Guy DeBorgore posted:

IIRC with the subsidies, poor and middle-income people pay much less under PPACA than they would've beforehand, and that would still be true after the price hikes this year. it's just that it has a high sticker price.

Adventure Pigeon posted:

So here's a question, how do we shift the academic left to where it needs to be? Because right now the focus is on race and gender and how everyone that disagrees is a racist sexist that won't acknowledge their privilege, and that's where the next batch of fresh faced young campaign staffers, thinkpiece writers, and everything else is coming from. They're going to make it very hard for Democrats to shift back to being the party of the poor, because that's not even on their radar. Hell, I imagine to them the Trump victory just validates everything they've been told about rural voters.

Strep Vote posted:

https://mobile.twitter.com/orientdistress/status/796664869764419584#tweet_796664869764419584

HannibalBarca posted:

Speaking of the Democratic party being in shambles right now, let's count the ways:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/democratic-party-in-crisis-trump-president-231134


“I don’t know who’s in charge. Who would email me?” said one state party chairman when asked if he’d heard from other party leaders.

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

Treating disenfranchised people as disposable demographics who don't factor into your political calculus is why you got the numbers wrong AND loving LOST.

Typo posted:

OTOH maybe it's good that the dems has to face those issues today instead of in 2020

guts and bolts posted:

What needs to happen is for an actual national dialogue to take place to get at the root causes of why people do things like "intentionally vote Donald J. Trump into the office of the Presidency"

What is actually happening and what will probably continue to happen is smug virtue signalling nonsense calling for the (un)ironic disenfranchisement of rural whites

While educated leftists stay in a race to see who can be the most Progressive™ and Enlightened™ in all the land, people like Trump will continue to "tell it like it is" and win in 2020 and really for the foreseeable future

Democrats are supposedly represented by the demographics of America's future, but we're not even going to loving make it to that future if this poo poo keeps up, so yep, time to put on the big boy pants and figure out why the gently caress we didn't just appeal to people's empty-rear end bank accounts and depressed counties and the lovely job market for lower middle-class people and make a plan to improve that poo poo, time to figure out why people associate the Left with elitist jerk-offs so stuffed up their own asses they literally cannot fathom losing the general election because haha that other guy, right?, time to figure out that even if you totaled up every POC vote and LGBT vote in the loving country it can't defeat the 63% of the country's eligible voters you have apparently alienated with your messaging

dehumanize yourself and face to bloodshed i guess

LinYutang posted:

@freddiedeboer is really great right now

https://twitter.com/freddiedeboer/status/796705717558374400
https://twitter.com/crushingbort/status/796796039558819840

Sheng-ji Yang posted:

https://twitter.com/nytimes/status/796831076886970368

jesus christ

Full Fascism Now

Pick posted:

Clinton was between a rock and a hard place on appealing to women. Feminism is very divided, enough that I would say even "2nd wave" and "3rd wave" are not distinguishing enough to properly communicate the magnitude of the difference. The first type is primarily grounded in economics. For example, things we take for granted now but needed to fight for: bank accounts without a male co-signer, can't be fired for pregnancy, can't be denied services on the basis of sex. The second is grounded on social behavior. For example, cat-calling, media representation, marketing/body image. I genuinely think Clinton cared more about the former, but campaigned heavily on the latter. Women who are older and who are poor care more about the former, in my experience--and in many cases it is justified, because a person's first priority is food on the table. That is why Taylor Swift weighing in would not do anything to change a Trump-voting woman's mind.

Pick posted:

2nd wave: pay us equally, stop raping us
3rd wave: burlesque is empowering, anything lena dunham does

hailthefish posted:

And the well's so completely loving poisoned on discourse about it, both by the people with weird fringe viewpoints trying to co-opt the whole movement, and by the fuckers on the alt-right who've gleefully co-opted any possible term you could use to describe to the weird-fringe-viewpoint people and started using it to apply to the whole movement anyone with an opinion on gender politics more progressive than the saudi morality police.

Corek posted:

https://twitter.com/GovHowardDean/status/796838538641833990

Sheng-ji Yang posted:

Sir Tonk posted:

No way, I'm actually surprised that Schumer is backing Ellison.

DaveWoo posted:

He's followed up on that tweet

https://twitter.com/jonathanweisman/status/797177693582331904

Oh, okay, maybe he just worded his original tweet badly and-

https://twitter.com/jonathanweisman/status/797177951733317632

ffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffffff

Zikan posted:

democratic civil war update

http://www.cwa-union.org/news/releases/cwa-endorses-keith-ellison-for-chair-of-democratic-national-committee

Atrocious Joe posted:

http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/obama-approve-dakota-access-pipeline-231255

Typo posted:

yes there will be

Well What Now posted:

he's not wrong but it's way the wrong drat time to say this

BUSH 2112 posted:

maybe i'm just being a douche here, but this poo poo is driving me loving insane. a dude who didn't win the popular vote, has no experience, was colluding or at least complicit in the illegal hacking of a loving political party by a foreign country, and has said and proposed horrid bullshit is the president elect. they're treating this loving rear end in a top hat with kid gloves, and the media is completely uninterested. "well it turns out russia admitted that is was in contact with trump and his staffers the whole time, now look at this guy who photoshops himself into some d-list tart's photos! that's news!"

seriously, gently caress all of these people. i feel like the liberal version of a goddamn breitbart reader, how the gently caress is this all going down without incident? i honestly can't believe that it's all getting swept under the rug by everyone with any power.

