever they were told, which is how one guy was Michael Weiss in one record and Joshua Weiss in another and Adam Weiss in a third. You could tell it was the same dude because his wife had FIVE GIVEN NAMES and by god, you wrote down every single one of those fuckers whenever you referred to her. It was something like Ulrike Annika Maria Sophia Laura Ahrens. Even on her death certificate. She must've been some kind of terror.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Oh! Another naming convention I noticed was giving the kid the names of their baptismal sponsors, so Maria Sophia Margarita would be named Maria after the saint, then her sponsors as listed would be Sophia whoever and Margarita so and so. Girls sponsors would be girls and boys would be male. This seemed to have gotten less common further into the 19th century but earlier records you can bank on it. Now if I only knew if the sponsors were also family members or just friends...

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Brennanite posted:

I saw a dispute on an ancestry tree that said "Jean couldn't possibly be the father since he was born in 1811." I almost fell out of my chair laughing. Literally every male in the family had Jean as their saint's name. Have you seen where they move the saint's name to the end? Like, the baptismal record reads "Marie Anne Catherine" but they're buried under "Anne Catherine Marie." It seems to show up with increased contact with the English.

I have seen every goddamn permutation known to man, I think. Its like even the parish priests know they have too goddamn many names and just throw them in whatever order however they remember it (with the aforementioned badass xth great-grandma who made drat sure they got it right EVERY time even after her death the exception).

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Brennanite posted:

Has anyone had any luck ordering death certificates? My mom wants me to use it as a launching pad for getting my grandmother's hospital and mortuary records.
What state? And I don't know that you'll be able to get hospital records. I don't even know if they keep those past a certain period of time. Also keep in mind when ordering them that you don't necessarily need a notarized copy unless you're trying to do something legal with them like get an inheritance or whatever, as those tend to cost more and take longer. Some states like Michigan (https://www.seekingmichigan.org) have all of them from around 1898-1952 that they currently have online for free, though their search engine could use some work.

quote:

Edit: Oracle, your post is a lot funnier now that I've tracked a woman whose name is never the same on any document. Baptismal name was Marie Aimee Scholastique and she's Scholastique on her marriage record, Marie on the first census, Widow Husband's Name on the next one, then Mrs. Second Husband's Name, Solastie First Husband's Surname, and finally Aimee Second Husband's Surname. No wonder we can't figure out where she's buried.
Right? Its funny cuz its SO GODDAMN TRUE.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Do you have subscriptions anywhere? If no PM me with the relevant info and I'll see if its on one of the big two.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

ComradeCosmobot posted:

Christine in particular might be findable from children who lost her original surname as their mother’s maiden name upon marriage. But here, you’d need some idea of where Christine may have gotten married.
Also keep in mind that she may have Anglicized her last name so that it was the same as her father's instead of the patronymic (people apparently got real het up about your surname not matching your father's as it had a whiff of illegitimacy). All my Swedish female relatives did this, and on the death certs that's how their father's names appear.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

I know you can do it in Rootsmagic fairly straightforwardly yeah but you need some kind of software. Or just enter it by hand into a new tree I guess.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

HELLS YEAH!

Man why can't our government do cool poo poo like that (well ok they already have with a lot of records like a LOT mostly it's stupid states being stupid and greedy with their records)

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Genealogy sometimes come in handy in the real world. Like when you repeatedly own racist congresscritters who want to limit 'chain migration' by showing how they themselves wouldn't be here without it.

https://twitter.com/CleverTitleTK/status/951830248794087425?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2018/jan/12/trump-pence-migration-records

quote:

Like millions of other Americans, Trump owes his existence to ancestors on both sides of his family having been allowed to travel from Europe to join relatives who had already settled in the US.

In October 1885, Trump’s grandfather, Friedrich Trump, arrived in Manhattan as a “gangly 16-year-old boy” fleeing poverty and military service in Germany to live with his sister Katherine, according to Gwenda Blair’s book The Trumps: Three Generations of Builders and a Presidential Candidate.

“Friedrich Trump was not going to be alone,” Blair writes. “His oldest sister had immigrated to New York a year earlier, at 23. There she joined her fiancé, a shipping clerk from Kallstadt … He had come to America after two older cousins set up a wine business in New York City.” Another Trump sister, Louise, later followed her siblings from Germany to the US.

So Dan. Let's say Victor Scavino arrives from Canelli, Italy in 1904, then brother Hector in 1905, brother Gildo in 1912, sister Esther in 1913, & sister Clotilde and their father Giuseppe in 1916, and they live together in NY. Do you think that would count as chain migration?

