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Norns posted:No, but that sounds like something I want to listen to! Morrison wrote New X-Men. He's talking about New Mutants written by Claremont (then some others) and running concurrently to Uncanny X-Men in the 80s. If you're going chronologically, it won't pick up for awhile.
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Jul 6, 2017 20:16
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My bad misread that
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Jul 6, 2017 20:20
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New Mutants starts around Uncanny #155 or so I think. X-Factor starts after Uncanny #201. It's worth reading them concurrently because they cross over a little bit (particularly New Mutants since Claremont wrote more than half the run of it).
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Jul 6, 2017 21:41
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Norns posted:No, but that sounds like something I want to listen to! Here's the link : https://www.xplainthexmen.com One word of warning for some audiences. Jay (one of the hosts) is really into the queer/feminist theory end of the X-Men, and sees a lot of the series through that. I think it's 100% justified in discussing but lots of comics fans are a bit more reactionary, and I'd rather have someone not bother than go in and get angry about people bringing politics into their funny books discussion. I'd also suggest skipping the first few episodes and going straight into the coverage of Giant-Sized #1 (The Retcon That Walks Like A Man) since the early stuff is covered in very broad strokes and IMO not nearly as good. rkajdi fucked around with this message at 23:59 on Jul 6, 2017 |
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Jul 6, 2017 23:57
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Nothing about that turns me off of it. Definitely going to give it a listen. Thanks for the recommendation.
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Jul 6, 2017 23:59
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Norns posted:Nothing about that turns me off of it. Definitely going to give it a listen. Thanks for the recommendation. Yeah, I only brought it up because a guy I suggested it to got hyper mad after listening that I'd suggest some "SJW bullshit" to him disguised as a comics podcast. It was an eye-opener about him, but I guess half of the guys out there just want to read power fantasies and ignore any subtext. Especially with X-Men, I don't see how people can do this, given how much the Claremont especially pushed the limit as to what was publishable at the time.
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Jul 7, 2017 12:28
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Speaking of Queer Subtext, Rachael being totally into Nightcrawler, especially when Kitty is currently available. WTf! Unless they're preparing for Kitty/Illyana to become a textual thing and not a subtext. Dark Phoenix gets a lot of love, but Brood Saga is also excellent, and also Claremont is why Carol Danvers is my favorite Super Hero. There issue featuring Her and Wolverine fighting Rogue was one of the first X-men comics I read as a kid.
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Jul 7, 2017 12:39
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I listened to Jay & Miles for a long time and enjoyed them a lot, but I fell off at some point. I think around about the time they got to Mutant Massacre. I enjoyed their insight but thought they sometimes seemed almost too reverential of Claremont's work. I really liked the episode they did with Kurt Busiek as a guest which discussed the Silver Age team, because that was something they appreciated but weren't necessarily huge fans of. Anyway, that's definitely on me; it's good podcast and definitely listen if you like the X-Men. I believe Miles has a Thor podcast now which I've been meaning to check out as well. Edit: There's one episode where Jay interviews a guy who was a writer and producer for the X-Men '92 cartoon who also wrote the pitch bible for X-Men: Evolution, where he a) decides he needs to recap the entire history of X-Men (Jay - who obviously knows this all already - is polite but sounds incredibly bored); and b) keeps pronouncing "Claremont" as "Claremount" and it's really distracting.
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Jul 7, 2017 13:08
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He also constantly refuses to take any credit for xmen evolution and seems to not actually want to discuss the show. It's weird. Their Claremont interview is pretty fantastic though.
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Jul 7, 2017 13:33
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rkajdi posted:Yeah, I only brought it up because a guy I suggested it to got hyper mad after listening that I'd suggest some "SJW bullshit" to him disguised as a comics podcast. It was an eye-opener about him, but I guess half of the guys out there just want to read power fantasies and ignore any subtext. Especially with X-Men, I don't see how people can do this, given how much the Claremont especially pushed the limit as to what was publishable at the time. It's cool to find out people not to associate with anymore, at least.
