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Man, I don't know. I don't think there's a 19th person, at least not in this cycle. Beatrice's nuclear meltdown and the similarity of her appearance to Rosa's really just makes me think rosa is the main culprit for this scenario. She has two solid enough motivations to kill her siblings. Revenge and money. Jessica and George also represent unacceptable barriers to Maria becoming the heir. The servants can be explained as collateral damage. They knew too much and raised the risk level too high. Now all that remains, really, is Battler. I suppose this is too much why and not enough how, but those are the factors which make me believe that Rosa is the so called witch. She is also the person we see behave with the most outward violence. She is relatively young and appears physically healthy, so some feats of strength aren't out of her reach, unlike Kumasawa... And that last scene with Natsuhis room being broken into by the witch... Rosa has a firearm. If she can't kick the door down because of gohdas superior strength, she can shoot him through it. Then she can kill Shannon and George. So what, then, are Battler and Maria doing during my hypothetical version? POOL IS CLOSED fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Nov 19, 2016 |
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Nov 19, 2016 08:15
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NachtSieger posted:Well, George is probably busy being dead. Right, that should've been Battler!
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Nov 19, 2016 15:43
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whitehelm posted:Don't forget that last we knew, Rosa was barricaded in the room with Battler and Maria. You need to figure out how and when she snuck out with this theory. Unless she didn't sneak.
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Nov 19, 2016 17:04
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There are also two other servants on the island, right? Munon and Runon, I think? We've only been introduced sort of to one, who's a slacker.
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Nov 21, 2016 16:31
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Dr Pepper posted:They're two other servants who work for the Ushiryomias but weren't given a shift on the island for the conference. So other then a background reference they're not important. That's possible and likely, but at the same time, fairly tight narratives don't usually dispense mostly useless information, either. What I'm saying is they're totally children of the corn!
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Nov 21, 2016 16:52
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Mercury Hat posted:In that case, I propose that all of Jessica's classmates snuck onto the island to kill her and her family for beating them up with brass knuckles It's about as likely as witches! Also, seriously... brass knuckles. 
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Nov 21, 2016 19:44
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tiistai posted:At any rate, if nothing else this should prove Rosa didn't kill Shannon, George and Gohda by herself since she was with Battler the whole time since they were last seen. No way she could have snuck out, Well, that's something I've also been considering... It seems that at least some of the time, piece-Battler is also saying what meta-Battler is ranting at Beato. The other pawns at least sometimes respond to meta-Battler's rants and the setting transitions make it look like he's kinda dissociating? It's eroding my faith in his reliability.
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Nov 21, 2016 23:47
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KataraniSword posted:It's entirely possible that the metaverse/purgatorio version of Battler is in fact not the Battler that existed in this "game" prior to it being narrated. So here's a question that you'd never think to ask in a game where Magic And Witches Don't Exist: if you take the place of an alternate reality version of yourself, are you still you, or are you the alternate you? In my profession, there's the concept of independence in appearance versus independence in fact. I'm going to extend this concept to interdimensional body-swapping between the same being traveling along different forks in the timeline and say that if alpha-you takes the place of beta-you, for all intents and purposes, you are yourself, even if the experiences your alpha and beta have accrued have resulted in alpha and beta developing different perspectives and agendas. No one in the beta-timeline has demonstrated any ability to perceive alpha-purgatory besides meta-Battler. (let's just confuse all the prefixes, hooray!) There's no reason to believe that meta-Battler is more than a ghost caught in the machinery of the universe. I suspect he might be less, and is some coping mechanism by real-Battler -- whether the pawn/beta-Battler we're seeing in this ep, or some "true end" Battler we'll meet in the future. (I mean... these games usually do have a "true end", right? So I anticipate we'll encounter that eventually...)
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Nov 22, 2016 00:35
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SardonicTyrant posted:Imagine four Battlers on the edge of a cliff. I'm gonna fall out if Battler pops up with a playing card in one of these screenshots.
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Nov 22, 2016 01:37
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I think Rosa and Maria's headshots were swapped on this line: "...Are you saying... that you even want to be together with that kind of Mama...? Even though... I've been such a bad Mama...!!" drat, though.
