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A human heart posted:Isn't a lot of this advice quite biased in favour of extremely formulaic genre fiction narratives with plot and characters as the main focus. like you're spending all this time talking about plot but lots of great books don't have much of a plot or its fairly unimportant? a formula isn't bad, tho. after all, when i bake cookies i use a recipe because i dont know how to cook. some really good chefs use recipes. thats fine, because they still make good food. its the same thing with fiction. you can have plot centric stories and take the formulaic structure and make it work (also, good authors know how to hide that they're following a formula). also, there are plenty of good stories that have formulaic plots and some that askew having plot whatsoever. while i will probably be a dissenter and say i dont think everything needs plot, i still see the value in writing with plot. and i also think it's important to write plot and learn how it works in order to figure out the ways to get passed plot. and, also, a lot of this is subjective. readers in genres like fantasy or pulp are probably not going to like the no plot stories (even if they're good no plots). probably for other genres as well but idk i don't read genre often enough that say anything definitive. so, i guess to answer your question, yes it will lead to formulaic structures but that's not necessarily a bad thing. some (probably most but i dont have anything to back that up) readers like to read those kinds of plots. and most good formulas give you room to stretch, letting you still write something that even if it fits, is still your own. even then you can still change the formula, get rid of plot beats, add new beats, subvert beats. after all, it is p boring to read a formulaic story, thats why authors hide that they use one.
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Feb 28, 2017 17:47
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Sitting Here posted:The people reading this thread are probly not the ones who are going to write a dadaist masterpiece, tho yeah theyre gonna write doodoo (poo)
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Feb 28, 2017 20:53
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well first they werent written in caps lock so that helps out
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Mar 1, 2017 03:16
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more like dumbmatic
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Mar 1, 2017 03:17
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A human heart posted:Is there like a stone tablet somewhere that says 'usual practice' that all the new writers need to adhere to or something yes
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Mar 9, 2017 16:45
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lol thinking people will read the op
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Mar 9, 2017 21:25
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no ur writing wrong let me do it 4 u
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Mar 9, 2017 23:57
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im a troll
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Mar 10, 2017 02:54
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sebmojo posted:empty quoting this lol
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Mar 10, 2017 04:51
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anime was right posted:you're not my real dad hi dad
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Mar 11, 2017 07:25
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crabrock posted:SHOULD HAVE U MORAN'S no u
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Mar 15, 2017 19:39
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anime was right posted:this thread is way worse than the old one. fight me if i'm wrong. ur way worse
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Mar 16, 2017 18:56
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Chairchucker posted:Here's some fiction: sebmojo is a good writer 
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Mar 16, 2017 20:11
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u write bad, prob
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Mar 17, 2017 02:13
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maybe try writing good?????
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Mar 17, 2017 02:13
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anime was right posted:actually getting published, now thats some real fiction drat owned
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May 12, 2017 23:47
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maybe the protags r the cops
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Jun 1, 2017 21:40
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FunkyAl posted:Hello fiction writing thread, I wrote a Frasier Fan Fiction, please enjoy thank u
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Jun 16, 2017 02:10
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Djeser posted:why did you need to use a japanese word for the thing i love anime
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Jul 3, 2017 22:20
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for pacing, read other stories in your genre/style. notice how they pace their action but also notice when the pacing seems annoying to you. try to get a feel for how long different types of scenes (major, minor, action, character development, etc) should be. this will change depending on genre and intention, which is why reading similar stories you want to write is helpful. also get in the head of a reader. do they want to read this scene? is it interesting? is it meaningful? when and where does it get boring and can i just cut those boring sections or do i end the scene early or cut the entire scene?
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Jul 24, 2017 15:54
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fridge corn posted:most of the topics discussed in this thread seem to be about character development or plot progression. my question was about style, which is generally not very important to genre fiction thats very wrong and im not even a genre writer
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Aug 29, 2017 23:22
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CantDecideOnAName posted:get writing.