Venom Snake posted:

Guess what. Trump won so now they are trying to curry favor with him. Although I will say Trump has woken some individual reporters up to the danger Trump poses to the free press.

Fast Luck posted:

These were Bernie's appointments to the platform committee

Atrocious Joe posted:

https://twitter.com/markos/status/796767945334648832

DailyKos getting dark man

comingafteryouall posted:

I don't know if this would have worked for Donald Trump, though. Trump lying his rear end off didn't matter because Clinton was completely untrustworthy. But if he's up against a real honest politician with actual principals? Stuff might have mattered.


This is the most terrifying prospect I have ever faced while following American politics.

Holy gently caress.

Peel posted:

anyway, the heavy focus on reforming democratic economic stances, while important, imo continues to obscure a point itt: that the #1 threat to democratic success in future elections, and one of the key causes of the disaster on election day, is republican attempts to prevent minorities voting. they already have met with success and now they control more state governments, the justice department, and might have more of the supreme court. on the face of it making sure their base is allowed to vote at all in future elections is the most important task for the democratic party right now. hopefully obama will still try to do this even though his position is much worse

this is one reason why i keep dragging things back to race itt. no matter how important advancing a positive economic message is, this was the core issue of the last election, will be of the next, and the democrats neglect it at their peril

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

No, this is exactly what I was looking for, thanks.

I studied history in college, so I got a headful of what the worst in race, sex, nationality privileges actually looked like. So Idpol stuff was like an alien language to me. I think young people are especially vulnerable to that kind of rhetoric because those are the issues which most directly affect their lived experiences so - while they're still important, they also don't fear the need for healthcare, or (usually) don't have kids to raise. The tangible threat of material danger doesn't occur to them.

Fidel Castronaut posted:

I don't want to throw the baby out with the bathwater. There are valuable parts of identity politics that should remain and I don't think it is completely incompatible with Marxist/Marxist-lite class politics. One thing that must go is the overemphasis on representation in politics and media. One of my favorite stories of the importance of representation is Nichelle Nichols wanting to quit Star Trek and MLK telling her that it's important for little black girls to see a black woman who is on TV and not just a maid. Mae Carol Jemison, the first black female astronaut, cites Uhura as an important inspiration for her own path to space exploration. That's loving awesome and I love that and we need more of that. However, Hillary being a woman, Huma Abedin being a Muslim-American woman, Donna Brazille being a black woman...none of this added up to a candidacy that women of color and white women found incredibly appealing. Representation matters but it can't be everything because being a woman doesn't mean you can't be oppressing women too.

I should be high for this poo poo.

Gringostar posted:

the silver lining of trump as president is that because he's so hated it will be easier to get people to come out and try and flip / keep seats to at least get one branch of government back

you just also need a message for working class people to vote for which has been the achillies heel of dems for 30 years

Fullhouse posted:

the "disaster" here is the terrifying part. if they called a convention just to make gun ownership mandatory and abortion illegal that would obviously be terrible but it wouldn't destroy the country overnight

MJ12 posted:

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/11/clintons-popular-vote-lead-will-grow-and-grow/507455/

This article is interesting because it's actually a good bridge if you're trying to convince centrist liberals to support more progressive policy. Clinton did, in fact, mobilize a pretty significant number of Democratic voters. In fact, her turnout might be within striking distance of Obama '12, which is pretty impressive since Obama had all of Clinton's brilliance, none of her baggage, and a lot of charisma. But middle America wasn't part of that coalition. They were left out, and they voted for Trump instead because they were desperate, because they were tired, and because, yes, some of them were racists who'd normally have sat it out, but we don't need or want #3. Democrats and millenials didn't fail Clinton, unless by that you mean you want to organize a million Democrats to move to the Rust Belt.

Clinton didn't fail to inspire the people she was talking to and the people whose issues she was speaking of addressing. She just, like so many people before her, failed to address the issues of a group which was hurting and desperate and looking with nostalgia in better times, and Trump tapped into that vein of dissatisfaction. The one thing Trump said that resonates with me right now is this. "What the hell have you got to lose?" I think, more than "Make America Great Again," that's what Trump's campaign was based on, and why it won. We let these guys rot so long they figured they had nothing to lose. And we hosed up. We took them for granted and we hosed up.

Thinking of it, I think the whole "Clinton was a Bad Candidate with a Bad Campaign (TM)" message is somewhat counterproductive no matter how true it is because it implies that if Clinton had been more charismatic (like Corey Booker) and her campaign had tweaked its algorithms better, they'd have won handily. Which is:

1. Probably true;
2. Justifies centrists going "we can do the same thing in 2020 and win."
3. Is probably going to make people who supported Clinton less inclined to listen (see #2).

