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Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

No, just murder the insane woman when she kidnaps you at the start of the questline

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Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

The dramatic stories and questlines in Oblivion and Skyrim are another big part of why essential characters are a thing. There are almost no points in Morrowind where two characters interact with each other, no points where a big villain appears to you and comes up with some convoluted reason you can't kill him (except uh the main bad guy I guess, but that's kind of his thing). If you kill, say, the head of House Telvanni because he's getting in your way, well... that's allowed! You're the new grandmaster.

It's not a style that a modern game could really pull off without coming across as weirdly static and wooden, I think. Games now need heavy scripting and detail or they just... don't work, one of the reasons you don't see as many quest mods as you used to. It's unfortunate but there's no going back :shrug:

Of course this isn't helped by Bethesda being hacks who are determined to undermine everything people like about their games at every opportunity.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

prometheusbound2 posted:

The three word rebuttal to that is "Fallout:New Vegas."

Morrowind is great, I love Morrowind, but I think nostalgia takes hold. The quests were still linear relative to Fallout 1 and 2. And the wiki-dialog was awful, perhaps worse than the short little dialog bits in Skyrim.

Yeah, good designers can get around it if the entire game is built on it from the ground up. Bethesda have chosen to take a specific route and style where it doesn't work and that's entirely their own fault - just saying there are interesting reasons that lead to it too. Stuff like NPCs in MW never fighting each other without player interference. Radiant AI might not be as cool as they made it out to be but it's still a spanner in the works.

I think I covered Morrowind having linear and static quests/dialogue which would be even more jarring and weird in a game with modern production values.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Help I'm installing this stupid game again instead of playing something good

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I'm sure there's a good version of Morrowloot but I can't remember which one it is

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

It's still better than vanilla because the vanilla scaling loot is terrible :shrug: it should absolutely be more modular though, I hate feature creep.

Lunchmeat Larry fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Feb 16, 2018

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Internet Kraken posted:

I really disagree with this. The problem with stuff like Morrowloot is that while its interesting at first, it completely fucks up difficulty. It becomes way to easy to turn yourself into an overpowered death god because you found some absurd piece of gear. Which might seem cool at first but quickly loses its appeal for someone like me that wants combat to stay vaguely interesting. Then if you know about the location of something absurdly strong beforehand, you have to just ignore it otherwise you'll feel obligated to go straight for it. Cause if you're gonna break the game with OP loot eventually, why not just do it at the start?

I much prefer Skyrim because I feel like I can explore anywhere I want without accidentally turning myself into a death machine with one piece of OP gear. I think its a good compromise between the Morrowind system and Oblivion's ridiculous scaling where every bandit was equipped with glass armor the second you reach the appropriate level.

You're not wrong on the first point. On the other hand it's great to organically discover a really challenging area, get through it at a low level by guile and sneakiness and get a powerful item way ahead of schedule. It's one of the most fun things about open world RPGs to me and it's something that's just absent in vanilla game.

Like what's the point of exploring and adventuring in vanilla? Everything you find is going to be of a similar quality. If you stumble across a legendary artefact at a lower level you've outright screwed yourself because it's going to be obsolete in a few levels. It's not quite Oblivion but it's very close.

There have to be other mods that fix this a bit right

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Can't believe I installed 100+ mods at once on a fresh Oldrim install and I'm getting poor performance, how did that happen? Mystery

Joking aside I'm assuming it's either conflicting graphics mods or too many scripts running. For the former i guess I just have to disable them a few at a time. Any way to check the latter directly?

