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Poll: Who Should Be Leader of HM Most Loyal Opposition? This poll is closed. |
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| Jeremy Corbyn |
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95 | 18.63% |
| Dennis Skinner |
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53 | 10.39% |
| Angus Robertson |
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20 | 3.92% |
| Tim Farron |
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9 | 1.76% |
| Paul Ukips |
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7 | 1.37% |
| Robot Lenin |
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105 | 20.59% |
| Tony Blair |
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28 | 5.49% |
| Pissflaps |
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193 | 37.84% |
| Total: | 510 votes | ||
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Oberleutnant posted:Maybe if you want a genuinely fair and compassionate society our parliamentary democracy just isn't the answer. Agreed. I think Corbyn supporters should abandon it entirely.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:05
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Irony Be My Shield posted:I agree, but Tony Blair ended up poisoning the public's perception of himself and the Labour Party by extension by being a lying, maniacal warmonger. Even if you personally think the good he did outweighs that that's not how the general public sees it. Yet he won an election even after the invasion of Iraq and I don't recall it being a talking point in 2010 and certainly not in 2015. Any reputational damage has been personal, not to the party. I of course welcome evidence to the contrary.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:09
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Oh dear me posted:Pretty sure we'd[*] all be happy with this. It's not on offer. The people who want to ditch Corbyn want to make sure it is never on offer. Rather than loving up the labour party by trying to make it something it isn't, wouldn't it make more sense to take an existing socialist party and focus on building up its popularity? Or even turn Momentum into a party? If there's a groundswell of support waiting to be tapped, thwarted by the dastardly PLP, why not sidestep it entirely?
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Mar 31, 2017 18:12
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Labour is the socialist party, gently caress off to the Lib Dems. Labour is the centre left party.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:16
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Benjamin Arthur posted:The Liberal Democrats are the centre left party. Oh dear. His Divine Shadow posted:Centre left is dead, labour is dead. There is no future for that kind of politics, people will rather vote right wing. Agreed. That's why Corbyn's attempts to move Labour further left have proved so popular.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:19
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Did you just have an epiphany that theres the perfect party out there for your third way horseshit and that all this time arguing pedantically has been somehow wasted? No but I am resigned to Tory governments until at least 2030 thanks to people like you. Let's hope we're all healthy and wealthy enough to survive it.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:24
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Benjamin Arthur posted:I quite enthusiastically support the Labour Party and its leader. If Labour manages to defeat the Tories somehow I don't think it will be thanks to people like you who have nothing beyond condescending pessimism to offer. It'd be specifically thanks to people like me: lifelong Labour voters in marginal seats. gently caress your 'enthusiastic support' for Corbyn. It's worse than worthless.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:35
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Do you plan on volunteering for Labour in your marginal seat? If so you might want to get some practice in acknowledging the good that some of Corbyns policies could do. No. I'm a labour voter not a party member. Benjamin Arthur posted:I don't actually consider the Liberal Democrats to be on the left at all really, I'd describe them as centre-right. The thing is New Labour are no more leftist at all and also belong to the centre-right. If you want a neoliberal party with "progressive" branding the Liberal Democrats are still the best fit. Jfc.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:54
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Benjamin Arthur posted:The point argued was how well the polls could indicate the specific sources of Corbyns unpopularity, not the unpopularity itself. We've discussed polls that ask this question at length in this thread. It's never a fine toss up between 'the coup' and Corbyn being the reason.
