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IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Keg posted:

My unfair edge during the Party Poker days was having a huge pokertracker DB mined from a few weeks when I'd just leave a bunch of tables going while importing hands into pokertracker. I think close to when Neteller shut down, Party stopped generating hand histories on tables where you weren't sitting, but until then it was pretty great being able to load up the game and search through a list of people who were absurdly passive and loose.

Those were the golden days.

Sheep-Goats posted:

If you have some experience at poker already and want a solid book to open the door into the modern poker world you can't do better than Small Stakes No Limit Hold'em by Metha and Flynn and one other guy that I always forget.

I seem to recall getting about a chapter into this before they suggest reading Professional No-Limit Hold'em Vol 1, where they talk extensively about putting people on hands and planning hands, they have some name for this that I forget. Is this a necessary read or can noobs pass over this on their road to live or online cash riches? (i.e. Moshman has a book on SNG's that is basically replaced by his student Greg Jones).

Also I found Harrington on Online Cash Games to be super valuable in summarizing what I already knew about positional ranges.

Sheep-Goats posted:

There used to be (maybe still are?) shortstackers who would play 12-20 tables regularly, who had software that would sit them at new tables as they closed open ones, who had Autohotkey set up so instead of clicking a mouse they would hit like 1-5 for fold/call/bet/raise 3x/push or whatever, and would just kind of matrix out while grinding their custom made spreadsheets against the world.

I am reminded of this video

Imaduck posted:

I've heard good things about America's Card Room as well, but I haven't checked it out yet. Bovada's anonymous thing really annoys me, so I'm thinking of making the switch.

So the tournament play here is soft, but I was a little put off when I saw several quad over quad plays in a very small hand sample. I have seen worse, back in like 2007-2009 but it just struck me as odd.




Everyone says good things about Bovada, but I can't justify playing without rakeback. What is the rake structure/volume on MTTs and SNGs there?

Also anyone playing much at Foxwoods or in Chicagoland lately?

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Feb 16, 2017

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IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

bengy81 posted:

Ignition does 10% rake on MTT's. not sure about SNG's.

For what it's worth, they don't usually do more than 1.5 hrs of late reg. and they don't have a million tournies with ridiculous overlay like they did until mid last year.
ACR has way more variety, but Ignition isn't bad .

I've yet to see any quad over quad hands in the last year on either site, so maybe you just have a weird sample. But if you are implying that ACR is rigged than online poker might not be for you.

Sorry, I'm not implying the ACR RNG is rigged, maybe I was just seeing a lot of family pots, or perhaps a little collusion or something of that sort. I just thought the sample was really odd, but again it was a small sample so not really significant. I also find all the automated ACR phonecalls to be more than a bit intrusive and annoying.

I was playing a lot on juicystakes about a year ago and had a pretty sick run for a week playing the microstake wild west tournament type. I would just play my usual style until I hit the end of registration, then I would match the bigstack in 500chip rebuys and an add on and bully the rest of the tournament. I definitely got quite lucky with seating most tourneys, but even during that rungood there was at least one instance at tournament end where I thought the play just seemed really strange, I couldn't tell if it was botty or collusion or dumb luck, maybe I can dig up a few hands if I still have the laptop I was playing on lying around somewhere. The best part was winning in spite of this. Unfortunately they don't run these tournaments under the same buyin structure anymore, the cost is more prohibitive to playing profitably in this way and also no one registers for it. I also read on pokerscout or 2+2 or somewhere recently juicy instituted some strange restrictions on withdrawals (needing to rake a certain ratio of your winnings in order to withdraw), can anyone validate this? Do people still play on Carbon?



Sheep-Goats posted:

Everything is skippable if you already know it. If you want to know if it's worth your time because you're already a ways along in what you know about poker I'd suggest finding a copy somewhere and reading the chapter on Stack to Pot Ratio. If that material is familiar maybe that book isn't the best use of your time.

If you're picking up poker for the first time ever in 2017 I think it's going to be worth your time one way or another but I remember your avatar from old poker threads so I don't think this is the case for you.