Lunchmeat Larry fucked around with this message at 11:13 on Feb 19, 2018

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Yeah, did the usual TES5Edit/LOOT/Wrye Bash dance. I'll post my modlist when I get home, there's probably some outdated stuff and/or fat that can be trimmed

VV yeah I think I might bin LotD for now. Seems like a mod to keep for an otherwise minimal setup or for when I finally get SSE. Also just realised I might not have installed the memory fix properly since I'm using MO

Lunchmeat Larry fucked around with this message at 12:00 on Feb 19, 2018

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Managed to get everything behaving itself with a bit of tweaking, mostly ini stuff that I'd forgotten to do through Mod Organizer. Everything's perfect now except my outside LODs are weird and ugly and occasionally, uh, purple triangles.

e: ok now it's just distant water that kind of looks like a distractingly ugly pale blue smear but whatever I'm not expecting miracles here

Lunchmeat Larry fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Feb 19, 2018

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

What are some fun Ordinator builds? I've mostly played with SPERG before now, usually magic-heavy, so I was thinking sword and board with heavy armour and Thunderchild shouts but at a quick glance the perks don't look too exciting so all of a sudden im thinking of adding some sneaking and ranged abilities and we all know where this is going

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Spellsword might be a shout, could work well with wintermyst for full EnaiaiSialon

Also uhh

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

does anyone have any thots on Zim's Immersive Artifacts? Is there a better mod that does similar things? I like unique items to actually be useful but I have no idea

https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/81036/

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I keep forgetting and installing stuff in program files and it's never really been an issue. Probably shouldn't be like me, though.

Langosta Whiteman posted:

tl;dr: Resto +Alt + Ench spell sword. Dumping stats into Magicka if you're a badass like me. Non-Destruction damage spell sword.

So first, the most important parts of the build are having CCO, Summermyst, and Apocalypse (and the raptor feet and BAT mods if you play an argonian, which you totally should, and you should also have all different colors on your argonians face and have Rainbow somewhere in his or her name.) Dumping all stats into magicka makes your spells take care of all offense and defense for you. Focus on getting the Tree Rings and Ocato's Recital spells, the Spirit Tutors perk, and the enchants Heal and Power Surge above all else.

Alteration is great for traveling spells and perks, and also your spell sword extras. Home Mythal + Dimension Door are awesome when you have a good permanent place for crafting and storage. You'll naturally want to get your spell sword perks, also the passive boots to magicka and resistances. Vancian Magic is interesting and still makes use of your magicka pool, even if it makes casting free.

Restoration is your damage and survivability. False Light is what I use, and with that branch and the Spirit Tutor branch you'll have exceptionally powerful offensive spells. Heal Other will be the majority of your damage. Tree Rings is your major survivability so make sure to keep it up in long fights. The duration will increase in your magic effects menu, but it will always last 30 seconds.

Enchanting is where you'll get buffs and Spellscribe. Make weapons with either Heal + nothing else, or Power Surge + anything but Heal. Reason being, False Light will let you deal out tons of damage from Heal (like 500k mid game), but will also reverse any other effect you combine with Heal. Heal + damage will turn into damage + healing on enemies, Heal + %effect will become damage + -%effect on enemies. Power Surge works best with Power of Knowledge and is typically what I use.

Everything else is to taste. Power Surge plus Apotheosis is hilariously powerful when combined with the Crusader stuff on the branch to the right. Add Spellscribe with Repel Undead and you trivialize fights with undead by way of burning them to ash while they run from you. The DoTs and buffs/debuffs scale with resto, again making stat dumping into your blue bar a worthwhile choice. Alchemy is pretty op, and will make you a god, so avoid it.

Stay safe, marsh friend.

this is great, going with something similar to this

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Just don't do what I did a few years ago and use apocalypse, spectraverse, dwemertech, forgotten magic and some other stuff I can't remember all together. You end up with like six tabs of spells and spend every fight agonizing over choice paralysis

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Langosta Whiteman posted:

and then I clicked the link and the first row of monsters was ducks and seagulls :v:

I wish some of those mods could transfer over to SE. I'm sure there's a way but I haven't figured it out yet. Having Nemesis chase me around sounds like it would own

I love the pigeons mod. Between their idiotic noises and my mods that add ambient drunk lunatics and make it grey and rainy all the time, Skyrim has never felt so much like home (scotland)

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Wildcat is fine, Smilodon is really just a stripped down version for SSE/console requirements

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Dark0ne pmed me on the es forums like fifteen years ago saying It was professional slander that I said his username was silly and I had to retract my comments. Now he runs the Nexus

