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Not only the millions who will lose insurance, but how many jobs will be lost? There were reports of it being millions also. Thanks for the thread Leon.
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Mar 7, 2017 04:02
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quote:"Well, we're getting rid of the individual mandate. We're getting rid of those things that people said that they don't want," Chaffetz replied. "Americans have choices, and they've got to make a choice. So rather than getting that new iPhone that they just love and want to go spend hundreds of dollars on that, maybe they should invest in their own health care. Jason Chaffetz is the worst.
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Mar 7, 2017 15:43
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quote:“We’re going to have insurance for everybody,” Trump said. “There was a philosophy in some circles that if you can’t pay for it, you don’t get it. That’s not going to happen with us.” People covered under the law “can expect to have great health care. It will be in a much simplified form. Much less expensive and much better.” quote:Scott Pelley: Universal health care? Lol remember this? I almost want to believe Republicans fooled Trump into thinking everyone is going to be covered on their "replacement" plan, so he's supporting it. This is one of those occasions where I wish Trump would bully the gently caress out of them. The bill doesn't make any sense, even if I was a conservative I'd wonder why it even exists. 7 years and this is all they bring to the table. What a joke. But hey if the rich get their tax cuts and less poors getting a government "entitlement".
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Mar 8, 2017 03:47
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Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:All debt is treated the same in personal bankruptcy except for student loans, civil judgements, and penalties issued by a court or government agency. It makes me wonder if Republicans are going to float the idea later to somehow make it much harder to get medical debt dischargeable in bankruptcy. I mean that only contributes to half of all bankruptcies that are filed but hey I wouldn't put it past them to try to reform bankruptcy the way they did it in 2005.
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Mar 8, 2017 22:36
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Thats why I favor calling this garbage bill a tax plan rather than a healthcare bill.
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Mar 9, 2017 22:00
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DaveWoo posted:By Tucker Goddamn Carlson of all people. It's loving amazing. Great questions, couldn't even pull the wool over his eyes. Confounding Factor fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Mar 9, 2017 |
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Mar 9, 2017 23:34
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Not sure if this was posted here, but interesting article in Vox on this bill The Republican plan to slash Medicaid, explained http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/3/10/14847218/medicaid-ahca-republican-obamacare-replacement quote:The cumulative effect, according to an analysis by the Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, is a $370 billion cut to federal funding to Medicaid over 10 years. Some of that money could be made up for by states, but most of it won't be. quote:More to the point, the up to 11.2 million people that ending expansion could kick off the rolls is a massive human toll to pay quote:"Under the House plan’s per capita cap, states would have had to cover the entire cost of rising need on their own,” CBPP’s Park, Aron-Dine, and Broaddus write. “And rather than being able to invest in improving care, many states would have been forced to scale back or ration substance use treatment as the need increased, or to weaken Medicaid coverage for other groups.” And those who stay on Medicaid will get even worse coverage. No pun intended, but the more I learn about this new healthcare bill the more sick I get.
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Mar 11, 2017 20:00
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So who all here is worried their employer will stop offering insurance plans and/or lack the money to buy the insurance that has the coverage one needs? It just amazes me the illusion of choice offered to Americans, when it really comes down to those who are able to pay and those that can't. And who loving knows what coverage one needs in the future. What a sick twisted ideology Republicans adhere to. I'm worried my employer will stop offering insurance and I am in the low end, barely middle class income.
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Mar 13, 2017 22:40
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mcmagic posted:The mandates on employers would need to be taken out with 60 votes. Democrats won't give them any votes. Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:None of the plans or subsidies involved impact employer-provided plans unless your employer has less than 50 employees and didn't offer anything before they were required to. Well as much as I'm delighted by that news, I guess I care more about those that aren't as fortunate as me.
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Mar 13, 2017 23:00
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http://money.cnn.com/2017/03/15/news/economy/medicaid-premiums-work-trump/index.htmlquote:One of the most controversial measures would be adding a work requirement, with the goal of helping them rise out of poverty, Price and Verma said. My god Republicans are so loving dumb.
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Mar 15, 2017 18:49
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Since we are talking about starting businesses, I'm reminded about that incredibly moronic comment from Rep. Justin Chaffetz about those making a decision to buy a new iPhone or healthcare. In a twisted way, he's kinda making the argument why we need a single payer system or something like it that takes away healthcare costs from working Americans thus giving more money in their pockets to spend in the economy on goods and services, like an iPhone. Because under the GOP plan you have a variety of groups that are going to be losing even more disposable income which is what should be going back into the economy to grow GDP. That hurts the growth of businesses who rely on consumer spending. So why aren't big corporations and small businesses rallying together to fight on behalf of consumers then? If taking away the exorbitant costs of healthcare gives much more purchasing power then why not? Even if you take Rep Chaffetz comment at face value, that seems a direct attack on companies like Apple. Am I overlooking something?