Thanks for the thoughtful answer considering my background. To clarify I was asking on behalf of newish players. i didn't do multiple reads or study the cash game material thoroughly as i did MTT or SNG material, i just read SSNHLE PNLHE and Harrington Cash and Online Cash books once and tried to internalize the play and remembered feeling like things seemed incomplete in places, SSNLHE specifically stuck out to me, but maybe because it came out more recently.

So better put, as a new player, my questions should have been: Can I read SSNLHE without reading PNLHE V.1 also by Metha, or would skipping over PNLHE V.1 be a mistake?

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 20:40 on Feb 16, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

I think it provides a good model for how to think analytically about something in poker. Everybody gets by instinct things like odds and hand reading (even if they're terrible at it at least they can see the utility right off the bat) but that's poker from 1700-2007. Things like SPR or what I call shaping (don't know if there's an actual term for it, I basically mean betting with the intent of forcing polarization or nonpolarization for villain based on what you think is better for the hand) are extra more modern poker tools that a new player has to learn to build for themselves at some point and what SSNLHE does is show you how to build probably the simplest one of them. So it's good as your first poker book to show you, like, a method of improving rather than just saying "here is the material."

Much clearer than I could have put it, thank you for that.

Also thank you for the pokerguys suggestion, I had not seen this. This poo poo is entertaining and informative.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Feb 16, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

Note that wearing glasses and things like that isn't strictly +EV. Sometimes it can be a struggle to see hearts vs. diamonds if you're in the three or four seat and the casino is dark, put on glasses and maybe you make an occasional mistake about that where if you weren't wearing glasses you wouldn't have. Maybe you get a drunk retard coming out of the nightclub who has an extra 1200 in his pocket that he's going to either try to double in twenty minutes or lose because he struck out in the club -- which table is he going to sit at, the one with normal looking people or the one full of people dressed up like the loving Black Mage? If you're trying to make sure the drunks have fun so they rebuy a few more times it's going to be harder to do that wearing a balaclava than it would be with your honest normal face.

Oakley has high contrast lenses that can help you recognize the shapes on the cards (clubs v spades, hearts v diamonds). I found this helpful in live poker. If you call their help line and explain your purpose the reps are super knowledgeable. I also hate bright lights, and I find that my eyes get tired in any live tournament session or cash session over 4 hours. Also I would recommend caution if you choose polarized lenses, a lot of the felt on tables sparkle when wearing polarized lenses. I actually like it, but I have heard of it giving people headaches. Also unless you are active duty or a vet you may be SOL if you need Rx lenses in high contrast but don't quote me on that. I know lenscrafters handles retail Oakley frames but I'm not sure if they can do Rx with legit Oakley lenses. Vets/AD military should check out Oakley SI if you haven't heard of it already, even if you don't need an Rx they have discounted Oakley glasses and other shits. They also offer this to FF, LEO, and EMTs.

Imaduck posted:

On the bots: There are a ton of caveats with this challenge. The bots play very slowly; probably much slower than you could play online. The human players are putting in tons and tons of long sessions, which is a huge disadvantage since humans get fatigued, but bots don't. This is a deep stacked variant of the game, which most of the players are less familiar with, and the bots are only trained on how to play in this specific, deep stacked scenario. This is heads-up only; building a bot for multiplayer variants of the game using this methodology is basically impossible at this point. And even if the bots win this challenge, it doesn't mean they wouldn't get exploited like crazy online, once people figured out what exactly they were doing...

One interesting thing to come out of this will be how training changes as these bots get better. Blackjack is a long solved game, and you can play with a bot that will tell you whenever you make an incorrect move. Soon, poker will be like this; we're already using poker simulations to improve our game, but soon the best players train against bots instead of humans to find the weaknesses in their game.

I'm curious about whether humans can even exploit ranges the way Libratus is currently exploiting ranges or if it is a type of optimization that only a computer can accomplish (i.e. Google being able to solve the Rubik's cube in 20 moves or less from any starting position). This would have the potential to be devastatingly exploitative if someone could memorize lines or create a bot to dominate the online space. Anyway they are a long way from dominating non heads up play so no need to worry for now unless you are an online HU player.

Imaduck posted:

My friend says that 100% of players at the table that have backpacks are pros. In my experience, story checks out. I might have to expand that to fanny packs as well.