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Sounds like they fit in with the main mod then

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

They keep forgetting to put loving Hearthfire on sale so I still don't have it

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

It's a matter of principle at this point

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I'm on og Skyrim and I've just come to accept that distant water will never really look right

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I'm too anxious to upgrade because I feel like I'll get days into the modding process and realise one of the mods I want to use hasn't been ported

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

If Bhruce Hammar has been ported, him

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I'm not generally an elitist about these things but can we just ban people without IP/legal qualifications from talking about theft and terms and contracts forever. I have a headache. What a loving idiot

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

Seems like it will be hard to find anyone defending him this go around, curious if the nexus will back him up again though.

They will yeah

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Nasgate posted:


IIRC there's specifically a clause about this in the TOU for the CK, or maybe the main game itself.
which probably isn't worth poo poo but don't tell the modders that

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

It's really weird that nobody has made any big Blackreach content/quest mods. It's just a big empty beautiful area, Bethesda already did more than half the hard work for you

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I modded my original Skyrim out the rear end a few months ago, played a few hours and promptly got distracted as usual. I wasn't too happy with the performance so I'm considering just getting SE, but use a lot of dumb mods that might not have been ported. If anyone can be bothered having a look through my list, is there anything major here that I won't be able to pick up for the SE?

Like, some of it is probably crap and needs unselected anyway, and I'm not going to cry too much if I have to go without whatever Realistic Husky Sounds is, but you know.