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Nov 23, 2016 16:53
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Redmark posted:also, cow tits hm. Tongue salad does sound kinda good, though.
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Nov 24, 2016 18:59
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bman in 2288 posted:So... What was the point of being a monster to Rosa? What do they stand to gain from abusing a small child so? I guess it's easier to understand if you've been abused. Not to say that all victims are destined to take on that role themselves, but in my experience abuse leaves an indelible mark on not only how you perceive the world, but also how you cope with stress. Some people release that stress through tormenting someone who cannot fight back. Basically all the adults in this game have a poo poo load to answer for, and Kinzo above all.
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Nov 25, 2016 02:06
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Is Golden Beatrice truly an endless witch? Or is her power really just endless destruction of things not fated to end by her hand?
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Nov 30, 2016 16:26
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EagerSleeper posted:This family, I swear... With how much they have romances with furniture, I wonder how a trip to Ikea would go. We don't talk about the Ushroimiya vs Ikea and the people of Japan case. It's not fit for public broadcast.
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Nov 30, 2016 17:55
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They all seem to have been old enough to know that what they were doing was wrong when they abused Rosa. Rudolf included. Unfortunately, this type of behavior seems to have been normalized in the Ushiromiya family, so even though it was wrong, the siblings certainly felt like treating Rosa badly was their right as her elders. They're basically all badly behaved people who were abused by Kinzo and (just getting the hints from how they refer to her) their mother. The servants (with the exception of Gohda, who wasn't around for it) seem to have been subjected to some seriously dehumanizing poo poo, too. Plus Kinzo has had the current main branch of the family isolated on this dumpy island for the past 30 years. That's a long time to beat this nasty poo poo into his staff, his immediate family, and at least one grandkid.
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Dec 3, 2016 20:09
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CottonWolf posted:That was my read on it. Kinzo's a monster. The only question is, did Rosa kill old Beatrice from the intro or young Beatrice? Also, was that young Beatrice in the intro to this episode? If so, why does she refer to Kinzo as grandfather? Is she Krauss or Rudolf's child? Though that timeline doesn't really add up. If young Beatrice was that old then, Krauss and Rudolf would have been too young to impregnate anyone at the right time. Referring to an older man that you're close to as "grandfather" isn't that unusual in Japanese, so the most we can take away from it right now, I think, is that young Beato had a close relationship with her captor Kinzo. He's probably one of the few people she ever met. I suppose the soundest theory is that she's mistress Beatrice and Kinzo's daughter and may/may not be their only offspring. It's possible young Beato has had children of her own by this point, too, and they might be sent to the orphanage to get them off the island. It would be a little difficult to hide additional people, especially newborns, I think, and I doubt Kinzo would feel that attached to them once he has his precious Beatrice reborn to cling to.
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Dec 6, 2016 20:34
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That might make a nice avatar.
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Dec 7, 2016 16:14
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Eva seems especially aggressive this episode, and it's grating as hell.
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Dec 7, 2016 16:52
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bman in 2288 posted:Oh poo poo, really? I did not pick up on that. Yeah, solving the mystery would be less motivating if the children and servants weren't also murdered.
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Dec 7, 2016 20:47
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Polydactyly is tied to more than 3 dozen genetic mutations, some of which are dominant. (I don't know if it would still manifest as extra toes, though.) I don't think the game has mentioned if Kinzo inherited it from one of his parents, or if his was an apparently spontaneous expression. Sometimes the trait appears to skip generations, so his parents might not have expressed polydactyly, but could've each independently carried recessive alleles. Let's assume Kinzo's wife is the biological mother of all 4 siblings but doesn't have any recessive or dominant polydactyly genes and Kinzo's polydactyly is a dominant allele. Then if I remember right, each kid has a 50% chance of inheriting polydactyly from Kinzo. The cumulative probability of one or more siblings having an extra digit is something like 93% (thanks to Sodacan who linked me to a binomial probability calculator thing, because I couldn't remember how the hell to calculate this morning).
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Dec 9, 2016 17:40
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I think witches aren't being counted as humans, so she's not violating her own rules.
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Dec 9, 2016 20:04
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Killing was the only way to make him stop interrupting and listen Honestly, youth these days.