— Jennifer Mendelsohn (@CleverTitleTK) January 11, 2018


https://blog.eogn.com/2015/11/13/think-your-immigrant-ancestors-came-here-legally-think-again/ (This is how a bunch of my dad's side got here, literally just wandered over from Canada into Michigan. Course parts of that line had been back and forth from Detroit to Montreal since the 1700s so screw your borders).

quote:

An article by Brian Donohue, recently re-published in the NJ.com web site, will interest many genealogists, especially in light of the political issues in the Presidential campaigns that are receiving a lot of publicity lately. Donahue points out that a high percentage of America’s immigrants have arrived illegally for the past 150 years or more. Most of them stayed, raised families, and the immigrants and their descendants have contributed greatly to America’s industrial might, military strength, culture, and more.

Oracle fucked around with this message at 21:46 on Jan 12, 2018

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

I find a John Buckley who's listed as a smith from London, England arriving in New York on 10 March 1860 on the Devonshire. He's listed as age 25 which would put him at the right age as well. His destination is just 'U.S.'
Source Citation
Year: 1860; Arrival: New York, New York; Microfilm Serial: M237, 1820-1897; Microfilm Roll: Roll 199; Line: 10; List Number: 150

There's another John Buckley from Great Britain listed as a laborer leaving Liverpool who's going to Hartford, CT (big whaling town at the time) 28 Sep 1855 on the Ashburton. Single male 21.

I will note that Chebanse is only 68 miles from Chicago and was a stop on the railroad on the way from Chicago (first stop after Kankakee) as of 1854. There is a John B Buckley in Chebanse on the 1860 census, (taken in August of 1860) living with a woman Mary same last name (no marital status given - his wife?) and listed as a landlord (the Carter House Hotel aka the Carter Hotel built in 1857) who has several tenants. He is in fact the only John Buckley I can find in the 1860 census in Illinois born in England near that year (lots from Ireland though!)

Another interesting tidbit: King Edward VII of England visited Chebanse on a hunting expedition in 1860 while touring the U.S. and Canada.

quote:

In 1860 the Prince of Wales, who was later King Edward VII and other English nobility stayed at the hotel in Chebanse and hunted in the vast surrounding prairie as wildlife was abundant and stories of the plentiful game brought distinguished visitors. It was said, 'The ducks and geese were so thick sometimes they blotted out the sun.')
So yeah, your nth great-uncle may have entertained royalty (the Carter Hotel was the only hotel in town). Holy poo poo. Looking around online it looks like he came to the U.S. in Sept 1860 and went from Canada into Detroit down to Chicago:

quote:

On September 20, they boarded a ferry at Windsor and entered the United States at Detroit. The prince was met by the mayor, Michigan governor, and 30,000 boisterous Americans, some of whom rushed onto the boat, forcing members of the royal party overboard. (Oracle's note: stay classy, Detroit!) So many well-wishers poured into the streets of Detroit that the royal procession had difficulty moving through the city.

In Chicago, an even larger crowd of 50,000 greeted Edward. The continual cheering outside his window compelled him to appear on the balcony of his hotel room. When the stress of the trip caused the prince to suffer from headaches, it was arranged for him to spend a few days hunting at a rural lodge nearby.

Another place to check is findagrave.com. I took the liberty of looking for any Buckleys buried in Chebanse and found two: Ida and Thomas Buckley. Was John's wife's maiden name by chance Breatherton? Because if so I believe I found some relatives for you (read the obits attached to the record, click on 'view original').
I have driven through Chebanse, its right along I-57 which follows the railroad that has been there since 1854 and is still in service, its a main interstate to Chicago from the south. It is a teeny tiny little spot on the map even now maybe 1000 people live there, farming community. On the previous link to Chebanse you will notice the line:

quote:

1861: Civil War quota for Chebanse doubled in error, not rectified
I wonder if maybe this is why there were two muster records? Though I do note that further down the record for the Chebanse Civil War a local man is listed as having served in the 12th Cavalry in the notes. So this might have been a list drawn up to satisfy the doubled quota and included men already gone? Not sure.