    # This file was automatically generated by Mod Organizer.
    +Religion - Prayer Meditation Worship
    +Vigilant of Stendarr Quests
    +Staff of Magnus Hotfix
    +Skyforge Hotfix
    +Bonemold Hotfix
    +New Beginnings -- Live Another Life Extension
    +Unique Uniques
    -Random Alternate Start
    +Achieve That
    +Vivid Clouds and Fogs
    +Skyrim Subsurface Scattering Patch for ENB
    +Skyrim Particle Patch for ENB
    +overwrite
    +NLA
    +High Quality LODs
    +Skyrim Distant Detail
    +Enhanced Night Skyrim
    +Watercolor for ENB and Realistic Water Two
    +Zim's Immersive Artifacts V1.4
    +Artifacts - The Tournament of the Ten Bloods
    +Better fast
    +Destroy the Thieves Guild - Final version
    +Alternate Start - Live Another Life
    +Apotheosis - Lifeless Vaults
    +The Choice is Yours - Fewer Forced Quests - Improved Dialogue Options
    +Open Civil War
    +aMidianBorn Book of Silence - Armors
    +Legendary Skyrim Crossbows
    +Diverse Dragons Collection 3 (DDC3)
    +Missives
    +Realistic Husky Sounds
    +TK HitStop
    +SkyFalls and SkyMills - Animated Distant Waterfalls and WindMills
    +The Skyrim Distance Overhaul Beta (S.D.O.)
    +Bypass Ustengrav
    +Bypass the Seven Thousand Steps
    +Bleakfalls Bypass
    -RealVision ENB 315b
    +Relics of Hyrule - A DLC Scale Zelda Mod
    +The Hanging Gardens - a Quest
    +Here There Be Monsters
    +Molag Bal's Inferno
    -The Forsworn Legacy
    +Skyrim Flora Overhaul
    +Blackreach Overhaul
    +Holidays
    +Dogs of Skyrim
    +Hidden Treasures
    +Pigeons- Elements of Skyrim pt.12 (mihail immersive add-ons- birds)
    +Phenderix Magic World
    +WARZONES - Civil Unrest 2015
    +Xenius Character Enhancement
    +Character Creation Overhaul 1_3_2-21587-1-3-2
    +Stones of Barenziah Quest Markers
    +Expanded Towns and Cities LE Version
    +Immersive Citizens - AI Overhaul
    +JK's Skyrim
    +Dawn of Skyrim (Director's Cut)
    +Darkend
    +Voyage to the Dreamborne Isles
    +VIGILANT Voiced - English Addon
    +VIGILANT
    +Immersive Weapons
    +Legacy of the Dragonborn (Dragonborn Gallery)
    +Beyond Skyrim - Bruma
    +Skyrim HD - 2K Textures
    +The Tools of Kagrenac
    +Magic Duel - Reborn
    +UIExtensions
    +Extensible Follower Framework
    +Immersive Armors
    +Static Mesh Improvement Mod
    +Snippy - Droid Follower
    +Frozen Electrocuted Combustion
    +Ultimate HD Fire Effects
    +Real Clouds
    +Skygazer Moons - Masser and Secunda Ultra HD 4K (2K and 1K) Moon Textures
    +Immersive College of Winterhold
    +Enhanced Lights and FX
    +Unique Grasses and Groundcovers - Nature and Landscape Enhancement
    +Enhanced Landscapes
    +NobleSkyrimMod HD-2K
    +Beyond Reach
    +Legendary cities - Tes Arena - Skyrim Frontier Fortress
    +Book Covers Skyrim
    +The Shadow of Meresis
    +The Forgotten City
    +Thirteenoranges
    +Wyrmstooth
    +Immersive Sounds - Compendium
    -Purity of True Storms - a compatibility patch
    +Farm Animals
    +Ducks and Swans for Skyrim 1_1
    -True Storms - Thunder and Rain Redone v1.5
    +The Notice Board
    +Interesting NPCs
    +Improved Combat Sounds
    +FSS - No pause between lines
    +Garm the Husky Companion
    +Immersive Patrols
    +Dwarven Colossus - Mihail Monsters and Animals (Mihail immersive add-ons - ESO)
    +TK Dodge
    +Mortal Enemies - De-aimbot Your Foes
    +Ultimate Dragons
    +Sneak Tools
    +Nock to Tip
    +Ultimate Combat
    +Realistic Ragdolls and Force
    +Fores New Idles in Skyrim - FNIS
    +ShowRaceMenu Precache Killer
    +Blackreach Railroad
    +Skyrim Immersive Creatures
    +Realistic Water Two
    +The Wheels of Lull
    +Konahrik's Accoutrements - Dragon Priest Armory
    +The Lost Wonders of Mzark
    +Aethernautics- A Space Travel Mod
    +Clockwork (Clockwork Castle)
    +INIGO
    +Enchanted Arsenal
    -Purity
    +Dwemer Spectres
    +Revenge Of the Enemies 2016
    +Extra Encounters Reborn
    +Common Clothes
    +Aesir Armor
    +Lore Weapon Expansion
    +Weapons of the Third Era
    +Wizard Hats
    +Aetherium Armor and Weapons Compilation
    +Automatic Variants
    +ASIS
    +Enhanced Blood Textures
    +Apocalypse - Magic of Skyrim
    +Ravengate - Riften Underground
    +Wildcat - Combat of Skyrim
    +Andromeda - Unique Standing Stones of Skyrim
    +Thunderchild - Epic Shouts and Immersion
    +VioLens - A Killmove Mod
    +Wintermyst - Enchantments of Skyrim
    +JaySuS Swords
    +Winter Is Coming - Cloaks
    +Cloaks of Skyrim
    +Bandolier - Bags and Pouches
    +Ordinator - Perks of Skyrim
    +Enhanced Skyrim Factions - The Companions Guild
    +Undeath
    +No Permanent Essentials
    +Complete Crafting Overhaul Remade
    +Clothing and Clutter Fixes
    +Even Better Quest Objectives
    +Dragon Stalking Fix
    +Weapons and Armor Fixes Remade
    +Cutting Room Floor
    +moreHUD
    +Dragon Soul Relinquishment
    +D13 Faster GET UP STAND UP animation vanilla friendly
    +Bring Out Your Dead
    +Skyrim Project Optimization
    +Convenient Horses
    +Immersive Animations
    +Lore-Based Loading Screens
    +Pumping Iron - Dynamic Muscle Growth
    +RaceMenu
    +Skyrim - Enhanced Camera
    +AutoSave Manager
    +Better Stealing
    +Better Jumping
    +Better MessageBox Controls
    +Better Dialogue Controls
    +Bounty Gold
    +A Quality World Map and Solstheim Map - With Roads
    +Mfg Console
    +Extended UI
    +Wiseman303's Flora Fixes
    +Enchantment Reload Fix
    +No stretching
    +Fuz Ro D-oh - Silent Voice
    +SkyTweak
    +Grimy Utilities
    +DienesTools
    +FileAccess Interface for Skyrim Script - FISS
    +Grimy Plugin
    +Modern Brawl Bug Fix
    +Bug fixes
    +Crash fixes
    +Unofficial Skyrim Legendary Edition Patch
    +Skyrim -Community- Uncapper
    +MorrowLoot Ultimate
    +SkyUI
    *Unmanaged: Dawnguard
    *Unmanaged: Dragonborn
    *Unmanaged: HearthFires
    *Unmanaged: Bashed Patch, 0
    +SKSE ini pre-download for lazy users