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Aug 30, 2017 20:12
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magnificent7 posted:It's killing me. I want to write words. I want to write crafty descriptions, multi-dimensional believable characters, unexpected twists and emotional rollercoasters, but I end up with poo poo sandwich on a filthy re-used paper plate. i think this is the main issue. it isnt that youre writing bad, which happens we all write bad, it's that youre putting too many expectations on yourself. you cant just expect to pick up a pencil and write these engaging stories w/o a lot of experience. it takes time and effort. one analogy i liked from an author (forgot her name) is that writing is like driving. when you first start driving, youre so focused on what youre hands and feet are doing, you cant listen to music or talk to people in the car. once you get more experience, though, those things get more natural and you can listen or talk without thinking about your feet. its the same thing with writing. you have to learn and get comfortable with writing good sentences, developing characters, creating good plots, etc. and it doesn't happen all on its own, nor is all of the pieces going to be mastered at once. you have to build yourself up, and once you can write strong sentences you can then focus on the next thing, like characters. it takes time and practice. keep working on it, but dont expect to create a masterpiece immediately. its okay to fail at what youre trying to do, because it teaches you how not to do it. eventually, with all those gently caress ups, you realize how to actually do what youre trying to do. w/r/t to ideas, i like to think the brain is front loaded with bad ideas. as in, when you get a prompt, your brain is equipped to solve it, but usually in the most simple, efficient way. the issue with writing fiction is that the most obvious interpretation is usually the most boring. however, i still find a lot of value in writing or brainstorming those bad boring ideas, because it gets those ideas out of your head. it also gives your brain a new problem -- whats a better idea than this stupid poo poo? and sometimes, it works out and you can get something really cool because your brain takes leaps from that basic, boring idea. (sometimes it doesnt work but thats okay). i know sebmojo does a similar thing where he takes the most obvious interpretation and then changes it until it gets more interesting, but my method mostly involves deleting that rough draft and starting a new thing entirely. different strokes, but it can help.
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Sep 6, 2017 17:52
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my early dms and losses helped me as a writer a lot more than any of my hms and wins.
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Sep 6, 2017 19:12
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CantDecideOnAName posted:I should probably get back into TD, it's been a long time. I had to quit because the kayfabe got into my head and really messed with me. imagine the im permabanned poster fyad post but w/ kayfabe instead of irony im too lazy to do that
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Sep 6, 2017 20:08
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idk man poo poo geyser is p high brow
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Sep 6, 2017 21:35
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grats and gl
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Sep 11, 2017 19:48
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u murder them when theyre children its why its called killing your babies u dumbie
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Sep 14, 2017 17:56
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Stuporstar posted:What do ya'll do when you notice you're using a particular word too much? I keep shoving "especially" into my sentences, can't think of any word that works better. I finally checked the thesaurus, and not a single word in there has the right emphasis or works in the same context. It's driving me crazy. i search for every instance of the word and then cut it out and then make the sentence work w/o the word.
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Sep 16, 2017 04:23
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the old ceremony posted:you know what? writing is weird and kinda sucks. im writing a scene where a woman of size fucks a polar bear and now i guess i have to watch a bunch of videos of women of size loving polar bears so i can describe it accurately???? 😰 link?
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Sep 19, 2017 16:59
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Dr. Kloctopussy posted:at least don't repeat the same joke
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Sep 19, 2017 21:00
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Exmond posted:So during the start of TD I was pretty hopeful and getting good advice. Pick up punctuation books, fix spelling, fix grammar. I have gotten better on that side that the advice is no longer "pass grade 5 english". Still room for improvement of course. just @ me next time dont subtweet me. thats a joke i dont mean that but for real tho, thats like, how writing goes. like its easy to look up guides on how to punctuate dialogue or read a quick guide on the internet to grammar. but grammar and dialogue punctuation doesnt make a story interesting. no journal or agent is gonna be like "whoa holy cow did you see how good this guy can punctuate." so youre in the hard part of writing now, where your stories might be technically good (aka: error free, sentences make sense, plot points exist and there are characters) but not actually good (the story is interesting, the characters are enjoyable, the prose flows or has a particularly compelling style). and the solution isnt going to be some easy "how do i write a compelling story" because you will find conflicting advice, inconsistency, subjective thoughts, and wide variety of different interpretations of why a story is "good". and looking up the answer doesnt actually help you in the long run, because you can read somebody saying "make your character likeable and have motivation" but actually doing that in a story is completely different. the advice is simple but also lovely af. you have to read, to see what people think are interesting and engaging. and you have to write. i cant tell you how to write a good story, no matter what happens. like, i can tell you why your story didn't work. i can tell you what i disliked. i can tell you what i think makes a story good, but when it comes down to you putting the words on the page, i cant tell you how to do it. i really wish i could. i really wish there was some simple way rather than spending a stupid amount of time writing these loving lovely words and then still writing lovely loving words until sometimes i might get not as lovely words. the only way to get better is to write. and to keep writing. keep getting critiques, but you dont wake up one day and know how to do it. you have to go down into the word mines and