If you go to the same room enough irl you'll recognize familiar faces, and if you can estimate their VPIP over more than one sitting you'll have an idea as to whether or not they are a winning/verging on winning player or just a degen. At Foxwoods frequent players get fancy player cards (a black card after like 500 hours of table play over 75 discrete visits on discrete days) which generally indicates skill, but not always. Sunglasses are no indicator of skill although many good players wear them. CT is also a medicinal marijuana state and I am yet to meet a player who sits down smelling like a smoked blunt that plays well.

Imaduck posted:

I've started up making weekly poker videos again. If you want to see me grind some online sit and goes, do tournament reviews, and talk about beer, check out my youtube channel.

These are fantastic. Thanks for the content!

bengy81 posted:

Post pics of fanny pack please. TIA

This.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 04:35 on Feb 18, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
Buyin for 60USD to 1/2 and plan to play a single orbit to get the day on my player card after a show with my old lady.

Waiting for the blind I witness the guy two seats to my left call off like 60USD to a river straight that was made by the biggest chip stack by 47off in the HiJack and then grumble to himself about not raising preflop from early position and muck. There was one overcard on the board.

I wake up on my second hand in the SB (58USD) with JhJc, UTG (200USD) and the BTN (100USD) both limp and the pot is 7USD.

I raise 16USD and the BTN (an elderly lady) calls.

The pot is 38USD.

Flop comes 9s, 3d, Qh.

My action (42USD)

Whatdo?

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 18:59 on Feb 19, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

JaySB posted:

Bet $20

This happens.

BTN takes about 15 seconds and calls. (Note I can't really see the button, I am one seat left of the dealer, I jumped into the open seat because the blinds were nearly there).

Turn 5c.

My action (22USD)

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 20:04 on Feb 19, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

As played ship turn and hope she doesn't aw-shucks you with JQ/QT/KQ.

Imaduck posted:

I agree with the others; unless you really know the other player, it's hard to make an argument for doing anything other than shoving there. The vast majority of the time you're good, you can get called by worse hands, and your hand is vulnerable to a lot of turns.

JaySB posted:

I was kidding, you should be prepared to stop and go given that you have basically a pot sized bet on the flop.

As played you're still all in.

So betting 20usd was a bit of knee jerk reaction, I had already tossed the chips in before I reconsidered my tiny tiny stack.

As played I do push on the turn. Our villain looks me up with QTo and the river does not save me (Kd).

I agree with stop and go line. Also I don't think there is any version of this hand where I get top pair to fold without a low unpaired kicker.

How about this tournament hand from today.

I have 28000 chips in the big blind at 1200 with 100 antes. Four people limp, EP, HJ and Cutoff for 1200 each, SB folds and I check with 9d,6s.

There is 5200ish in the pot.

EP 32000

HJ 12000

CO 15000

BB 26800 (Hero)

Flop comes

9h, 6c, 7d.

My action.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 17:22 on Feb 21, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

For some reason I thought this was live, don't know why. If it's online c/r all day expecting a call / ship turn.

In fact, this was a live event.

$42 + $18 Foxwhoops daily event (gotta love live rake). 100 entries, we are down to 7 tables, 8 handed, there are approximately a million chips on the floor.

Imaduck posted:

On the other hand, if there are players behind you that will bet most of the time when checked to if they have overcards, then you absolutely have to check to induce.

This is great advice, and something that is relatively easy to keep track of live. I feel like intuition is actually hard earned live, online you can just look at the stats, but intuiting VPIP and AF live requires a good amount of focus unless someone is betting every hand or folding their blind to every raise. I tend to get wrapped up in the most basic equity calculations whenever I am involved in a live hand. Had I been keeping this in mind more actively I would have been better in several spots yesterday, both when I was ahead and when I was behind.

No one folds or bets anything at this particular table so I open with 4200, EP calls, all other players fold and we are heads up.

EP 27800

BB 22600 (Hero)

Turn Qh.

Board

9h, 6c, 7d, Qh.

My action

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 17:47 on Feb 21, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

Great card for us there's so much of his range that that gives false hope to. Getting a little wet for trying "oh I hate that I'm gonna check to you" and getting one more half pot bluff of value from him, especially given they're playing it exactly like a draw rn. I think we just push.

