Thirsty Dog posted:

Mods please move this thread to TVIV tia

Captain Rufus posted:

Pkunk armada from Star Control 2

mcjomar posted:

well okay, I'll bite, "Random trade nutters blockade world because of sith shenanigans, Jedi sent to investigate" is sort of an idea with potential.
Throw in "this is how Vader was discovered and trained by Obi-wan" to 'resolve' a plot point, and maybe it's sellable. Apparently we're also explaining how he met Luke's mum, but whatever.

Pod Racing, Neeson, and McGregor are also kind of workable (I would legitimately watch a star wars movie about Qui-Gon and Obi-wan and their space detective investigations, like a buddy cop PI movie, but with glowsticks - and now that I say that, I still have no clue how nobody ever considered the idea). Oh yeah, that one big lightsaber duel at the end was kinda cool I guess.

But here's where it breaks down - Padmé is pretty much cradlerobbing, because Anakin is played as being creepy as poo poo in the second movie. Also, whiny, which is the bigger sin, for me, but let's keep going with the first movie. Anything to do with gungans and midichlorians is automatically bad by sheer definition, and should be removed wholesale from the movie. Bad racial stereotyping also (one member of the race is like this so all are like this ) because holy gently caress why would you even do this.
Cue die hard-ism "Sand? Who gives a poo poo about sand?"

Honestly the whole "leader escapes, goes to beg for help, gets turned down and promptly goes back and gathers allies to stage an uprising and/or guerilla warfare to reclaim planet" is a pretty reasonable trope, but ends up being played in the shittiest way because CGI, Gungans, and the inevitable cyclical plot points trying (badly) to imitate ANH (such as, big fight against big object, inexperienced kid blows it up with one well placed shot. Mentor dies in front of student, imparts some sort of message, student gets angry and starts attacking. There's plenty more, just look) which is I guess an attempt to say "all this has happened before, all this will happen again", but ends up being hamfisted.

There's good set of ideas in there, buried under a CGI mountain of bullshit and bad calls.

But that's just the first movie.
Number two?

If you strip out absolutely anything to do with Anakin, you end up with a semi-decent movie about Obi-wan Kenobi, space detective, and it's better for it.
Whiny teen drama is boring, news at 11.

Kenobi vs Fett is a pretty cool face off, and a fairly reasonable plot line. It gets screwed up because Lucas, but the basic idea is sound when you boil it back to the start. But if this had been a TV show, maybe it would have worked.
Clones? Also potentially workable, especially given the "manipulation" involved on the part of Sidious (okay, here's an aside, lovely Darth naming conventions endemic to star wars - Vader = Father, Sidious = insidious, Maul = violent attacky bastard, Dooku = wtf I don't even know. Dracula? Point is Lucas has a history of giving his Darths some lovely and obvious names. Devil's advocate maybe that's the point, as the Sith are possibly not always supposed to be subtle, even when that's what they're trying to do).
Problem? The whole thing ends up being a bit shallow as a vehicle to set up Palpatine's rise to power, but devil's advocate again, this is a movie, rather than a several month long TV show, so we only have so much time.

Then we have student following mentor into danger to rescue mentor but loving up because of inexperience (oh hello, plot point from ESB, where Luke went to rescue a bunch of people he looked up to and failed, and also lost part of a limb, force is cyclical, blah blah blah ) which as tropes go is fairly standard. Honestly this section makes Padme come across as a slightly stronger character, i.e. not a damsel in distress, much like Leia who is the best shot in the original trilogy (no poo poo, go look).

But then the inevitable repeat during the Dooku duel, oh hey, look, Anakin lost a limb, wonder who else did that.
Obi-wan covers things up, and Padmé gives in to Anakin (). This could have been a good plot point if it wasn't for supposed age differences and how Anakin is portrayed as being a ridiculous man-child (also, holy poo poo, my browser gives me naming corrections for "good" aligned star wars characters. But apparently gently caress the villains, like Dooku or Fett, they don't deserve a spell check ). I mean, guilty mentor covers for beloved student is a legitimate trope. But here, again, it's played like poo poo.
Y'see, a good villain has pathos, and is respectable, and likeable (in as much as one can like a villain). A bad villain is none of these things, is unrelatable, unlikeable for any reason, and earns no respect.

