Auspol August: The Greens Echo Chamber

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ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Wheezle posted:

So did lion hat get in or not?

I think he's doing well enough, probably. If Gabe gets in, that makes two LDP Senators.

# ¿ Aug 2, 2016 10:41

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# ¿ May 16, 2024 14:36

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

SynthOrange posted:

http://imgur.com/fqDd5S2

You fool! We gave you every chance to back out!

# ¿ Aug 3, 2016 10:33

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

SynthOrange posted:

Well... I'm coming from here:

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/jul/28/the-guardian-view-on-malaysian-politics-a-scandal-meriting-the-worlds-attention

Fair point

All my life they seem to go nuts every so often like this, and I don't understand it.

# ¿ Aug 3, 2016 11:44

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

So when is Leak doing the white trash version, or would that upset West Sydney voters? Definitely not racist.

# ¿ Aug 5, 2016 04:52

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

I'm surprised no one's mentioned Xenophon's challenge to the ABS to sue him for leaving his name and address off his census tomorrow. Seems a mighty big play, isn't that also encouragement to others?

White supremacist conspiracy theories seem to work the same as anti-semitism, being persecuted by a shadowy cabal is a common MO for racists. Let me guess, in this case it's the lefty media in cahoots with burquas who plan to eradicate all resistance by means of a weak ungodly state being bribed with ARE TAXES to do their bidding.

# ¿ Aug 8, 2016 07:19

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Recoome posted:

creepy death threats

Also got into a fight with a weird yospos poster who has an autistic fetish about posting about hating sci-fi.

Came across as a frustrated jock who doesn't have nerds in the neighbourhood to bully but probably right.

In other news Chris Pyne talks about :tinfoil:

because concern over your privacy is of course for nutters.

# ¿ Aug 9, 2016 00:05

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

A woman at my WFTD said she'd put herself down as Christian even though she's atheist "to stop those bloody Muslims having more say". :ughh:

# ¿ Aug 9, 2016 09:36

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

This is loltastic, the ABS guy on The Drum tonight was so enthused "get online Tuesday 9!" :v:

# ¿ Aug 9, 2016 12:35

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Starshark posted:

Would this have happened under Labor's NBN?

...

... You know what, gently caress it, I don't care. The right lie their arse off enough times, now it's our turn. I'm spreading the rumour that the internet infrastructure couldn't handle it.

I made this very joke on twitter last night and had a few Captains Obvious try and tell me they weren't related. Twitter has lost its irony.

# ¿ Aug 10, 2016 13:12

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Endman posted:

It takes a very special type of person to hear allegations made by children of sexual assault and immediately say "well they lie all the time you know"

It's an institutional reaction from an ex-copper, it doesn't surprise me. This is someone used to thinking in us and them terms, just like the rest of the country. TBH I don't know how it can be cured, but it's eating our culture alive. Every response to a smidgen of humanity is viewed as welfare-state bleeding-heart conspiracy to reinforce the division.

# ¿ Aug 11, 2016 04:11

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Endman posted:

I know the comparison is tired and overplayed, but I wonder if this is how it felt to be German in the 1930s.

Best analogy, I've thought it for some time. Except the feeling of being hard-done by is totally made up by the Nazi/veteran equivalent, its a deliberately fake division. I would call it social engineering but I think we've fallen into it via a cultural weakness for scapegoating the poor and immigrants. Politicians feel powerless to change economics without a great deal of backing so these are issues easier to keep on the news cycle without any intention to "solve" anything. That only deepens divisions and causes new problems.

You can shout "revolution" but its a failure of communication and will in the first place. Revolution tends to clear the decks for a time for new tyrants. The winners are generally not the people in any revolution.

# ¿ Aug 11, 2016 04:21

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Seen today: two ABS blokes in a booth at the mall, trying to not look like rabbits in headlights, surrounded by laptops and soothing informational signs, poor buggers.