If you look at the history of the 12th Illinois cavalry you'll note that it was made up of several companies and several companies were consolidated within it due to attrition or whatever during the course of its existence. John B Buckley from Chicago is listed as being part of Company C (consolidated) and was enlisted by a Lt. Conroe as spelled out here: http://www.ilsos.gov/isaveterans/civilMusterSearch.do?key=33129 In fact I went through every drat John Buckley from Illinois who was mustered into the Union army on that site and most of them were native born or from Ireland, there are two records for John B but neither mentions he was from Iroquois Co. one says he signed up in Cook the other doesn't say just says he was discharged for disability in 1865 as you mentioned.

Just for fun here's a history of the Illinois 12th Cavalry (Civil War records are extensive in the U.S. and you can basically follow step by step where your great-uncle may have been and what he may have been doing to get that disability. Illness like cholera was rampant, wounds would get infected, etc etc so it could have been in battle or otherwise. For the 12th, 38 enlisted men killed and mortally wounded and 4 officers and 192 enlisted men by disease). The relevant time period:

quote:

On the evening of the 28th of November, the Regiment reached Chicago, and was received from first to last with one grand burst of patriotic admiration and enthusiasm.

At the conclusion of the brief season of rest the Regiment, which had been recruited up to the maximum number of 1,256 officers and men, re-assembled at Camp Fry. On the 9th of February 1864, the Regiment started for St. Louis, and went into camp there. Early in March it embarked on transports for New Orleans, and shortly after arriving there was ordered to join General Banks, on his retreat down the Red River. It participated in the different engagements of the retreat, losing a large number of men. Subsequently the Regiment was returned to New Orleans, and ordered to do picket duty on the Lafurtche, from Donaldsonville to Thibodeaux, La., continuing on this line during the summer.

In the early part of September the Regiment was ordered to report to General Lee, commanding the Cavalry Division at Baton Rouge, when it was actively employed in scouting and picket duty. In the early part of November the Twelfth (then brigaded with the Second Illinois Cavalry, the Brigade commanded by Colonel Davis) and other cavalry Regiments under General Lee, made an expedition to Liberty, Miss., where they had a severe action, driving the enemy and capturing a number of prisoners, cannon and small arms. Lieutenant Colonel Dix, in charge of the outposts, repulsed several attacks of the enemy. Subsequently the Regiment participated in General Davidson's expedition against Mobile; returned to Baton Rouge on the 7th of January 1865; went up the river to Memphis, joining General Osband's Division. In the latter part of January, the Twelfth was a part of a raiding party through southeastern Arkansas. Returning to Memphis, it did scouting and picket duty until June, when it was ordered to join General Custer's Cavalry Division, at Alexandria, La. From there it marched with the Division to Hempstead, Tex., at which place it remained until sometime in September, when it marched to Houston, to Major General Mowet. From this time to the final mustering out the Regiment, distributed in detachments, was actively employed in guard and escort duty.

While at Memphis the Twelfth Cavalry was consolidated into an 8 company organization, and the Fourth Cavalry, having previously been consolidated into a Battalion of 5 companies, was consolidated with the Twelfth Cavalry.

The Regiment was mustered out at Houston, Tex., on the 29th of May 1866, and arrived at Springfield on the 14th of June, and on the 18th, it received final pay and discharge.
So it looks like he was at least in Memphis since its mentioned he was consolidated into Company C in the record. He may have received his disability injury during raids in Arkansas or on scouting duty or previous and it just acted up then.

They wrote a whole dang book on the 12th Cavalry and here's a fun tidbit:

quote:

So great was the regiment's contribution to the Union victory that a monument at Gettysburg honors the unit for its place "in the first line of battle."

I think I found your ancestry page, and looking at that probate record I'm going to guess the probate court did what everyone else does for all the little podunk towns/suburbs/etc around Chicago and just said your ancestor was from Chicago instead of Chebanse. Or maybe he died there in a disabled veteran's care home or something (lots of these popped up after the Civil War).

Edited to add: poo poo I totally forgot about the penisioners files. They’re available on familysearch, see if his wife or kid didn’t try to get a widows and orphans pension from the government for his service. They would have had to provide reams of paperwork to prove their relationship.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:33SQ-GT5K-Y3B?i=1382&cc=1919699
Looks like Chebanse Mary did apply. Use the number of the application in that link to find out more (like whether or not it’s really him)

quote:

After locating an ancestor in the Civil War Pension Index, researchers are urged to request a copy of the case file referred to by the index.
According to the National Archives, "...the number and type of documents in the Civil War and later series vary greatly from file to file; they are often numerous. The documents of greatest genealogical interest include the declaration of the veteran, the declaration of the widow, the statement of service from the War or Navy Department, the personal history questionnaire, and documents relating to the termination of pensions."
Photocopies of case file contents can be requested by submitting NATF Form 85 to the National Archives and Records Administration, Attn: NWCTB, 700 Pennsylvania Avenue, NW, Washington, D.C. 20408-0001. You can request NATF Form 85 by submitting your name and postal address, the form number (NATF Form 85), and the number of forms you require (limit 6 per request) to inquire@nara.gov. Pension case files can now be ordered online as well. Visit the National Archives’ website for details

More info: J B Buckley returns to Chebanse according to the 1865 Illinois state census. Fathers a few children. https://search.ancestry.com/cgi-bin/sse.dll?indiv=1&dbid=1079&h=675045&tid=&pid=&usePUB=true&_phsrc=NgG6861&_phstart=successSource
By 1870, Mary Buckley is living alone in Chebanse with four kids, James (from her first marriage to George Carter, owner of the Carter Hotel, you can see him listed as James Carter age 2 in the 1860 census) Thomas (on find a grave) Richard, and Ida (also on findagrave). John B is not found.

Oracle fucked around with this message at 18:52 on Jan 18, 2018

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Owlkill, everybody was a farmer in that era and area. It was like what you did in addition to whatever else you did. Shopkeepers also had a plot of land to farm on (you could either feed your livestock by growing hay or sell it, cheaper than buying it) and to homestead you had to also farm the land. Its Illinois, big wide flat rock free land with rich soil. You farm that poo poo, its like leaving money on the sidewalk if you don't.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Also this guide is handy if you like playing around on gedmatch and have never actually had any idea what the various admixture tools were for.

Also I got my first homework phone call last night from my niece who wanted to know about immigration in our family line. She asked about a great-grandfather. I asked her how far back she was supposed to go. She said as far as she could. I cracked my knuckles and grinned. "Does it have to be immigration to the U.S. or does Canada count? What if they came before the U.S. existed?"





Sadly she only needed three. :( And wanted to include a German who came over much much later.

Oracle fucked around with this message at 17:07 on Jan 23, 2018

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

The Micronesian is probably just some of that archaic DNA, Dick Trauma. I had Finnish in my background also, apparently there were 'forest Finns' who went to Sweden to live in the forests and basically be Swedish rednecks.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Well drat, now that's a story Krispy Wafer!

Dead grandmas are just repositories of information. We found photocopied handwritten notes in my grandmother's basement dating from the 80s from some distant cousin or other that fill three ring binder a solid inch and a half thick and so far DNA has confirmed all this lady's research (and that my family is hella faithful I think I've DNA confirmed back to like 4th great-grandparents on all sides that I can get back that far). Mostly farmers, farmers everywhere, as far as the eye can see. A few barrelmakers for a winery that died from inhaling sawdust and a hansom cab driver and a coffin maker, but even the coffin maker was a farmer or had kids that were.

Also found an old trunk that belonged to my great-grandmother that has old pictures in it that I have no idea who they are, just what side of the family, need to post those online and see if anyone else knows (yes, I still know several of my 3rd and 4th cousins on several sides, the majority of the family stuck to Michigan. I swear you cannot throw a rock in certain parts of Michigan without hitting one of my cousins. I once had a babysitter that turned out to be a third cousin. This is what happens when your great-grandma is one of 21 and your other side is full of Irish Catholics).

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

quote:

And this just goes to prove what sorts of strange stories you might be able to uncover by contacting your cousins.
yeah it’s a bit of a truism at this point ‘if you can’t go up, go out.’ Which is why I have started tracing every ficking O’Leary in my tree. Some apparently did the Oregon Trail and ended up with a whole branch of the family out there that explained why a distant cousin was listed as dying in Denver when at the time I was like ‘who the gently caress could she have possibly known in Denver in the early 1900s?’ (She was buried back at home in Michigan and was visiting her brother who had stayed with these cousins for a time based on census records. They were all in the lumber industry before they went - you guessed it - farming! We loves us some diggin in the dirt). FYI there are a LOT of loving O’Learys in this goddamn country. How the hell one county in Ireland managed to send like a million people to the U.S. it’s like there must’ve been a baby production line cuz the place is just not that big it would’ve been standing room only.

quote:

My wife did the Ancestry DNA and if you were debating between the two of them, 23&me seems to give more information.
Depends on what information you’re looking for. Ancestry has over 1.5 million DNA tests on record after this last Christmas season. That is one big pond if you’re fishing for relatives. FTDNA does all the mtDNA and Y testing and has a pretty good sampling of northern/Western European users, ditto MyHeritage which also allows free uploads from other companies (FTDNA allows them free now too but to see more than just your first page of matches you need to pay a one time fee, I forget how much but nothing horrible). And of course gedmatch lets you upload anything along with gedcom files and chromosome map and compare as well as do ethnicity poo poo and all for free (triangulation is a Tier 1 subscription but you can pay for just one month up to a year and is pretty cool from what I’ve seen, not jumped into that yet).
I do wish I’d have jumped on that 49 dollar sale 23&Me had running back in December. Found out a first cousin did it and that at least forced me to update all my poo poo to Genesis on gedmatch.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Ok so this is cool.

quote:

Family Genealogy Books Jiapu or Zupu家譜: Although many family genealogy books dating from the 9th to 13th centuries to modern times were destroyed during the Cultural Revolution, families may have handwritten or printed copies either in the ancestral village or brought with them to the United States. The village birthplace and burial site for each male relative may be listed. The books trace the male lineage from the first progenitor to the present. Wives and sometimes daughters were listed, but matriarchal lines were not usually traced.

Those doing Chinese genealogy either get really lucky and go back like 1000+ years if their Jiapu survived and they know their ancestral village or they are SOL because stupid commies.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Or you can just join the facebook group 'Genealogy Translations' and ask them for help.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Krankenstyle posted:

Some writters are incorrigible, though. This page took something like 90 minutes to decipher, some sections requiring 5+ passes:
That's downright beautiful compared to some of the poo poo I've had to wade through.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Dick Trauma posted:

Fffffuck this poo poo.

I'm pleased as punch when I look up a record and find that it was typewritten. :kiddo:

Yeah that's like, every old German record I've ever seen.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

I just got a treasure trove of stuff from my late grandmother's estate courtesy of my aunt. Word's getting around I'm the family historian and people are actually keen on unloading all the old pics and poo poo on me. Thankfully my family's main defining genetic trait on that side is being utter packrats so there's a lot of stuff.

Including this letter my grandma saved from my grandpa. He sent it to her shortly after Pearl Harbor. He was a 21 year old plumber's apprentice and she was an 18 year old high school student.

quote:

dDearm Marion
Iwill tell you A story
Once upon a time there was aboy and girl they were very much in love
They wanted to get married but before they got around to it WARw was
declared so they decided t o wait till it was all over .
Finely the boy was drafted. So he got the girl an engagement ring
they were very happy of corse they knew that soon they would part
But it would not be for long.The boy wemt to the army all he could.
think of was when he would get back they could get married.
Finely peace was declared, the boy hurried back as soon as he could
he founed a job they were married, before long they had a small
house and famly. they lived many happy years they died happy
grandparents, having two great grandchildren.

well I must close, ihope you liked my story as it may be the only
one Iwill ever write
Yours forever
Bud
PS I love you very much. ################### #
This was typewritten on an actual typewriter at his place of employment after he found out he'd been drafted and mailed to her. He got everything right except he married her while he was back on leave not after the war was over, and he actually had five great-grandchildren at the time of his death. He obviously had never typed anything before. My grandma always said he was the only man she ever loved. He was bomb disposal and hit the beaches D-Day +4 and followed the front basically all the way into Germany. I also got his scrapbook from his time in the military. He was apparently the hero of the unit when he jury-rigged up a hot shower for them using his mad plumber skills.

Oh, and they first went out because she and her girlfriends wanted to go out partying and someone mentioned my grandpa owned a car so they invited him so they'd have a ride. So I guess all those car commercials were telling the truth, dammit.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Oh also Ancestry is having the 69 dollar sale again, 'limited time only' but they keep extending it so I wonder if this is going to be the new price. I've seen it for 59 and its 49 if you go to conferences like RootsWeb (coming up soon) but this is probably reasonable. Also MyHeritage and FTDNA are of course following suit (23&Me might be? Haven't seen anything of late).

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Krankenstyle posted:

Just found out my great grandmas uncle did time in 1890 for beating the crap out of a dude who almost died. Apparently my guy was known as "Headbutter-Larsen" :stare:

Time for a username change! Mods?

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Krankenstyle posted:

Oh yeah! Except the original Danish "Skallesmækker" has a nicer ring to it, but sadly nobody would understand it. :shrug:

Skull-smacker Larsen?

Skullcrusher is a time-honored Anglo name in this vein. Also makes you sound like a professional wrestler ala Hulk Hogan.