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Jul 7, 2017 14:36
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Just listened to the first few episodes. I'm glad they found Sunfire as bombastic as I did. I didn't know I wanted a podcast companion for my X-Men read, but it seems to fit well.
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Jul 7, 2017 14:57
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Wheat Loaf posted:I listened to Jay & Miles for a long time and enjoyed them a lot, but I fell off at some point. I think around about the time they got to Mutant Massacre. I enjoyed their insight but thought they sometimes seemed almost too reverential of Claremont's work. I really liked the episode they did with Kurt Busiek as a guest which discussed the Silver Age team, because that was something they appreciated but weren't necessarily huge fans of. See that's part of the interesting part to me. Claremont's X-Men is the best long run of any comic I can think of. I get that the sex fetish stuff is a huge hangup for some people in this forum, but TBQH I didn't notice it as a sex thing at all when I first read the run. I'm also sort of interested in seeing the podcast go over the reboot post-Muir Island, since that's where I picked up comics originally. I will also say that on relistening I skip all the non-arc episodes except for the Busiek and Claremont interviews (everyone who likes comics should listen to the latter), as well as the couple of episodes with G. Willow Wilson on them. I'm a bit out of touch with modern X-Men (I think I haven't read an issue since the Apocalypse event) so a lot of that is way less interesting to me than the 80s and 90s stuff. And the spin-offs don't hold a lot of nostalgia for me, so I don't care much about any of the cartoons or movie episodes. quote:Anyway, that's definitely on me; it's good podcast and definitely listen if you like the X-Men. I believe Miles has a Thor podcast now which I've been meaning to check out as well. I've been listening, and it's OK. Miles is much more of a fan and doesn't come in with the same kind of critical eye for the art that Jay usually has. I also never really have been into Thor much, so it's also comics that I don't have the attachment to. There is a lot of passion and effort put into the podcast, so if you really like the Simonson Thor stuff I'd suggest giving it a listen. Endless Mike posted:It's cool to find out people not to associate with anymore, at least. Pretty much. It's been a problem that I've run into with a good number of people that I've gotten back in contact with in the last year or so. There are so many nerdy folks who have red pilled pretty hard, or are "balanced" meaning they just don't like non-cis white dudes being discussed in the hobby but don't yell slurs at them. Nerd hobbies have gotten oddly depressing since the whole gator fiasco made it acceptable to be an open bigot again.
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Jul 7, 2017 15:28
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rkajdi posted:See that's part of the interesting part to me. Claremont's X-Men is the best long run of any comic I can think of. I get that the sex fetish stuff is a huge hangup for some people in this forum, but TBQH I didn't notice it as a sex thing at all when I first read the run. I'm also sort of interested in seeing the podcast go over the reboot post-Muir Island, since that's where I picked up comics originally. That's fair. My first encounter with Claremont was actually his second run on Uncanny (where he introduced the Neo, who weren't very interesting but were at least something other than "THE X-MEN AGAINST MAGNETO!" for the millionth time) and X-Treme X-Men, which I didn't really enjoy all that much at the time and, now that I have a fuller idea of his body of work for Marvel, think encapsulates most of his less glowing habits as a writer. While I enjoy his classic run pretty much all the way through, and appreciate how important it was for Marvel and for superhero comics more generally, it doesn't mean as much to me as it does to a lot of folks for whom it's their formative experience of the X-Men, because I went into it associating Claremont with other versions of the X-Men which hadn't impressed me that much. I agree that it's the best long run in superhero comics. What are the comparisons? I'll go with runs by a single writer that are 10 years or more off the top of my head, but which are also the defining runs in my mind. The closest comparison is Marv Wolfman on the New Teen Titans and its spin-offs, which he wrote for the same length of time as Claremont wrote X-Men - 16 years (Claremont: 1975-1991; Wolfman: 1980-1996). I like that but Claremont's X-Men is definitely better.
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Jul 7, 2017 15:42
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Lee and Kirby's Fantastic Four is probably the best run ever.