# ¿ Aug 12, 2016 06:07

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Is not-a-Green still posting? :jerkbag:

# ¿ Aug 12, 2016 09:25

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Redcordial posted:

I can't believe she honestly stated that the squatting toilets themselves aren't a threat, but it's a slippery slope and the Australian way of life starts to be eroded with the introduction of dynamic toileting.

Jesus... At least our villains are completely transparent, and obvious with their ideological flaws.

It's a stupid person desperately trying to crowbar offence into cultural differences. Speaking of which, what the gently caress Leyonhjelm. I hope the Australian taxpayer isn't paying for this little fishing expedition.

# ¿ Aug 15, 2016 05:13

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Does anyone else feel that silly season came bloody early this year?

# ¿ Aug 15, 2016 10:38

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

SynthOrange posted:

You're one of those climate change quacks arent you?!

Are you suggesting that the Liberal party are the La Ni�a infesting the body politic?

# ¿ Aug 15, 2016 13:16

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Cartoon posted:

This will do nothing but raise the stakes with the Chinese hawks. Any difficulties that the central committee might have had with military procurement are now overcome. This is what starts arms races and eventually someone decides they have to make the first move.

Basically, if you make big blustery statements about aggression, you're doing it to precisely the wrong culture. You put them in a corner, in their eyes shaming them, and they are very, very patient.

quote:

News just in!!! FTAs are poo poo and we should stop signing them.

This is getting to be too depressing and relentless.

Oh the irony of Andrew Robb getting the swinging door to an investment bank on the strength of his "negotiating skills".

BlitzkriegOfColour posted:

Have you considered that great power imperialism is only ever kept in check by other great power imperialism, and with the US being so much more insanely powerful (and also, insane and powerful) there is literally nothing to keep its imperialism in check? I mean, if you really assess the situation, you'd be willing to let the Russian/Chinese empires expand a little in order to check the US. Otherwise they're just going to continue to encircle everyone, as they do now.

Personally I think American economic imperialism has its limits, eg China and the EU. America is more interdependent than its politicians like to pretend, and everyone else knows it. That makes its Pacific posturing all the more silly and dangerous.

From the half-assed comments from others I suspect there is a smidgen of armchair morality floating about. Well this isn't Versailles and we sure as hell ain't Woodrow Wilson (whose morality is rather doubted these days). No one likes to be subsumed by an empire (except us apparently), and as I've said before, many will choose subsumption over being a plaything of some new dick-measuring contest. In a perfect world we'd all obey rules and play nice, get real. Everyone's seen what happened to Africa, Asia is not going the same way if they can help it.

# ¿ Aug 16, 2016 05:38

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

MiniSune posted:

He waits in the dark, waiting to strike.

But the public don't want him. This is terminal behaviour.

# ¿ Aug 16, 2016 09:33

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

At last, a chance for Aussies to be accelerationists just like the UK and US.

# ¿ Aug 16, 2016 10:04

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Endman posted:

While it annoys me to say so, we have to rely on America to be the limiting factor. It's really Washington that gets to decide how far this escalates.

Let's hope they don't elect Trump!

Comedy option: send in the UN. TBH I'm just as cynical about Hilary's leadership, the US is just as likely to be a paper tiger as it is a belligerent. Either way, China won't listen. Maybe we have to hope that Vietnam beats them up a bit.

# ¿ Aug 17, 2016 06:08

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Here is a free noice for a good home (not in Australia though)

# ¿ Aug 17, 2016 08:06

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Also we didn't know how to sell those products well to other economies and have too small a base to support local goods compared to any competition, and many still don't. Hence the rent-seeking.

# ¿ Aug 17, 2016 08:15

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

People who don't listen to Late Night Live on Mondays will not have heard two very interesting tidbits via Laura Tingle:

* They are trying to get out of Nauru. They just haven't figured out a) how to get out b) how to make it look like everything's ok or at least not Dutton's fault, but he keeps saying everything is fine.

