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NumberLast posted:I honestly don't really think there is one. what have you done to claim the mighty title of 'actual leftist'?
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Jun 29, 2016 22:28
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Wikkheiser posted:on the flip side, anti-capitalists co-opt identity politics to advance a left-wing political cause. not all LGBT people want to overthrow capitalism. Okay, I'm out. Have fun, nerds!
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Jun 29, 2016 22:28
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if you think about it getting basic human dignity and legal equality is the ultimate selling out...
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Jun 29, 2016 22:29
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the top transgender official in the U.S. government works for the Pentagon, and previously developed a night-vision gunsight for the Apache gunship. this is an outrage.
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Jun 29, 2016 22:31
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Obama evolved on gay marriage, the fraud
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Jun 29, 2016 22:32
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 quote:Simpson occupied several systems engineer, systems architect, and systems integrator roles in between 2002 and 2006 on projects diverse as the Unmanned Combat Armed Rotorcraft (UCAR), the Joint Airborne Weapons System (JAWS; later renamed the Beechcraft AT-6B) and a variety of advanced technology development and demonstration projects at Raytheon. Simpson also contributed to the development and/or testing of numerous operation missile systems including Maverick, AMRAAM, Standard, Phalanx, TOW, RAM, JAGM, ACM, HARM, JSOW, MALD, ESSM, SilentEyes, Sidewinder, Sparrow, Paveway and Tomahawk. quote:In September 2015, Simpson was sworn is as the first Deputy Assistant Secretary of Defense for Operational Energy.
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Jun 29, 2016 22:39
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Wikkheiser posted:the top transgender official in the U.S. government works for the Pentagon, and previously developed a night-vision gunsight for the Apache gunship. Seriously don't get what your point is here vis a vis Goldman coopting progressive messaging to cover their own fiscal conservatism
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Jun 29, 2016 22:42
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Karl Barks posted:i think they're doing it for cynical PR reasons, and I'd imagine they wouldn't do it if it didn't work. i basically think this of any corporation that suddenly starts promoting minority causes once it's in vogue to do it, goldman is just a company that i particularly don't like as an lgbt person am i not allowed to enjoy that all these corporations are falling over themselves to say how much they love me
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Jun 29, 2016 22:47
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Badger of Basra posted:as an lgbt person am i not allowed to enjoy that all these corporations are falling over themselves to say how much they love me Sellout
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Jun 29, 2016 22:53
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do you guys expect corporations to advance bold progressive policies ahead of majority opinion or something
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Jun 29, 2016 22:55
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Corporations advanced the cause of lgbt rights probably more than any other single factor. If not they are very high on the list. NumberLast posted:You, friend. Oh boo loving hoo, pr normalizing lgbt people is hardly worth  about.
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Jun 29, 2016 22:55
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Badger of Basra posted:as an lgbt person am i not allowed to enjoy that all these corporations are falling over themselves to say how much they love me You are absolutely allowed, not that you even need my permission to do so.
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Jun 29, 2016 22:56
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Badger of Basra posted:do you guys expect corporations to advance bold progressive policies ahead of majority opinion or something I think they should be held to account for their lovely regressive views like any other entity
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Jun 29, 2016 22:57
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Karl Barks posted:You are absolutely allowed, not that you even need my permission to do so. ok well the premise of this thread seems to be that i should think it's disgusting that they would dare to do this, when they are part of wall street
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Jun 29, 2016 22:59
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TROIKA CURES GREEK posted:Corporations advanced the cause of lgbt rights probably more than any other single factor. If not they are very high on the list. IIRC weren't there some corporate ads that featured a gay couple with kids and some group called millions of moms or something threatening to boycott them because it normalized gay relationships, only for that corporation to tell them to gently caress off several years ago?