I doubt there's much EV difference between pushing now (to kill draws and get max value from QX sometimes) vs softer lines in hopes of letting them hang on a Q or possibly getting there with hearts/JT etc due to the relative likelihoods of those holdings. It's bad policy to get as invested as we are now and then to start looking for exits all the time too and I don't think this is an extraordinary circumstance. Maybe it's worth considering your table image here to pick between them but I think lots of people could see a turn shove as a bad barrel in this hand and limp/bet/bet shouldn't be so scary that we never get paid especially given stuff like QT/JT is all over their range.

So indeed I ship it here, and I'm looked up with Qd, 8h and he smashes a third Queen on the river and I'm on the rail.

In other news I left here and sat down at 2/5 with 200USD and woke up with Queens and shipped it against a raise to 40 two calls and a reraise to 125 and got called down by JQd and KK and smashed the last Queen in the deck on a paired and flushed board for a nice 800USD pot.

Kings also lost the sidepot to JQ when JQ hit the diamond flush.

So the QQQ swing karma came back to me haha.

Also I will never play 500NL, those guys are crazy.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 22:13 on Feb 24, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
I'm interested in learning Limit Hold'em more seriously. I have Elements, SS1&2, SSHE, HEPoker for Advanced Players, Weighing the Odds, Mathematics of Poker, Winning in Tough Hold'em Games, and Internet Texas Hold'em. I bought these for an old roomie who was interested in limit figuring I'd read them someday. Today is that day, I have gotten through Elements LHE chapter, SS1/2 LHE chapters, SSHE and HEPfAP, I'm just now cracking open Winning in Tough Hold'em Games. At the suggestion of some rando limit thread I ordered Cooke Real Poker I & II, and Hold'em on the Come. RPII and HOTC have arrived, I'm still waiting on RPI.

Does anyone have a suggestion on what order to read these, also could you point me at some good online limit resources (other than 2+2 forums obv)?

From what I can tell the ideal order seems to be:

Maybe start with Elements LHE chapter,

Hold'em Poker (I thought this wouldn't be necessary but you're calculating things in LHE like gutshots for two streets, especially against small stakes players that makes revisiting all drawing scenarios worth rereading, some of the basic stuff on hand hierarchy you can glaze over if you are not a poker beginner).

Super System 1&2 LHE chapters (the key thing I'm recalling from here now is that K72 and a few similar hands cannot make anything but a backdoor straight).

Small Stakes Hold'em (this is literally gold, buy this book, wear out the bindings and buy it again).

Hold'em Poker for Advanced Players

Then I'm unsure, maybe Winning in Tough Hold'em Games before the others as it appears to be the best book on the subject according to 2+2 threads.

Sheep-Goats posted:

I was a bartender before and I apologize to the dealers out there but tipping can be a real problem for staying +EV if you're playing 1/2 or 2/4. At those stakes I only generally tip when I win a a ~100 BB pot or greater and I tip one dollar. I will occasionally tip if I've won a bunch of smaller pots and feel bad about it. If the table goes short handed (either six or five or less, depends on the place) you can request a rake reduction from the dealer (who will ask the floor). I always tip a dollar on being granted the reduction.

Is it pointless to play 2/4 limit (live) to learn with 4USD rake structure? $1 Flop, $1 at $10, $1 at $20, and $1 at $40?

Limit appears to swing a lot from hand to hand, but it doesn't really have an affect on the bankroll as long as you play correctly from what I can tell.

Turdsdown Tom posted:

lost QQQJ to QQQK last night and it hurts my soul

JaySB posted:

Don't buy into live cash games with 40bb

I know, I thought it was 1/2, and I had another 300 in my pocket. Looked at the panel and saw the $200 number, didn't realize it was the minbuy haha. I was like, I always buyin for 200. The ridiculous chip castles should have been a big hint.

After that pot all the 2/5 regs were like, is this your first time at 2/5? you should stay a while now that you have a buyin or two.

bengy81 posted:

Poker books are expensive...

Pretty much every poker book printed before 2013 is about 3usd on half.com with 3-4USD media mail fee/book. This should soften the blow a bit.