* There are apparently good numbers to get a private bill across the floor in both houses for an RC into banks. Nats in the Reps are said to be dead keen on flexing their new muscles. This would be a remarkable result.

With reference to the first point, please read this great blog post from Andrew Elder. He too thinks the end is in sight for Nauru and lays out the various reasons why this is going to be the same kind of botch revisionism we've come to know and love from our racists.

# ¿ Aug 18, 2016 14:33

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

I'm conflicted by First Dog's portrayal of female News Corp employees as incoherent dingbats. Discuss.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 06:44

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Speaking of torture, I didn't need to be reminded of this:

quote:

�I expected the maximum reaction to my being the first woman prime minister to come in the first few months,� she said. �What I found living through the reality was that the sort of gendered stuff actually grew over time.�

Gillard singled out the ABC�s decision to fund a four-part sitcom titled At Home with Julia, which parodied her relationship with her partner, Tim Mathieson.

�They chose bizarrely, in my view, to finance a comedy where an impersonator played me,� she said of the state broadcaster. No similar program had been made of other prime ministers, before or since, she noted.

Gillard agreed with an academic quoted by the Atlantic who said sexism was more socially acceptable than racism.

�In some ways, I think we put a burden on women in the face of gender attacks that doesn�t necessarily play out in the face of racist attacks.�

She singled out her announcement of the carbon tax in 2011, which prompted protesters to rally against her outside Parliament House, some wielding signs such as �Ditch the witch� and �JuLIAR�. Tony Abbott, the then leader of the opposition, stood in front of them while condemning the tax.

�I have made the point since that, if Australia had an Aboriginal Australian prime minister and the opposition leader went and stood in front of signs that said �Sack the black�, or inserted any of the dreadful words we have for Aboriginal Australians, it would have been a career-ending moment,� she told the Atlantic.

�And if an Indigenous Australian prime minister had complained about that, I don�t think people would say, �Oh, he is just playing the victim.�

�But that is what gets said about women who complain about sexism. There is an added kind of layer that women leaders are just supposed to take it on the chin and not complain about it.�

I've never understood why At Home With Julia was ever made, except as some kind of peace offering to the conservatives who simply demanded more. The only similar thing I can think of is a song called Wargasm featuring Thatcher and Reagan and that was in the 80s, back when talking puppets of famous people was supposed to be funny.

But if there had been a Sack the Black moment, I think Julia is quite mistaken that it would have been career-ending.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 09:54

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

I don't recall because I never watched it. I did see the promos which were bad enough. That's My Bush was a group sitcom IIRC it wasn't specifically calling out a female leader. People younger than I won't know that when Thatcher got a Ministry, everyone from the Goons to Monty Python, and the Goodies made fun of her, suggesting she was stupid or inexperienced or naive.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 10:05

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

The Narrator posted:

I'm not sure what's fair play and what's not when it comes to parodying a politician, but I think the real-world stuff that was slung around when Gillard was in power makes it the subject of more scrutiny.

The fact the show revolved around their relationship was the creepy thing. There's always been a few jabs at First Lady/First Bloke (Denis Thatcher particularly, but don't forget Janet Howard), this was a sustained effort to parody a leader outside their job. Something never done to a male leader. Take just about any major Australian leader of the last 50 years. Lots of rumour about "the wife" being the "power behind the throne" yet never taken on directly, certainly never the focus of any satire. But get a female PM and its sniggering at the First Bloke and how it must be to live with Her.

There was once a code of conduct about the families of leaders, but that just got forgotten with Gillard, and now it's back to normal as if Gillard was some kind of weird glitch that we can put behind us. Tony Abbott has a completely dodgy reputation with women, imagine a comedy about that.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 13:32

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

The Narrator posted:

I appreciate your civil responses. I'm still unpacking how I feel about the show so it's nice to get people's thoughts.