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Mar 18, 2017 17:25
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ozmunkeh posted:Why would businesses voluntarily relinquish the power they currently exercise over workers? The motivations of mom&pop stores vs large corps are different but it's still all about power. Sure I wouldn't disagree with that but then you have cases like this: Wetzel's Pretzels' CEO says minimum wage increase boosts business http://www.marketplace.org/2017/02/17/economy/fast-food-ceo-says-minimum-wage-increase-boosts-business quote:“The increases in minimum wage have been good for my business, and the data would support what I’ve said,” CEO Phelps said. quote:“My overall sales were something like 15 percent ahead after the first minimum wage bump, and now they're about 12 percent ahead this year,” franchise owner Jacobs said. “It isn't because I'm such a great manager or smart guy, but the buying public has more money in their pocket.” quote:“By my looking at it, the minimum wage increase has just been a godsend,” Jacobs said. “My income this year will be double what it was in 2013.” quote:His employees have gotten a raise. His CEO is getting big numbers. His customers can buy more pretzels. And Jacobs can buy more guitars. And there's an economist cited in the article who says getting data to prove minimum wage increases helps fast food companies is extremely rare because companies obviously don't have the incentive to undermine their own narrative about higher wages = higher prices and so on. asdf32 posted:The government spending money on anything spurs the economy in the immediate but that's a finite resource. What's a finite resource? Money? Our government has an unlimited ability to spend money, we can never run out of it.
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Mar 18, 2017 18:48
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SousaphoneColossus posted:One thing that has always struck me as weird is that the left in the US is so narrowly focused on single payer to the exclusion of other models. Lots of countries are not strictly speaking single payer UHC but their systems work well, and some would probably argue better than Canada or the UK. I can agree with that and one of the problems I see in healthcare debates is that its so focused on "who pays?" rather than focusing on why healthcare costs so much in America. We spend the most per capita and get the least benefit, in fact we spend far and away more than other developed countries.  
Confounding Factor fucked around with this message at 22:12 on Mar 20, 2017 |
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Mar 20, 2017 22:09
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evilweasel posted:
So to continue the trend of reducing inefficiency, what about a modest proposal of gradually lower the age in which Americans become eligible for Medicare while also encouraging supplier competition?
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Mar 20, 2017 22:27
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Obamacare attacked that problem as well! One of its major goals was to "bend the cost curve", adjusting the incentives in the medical system to encourage better and more efficient results.
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Xae posted:Look at the surrounding countries like Italy, Portugal and Greece. The problem with adopting that diet in America is you need to also adopt their culture ie it's impossible.
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Mar 21, 2017 00:25
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BarbarianElephant posted:Then the UK is doing pretty well with a national diet nearly as bad as the USA.
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Mar 21, 2017 00:42
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TyrantWD posted:My biggest concern was that Trump would have only done things that would only cause noticeable harm to the average Trump voter years later, and therefore skate through re-election. The biggest concern i had with Trump before inauguration is if he is a flash in the pan, like some of policies might be good economically. Short term benefit but long term damage the next Democrat president would have to clean up. But now are 3 months in and a lot of these signature moves have been disastrous for Trump like the travel ban. If this healthcare bill doesnt pass you gotta wonder what other "bigly" campaign promises will be broken. I think for those of us on the left we should be glad there is a lot of incompetence. If Republicans cant get any significant leglistation to pass in 4 years thats good for us.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:01
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https://mobile.twitter.com/Alyssafarah/status/844600543519686660
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Mar 22, 2017 19:44
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Im here for the lulz if they wont vote on the bill.
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Mar 23, 2017 19:05
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Give me all the lols. Bison.gif
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Mar 23, 2017 20:48
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evilweasel posted:i go to meetings for 2 hours and the cbo tells the house they're spending almost $200b extra to cover zero additional people 
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Mar 23, 2017 23:23
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evilweasel posted:bannon is going all out leaking stuff to try to kill ryan Oh man I want this healthcare bill to be dead so badly just for all the drama that is going to ensue.
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Mar 24, 2017 03:02
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Typo posted:If trump starts doing rallies in their districts idk man, he can primary them from the Trump-Axis if he has to Trump rallying in those districts won't matter, they know this bill isn't a full repeal of Obamacare.
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Mar 24, 2017 03:09
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evilweasel posted:Here's the final sale job: to the HFC, we gave you what you want, to the moderates, the Senate will take it out, don't worry about it: Lulz, I've heard Reps in the HFC say just repealing the EHB isn't enough. These ideologues want even more time to review the bill before a vote is cast but more so they'd rather start over. Any kind of language in the bill that vaguely looks like Obamacare will probably be shot down.
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Mar 24, 2017 03:13
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Noctone posted:If the next 46 months are anything like the first two have been then I can't wrap my head around how anyone could ever again trust Republicans to govern. Everything about how they've handled this bill has been insanely inept. They'll just blame the "RINOs".
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Mar 24, 2017 03:18
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He said on his Twitter that the changes they've been making to the bill weren't pushed by the HFC. So yep it won't get passed.