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Jun 29, 2016 23:00
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A Winner is Jew posted:IIRC weren't there some corporate ads that featured a gay couple and some group called millions of moms threatening to boycott them because it normalized gay relationships, only for that corporation to tell them to gently caress off several years ago? Yes
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Jun 29, 2016 23:00
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loving sell-outs
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Jun 29, 2016 23:01
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corporations man (shakes head, exhales huge cloud of vape smoke)
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Jun 29, 2016 23:01
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Badger of Basra posted:ok well the premise of this thread seems to be that i should think it's disgusting that they would dare to do this, when they are part of wall street I think you are allowed to be happy corporations are kissing the ring and I (and you maybe) can also think GS is cynically exploiting public opinion. Don't see these as mutually exclusive. Socialist organizations are largely one of the only political groups that have supported universal rights for LGBT people for the past 150~ years I'd imagine
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Jun 29, 2016 23:03
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Karl Barks posted:I think you are allowed to be happy corporations are kissing the ring and I (and you maybe) can also think GS is cynically exploiting public opinion. Don't see these as mutually exclusive. Weren't most socialist organizations branded as being involved with LGBT because it was just another way to scare people into being against them though? Like being a communist = being a homosexual and vice versa with the implication that both are immoral.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:08
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The anti-capitalist left has to reconcile support for (a) the equality of LGBT people with (b) radically reforming or destroying capitalism. These are compatible positions, but there's dissonance because (a) is being achieved but not (b). Which suggests that capitalism is compatible with LGBT rights after all, much to the horror of pro-capitalist social conservatives and anti-capitalist social progressives. Karl Barks posted:Socialist organizations are largely one of the only political groups that have supported universal rights for LGBT people for the past 150~ years I'd imagine
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Jun 29, 2016 23:15
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A Winner is Jew posted:Weren't most socialist organizations branded as being involved with LGBT because it was just another way to scare people into being against them though? Like being a communist = being a homosexual and vice versa with the implication that both are immoral. As far as I know that was an American phenomenon in the 50's related to the red scare. Many early socialist leaders were gay. Maybe gay people back then mostly fell into socialist movements because they presented a different path? Not sure. Communism I would say on the whole was less friendly to gay rights than socialists, tho Lenin abolished all laws against homesexuality.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:15
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Karl Barks posted:As far as I know that was an American phenomenon in the 50's related to the red scare. Many early socialist leaders were gay. Maybe gay people back then mostly fell into socialist movements because they presented a different path? Not sure. The US did it in the 50's yeah, but Weimar era Germany also did it a ton. And pretty much every communist country but the USSR has been kinda poo poo when it comes to LGBT rights.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:21
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Karl Barks posted:As far as I know that was an American phenomenon in the 50's related to the red scare. Many early socialist leaders were gay. Maybe gay people back then mostly fell into socialist movements because they presented a different path? Not sure. it is absolutely not an 'american phenomenon' but it did happen here yes. Basically everyone used "AND THEY LOVE THE SICKO DEVIANTS TOO" as an insult on political groups that were too 'fringe'. Sadly yes the USSR is the closest to 'ok' with gays we had at that time and...hahahahahahaha
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Jun 29, 2016 23:26
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Wikkheiser posted:The anti-capitalist left has to reconcile support for (a) the equality of LGBT people with (b) radically reforming or destroying capitalism. I mean..... I'm not sure if I necessarily agree that (b) isn't being achieved, either through capitalism's own self destructive forces(climate change, primarily) or through a very slow political process. I don't think I would have ever said LGBT rights weren't compatible with capitalism tho. Wikkheiser posted:Anarchists even more so. But so what? Don't forget about us when the capitalists give you oodles of $$$
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Jun 29, 2016 23:27
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A Winner is Jew posted:The US did it in the 50's yeah, but Weimar era Germany also did it a ton. The Soviet Union decriminalized homosexuality early on, although regressed, and then eased up again later. But it would eventually fall behind the liberal west, which allowed the formation of independent gay owned businesses (bars and clubs), newspapers, political organizations and so on. The communist world stunted gay rights, not because of an animus toward homosexuality per se (although that was a factor) but because those systems had a one-size-fits-all model. Cuba today is a dreary example of it. There's a state-run LGBT organization run by Raul Castro's daughter, and this is promoted as showing how progressive Cuba is, but Cuba is on the regressive end of Latin America when it comes to actual rights.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:30
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Anarchists are def better than Commies if you are measuring by liters of booze drank
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Jun 29, 2016 23:31
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I tend to like anarchists more than commies.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:36
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They certainly have cooler haircuts
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Jun 29, 2016 23:38
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The most militant anti-homophobes I've known have been anarchists.
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Jun 29, 2016 23:50
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Wikkheiser posted:The most militant anti-homophobes I've known have been anarchists. I think you'll find some of the most militant people generally are anarchists. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NGu__oqMcKM SirJohnnyMcDonald has issued a correction as of 00:03 on Jun 30, 2016 |
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Jun 29, 2016 23:54
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Wikkheiser posted:The most militant anti-homophobes I've known have been anarchists. Agreed, anarchists are pretty cool
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Jun 30, 2016 00:12
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the comically evil avatar of finance capitalism flying the trans flag remains funny https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvlTJrNJ5lA
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Jun 30, 2016 01:10
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Yeah who cares about that, let's talk about anarchists some more Hell yes Emma Goldman 
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Jun 30, 2016 02:12
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On the other hand ugh green anarchists
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Jun 30, 2016 02:13
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Christian anarchists just confuse me tbh
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Jun 30, 2016 02:15
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Al! posted:Christian anarchists just confuse me tbh I went to catholic school! Render unto Caesar was an important lesson~
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Jun 30, 2016 02:16
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please learn more at triple double u dot romans thirteen no space dot com
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Jun 30, 2016 02:19
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anarchists can make useful allies in the fight against capitalism but should be purged from the ranks at the decisive moment, imho
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Jun 30, 2016 02:20
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syndicalists are anarchists with a petit bourgeois distrust for the working class
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Jun 30, 2016 02:26
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