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Mar 31, 2017 18:58
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Benjamin Arthur posted:So if Labour wins it will be thanks to people who complain for years and then do nothing when the time comes to actually remove the Tories. Got it. Labour won't win an election with Corbyn in charge. When Labour does win - assuming it continues in its current form and is in a position to do so - it'll be because Labour voters like me vote for its candidates. Comrade Cheggorsky posted:Jeremy Corbyn owns because all the green party etc voters who paid £3 to vote for him now have to defend his atrocious record and come to terms with the fact they have given the tories at least another decade in power This doesn't actually bother them.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:03
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Opposed to Labour voters like me voting for their candidates? Assuming you do vote and vote labour it'll be in spite of your efforts, not because of them.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:08
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I'm not sure what irony you think you've detected. By supporting Corbyn you've actively and objectively made Labour less likely to form a government.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:10
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Benjamin Arthur posted:It's either the irony of you adding "assuming you vote Labour" regarding me; when all you do is post negatively about the party and its leader, or its the irony of you thinking that when a Labour victory comes it will be thanks to the great complaining pessimists who sad on their arse predicting doom and in reality were really hoping for some I told you so schadenfreude It's not safe to assume people who support Corbyn actually vote Labour. I post negatively about Labour and its leader because its a loving poo poo show and vulnerable people need it to be better. I'm a labour voter, not a Corbyn apologist. I'm not 'predicting doom'. The doom is now. Labour is hosed.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:19
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Benjamin Arthur posted:It's not safe to assume people who support Corbyn will vote labour but we're supposed to trust you about being "lifelong labour supporter" when you support neither the leader or the parties original ideals? You don't have any more reason to doubt that I'll vote Labour than the reverse. I don't care if you believe me or not and it doesn't matter: any future labour win will be thanks to people like me - or in your paranoid imagination people like who I am pretending to be - labour voters in marginal seats. The very people Corbyn is alienating in droves. quote:The next election is ages away and Brexit is going to shake things up, regardless even if nothing changes significantly in that entire time theres still far better ways we can spend it than reading impotent rage about how Labour is hosed because Corbyn is bad and theres nothing anyone can do about it. Three years is not 'ages away' and labour has made itself irrelevant to the Brexit process. What you choose to read is your concern.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:34
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Benjamin Arthur posted:"in your paranoid mind"? It's not paranoid to acknowledge that many of Corbyn's most ardent supporters in this thread dont vote labour. quote:Three years is indeed "ages away" in politics. How likely did you consider a Donald Trump presidency three years ago? Corbyn is not going to become popular in any time scale.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:42
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Benjamin Arthur posted:Which ardent Corbyn supporters in this thread won't be voting Labour next election? I haven't a clue how people will ultimately vote, we only know how people tell us they did vote when last given the opportunity. quote:And Brendan Rodgers will never finish higher than 5th with Liverpool. Not everyones concerned with your self important predictions dressed up as fact. The departure of Suarez demonstrated the veracity of that prediction. I stand by it entirely. Though it seems my predictions have had quite an effect on you given the ease with which you recall them. Congratulations though I think you're literally the last person in this thread who thinks Corbyn has a chance of being the next prime minister.
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Mar 31, 2017 19:50
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OwlFancier posted:The issue is that dragging the country kicking and screaming to the left is a substantial part of why Corbyn is so disliked by much of the establishment. So someone who isn't disliked would be someone who isn' threatening to upset the status quo. Ordinary people don't like him either.
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Mar 31, 2017 20:55
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Trickjaw posted:Unless I have missed something, Caroline Lucas is not the leader of the green party, its now a job share. This really calls into questi8n the integrity of the polling. Again. If it's a job that she's sharing then she is indeed a leader of the Green Party and your ridiculous reason for questioning the integrity of the poll vanishes into a cloud of farts.
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Mar 31, 2017 21:03
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jabby posted:Part of incrementalism is enduring the difficulty involved in actually shifting public opinion, not giving up totally because your first attempt in decades isn't going very well. You might be prepared to endure it but what about the millions of ordinary people who didn't ask to endure your little experiment and need a Labour government?
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Mar 31, 2017 21:46
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OwlFancier posted:They can join and vote in the leadership too if they want? You're serious aren't you. loving hell.
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Mar 31, 2017 21:49
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Cerv posted:Where are the other 18 tweets? I got bored scrolling through the replies Shadow cabinet member briefs him on a story asks for time to get more data doesn't reply journalist gets in touch and is told that they're giving the story to somebody else.
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Mar 31, 2017 21:50
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OwlFancier posted:I don't find "don't participate in democracy because the people who don't want to participate in it might have wanted to hypothetically vote contrary to you" very convincing. So you only care about people's opinions if they're able and prepared to join the Labour Party. I see.
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Mar 31, 2017 21:54
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Coohoolin posted:Wrong. I'm a unite member, and tried to vote for Corbyn because I wanted to see a shift to the left. I was unable to do so because of leadership election wankery. As a Swiss citizen, I'm not allowed to vote for UK or Scottish elections. I'm a member of the SSP and will continue to campaign for a socialist party that supports Scottish independence. A student trade union member. What a world.
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Mar 31, 2017 23:05
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Pochoclo posted:The vast, vast majority of college/university students are employed. This doesn't ring true.
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Apr 1, 2017 00:23
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Pochoclo posted:Ok so in the UK it's not the VAST majority because first world I guess, but it's still a majority. https://www.theguardian.com/education/2014/aug/11/students-work-part-time-employability That seems to be a study of University students. Add in college students and it'll drop to well under half.
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Apr 1, 2017 00:32
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Namtab posted:Ill need evidence to support this. Owlfancier already provided you with it and you quoted it?
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Apr 1, 2017 00:39
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