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Jul 7, 2017 15:46
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Wheat Loaf posted:I agree that it's the best long run in superhero comics. What are the comparisons? I'll go with runs by a single writer that are 10 years or more off the top of my head, but which are also the defining runs in my mind. The closest comparison is Marv Wolfman on the New Teen Titans and its spin-offs, which he wrote for the same length of time as Claremont wrote X-Men - 16 years (Claremont: 1975-1991; Wolfman: 1980-1996). I like that but Claremont's X-Men is definitely better. The other stuff I compare Claremont's stuff to are that Teen Titans run (which is almost as good early on and trails off very quickly), Peter David's Incredible Hulk (1989-1998), and Brian Bendis' Ultimate Spider-man (2000-currently, depending on how you consider the Mile Morales stuff). I like the latter two runs a lot, but neither is as competently plotted or as long as the Claremont stuff. The Hulk also has the disservice of sticking around a bit too long, since everything after the Pantheon arc is pretty forgettable IMO. There's also a very long arc of LOSH stuff, but that's more writing rotating through a few guys instead of one consistent vision. Codependent Poster posted:Lee and Kirby's Fantastic Four is probably the best run ever. I know I'm committing sacrilege by saying this, but Lee and Kirby aren't even the best FF run ever. Hickman's stuff is much more well thought out, and doesn't suffer from the really bad silver age-isms that all of Stan Lee's writing has.
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Jul 7, 2017 16:26
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rkajdi posted:There's also a very long arc of LOSH stuff, but that's more writing rotating through a few guys instead of one consistent vision. Oh, yeah, Paul Levitz wrote the Legion for about nine years or so, didn't he? I think he only has one story (Great Darkness Saga) that's really distinguished, but that might be because he allegedly used his pull when he was publisher to bar any Legion issues he wrote from ever being reprinted or collected.
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Jul 7, 2017 16:32
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Dan Slott on Spider-Man. 
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Jul 7, 2017 16:47
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I don't know if it counts as a long run, but Hickman from Fantastic Four/FF to the end of Secret Wars was really good. But that is off topic. I love the charachters in All New Wolverine, but feel enemy of the state's murder an entire town was cheap and felt un-earned by the writers. I'm workimg on Unlimited time so how long is the trigger scent story going to go?
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Jul 7, 2017 16:50
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Wheat Loaf posted:Oh, yeah, Paul Levitz wrote the Legion for about nine years or so, didn't he? I think he only has one story (Great Darkness Saga) that's really distinguished, but that might be because he allegedly used his pull when he was publisher to bar any Legion issues he wrote from ever being reprinted or collected. I think there' a good amount of interspersed Keith Giffen issues in there. Having read a huge amount of that run, it's easily the best thing DC was doing at the time and I would suggest it to people who don't like DC's honestly rather schlocky writing on most of its capes books at the time. Really this comment could apply to most of DC's output up until I gave up on DC a year or so after New 52. There's some good in there, but the bad stuff is much more dire than the low end of Marvel.
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Jul 7, 2017 17:12
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Codependent Poster posted:Lee and Kirby's Fantastic Four is probably the best run ever. First 100 issues of Spider-man
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Jul 7, 2017 18:23
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rkajdi posted:Pretty much. It's been a problem that I've run into with a good number of people that I've gotten back in contact with in the last year or so. There are so many nerdy folks who have red pilled pretty hard, or are "balanced" meaning they just don't like non-cis white dudes being discussed in the hobby but don't yell slurs at them. Nerd hobbies have gotten oddly depressing since the whole gator fiasco made it acceptable to be an open bigot again. Gator fiasco?
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Jul 7, 2017 21:16
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plainswalker75 posted:Gator fiasco? Gamergater.
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Jul 7, 2017 21:27
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Endless Mike posted:Gamergater. Ohhhhhhhhh. Ugh, yes.
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Jul 7, 2017 21:50
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For long runs, Otto Binder's Marvel Family work, across 12ish years and multiple titles, it's one of the best comics runs ever. His Superman work, spanning I don't know how many years (15-20?) probably had more influence on the pop culture archetype of superheroes, until at least the end of the 20th century, than any other single creator's work.