I missed the first episode and didn't watch it until the 2nd episode which was the most unfunny political satire I've seen in 30 years. The promos were always playing up that relationship in a really unfunny way too and it bothered me as a adjunct to the upfront demonising of Gillard everywhere else. That it was co-written by a woman seems all the more incongruous, apart from being a terrific protection against charges of unfairness, because it felt mean and condescending.

When Thatcher became PM, the equally condescending humour aimed at her switched over to Denis. A similar thing happened to Florence Bjelke-Petersen and her pumpkin scones; the fearsome leader is just called names for their day job and the partner becomes a figure of fun. You can probably throw in a couple of American examples too.

Gillard was never treated as someone with true authority. That was a deliberate choice by the Opposition and very much abetted by the Press Gallery. On top of this, we got At Home With Julia. Had she had more respect and authority, that show might have been written differently and come over with greater satiric effect. But as it was, it was just another stupid cartoon about someone the cartoonist couldn't imagine being.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 14:28

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

BlitzkriegOfColour posted:

So how the gently caress do you do it?

Serious question, serious answers please.

I watch far less TV than I used to. Partly because my reception is poo poo, partly because most of the time I only catch SBS or ABC channels and there's only so much ABC24 that I can take at a time.

But TV used to be a huge part of the culture, and it had to encompass a wide audience. Rove McManus said something insightful about TV programming recently, that everything is niche, so stop trying to program for the wider "morons" and program something targeted and interesting. But no, Andrew O'Keefe is doing yet another panel show. The problem isn't with the audience, the audience is shrinking. And so TV will continue to shrink.

# ¿ Aug 19, 2016 16:45

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Cleretic posted:

This makes so many weird turns that it reaches the point where I think you can legitimately read it as pro-dole bludger. Not even pro-unemployed, SPECIFICALLY pro-dole bludger.

JUST after we've had an excellent demonstration of what happens when you cut the public sector ie Census. What timing they have.

# ¿ Aug 21, 2016 05:22

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Didn't the ALP whip their federal senses in Western Sydney? So just a fruitless popularity contest in the rags perhaps?

# ¿ Aug 22, 2016 05:50

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

snoremac posted:

You reap what you sow I guess.

Excellent result, a range of excuses we can demolish.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2016 08:53

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

A helpful reminder of Michalea Cash's input by the Greens:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_PvctU6aHU0

So what the gently caress does "undermine" mean? Anything they want, apparently.

# ¿ Aug 22, 2016 14:56

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Cartoon posted:

Dead or assimilated by the end of this generation. When results matter! I don't know where to start. The completely disingenuous dog whistle headline, the blaming of bureaucracy, the hand wringing about current performance when everything possible to gently caress things up has been done since the nineties. Abolishing ATSIC was when we as a nation declared war on the indigenous population and then called in the bully boys to help in the extermination.

Do you get the feeling that there's a lot of turnover and the people responsible for spending the money didn't give a gently caress what it was spent on and no one is held responsible and the money is wasted? Almost like money is used to kill an issue until it so totally fucks things up that it becomes an issue in itself.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2016 03:05

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

snoremac posted:

I just think he's so adamant on the most ridiculous things that it suggests he's more than a typical shill. There's some psychology going on there. For example, he's posted the same easily disprovable climate change graph for years. You'd think a shill would at least change things up a bit to hide their deceit, but he pushes the same graph again and again. If you take him at face value, he's really deluded.

Edit: Okay, I went back and re-read this. Bolt is definitely a callous pile of poo poo.

Yeah the Something Wonky boys have been Bolt watching for years and their considered opinion is poo poo also. He might be deluded as to how he is viewed (typical persecution complex) but his methods are simple dishonest shillery. He doesn't care about that graph or the argument, he cares that it gets out and into other people's heads to make it easier for him to make the next poo poo argument so that his side wins, whatever side he's decided on. As long as he's right, he doesn't care what reality is.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2016 09:53

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Doctor Spaceman posted:

Bolt's got some strange issues. He's an atheist or a very lapsed Christian but he still feels the need to make a full-throated defence any time the Church is attacked.

