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radmonger posted:He's the political version of that plan to eliminate mosquitoes by releasing sterile ones that are supposed to fill the relevant ecological niche and then die without issue. 
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Nov 1, 2016 16:46
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radmonger posted:He's the political version of that plan to eliminate mosquitoes by releasing sterile ones that are supposed to fill the relevant ecological niche and then die without issue. I'd like that to be true, but I'm not sure that it describes Corbyn in the current political/media climate.
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Nov 1, 2016 16:48
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As has been pointed out numerous, numerous times, mainstream parliamentary Labour doesn't really have a viable alternative either. which is not really surprising in the wake of a very big recession, even if that recession is not, strictly speaking, Westminster's fault Labour was going to spend a couple of years in the wilderness regardless, and there are worse things to do than spend it on ideological innovation
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Nov 1, 2016 16:50
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It's pretty cool to have a party leader that wants to improve the NHS and nationalise the railways. The NHS is probably the best thing about Britain and it was sad when all the major party leaders wanted to either destroy it or not oppose its destruction.
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Nov 1, 2016 16:52
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ronya posted:As has been pointed out numerous, numerous times, mainstream parliamentary Labour doesn't really have a viable alternative either. The other thing that gets glossed over is that there's failure and then there's failure. Brown and Miliband underperformed, Brown probably unavoidably and Miliband not because ideologically he was in the wrong place but because he was personally a terrible leader and campaigner. Fine. Claiming that the Labour Right lost 2 elections and therefore there's no difference if the Labour Left loses an election conveniently skips over the fact that there's a big difference between losing an election with 30% of the vote and losing an election with 20% of the vote.
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Nov 1, 2016 16:56
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Alchenar posted:The other thing that gets glossed over is that there's failure and then there's failure. well, we know that too. Kinnock lost in 1992. He had not moved rightward enough. but a big part of winning is the metagame of successfully manipulating the Labour left so that the part which publicly attacks you is the part that the British public actually despises, and the rest maneuvered into grudging internalization of electoral logic - that's the source of "credibility".
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Nov 1, 2016 17:02
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Who in the PLP is charismatic and racist enough to win over the English public and win the next election?
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Nov 1, 2016 17:03
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Alchenar posted:The other thing that gets glossed over is that there's failure and then there's failure. Practically speaking what is this big difference?
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Nov 1, 2016 17:04
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jabby posted:Practically speaking what is this big difference? It's the difference between being Labour (29%) and being the Lib Dems (23%)
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Nov 1, 2016 17:07
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hakimashou posted:ETA Miftan, Tthough I hate to spoil the SA fun for you, some idiot goon from the video games bought me this AV for reasons that have absolutely nothing to do with D&D or slavery or racism. Sorry if it lead to confusion, but far be it from me to waste another goon's hard earned I've seen you post in I/P, so I got most it first hand, thanks. Onto things that are actually interesting: Labour wasn't going to win 2020 regardless of who is in charge, unless it's Theresa May or possibly Thatcher. It's much better for them to get their act together over a couple of years and present an actual alternative in 2025. Yes, another 5 years of tories is gonna gently caress over lots of people, but I don't see an alternative. Maybe #libdemfightback?
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Nov 1, 2016 17:07
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by changing it back.
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Pissflaps posted:https://twitter.com/MSmithsonPB/status/793448972362940416
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Nov 1, 2016 17:11
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ronya posted:As has been pointed out numerous, numerous times, mainstream parliamentary Labour doesn't really have a viable alternative either. Labour tried ideological innovation, that's how we ended up with Blair. What it needs to do is go back to the party roots.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:22
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kustomkarkommando posted:A lot of articles have gingerly pointed out that rumours that heseltine strangled a dog to death have apparently been swirling around Westminster for years The first scene of the American Game of Thrones was pretty much this 
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Nov 1, 2016 17:29
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feedmegin posted:The first scene of the American Game of Thrones was pretty much this You mean House of Cards? But then Game of Thrones did have a dead, uhh, dog, execution of an innocent man and incest + child murder, so maybe, just maybe, it fits too. I'd like to think we're not quite there yet though  e: dammit spent too long finding a good emoticon Private Speech fucked around with this message at 17:37 on Nov 1, 2016 |
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Nov 1, 2016 17:33
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Jedit posted:Labour tried ideological innovation, that's how we ended up with Blair. What it needs to do is go back to the party roots. So you're saying Labour tried idealogical innovation and it ended up in government for 13 years. It's currently going 'back to its roots' and no fucker will vote for it.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:34
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Cerv posted:It's the difference between being Labour (29%) and being the Lib Dems (23%) Not really, because Labour's status as the official opposition is essentially secure even if they do suffer a catastrophic defeat. Barring the rise of either the lib dems or a new party to hitherto unknown levels, which seems unlikely, the loss of even a hundred seats would be damaging but would not really change the 'labour vs the tories' narrative of the country.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:35
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ronya posted:As has been pointed out numerous, numerous times, mainstream parliamentary Labour doesn't really have a viable alternative either. A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: "Corbyn and his supporters are preventing mainstream Labour from developing a viable alternative."