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Jul 8, 2017 06:06
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Squizzle posted:For long runs, Otto Binder's Marvel Family work, across 12ish years and multiple titles, it's one of the best comics runs ever. His Superman work, spanning I don't know how many years (15-20?) probably had more influence on the pop culture archetype of superheroes, until at least the end of the 20th century, than any other single creator's work. I'd say Lee/Kirby F4 is more influential since it basically introduced the idea that super heroes could have personalities and conflicts separate from fighting villains.
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Jul 8, 2017 16:32
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Jonny Nox posted:But that is off topic. I love the charachters in All New Wolverine, but feel enemy of the state's murder an entire town was cheap and felt un-earned by the writers. I'm workimg on Unlimited time so how long is the trigger scent story going to go? The trigger scent is the focus of the story arc but it gets resolved in a good way. Ending spoilers if you want them: they remove her sensitivity to the trigger scent entirely.
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Jul 8, 2017 19:23
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Nuns with Guns posted:The trigger scent is the focus of the story arc but it gets resolved in a good way. Ending spoilers if you want them: they remove her sensitivity to the trigger scent entirely. Which is good. Can't wait until someone reverses it. Just like how they reversed "All the trigger scent has been destroyed."
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Jul 9, 2017 12:01
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Am I the only one who hates how Logan is called Old Man Logan now? Like Old Man is his first name and Logan is his last? Its like Marvel has to call him Old Man Logan to keep the trademark alive or something. It's dumb and annoying. Just call him and his book Logan.
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Jul 9, 2017 21:22
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pubic works project posted:Am I the only one who hates how Logan is called Old Man Logan now? Like Old Man is his first name and Logan is his last? Its like Marvel has to call him Old Man Logan to keep the trademark alive or something. It's dumb and annoying. Just call him and his book Logan. I don't necessarily mind that his book is called "Old Man Logan", but it seriously annoys me when characters in-universe refer to him that way.
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Jul 10, 2017 17:47
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So, thoughts on the last page of Astonishing X-Men #1?
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Jul 22, 2017 07:10
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Roth posted:So, thoughts on the last page of Astonishing X-Men #1? Eh? I mean, it's far from the most stupid or outlandish things to have happened in an X-Book. It's not even the most stupid thing to have been done with Professor X after his death. I'm willing to withhold judgement for at least another issue.
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Jul 22, 2017 18:08
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The return of that character was rumored to be the plot of the RESURREXTION mini series before they retooled it into an event branding.
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Jul 22, 2017 22:04
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Roth posted:So, thoughts on the last page of Astonishing X-Men #1? I'm shocked it took this long. gently caress it, pull the trigger.
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Jul 24, 2017 02:40
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so yeah, they're having Emma attempt to turn teenage scott into adult scott, complete with him loving her. What the gently caress?
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Jul 27, 2017 07:53
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Is Claremont writing again?
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Jul 27, 2017 08:04
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That wasn't Claremonts MO. Hell it doesn't even involve Storm
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Jul 27, 2017 08:23
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Soonmot posted:so yeah, they're having Emma attempt to turn teenage scott into adult scott, complete with him loving her. What the gently caress? I skimmed through the first issue of the Secret Empire crossover and decided to wait it out before picking up Blue again. Good to know that was the right decision. Everything that's been mentioned here about New Tian sounds dumb as poo poo and I hope there's an immediate reset after this dumb crossover is finally over.
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Jul 27, 2017 12:21
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Grief makes telepaths go insane. It's almost canon at this point.
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Jul 27, 2017 13:00
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X-Men: Blue was good because Polaris is back in her best costume.
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Jul 27, 2017 19:56
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Rhyno posted:The return of that character was rumored to be the plot of the RESURREXTION mini series before they retooled it into an event branding. Sooooooooooooooo....is Xavier gonna hop in like a brain-dead twin body like in the movies? "I didn't just have a sister, Cassandra Nova. I had a brother too!!"
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Jul 27, 2017 21:16
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