The newer books are probably cheapest if bought as an e-book in most cases, check Amazon before B&N, (SSNLHE is like 10usd as an e-book and 35USD as a paperback).

If you happen to attend/have an affiliation to a top Uni through a friend or family member, they will often order/purchase any book for their library if you can come up with anything that sounds like an academic interest.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 20:10 on Mar 4, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
Here is another live tournament hand I'm pretty much certain I misplayed.

I am BB with about 32,000 in chips. Blinds are 1,000 and 2,000 antes are 300.

UTG calls as do three seats near the button and the small blind. I check T8off and the flop comes.

3 suited Q J 9.

UTG bets the pot and everyone folds to me.

My action.


Also:

Anyone going to FW for their high hand promotion Monday?

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Mar 4, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

bengy81 posted:

What's UTG's stack size? Is limping standard at this point of the tournament? Do we have any history on villain?
Not trying to ask dick questions, I just don't get to play live very much, and I know live plays quite a bit different than online.

No that's my bad, UTG has me outstacked by three or four to one (he is one of the major tournament chip leaders at this point) and has been bullying the table since he landed there busting at least three players in about 10-20 orbits (I am clearly sitting in a very unfortunate seat). We are table 14 of maybe 20 remaining tables (tables break in descending order by number at this specific tournament, idk if all live tourneys do it this way but online ones seem not to do it this way). My stack is probably third largest at the table (second is not far off) but the blinds are raising somewhat aggressively at this point.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 21:41 on Mar 4, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

JaySB posted:

We loving have 16bb this is such a stupid question to pontificate about.

I do in fact push and run into KTo. I don't catch up.

My thinking was I have most of his range beat and he has been calling off other people with his bully stack with as little as an overpair. When he snap called I was hoping to run into two pair, or a set, or I guess literally any hand other than KT.

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

JaySB posted:

You played it fine. It was 3 of a suit on the flop right? He could be betting that with any pair and semi nutted flush combos, any combo draws, any 2 pair, any flush. You have 16bb and a straight, if you're ever folding it's pretty marginal. And it's never good to let them peel for cheap.

My wording was bad there, it was actually three off suit cards (3 suits would have been better, three suited kinda sounds like the flush was on the table).

Anyway it was a rainbow, but it is good to know that with a flush on the table this is still the correct play. I probably would have questioned whether I would ever get better to fold, and I guess yeah a low flush might fold here, and a four card flush draw is losing money by calling to jam as well, and I have any non flush draw and non set badly dominated.

bengy81 posted:

What's UTG's stack size? Is limping standard at this point of the tournament? Do we have any history on villain?
Not trying to ask dick questions, I just don't get to play live very much, and I know live plays quite a bit different than online.

This guys VPIP was probably over 40 if I had to guess.

Also from what I could tell the bubble was still like 2-3 hours away, (12ish levels).

In the spirit of speculation, should I play this the same if the bet were like 1/3-1/2 pot and the limpers call?

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 16:49 on Mar 5, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
Other than say 2+2 forums, are there any good resources out there on ICM with regard to fixed limit tournaments? I'm guessing strategy has to be somewhat different than just FL HE or Omaha cash games, but not quite as aggressive as the Nash solutions for NLHE tourneys.

I played the HH promotion at FW yesterday, if you plan to attend one I suggest getting there a few hours early, 07:00 should do it, and lock up a seat well before the line starts, someone was waiting from 09:45am until 12:30 to get a seat at 2/4HE FL, and there were over 200 people waiting on 1/2 by noon. Every table was running downstairs by 15:00. I don't recommend playing 2/4 tho, they rake 3 dollars from the first 10 during the promotion instead of their usual structure. 1/2 has a similarly bewildering rake. I managed to net a decent return in spite of this, but I feel like EV can't be better than zero with rake that high at 2/4 or 1/2 when the pot doesn't break 10bb for limit or 30bb for NL.

It was really cool to see that many people playing though, I have renewed hope for the US poker economy.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 23:44 on Mar 14, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
Prepping for some more tiny tourneys next week and I ran into another big blind special.