Oh that's easy, he's a toady. Doesn't matter what the authority is, he'll suck up to it. It's very lapsed church schoolboy behaviour, but also remarkably Australian. We like to pretend we're anti-authoritarian but we're hierarchical as gently caress and always anxiously looking up the ladder. People like Bolt exemplify that mindset.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2016 11:15

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Anidav posted:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2016-08-23/anthony-albanese-search-finds-father-he-thought-was-dead/7776918

And yet he's fine with torturing immigrants. Some people huh.

# ¿ Aug 23, 2016 12:18

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

hooman posted:

But enough about the September OP.

Actually there was a good bit on the whole sad NT situation on Late Night Live. It's sadder than Tasmania.

# ¿ Aug 25, 2016 06:06

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Brown Paper Bag posted:

I'm baffled foreign donations to Australian political parties are still legal.

I like Chinese, I like Chinese, they bring lots of cash from overseas, we can funnel it through dinners with the greatest of ease. Lots of Liberal Party Yum Chas for some reason lately :v:

# ¿ Aug 26, 2016 03:25

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# ¿ May 16, 2024 14:36

ewe2: Jul 1, 2009

Lmao at the Hun today, Political Editor Ellen Whinnett desperately trying to have a bet each way, basically telling the ALP and the Greens that no plebiscite will be their fault because the law won't be changed but she thinks it should have been changed years ago but those ALP and Greens are SO POLITICALLY MOTIVATED and they should just go along with the Government because stuff. And Bill Shorten changed his mind, shock horror. It's the wackiest piece of self-justification I've ever read from her and that's saying something. It's also a shame she's going off to London because there'll be nothing relatively sane to balance out Tom Elliot.

so you don't have to go near the Hun's insane spittle posted:

PARLIAMENT resumes next week and the boffins are preparing the legislation to establish the plebiscite on whether same-sex marriage should be legalised.

But the real crunch will come when the legislation is tabled in coming months � because Labor, the Greens and some Senate crossbenchers are threatening to block it, or refusing to say if they will support it and are trying to force the government to hold a parliamentary vote on the issue. The problem with that is there�s a very good chance this weird bloc of Left-wing parties and Right-wing senators might succeed in killing off the best chance Australia has of allowing marriage equality any time in the next three years.

Turnbull cannot cave in and allow a parliamentary vote � it will kill him politically. The Right of his party and the Nationals will explode and he will have breached his election commitment to hold a plebiscite. And, given that many Liberals and most Nationals MPs are opposed to changing the laws, a vote on the floor of parliament is no guarantee of success. If that occurs, the Greens and Labor, who consider themselves leading advocates for same-sex marriage, will be guilty of stopping the law change required for same-sex couples to marry.

If the plebiscite is blocked, Labor and the Greens will be sending a message that they�re more interested in hurting Malcolm Turnbull than letting gay people get married.

My view is that the parliament should have decided this issue. That is what we pay our MPs to do. I also believe same-sex couples should have the right to be married, given we have removed legal impediments to adoption, IVF, end-of-life decisions and civil unions for gay couples.

And I do not believe the government�s assertion that the debate will be conducted in a mature and respectful way; it is obvious vile, homophobic views will be aired, including by some Right-wing MPs.

Equally, it�s guaranteed that those who express views opposed to same-sex marriage will be demonised as bigots and efforts will be made by the Left and social media to howl them down and deny their right to a say.

But a plebiscite is the position the Coalition took to the election and it was the Coalition that won a majority. Malcolm Turnbull has clean hands on this. He supports a vote in the parliament but inherited the plebiscite from Tony Abbott and, sensibly, decided to stick with it, to be true to what the party had decided.