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Dec 9, 2016 21:33
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This doesn't eliminate someone's chimpanzee theory.
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Dec 10, 2016 00:34
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EagerSleeper posted:It actually does. If Beatrice were any number of chimpanzees, she'd be an excellent climber and hence would not have fallen to her death. Chimpanzee theory: disproven. hmm, i didn't look at it this way... but what if, once freed from her cage of flesh, Beatrice was able to summon x chimpanzees to Rokkenjima, and use them as furniture to do her bidding?
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Dec 10, 2016 03:54
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resurgam40 posted:Magic is only "real" if it can be performed exactly the same in front of everyone, and so far, it has only been performed in front of "believers" in magic or people who ended up dead by the end of the story. Legitimate energy sources, metamorphoses, and systems of physics do not suddenly stop working depending on who's observing; that isn't how those things work. And the metaphorical, systematic meanings behind these acts are not only hinted at by the author to be the truth, but are far more interesting to me than any so-called magic has been yet. they're bald chimps in diapers 
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Dec 12, 2016 19:33
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SardonicTyrant posted:
Yeah. Wow, Kumasawa.
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Dec 13, 2016 15:27
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EagerSleeper posted:I was about to say RIP Gohda and Kumasawa, but then this (wonderful, exciting) bullshit happened. My hypothesis is now that Kumasawa is the mistress. 
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Dec 13, 2016 18:01
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tiistai posted:I don't know where you guys are getting this, even the narration says she doesn't look anything like Kumasawa. Clearly they're completely different people. Say it in red, witch!
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Dec 13, 2016 19:16
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Sindai posted:Poor Gohda, he's the only person who's not a secret wizard. He's a kitchen wizard! 
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Dec 13, 2016 22:41
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Yeah, that fight was very much like a game of pretend one upsmanship between kids. Which isn't that different from how Beato treats meta Battler.
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Dec 14, 2016 15:36
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Beatrice wants worship just like any divine being! 
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Dec 14, 2016 17:09
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KataraniSword posted:Alternately, if you believe in magic/ It was a pretty good turnaround, I have to admit. But still very much "children pretending to be superheroes" at the same time. What happens when our (And what happened to the weird lolita witches from the last chapter? Did they just get the boot?)
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Dec 15, 2016 23:29
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, that was some Fist of the North Star 
poo poo. You are already dead, indeed.
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Or she was about to lie and Ronove stopped her so she wouldn't gently caress up the redtext.
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Dec 18, 2016 19:56
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tiistai posted:You'll just go mad if you start doubting even the basic premises. But what she started to say wasn't in red. 
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Dec 18, 2016 23:19
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If you're counting Japanese syllables, keep in mind that they count based on the hiragana, not really on the sounds. So Rokkenjima would have one more syllable of that double k is based on a tsu, I believe. Tbf it's been a long time since I studied the language. I'm pretty sure the key is also a person rather than an object or code. Knowingly or not, whoever the key is is the person choosing the first six victims. I think that person is probably a child, though maybe not Maria. Still, she does get the witch's letter first... I feel like we need more details about Kinzo before this can reasonably be solved but the speculation is very good.
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Dec 20, 2016 07:08
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My brain has stopped at likewise drawing the conclusion that the riddle involves a really tortuous metaphor for sex and childbirth. Maybe I've had too much wine this evening. 
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Dec 21, 2016 02:31
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So this room sounds like his combo mistress den and nursery, maybe.
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Dec 21, 2016 16:02
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The riddle isn't finished yet, I think; after all, there's still all the stuff about the key and the murder-twilights. Do you think we'll miss out on more murders? I don't. Beatrice isn't done yet. She's showing Battler this for a reason. Moreover, until all the players acknowledge Eva, she hasn't really won. There's no reason to think that she'll survive for much longer. The same may be said of Rosa.
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Dec 21, 2016 19:15
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EagerSleeper posted:Why does Kinzo keep someone hidden in an underground bunker for years on end? Why does any other awful person do it? 
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Dec 22, 2016 00:06
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Honestly, given the magic flung about and the constantly shifting orders of the murders, I don't know how much of this to believe.
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Dec 22, 2016 06:14
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