And I get that lots of you guys got shat on by Clinton supporters and schadenfreude is fun and good but you're gonna need to convince the centrists to shut up and vote for your candidate too at some point. I agree with about 90% of what's said in this thread. I agree that there are systemic issues with the Democratic party as it is. But I think that these issues are systemic-and it's not just about Clinton.

Well What Now posted:

I don't disagree with the message and I don't even object to the source, but imma gonna sigh really loudly right now ok

Segmentation Fault posted:

Same reason tumblr identitarians love Steven Universe: it's garbage for intellectual babies with the nutritional value of chicken mcnuggets

Segmentation Fault posted:

The guy who runs this patreon once made a satire video using clips from Glenn Beck's radio show set to Donald Duck, now he's crying about violence in video games

LinYutang posted:

bernie openly firing broadsides at the Dem establishment

Terror Sweat posted:

https://twitter.com/CoryBooker/status/797836749326155776

lmao he quoted himself on an inspirational quote thing

what a piece of poo poo

punk rebel ecks posted:

The primary had people on edge. Establishment Democrats were threatened by Bernie winning as he would be too radical for the American public and thus lose to the Republican Nominee. The Left Wing Goldwater so to speak. it was THE argument they always used.

Typo posted:

The democrats are losing more elections aren't they

FuriousxGeorge posted:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/05/14/obama-mocks-gop-you-drove_n_576170.html

exmarx posted:

https://twitter.com/sam_kriss/status/798096900578799616

Rand alPaul posted:

He said mean things about oil companies in Louisiana.

Slime Bro Helpdesk posted:

I don't necessarily want to say Obama didn't care, but from the articles coming out (and the reality of how badly they've done in Senate, House, and State campaigns), the issues facing the DNC are more than just ideological- they've been structurally weak for more than a decade. Beyond just bad leadership, they do not have the ability to mobilize in the way people imagine they could based on Obama For America's success in 2008/2012.

I don't think anyone here will agree with me, but I'm starting to lean more towards Dean for DNC chair. Yes it's a risk to moving the party left- but there needs to be some serious management there to get the party ready to win states.

Venom Snake posted:

https://twitter.com/SimonMaloy/status/796901222687080449

I rate this hot take actually fairly reasonable

mrmcd posted:

Also as long as we're adding planks to our new platform, I think one of them should be:

"Vote for us and Yoko Ono will never do this again"
https://twitter.com/yokoono/status/797187458505080834

FuriousxGeorge posted:

He was never like, hated by black voters during the primary or anything. Hillary just ran a better campaign with them. She's not totally incompetent.

etalian posted:

Trump supporters attacked the cast of SV at a LA bar and got thrown out

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2016/nov/12/kumail-nanjiani-thomas-middleditch-trump-supporters

Majorian posted:

Trump could get all the help he could possibly want from the Dems in bringing the old manufacturing jobs back to the Rust Belt, and it still wouldn't happen. He knew he didn't have a plan for that. He told those voters a lie that they desperately wanted to believe. His big mistake was in making that promise, without a plan for how to make it happen, or even appear to happen in the most shallow way possible.

Majorian posted:

Well, but that's my point: Trump promised them their old jobs, or something very similar to their old jobs. He promised that protectionist policies and bullying America's trade partners would bring the old manufacturing jobs back to the Rust Belt. He doesn't have a plan for making good on this promise, and he doesn't seem to have one for bringing new types of jobs back to the Rust Belt, either. Trump's strategy for bringing back the jobs, as expressed on the campaign trail, is basically as follows:

Step 1: Engage in trade war with China, Mexico, India, and other current U.S. trade partners.
Step 2: Get rid of all regulations possible.
Step 3: ???
Step 4: Profit!

He doesn't have a clue what he's doing.

Rand alPaul posted:

All those photoshops of her as Daenerys when really she's Cersei

Lord of Pie posted:

She's Catelyn Stark

The Rust Belt sends its regards

Aurubin posted:

Is Jill Stein president yet?

MaxxBot posted:

https://twitter.com/NellSco/status/815651004158853120

anime was right posted:

https://twitter.com/CNN/status/815571243516706817

theres some good salt in this twitter thread

etalian posted:

Joementum posted:

https://twitter.com/ByronYork/status/815680272595374082

Aurubin posted:

That said, pick Tom Perez, because Obama endorsed him I mean...uh...FUCKIN' BERNIE BROS! Also, this whole article just yells about identity politics and ignoring the working class, meaning they don't know a loving thing about Ellison.

Nonsense posted:

Laura Perry
3 hours ago
I don't watch television so I had never seen the Bernie Sanders ad until now. I think it's immensely offensive: there must be several hundred people shown in this ad, and I see four fleeting images of African-American faces and one possibly Asian-American. His America is definitely not mine, and I wouldn't want to live in his.

For what it's worth, I'm an over-60 white female Democrat, and I have spent all but one year of my life living in cities. The one year I tried living in the country, I felt I was living in Ghostville: all I could see were middle class white faces. So I fled back to MY America, where I see and live with all manner of colors and classes, people of poverty and people with Ph.D.s; Jews, Christians, Muslims, Black Muslims, Hindus and people of no faith.