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

It's the unsorted list from MO lol

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Fantastic, thank you!! Really appreciate you taking the time to do that :)

And yeah I took a "download first, sort out on a second pass" approach, particularly on the content mods, so this will be a good opportunity to do so.

Easier question: I assume I'd just have a bad time if I tried to transfer my save?

edit: it just... worked. Save transfer just worked. It's fine. everything's fine. the game seems stable. wtf that was the last thing I expected

Lunchmeat Larry fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Oct 2, 2018

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Convenient Horses is the one most people use

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Fuzz posted:

Anyone know how to get Deadly Mutilation working on SE? I found a bunch of threads of pride complaining about the lack of SE, and then there's a tutorial that talks about having that Idle Animation thing which I can't seem to get MO2 to recognize correctly (says data is missing above) and then that XP32 Skeleton thing, as well as one of those weirdass body mods with giant boobs... is there any way to get it working on vanilla bodies without all the bullshit? Or a simple way? I'm years or of the loop loop on modding Bethesda games, and I've already got a mod list of about 70ish mods for sounds and textures and weather and crap because I'm playing on VR and want to see how far I can push it... I just want to dismember a dude and then Fusrodah him before he hits the ground to scatter his entrails across a mountainside*, is that too much to ask?


* - (not psychotic, I've just been spoiled by freezing Aard in Witcher 3)

Deadly Mutilation was released for sse not long ago but seems to have disappeared, might be able to find it somewhere

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

So I'm playing Vigilant and holy poo poo this mod owns (odd anime stuff like magical waifu lamae bal aside). I thought it was just a sort of Souls inspired dungeon or two but it's really extensive and impressive

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Uh guys my companions have all started randomly muttering Amalgam's lines from Clockwork Castle :ohdear:

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Dragon Soul Relinquishment lets you trade souls for unarmed damage if for some reason that seems like a better option than perk points

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

What enemy mods do people use these days? I've been running Revenge of the Enemies but I'm about to retire my character and have kind of had my fill of its fat sacks of HP who constantly killed my heavy armour alteration-buffed Paladin lad with one power attack until like level 40, and looking at reviews I've realised it's not just that I'm bad + running wildcat + refuse to go lower than Adept, it's just badly balanced.

Is advanced adversary encounters good??

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

is the consensus on Immersive Citizens still to avoid it? I don't really remember what the vanilla AI is like but I can't say I've been impressed with the weird conflict behaviours or the way everyone in any given city likes to pop out of the same door and scream at me, and also that happening in the game.

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

I vaguely remember that even when putting perks into illusion my spells were never high enough level to affect anything but the most harmless dreg enemies. Can't even remember what mods I was using at the time though

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Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Ms Adequate posted:

This looks good as hell, except for one extremely pressing question: Where the gently caress are my Tribunal, St. Veloth, Nerevarine, and Traditional Dunmer Ancestor Worship?
for the love of god don't ask him, he'll have a depression spiral where he says there's another mod that adds a St Veloth shrine and it's better than anything he could ever make and he should just go away and die and nobody will miss him

he's a dramatic fellow, but in an uh... unusual sense, as modders go

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