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Hey Its St. Paddy's Day and you know what that means!

No, not green beer. DNA tests go on sale!!

Ancestry:$69 (reminder that ancestry does not take transfers from other companies) FREESHIPDNA can get you reduced or free shipping as a coupon code.
FTDNA:$59 (FTDNA does take transfers from other companies like ancestry and 23&me and MyHeritage)
MyHeritage (new, uses same lab as FTDNA, good for finding European matches):$69 (they will also take uploads from other testing companies)
23&Me:$79 (they will NOT take uploads of raw data from other companies)

Also all Irish records are free all weekend at Ancestry! Woo!

Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Krankenstyle posted:

Man I wanna try it some time but I've read that most of them (except maybe FamilyTreeDNA?) require subscriptions to keep access to your DNA data, do you have info on that?

FamilyTreeDNA requires a one-time fee of 18USD to see your matches and message them (or getting a DNA test through them, they don't really have any records to search like ancestry and their family tree portion is utter poo poo and just a place to upload a gedcom file and any changes you want to make to it require you to re upload said gedcom file after making changes in some other third-party software).

AncestryDNA requires 49 bucks a year to see and message your DNA matches. They allow you to make and keep your tree on there for free (but you won't be able to link any of their sources or see any sources on other people's trees).

MyHeritage allows you to upload and see DNA matches and message them but your public tree can't exceed 250 people without a subscription or you get nasty grams and it no longer is viewable (I think I just let my subscription lapse because I never used their dumb sources and unlimited space and backups include access to their sources and is meh overpriced IMHO)

23&Me is like FTDNA in that’s you get permanent access when you take the test. You have to opt in to sharing your data with close matches, they don’t support family trees on the site, and the database is smaller than Ancestry’s. You can download your raw data. 23&Me also has a global genetics project where if your four biological grandparents are all from the same country you get a free DNA test and all kinds of results on health etc so they can broaden their database. You have to be at least 18 speak read write English and I think reside in the US. Details here.

LivingDNA allows you to upload for free and if you do so before August of this year (I think) you'll be able to see matches for free too so they can build their databases. They also offer a discount on testing if you qualify for any of their various projects wherein they try to refine DNA ethnicity tests to make them more accurate to location (basically if all four of your grandparents were born/are from within 51 miles of each other in various countries, they have a long list, check their website for details its all over it).

Gedmatch.com and gedmatch Genesis are both free to upload both gedcom and raw DNA data files to from just about all the various testing companies but if you want to use their nifty Tier One tools which include triangulation etc. its some amount a month but you can buy just one month's subscription (I want to say its 39 but go check).

Also if you uploaded to gedmatch.com but not genesis, go do that, otherwise you're missing out on finding 23&Me matches from the new chipset that debuted in August 2017. You'll have to remember to periodically check both, though. Genesis site is still in beta officially I think but its a LOT faster and smoother looking.

You can also upload your DNA and trees to wikitree.com for free and it includes the ability mark yourself as a YDNA descendant or MTDNA descendant of whoever you're descended from and your haplogroup etc. Its growing pretty rapidly too someday I will get around to doing that but man you are forced to go through every person on your tree one at a time and correct or mark as duplicate with already existing people and since I have both colonial and French-Canadian roots I have a shitton of duplicates and over 2000 people on my drat tree and fuuuuuuck that.

Oracle fucked around with this message at 21:50 on Mar 17, 2018

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Oracle
Oct 9, 2004

Those are great. I always found letters home interesting, for what they leave out as much as what they write. We have a letter from my great-grandfather's sister in 1952 who had the misfortune of being in Russia-occupied Berlin. It was nuts, I looked it up on google maps and the apartment where my great-grandfather lived before he came to America and his sister's kids' apartments were literally 300 yards from each other but managed to be on opposite sides of the Berlin Wall. Talk about luck. Its written in Sutterlinschrift but I luckily knew a guy in Germany whose grandparents could read it and they translated it for me back in the 90's/early 2000s.
I also have my great-grandmother's alien resident book. If you weren't an American citizen (or if you were and they didn't like your politics, or your travel history or ethnicity or whatever else J. Edgar didn't like) you had to carry it around and show it on demand by any authority. She never wanted American citizenship (she was from Bavaria) or never got around to it or something. Her husband became a citizen and I thought that automatically made the wife (it didn't work for husbands interestingly enough) one too at that point in time but maybe its because she went back to visit in 1936-7. I'd be curious if she ever had a file on her. I should look up the number on the book.

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