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Mar 24, 2017 04:00
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Some commentator I think it was on RT (lol no pun intended) who said it's not just 24 million impacted, if the CBO estimates are right, that would lose insurance but ALL of us will be impacted by it because those that are uninsured are going to be asking others for financial help to pay medical bills and prescriptions. I thought that was a very important point. We are heading towards serious social unrest if that bill gets passed by both chambers in Congress.
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Mar 24, 2017 16:44
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And the thing is if you build up to a social explosion in 4 years, the police have already been militarized as we saw in Ferguson and with how nuts Trump is tweeting threats on "sending Feds to Chicago" how do you think this administration is going to quell social unrest? Terrifying.
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Mar 24, 2017 16:48
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Rhesus Pieces posted:https://twitter.com/bendavanzo/status/845282659446214657 gently caress yes.
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Mar 24, 2017 17:22
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Craig K posted:donald trump, out of spite, switches party affiliation from republican to democrat That's exactly what I was just about to post hahaha.
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Mar 24, 2017 21:07
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Discendo Vox posted:The Republican strategy is now to sabotage health insurance markets administratively and use the "collapse" as justification for repeal.
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Mar 24, 2017 22:05
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at people on Fox saying its not Trump's fault and defending his "dealmaking skills"
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Mar 24, 2017 22:15
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Monkey Fracas posted:If only they had actually been working on a replacement for the 7 years they were bitching about Obamacare and holding masturbatory votes to repeal that were guaranteed to go nowhere instead of making GBS threads out this half-baked hackjob then maybe they could have passed something. All Republicans had for 7 years were memes and obstruction. They never thought passed once the obstruction works and they regain majority on how to pass bills as a party. But hey this is a party that is so thoroughly intellectually bankrupt it doesn't surprise me.
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Mar 24, 2017 22:20
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Cause in his mind when Obamacare "explodes" he'll just blame the Democrats that it was their fault. I can't wait to see how the tax reform plays out. Watch the HFC once again block it cause the tax cuts aren't big enough. But cutting taxes is something all Republicans love anyway so that shouldn't face much resistance.
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Mar 24, 2017 22:38
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Hilarious if true.
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Mar 24, 2017 22:43
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Nissin Cup Nudist posted:Americans are pretty stupid Memes are pretty powerful...
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Mar 24, 2017 23:01
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So I have a question about getting a "Medicare for All" bill passed. When Obama ran for president in '08 he had UHC as one of his top priorities but after he got elected realized that trying to expand Medicare for everyone would have been filibustered in the Senate and certain centrists Democrats would have opposed it. So he dropped that and they had to hash out ACA. If Bernie or another Democrat that campaigns heavily around Medicare for everyone, they get elected, what could they do about getting the votes necessary to get that bill passed? If Bernie was president now, and lets say the bill gets passed in a Democratic majority House but the Senate is composed the way it is today, there's no way that bill would be passed. It'll be worthless to get Bernie in if he doesn't have a majority of Democrats that would vote for the bills he wants passed. Am I missing something?
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Mar 27, 2017 21:50
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evilweasel posted:Either they abolish the filibuster (not unreasonable, given that it has evolved from used only in extreme circumstances to a de facto 60 vote requirement for everything and there's been muttering about that for some time), they do it through reconciliation, or they hope that 2020 is the mother of all wave elections and they get 60 votes (they would need to win 12 and they can win like, two in 2018, maybe three if Ted Cruz is unpopular enough even if 2018 is a huge wave). My fingers are crossed that the Supreme Court rules in favor of that partisan gerrymandering case coming up, that would be yuuuuuuuge. Have you been following that at all? That'll help Democrats a lot in their 50 state strategy. Hieronymous Alloy posted:At this point it looks like health care benefits are a one way ratchet: each increase is politically nonrevokable, so we just have to keep ratcheting by expanding benefits. Yeah that's a great point, that's why I thought Republicans were hosed on trying anything regressive on healthcare. Progressives might hate incrementalism but in this instance it's extremely effective in that it's pretty much impossible to rollback. Confounding Factor fucked around with this message at 23:09 on Mar 27, 2017 |
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Mar 27, 2017 23:04
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Brainiac Five posted:Oh you better believe I am in favor of gloating over death and suffering to the fullest possible extent. After all, Emma Goldman was well-known for visiting victims of gas attacks in the hospital to sneer at them for refusing to be conscientious objectors, Abbie Hoffman wrote over a million words about how Vietnam veterans deserved all the health effects linked to Agent Orange exposure, it's more or less a consistently leftist position to exult in bloodshed. Frankly, if you don't believe people should die in agony for being born in an imperialist country, you're the lowest kind of reactionary. Nah that just makes you the lowest kind of scum. Nobody gets to decide what country they are born into. Leftists should be about reducing suffering not reveling in it. Strangely your logic kinda fits into the GOP's healthcare plan of taking millions off insurance and dying, but hey they were born in imperalist America so they should die in agony. Good grief man. I'm all for using the guillotine judiciously but what you posted is nuts. Confounding Factor fucked around with this message at 12:58 on Mar 28, 2017 |
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Mar 28, 2017 12:56
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We're already paying for Medicare and then some. We're just not getting it.
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Mar 31, 2017 23:47
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