Blinds are 1000 and 2000 with 200 antes and I have just been moved to a new table, I look down at Jc, Qs with 65,000 chips in the BB and I am facing a minraise from MP (100,000 chips) a call from the button 190,000 chips and a fold from the small blind (every other seat is 40k chips or less and we are about 30 seats away from the bubble). I call for 2000 more and the flop comes...

Jh, 6s, 4d

My action.

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Imaduck posted:

Check with the intention of check-calling most action unless something really weird happens.

This the standard play, and you shouldn't deviate from it unless you know your opponents are playing in an incredibly strange manner and can justify a more profitable line. But again, it'd have to be a really abnormal situation for leading here to make sense.

Sheep-Goats posted:

Why do we want our hand to improve?

Anything that beats us beats us so badly that we'll ~never catch up and there exists not much in that category (softly played AA-QQ from MP, sets but not really JJ, extremely gross two pairs). The board is not coordinated. The only cards we fear are A or K but a lot of those are being held by our two villains.

I see this as time for value mode. There are appx 4 or 5 bad cards in the deck and only two draws at them and we would love to get paid two bets here in every case that one of those ~4.5 don't come out.

MP is likely to barrel. Check to him, let him bet. In fantasy land he leads and button calls and we can push for infinite EV that looks like a squeeze. In reality it goes check/MP bet/button fold/call, check through, lead river and get reluctant call from TT-99 most of the time. We need to shape him wide here and it sucks rear end being oop and trying to get value here because our risks are bad compared to what we'd get ip, but you can't try to play hot on this board, if you play JQ like that you're going to have to be -EV on it -- gently caress me or leave isn't a great way to play middling hits.

If this is a low limit table full of nits and we were on the bubble then you can consider something else but this is our chance to keep M healthy for a while longer. I just think it's not great to play this protectively instead of hopefully.

JaySB posted:

There is so much LOLanalysis going on here. These are micro tournaments right? MP probably thinks "I have a decent hand I should raise" and is likely c-betting when checked to him almost every time. Check calling is fine, leveling yourself into bet folding is stupid. Check folding is the worst option.

So I do check, MP cbets 7000 into about a 15,000 chip pot, the Button calls, and I call.

The pot is now 36,000.

The turn comes:

2h

The board is now:

Jh, 6s, 4d, 2h

My action.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 22:21 on Mar 20, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

c/r button all in, get snapped by 35dd, ggggggggggggggg

This except 64s. I hit a Q on the river and got away with it...

JaySB posted:

Can you please just post full HH and ask for analysis. Debating every action on every street in without full information isn't ideal. Your flop action could potentially change since the button called the c-bet from MP which you didn't tell us.

Ok, I prefer it that way, I just recalled seeing hands posted this way at some point.

How about this hand. LHE live cash session. KsKc UTG, I bet from seat 6 and I'm raised from seat 8, who is raised by seat 10, calls from seat 1, 2, 3 and 5. I cap it and everyone comes along.

Flop comes Kh, Qh, Td.

Seat 5 checks and I check. The 8 seat bets and is raised from seat 10, called by seats 1,2 and 5, (3 seat folds), and I CR and seat 8 caps everyone calls to the turn.

6s.

Seat 5 bets, I raise, seat 8 raises, seat 10 completes, 1 completes, seat 2 folds,and before seat 5 can act I complete and am bitched out by seat 8 for acting out of turn, (honestly I was exhausted and on hour 12 or so of a 24 hour live session trying to get free monthly slotplay by hitting a reward tier that awarded such nonsense). Seat 5 completes anyway and I call.

River 5s.

Seat 5 checks, I check, seat 8 bets, seat 10 calls seats 1 and 5 fold I call.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Mar 28, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Sheep-Goats posted:

With that much multiway action I don't think top set is good by the turn. I didn't add up the bet bets but I'm pretty sure you're required to stay in there to scream PAIR THE BOARD on every street at the guy with the shakes and the hairpiece.

I haven't played LHE for like 15 years though maybe so w/e

This was pretty much my understanding of Ed Miller's SSHE. Better to call the river than to fold a giant pot. I probably could have avoided a fourth bet on the flop... but more often than not you want to push AA out of there and ward off straight and flush draws, (or at least charge them for each card). Nothing to be done against a flopped straight. I really wish the last (or second to last) card had been both a heart and paired the board. Next time I guess.