When you watch a good villain "fall" it is a tragedy, but still enjoyable, as you actually like the character or at least respect them and their reasons for turning to evil.
A bad villain, on the other hand, is just bad, with no redeeming features (good or bad), and hasn't got any reason worth discussing for their actions. Or to put it succinctly, good villains have internal logic for their actions that we can understand, even if we do not agree with it, while bad villains lack this internal logic, not because they are insane but because their writing is just that poo poo. A bad villain falls simply because the author decrees it is so, rather than because of the logic inherent and internal to the character.
The fall of Anakin has questionable logic (at best).

Oh hey, this terrible terrible effortpost has reached movie 3

So, first Palpatine tempts him by encouraging his rage (after the loss of his mother where he indulged his rage the first time - a scene which is actually one of the more understandable ones as it gives him human emotions, and a real reason to turn to evil (vengeance being portrayed as an evil motivation here). It's a pity that the following scene where he confesses to Padmé is such utter crap, and completely undermines the importance of this act and turns it into another whine-fest). The death of Dooku is... anticlimactic at best.

Then we have a lot of inane ridiculousness (thankfully some of which was removed on the editing room floor, or else we would now have moustache tweaking as a secret jedi language or something), ships in space adhering to the logic of ships on water/in the air (zepplins), and a very strange but actually potentially interesting "bad guy" in the form of Grievous (oh ha ha Lucas, very funny pun ).

Now, the battle between Kenobi and Grievous is one with potential (man/force vs machine with biological bits (at what point is a biological creature no longer biological but mechanical?)), but we end up with something a little lacking in depth. We could be kind and play devil's advocate in regards time constraints though. But honestly, I'm sure this could have been better and more stretched out.

Finally we reach Order 66, and everything that follows. So much internal logic in regards Jedi just goes horribly wrong here. Apparently the presence of one Sith, and the (possible) fall of Anakin was enough to cloud the future for all light siders? Did they not have any ability to deflect lightning bolts from their allies, and only from their enemies because of this? Etc.

So Anakin sides with Palpatine because he needs the "knowledge" he has about life and death to save Padmé, so he betrays the Jedi order, not just a little bit, but completely (the fall, to Luke's resistance in RotJ, plot point repeat and this time inversion). So there's a little internal logic here, vision of Padmé, must save Padmé, okay this sort of works, apparently the Skywalker family are great at misunderstanding the visions they see in the force. But then he's killing kids, and other Jedi, and murdering the "hostile" federation leaders. That... doesn't quite sound right. Shouldn't he go through more internal moralising or dilemmas before murdering kids? Or is it just flip switch, is now evil, here goes the death spiral ? And then the fight between him and Kenobi where he misunderstands things (this could have worked) but also does so wilfully, and doesn't think things through (this is dumb), kills the very woman he turned evil trying to save () and then blames Kenobi for something Anakin literally just did with his own hands.

And then we get the dumb as hell lava fight, ending with Kenobi taking Anakin's lightsaber ("Your father wanted you to have this, when you were old enough." *Death scream from lava floor* (that always cracks me up)). New internal logic gently caress up, Padmé basically dies literally of a "broken heart". What did she have an embolism of some sort because Anakin half-strangled her, but the robot was trying to be kind? No, it's just lovely writing again. I mean, what, she's got kids, but no her ~love for Anakin is too much to handle the loss~ or whatever. Poetic, but dumb as gently caress, and a seriously lovely trope to pull in the dumbest possible way, especially given that Leia can supposedly remember her. This is supposed to be an inverted remembrance of Han and Leia at the end of RotJ when DStar2 goes boom, but with Padmé giving birth to Leia and Luke as the galaxy becomes not free (as opposed to Han and Leia falling in love as the galaxy becomes free). Very crappily written.

RotS should have been a true inversion of RotJ, but it got repeatedly hosed up and became an inelegant bungled mess lacking in suitable depth. While the overall outline, and a number of plot chunks are good in theory, the practical execution is completely and utterly poo poo, and would have been better directed by almost anyone else (except Uwe Boll - although now I want that to happen, simply because it would be a comedy).

Throughout all of this, most things relating to Kenobi have been worthwhile, and anything relating to Anakin has been utter poo poo.
It's a series of movies that could have been good, and actually did have some degree of potential, but ended up being hamstrung with lovely writing, lovely directing, over-reliance on CGI, and an extremely whiny portrayal and script for Anakin. Almost every good opportunity was missed, and every good idea was repeatedly hosed up into an unrecognisable mess.

Or to cut an effort post short, Lucas repeatedly hosed up, missed every opportunity to do something good, and delivered a mismanaged, poorly directed, utterly bungled mess of a trilogy. In short, where the gently caress were the editors armed with shears to keep him in check?