break your pickaxe against the rocks over and over again until you start finding something decent. and it takes a time, sometimes a lot, but it's okay. i mean look at me. im a loving idiot. i racked up like 8 dms in my first 10 td entries or w/e. and sometimes im writing decently occasionally and some people even paid me for my words like wtf. but that took me years to go from "dumb idiot who cant stop dming" to "dumb idiot who can write okay sometimes." and the only way i got there was by writing constantly. and it wasnt by looking up guides or anything (i didnt read style manuals or anything, gently caress that poo poo). i just kept writing, trying to make my stories better, trying to come up with different ideas, trying different styles, seeing what people liked and disliked, but also what i liked and disliked writing. and i think i finally got something of a personal style that works for other people and also myself, but it was only after a lot of writing. also if you thought my crit was sarcastic, it is not. like im a jerk but i also want you to write better. mostly because i hate reading bad things but also because i want you to write better. but the advice i gave in there, while admittedly harsh, is there to help you. like as fun as it is to yell at somebody, i also try to make sure that im giving genuine advice. so dont think im trying to be an rear end in a top hat for being an rear end in a top hat's sake. i want to help. i was there with you, at one time. and it sucks. god it loving SUCKS to keep getting DMs over and over again and your trying your loving hardest and people hate it and youre like how do i write good what do i do i dont know im not trying to write bad but its all i can do. but you have to put the work in. you have to keep trying because eventually it starts to break through. you start to find your style, start to find the stories that work for you as a writer, and you find who you are as a writer. it can take a long while, but you can do it. i know you can. i mean i did it and im a barely functional human being. as a little aside, i think that my first collection of DMs in TD were perhaps the most useful things to ever happen to my writing career. they were what made me grow a lot as a writer and i think if i didnt get them i wouldnt be anywhere close to where i am today as a writer.
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Sep 26, 2017 08:14
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Mrenda posted:About submitting work to journals. This article says, "If you are submitting your work, you will inevitably deal with rejection. The average short story or poem may be rejected twenty times before it is accepted, and even famous writers deal with rejection daily. " https://electricliterature.com/lit-mag-submissions-101-how-when-and-where-to-send-your-work-887f826ff7d9 idk usually i subbed around 10-15 different journals for most of the ones that got picked up eventually but the same general principle is there. it will be rejected, a lot. but it getting rejected is normal, and shouldnt be discouraging
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Sep 29, 2017 19:26
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obv everybody's writing style and editing style is different, but the key is finding your own. some people underwrite and some overwrite its about knowing what way works for you and how you work with it.
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Oct 18, 2017 18:09
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Covok posted:I decided to try my hand at writing a story in a sword and sorcery style after I couldn't find a book the story collection of Conan the Barbarian at the book store nearby me. besides the terrible proofing and cliches, among other things, this story is just really boring. for an anthology that's supposed to be about one character, this does not convince me, in any way, to keep reading more of sebastian. sebastian is a dull, generic character who's character traits are "stoic" and "has a sword" and the world you present to me is paint-by-the-numbers fantasyland with nothing surprising or interesting.
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Jan 16, 2018 05:59
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sebmojo posted:Yeah i wouldn't write a thing if i didn't do thunderdome. now youre making td look bad 
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Jan 17, 2018 04:30
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while setting the scene is fine, your first sentence in your story is the most important sentence in your entire story, esp in shorter stories. it should drive the reader to want to read more. starting with the weather is boring. it doesn't clue us in to what the character wants, who the character is, what the plot is going to be, or any other interesting elements of a story. imagine you're telling a story to one of your friends. youre not going to start the story by saying "so, yesterday, it was really cold." youll probably say something like "so this crazy thing happened last night where i almost died" (note: dont ever start a real fiction story like that tbh). notice how u hook the reader in, making them interested to know, hey, why did you almost die last night? a first sentence''s job is to make the reader want to read the story, and it does this by being interesting and creating some level of intrigue. the weather and setting is important, but it isnt very interesting. if you could make the weather interesting than yeah, cool, use that as your first line. but for the most part it will be dull.
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Jan 20, 2018 17:48
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Naerasa posted:Actually, almost all the non-form rejections I've gotten from agents/publishers have been both kind and helpful. Some of them were even sweet. The only really rude ones were rude for reasons unrelated to critique. i think the value of it is that if you can deal with TD's critiques then a journal/agent rejecting your story/manuscript by saying "sorry, but this isnt the place for us" (which is the worst response you're going to get) is going to be a lot easier.
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Jan 30, 2018 01:42
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readingatwork posted:but can I write my novel in future tense!? yeah why not
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Mar 29, 2018 21:20
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hi maybe weird question but nowhere else to put this i have been working on a creative nonfiction piece, getting up to about 5k words, that i'm looking to get published eventually. anyone know any good markets for creative nonfiction, or any good resources for finding creative nonfiction markets? ive looked some up on google and what not, but im wondering if anyone has some good resources for finding them since i usually use submission grinder for my fiction markets, but idk if there's a similar thing for nonfiction.
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Jun 10, 2018 19:40
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