Poker is more exhausting than I recall.

I need to more actively document hands... but in LHE it is harder to recall the action when the pot goes 6 or 7 ways. I'm also a bit worried that LHE is loving up my NLHE game.

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

JaySB posted:

I've been grinding hard in the Upswing Poker Lab. If you're at all serious about getting better at poker I'd highly recommend it.

I was not paid to say that and had to pay for access to the info but the few tweaks I've put into my game since then have been well worth the cost.

This UI reminds me of codecademy. I wish something like this existed for LHE. Just watching the promo video for now though, if someone has an affiliate link or sth I'll use it if I decide to try it out, although it wouldn't be for a while, I'm still studying LHE for now/building a roll for NL200 (feel free to send a PM). But once I am satisfied with my LHE knowledgebase/build a proper roll for NL200 I am planning to pivot to NLHE live/online cash. Right now I'm just over 700BB in 4/8LHE.

The key thing I have learned from LHE and MTT study is that preflop hand selection is paramount. It is also the easiest leak you can plug. Whether you get your pfh charts from a website or a book isn't that important, you can add/remove hands from your ranges as you go/adjust against bad/tricky players, but it helps to have a solid strategy memorized so well that you can recall starting hands to open with, to see a raise with, and to reraise and 4bet with blind preflop from any position (especially in LHE as the play is much more straightforward than NLHE).

For MTTs I have been using the tool snapshove on iOS and I'll swear by it. Crushing online SnGs has a good syllabus for learning SNGs, and their pivot tables can sub for snapshove if you prefer a book to an iphone app, or don't have hundreds of dollars for an annual subscription service (snapshove is only like a 15 or 20usd one time fee, the online training sites, cardrunners, TPE, or upswing as JaySB recommended all cost between 30 and 60usd/month) although the value is definitely there.

I am approaching online services and coaching as I would a session with a TF/TA in college, learn as much as I can, read all the material in preparation, and go to them with lingering questions, problems I truly cannot solve with as much prep as possible so I spend as little time/money as possible, however it could be that the online services/coaching could teach all these concepts much faster and in a more digestible fashion, but I still think it is best to show up to these platforms/sessions prepared to learn.

People tend to think you're a fish as well when you have a book on the table, they're all, "oh are you on chapter one," I printed out the charts from COSNGs, SSHE, HEPFAP and use them to check my decisions after I make them and to review a range from a position if I can't recall the range perfectly (easier in live play than online, although online you can pull this all up on your screen in an excel sheet). You can adjust your charts to better serve your range in excel and print them out for live play, I print on half sheets (booklets) so they fit nicely inside the sleeve of a book.

As for studying ranges I use pokerstove, it is a highly visual interactive tool that helps with the memorization portion of the hand range and provides a visual reference that becomes second nature after a few hundred iterations. The best format for memorizing hands from books I recall came from Crushing Online SNGs. The range format went pairs, high card unsuited range, high card suited range (e.g. 88+, AJ, ATs, KQ, KJs, etc). I prefer this format because it is how I plug my range into poker stove for memorization, as a result when I learn a new range, I adjust it into this format if it is provided in some other format, e.g. SSHE, HEPFAP both have different hand range formats that I converted for the sake of memorization.

For mental game stuff, since I saw it on the upswing site, I would strongly recommend tendler's The Mental Game of Poker 1 & 2 as audio books, (I was able to buy the ebook on amazon and get the audio book offering for like a dollar more but I am not sure if this is still possible). These books gave me a blueprint for working through my other leaks, and the ALM gives a great way to see just how well you have mastered those leaks as you are in the process of plugging them.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 22:27 on May 2, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Stormfang1502 posted:

I just started working as a dealer over 2 years ago...

I agree that the more action that occurs the more money you will make. It seems like people tend to tip because of the way a hand goes, i.e. when they win, so the more hands that people win, the more tips you will see, so deal more hands! Remind players that you delivered when they keep asking for winning hands and you finally deal one. 2+2 has a dealer's handbook, I'll let you know if it is worth reading if I ever get around to it.