Ashcans posted:

I don't care about virus grenades (vortex grenades were worse, really), my point was that when the designers were specifically confronted with a situation where someone exploits the system to make a terrible game, their response wasn't 'Oh wow we didn't think of that, that's a problem', or 'Well, we have given you a lot of freedom to let you make a force that suits your story and vision, but it does mean that you have to responsible about using it - talk to your opponents before or after a game to resolve these problems' (which would have been an answer with at least some sort of consideration in it). The response was 'Well you can always break the game ridiculously in another way to one-up them!' That is like the worst possible answer you can give people.

Hamshot posted:

God GW fanboys are almost worse than Nintendo lovers. If you love thing by company loving love it and don't be a little bitch because others don't. Or is your level of self esteem so low everyone just HAS TO LOVE MY THING or you go cry into your Space Marine/Mario body pillow?

Moola posted:

gas this thread and lock us all inside

panascope posted:

Nothing is stopping you from playing 7th edition warham forever.

Lovely Joe Stalin posted:

Years of obsessive, unhealthy investment in a negative mental loop waiting for 40k to be AoS'd is being paid off by GW doing good things and 40k players being happy about the AoSing. It's a Monkey's Paw situation.

TheChirurgeon posted:

so what, you actually like the current shitshow ruleset?

TheChirurgeon posted:

because you're apparently unhappy that they're changing

Lovely Joe Stalin posted:

GW could give out a free cure for cancer with every box of Space Marines and you brainwrong weirdos would moan about Space Marine bias.

Hamshot posted:

TKIY posted:

You guys misunderstand, I want to ban myself for starting it.

tallkidwithglasses posted:

People spend their money on stupid poo poo, let's discuss how dumb they are for enjoying themselves for a bunch of thousand page threads.

ijyt posted:

if someone doesnt like a thing that you do, it doesnt necessarily mean they dont like you as well. hth the next time you get all weirdly obsessive about attacking a company you never intend to buy things from

Jeb Bush 2012 posted:

now this, this is a wrong opinion

Black_Nexus posted:

gently caress I loved those games, so much time spent playing those.

I haven't kept up with handheld gaming for years, but did they stop making advanced wars games?

Hamshot posted:

Lost in his thoughts, Eduardo did not hear the ork creeping up on him. Stunned by a blow to the head, Eduardo was thrown violently to the floor. The ork grunted in amusement, bending down and straddling his body. Dazed, Eduardo turned his head to look up at his enemy. The ork fellow was huge, well muscled and even attractive for his species. Right now the ork’s vibrant green skin was flushing dark in arousal. Eduardo whimpered as he realized what was about to happen.
Summoning up his powers as a Blood Angel, Eduardo bellowed in the Black Rage and began to flail about under the ork. The ork simply grunting, riding the panicked Space Marine like a rodeo bull. Already weakened, Eduardo simply did not have the strength to dislodge the much heavier ork.
All that thrashing around served to arouse the ork further. His name was Gurk, and the friction as the puny Marine flopped around between his muscular thighs was giving him quite a respectable hard-on. Gurk had meant to save the Marine for his own squad, but he couldn’t wait any longer. Whipping out his own plasma gun, Gurk seared off the back of the Marine’s armor, leaving his shining buttocks bare to the ork’s lustful gaze.
Eduardo moaned in fear, his virgin asscheeks clapping firmly together to deny the ork entrance. Gurk simply laughed, ripping off his crude orkish loincloth to reveal a thick green

Hamshot posted:

It's worse than that! Ork kommandos ACTUALLY COST loving FIVE THOUSAND EIGHT HUNDRED ^yen DOLLARS!

Bad Moon posted:

I can't wait to give Sega money

NTRabbit posted:

Terrible Opinions posted:

You missed the point entirely. Warhammer (which I should have specified to be 40k) isn't just played as a tournement game. Narrative games and campaigns are extremely popular, and are this most common way to play in an organized format. In these formats, it places more emphasis on fun then wining, and the tiers lists mostly disappear. Not everyone hounds Tournement reporters for lists so they can try them on Saturday. It sad that Warmahoards fosters such a system.

Irate Tree posted:

I will defend this doofy robit's honour to the end, sir

Yvonmukluk posted:

Let me tell you about Warpath Firefight...

NTRabbit posted:

NTRabbit posted:

Legend of Galactic Heroes