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Nov 1, 2016 17:36
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hyper from Pixie Sticks posted:What're the chances of a really cold winter? Well, they say global warming will eventually disrupt the gulf stream which will turn London into Siberia, so there's a bit of hope in the (not so) long run Speaking of which, Nat Geo posted their Di Caprio climate change documentary on youtube. Watch it and despair.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:36
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Jedit posted:Labour tried ideological innovation, that's how we ended up with Blair. What it needs to do is go back to the party roots. there's no winding back OMOV, it's why Corbyn has Momentum and not a horde of loyalists controlling key committees both the Labour right and left are adapting rapidly
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Nov 1, 2016 17:36
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: lmao, no he isn't. The Labour right are in the media enough that if they had a message that resonated with people that would be obvious. They've been trying some variation of "do what the Tories are doing" since 2010 and it doesn't work because there's already a party that appeals to people like that and it's called the Tories. Bonus points to the Progress wing of the party for going from hardcore Europhiles to calling for a hard Brexit and deportations and expecting people to be too stupid to notice.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:46
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jabby posted:Not really, because Labour's status as the official opposition is essentially secure even if they do suffer a catastrophic defeat. Barring the rise of either the lib dems or a new party to hitherto unknown levels, which seems unlikely, the loss of even a hundred seats would be damaging but would not really change the 'labour vs the tories' narrative of the country.
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Nov 1, 2016 17:57
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: I'm not sure the PLP's lack of talent is Corbyn's fault.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:04
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OwlFancier posted:I'm not sure the PLP's lack of talent is Corbyn's fault. He's hardly setting a high bar though is he. 30 years+ on the back benches and all his supporters can say about him is 'he makes jam'.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:09
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Pissflaps posted:He's hardly setting a high bar though is he. 30 years+ on the back benches and all his supporters can say about him is 'he makes jam'. That is a very silly response and I know you can do better.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:11
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He's a very silly leader of the opposition.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:12
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You're boring.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:22
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Pissflaps posted:He's a very silly leader of the opposition. Name a better one
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Nov 1, 2016 18:35
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quote:The Labour party backed her amendment in the Lords, and peers voted for it by 282 to 180. How do people actually figure this kind of stuff out anyway? I've been digging through parliament.uk's bill stages and part of the hansard for certain bills and it seems like it's almost impossible to figure out when amendments get voted on and when. Vague question I know but is the One Weird Trick I've been missing or is it really just the horrible slog it seems like it is?
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Nov 1, 2016 18:39
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: how hilariously pathetic "if we just had a big badge that says Official Leader on it we'd be able to suddenly discover unfound talents". That's your appeal to centrism. There's a reason you're the laughing stock.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:45
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: Remember when Liz Kendall thought that a million people would sign up to the Labour party to vote for her in the leadership election? How did that work out, remind me
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Nov 1, 2016 18:50
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drat that old quiet jam-making politician who only ran for leader because it was his turn out of the tiny old left group of Labour MPs and his incredible ability to destroy the chances and organisational skills of the popular, well known politicians with their well thought out program for the future of the Labour Party and the UK.
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Nov 1, 2016 18:58
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: "His supporters" being the majority of the party membership.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:00
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radmonger posted:A sentence in the passive voice can often be improved by a suitable rewrite. For example, try: Man how delusional do you have to be to regard ronya as a wide eyed Corbynite
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Nov 1, 2016 19:07
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namesake posted:drat that old quiet jam-making politician who only ran for leader because it was his turn
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Nov 1, 2016 19:09
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namesake posted:drat that old quiet jam-making politician who only ran for leader because it was his turn out of the tiny old left group of Labour MPs and his incredible ability to destroy the chances and organisational skills of the popular, well known politicians with their well thought out program for the future of the Labour Party and the UK. It turns out that giving a quiet old man who makes jam a leadership position doesn't work.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:10
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Cerv posted:Isn't that the root of a lot of the problems? He ran because it was his turn, not because he wanted to run or any of the left group of MP actually thought he was a qualified candidate. And no one even on his side expected him to win, or had any serious plan for what to do with the leadership if he did. No, the root of the problem is that the PLP will not allow any other left wing candidate to stand for party leader.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:11
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Pissflaps posted:It turns out that giving a quiet old man who makes jam a leadership position doesn't work. Only if the population is easily misled and wrong on most things.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:11
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Pissflaps posted:So you're saying Labour tried idealogical innovation and it ended up in government for 13 years. It's currently going 'back to its roots' and no fucker will vote for it. Why do you want Labour to be the party for racists? Are you racist? Pissflaps posted:It turns out that giving a quiet old man who makes jam a leadership position doesn't work. More the pity that you don't recognize the tragedy of this.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:12
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I would be real happy if the bulk of the party would up and get behind a solid left platform without thinking of their careers first and foremost.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:14
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Steve2911 posted:Only if the population is easily misled and wrong on most things. Being old and quiet and into jam making aren't enviable qualities. Maybe there's more to him than this but it's all his supporters in this thread ever say about him. Old. Quiet. Jam.
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Nov 1, 2016 19:16
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