In my limited experience the tips aren't much better at higher stakes but the players tend to have more experience/cruise more venues more often than the lower stakes guys, (esp. in limit). Listen to those players, they'll complain about things that bother them when they go to other casinos/or when another dealer annoys them (unless you're that dealer), e.g. last month I heard one 50/100 reg complain that at the Borgata the dealers were washing every hand without being asked, don't do that unless it is forced on you by the floor or the table requests it (votes it in). They'll also stir up tips for you if their game is ever not running, another 50/100 reg came down to 4/8 one night because nothing else was running, and got some kid so excited they were fighting over who would give the bigger tip if they won a hand.

I would suggest playing a bit or watching what the dealers who make the most in tips do if possible. I have seen that at higher stakes the players will try to entertain new players by making jokes and being friendly. They're obviously incentivised by easy money, but I think they probably learned this trick from the dealers.

Personally I find card tricks/flourishes cool, and I also appreciate when someone remembers me.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 22:47 on May 2, 2017

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

wide stance posted:

For Push/Fold decisions I tried SNG Coach by ICMIZER. It's neat and powerful but hard to conceptualize and improve for use at the table, at least for me :/

I have read somewhere people swearing by this, I haven't tried it out. I feel like rote memorization of shoving ranges in comparison to the blinds is likely sufficient, which is why I prefer spending a nominal one time sum on a book/app. Once I feel like my recall is more or less effortless, and have a serious db of sngs to look at, (sadly someone stole the laptop I used from 07-10) perhaps I'll take a harder look. I seem to recall people loving sngwizard.

IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.
Without money, the biggest loss would be -EV players trying to get even. The best players make a living talking mediocre players into jumping up in stakes, or staying at the table when they are clearly at a disadvantage. At the lowest levels there are lots of losing players that keep coming back for more punishment thinking a winning session means they are winning players. Without money this side of the game wouldn't really exist.

I feel like my real turning point from not making a profit to making a profit was the realization that variance keeps bad players in the game. Before this realization I thought I could stack any session in my favor, quit early, out think or outplay any opponent, and this mentality led me to steam pretty bad. I took every loss as a blow to my ego rather than looking at it as statistical variance.

If you look at most other competitive endeavors, skill is hard earned, and it is rare that you would ever see a novice beating a professional, even when the novice is granted a large handicap (e.g. golf, American football, hockey, chess). In poker you often see novices or beginners having winning sessions, days, or even tournaments, but statistically they are not winners.

When I realized this, and started thinking in terms of maximizing expected value, I stopped getting mad at myself when I made equitable decisions and lost, (although I'm still susceptible to tilting when I go on a downswing i.e. losing 10+ coin-flips/hands in my favor with cards to come, especially when these situations occur in short succession, also accumulating tilt over several losing sessions or weeks or months without profit). These issues are exacerbated by the fact that I'm playing mostly live games.

Anyway when I encounter this situation now, I try to remind myself that the variance giving my opponents hot streaks keeps them donating to my piggy bank in the long haul.

Two books that helped me with this were Elements of Poker, and The Mental Game of Poker I & II. I strongly recommend both books, although some of the advice in Elements runs contrary to TMGP and I tend to side with TMGP on the psychological hangups. The best piece of advice I recall from Elements was when playing Limit Hold'em you should buy in with enough chips that you are accustomed to having a huge stack in front of you, also when you lose you still cash out with a lot of chips. Whenever I play limit now I buy in for at least two racks but usually three, and I build myself a chip castle. Noobs think you made a lot of money at the table, and swings don't weigh as heavily on your mind, and you never have to buy back in when you sink say 50BB in a long sad losing session.

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 14:15 on May 22, 2017

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IED enthusiast
Nov 6, 2006

Love is Packed in Cylinders and Smells Like Ammonium Nitrate.

Buy SSNLHE FOR .75 and 3.99 shipping on half dot com

read the book.

make a starting hand spreadsheet or pm me and ill give you mine.

play 2/4 or 3/6 limit. 3/6 is beatable 2/4 is probably not (rake) although im up significantly this year playing 2/4.

500usd should last you at least 24 hours even if you drink yourself into oblivion and forget your starting hand chart. if you follow it religiously you should be able to play for quite a while.

"fold more hands."

IED enthusiast fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Jul 3, 2017

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