He has said he will advocate for a yes vote and will be voting for same-sex marriage. Contrary to reports, he didn�t pledge to hold the plebiscite before the end of the year. Attorney-General George Brandis did, but Turnbull was always more cautious.

Opposition Leader Bill Shorten campaigns strongly for a parliamentary vote and labels the plebiscite a �taxpayer-funded platform for homophobia��.

But footage leaked to The Australian of Shorten speaking in 2013 to the Australian Christian Lobby, which is vehemently opposed to same-sex marriage, has him saying he was �completely relaxed about having some form of plebiscite�� and �I would rather the people of Australia could make their view clear on this than leaving this issue to 150 people��. He also commented that �gay marriage is not the reason I ran for parliament��.

Shorten now says he has changed his mind after seeing hateful things said in the Irish plebiscite (which supported legalising same-sex marriage). And �gay marriage�� has since been rebranded as �marriage equality��.

Behind the scenes, much hand-wringing is going on about what question to ask at the plebiscite and whether the vote should be compulsory. While the result is not legally binding, the government will accept the will of the people.

To further complicate things, conservative senators including Derryn Hinch don�t support the plebiscite, apparently because of the cost (upwards of $160 million).

And Senator Pauline Hanson wants a referendum to define marriage in the Constitution, warning the current proposals could pave the way for other changes such as child marriage or polygamy � a similar position to that previously outlined by Liberal senators Cory Bernardi and Eric Abetz.

It�s a mess and it�s going to dominate the political agenda for months, despite the government�s efforts to get the focus on Budget repair.

The Coalition needs to show some spine and stare down efforts to kill off the plebiscite.

If the plebiscite is blocked, the Coalition must stand firm and point the finger at those who are really standing in the way of the reform � Labor, the Greens, and any crossbencher or government MP who crosses the floor.

No, gently caress you, have today's Tom Elliot spittle-flecked garbage too

I have a raging racist boner and lefties can't stop me posted:

Victorian primary school students should be spared political lectures in classroom

THANKS to the preponderance of left-wing teachers infesting our education system, schoolchildren no longer focus on the �three Rs�: reading, writing and arithmetic.

Instead they get biased lectures on society�s perceived political problems.

Take the asylum seeker debate. This week on 3AW I took a call from a concerned father whose seven-year-old son came home from the local primary school with some strange ideas.

According to the boy, �The government in Australia is evil�. When pressed by his dad as to why this was the case, the son replied: �Just because some people don�t have passports, they get sent to jail or an island like jail even though they have travelled such a long way on small boats.�

Apparently the teacher shared these views with the entire grade one class. This type of nonsense at state schools is wrong on many levels.

First, just how is it relevant to teach seven-year-olds an intricate subject like refugee policy?

Most adults struggle to find a neat solution to the issue of asylum seekers who arrive here by boat. How are small kids supposed to grasp such complexities?

Second, if such politics can�t be kept out of the classroom, how about at least presenting both sides of the argument?

Both the Liberal and Labor parties agree that letting in boat arrivals willy-nilly generates serious consequences � especially hundreds of tragic drownings as unscrupulous people smugglers crowd too many desperate people on unseaworthy vessels.

Would the primary school teacher who teaches kids that our government is �evil� care to resume such refugee deaths at sea? And if so, how could that be explained palatably to a room full of innocent seven-year-olds?

Biased politics have no place in class. If teachers want to spread their radical views, they should resign from education, join a party and have a crack at running for parliament. Otherwise, focus on the three Rs.

Ill-considered ideas about immigration are no substitute for rapidly vanishing skills like learning the times-table or correct use of apostrophes.

Tom Elliott is ~~Drive Time host on 3AW, weekdays 3pm-6pm~~ a raging fuckhead. No wonder his dad drinks.

I know what Judge Roy Bean would say. "Take them out, and hang them".

# ¿ Aug 26, 2016 09:32

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > Auspol August: The Greens Echo Chamber

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