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Just here to heap praise on Hickman's run so far and this latest issue in particular. Gregor's righteous anger falls flat when you realize she's been working to top the death toll presented earlier in the issue. Before his suicide Gregor's husband laments not having children with her and this doesn't draw any sympathy from me. Children for what? Born forfeiting their humanity, born into subjugation to mad gods created in human's own image of disdain and self-loathing? Mutants and their children dream of freedom and liberation, even for the humans. Humans want to put an end to dreams even and especially their own.
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Sep 6, 2019 02:32
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CubanMissile posted:Ok, but it's not like you ever see humans in these books staging protests for governments to stop using huge mutant killing death robots. Earlier on Magneto even brings up Operation Paper Clip. He's making a nod as to what people / governments are willing to tolerate and what extent they'll forgive if it gets them what they want. Nazis are monsters but uhh well we can forgive them and work alongside them as long as it allows us to exterminate the mutants (very topical!). I wondered if this was meant to just be about human extremists and it might be but I feel the scene I mentioned, Moria's experiences in her lives, and so on make it clear that no one person is responsible for the genocide, it seems to be what mankind works toward almost no matter what. Up to this point, the only life Moria lives a peaceful and fulfilling existence happens to be the one where no one, including herself, knows that she's a mutant. To come back to Magneto, I get the feeling Hickman isn't trying to reform Magento either but has a different take on him than Grant. The series so far has made me more sympathetic to Mageneto's extremism and I can say for the first time that, even though I think Apocalypse is a villain, I can kind of understand why he's doing what he's doing. Much like Moira, re-living these experiences over and over can radicalize you.
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Sep 6, 2019 07:07
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CubanMissile posted:I remember when Ghost Rider got infected with a brood and everyone poo poo their pants, and then I think Betsy just hit him with her psychic knife and it severed the link between the brood and Danny Ketch and it was just a big nothingburger. It was really off the wall but an overall fun read, if I remember.
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Sep 7, 2019 11:21
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danbanana posted:And it seems- assuming certain things about the HoX story we're seeing- to have radicalized Xavier. "No more" is a pretty hardcore statement when it comes to all of this. How much of that radicalization is exposure to Moira? How much is it just from this Xavier's personal experience? I've been thinking about this and even though the no eye / weird helmet design seems to be a Hickman staple, I realized Professor X's Cerebra helmet seems to echo Cyclops' mask from the Bendis run, after Cyclops has gone full-on mutant terrorist. I'm wondering if it's intentional or not.
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Sep 9, 2019 13:38
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Skwirl posted:I'm solidly on the idea that this is Moira's 6th life, it just tracks really well with what we know. Utopian co-existence, kill all the Trasks because gently caress Sentinels, Magneto's more radical approach to co-existence, full on nihilistic "Yeah, I'll work with Apocalypse." Except it isn't until after Moira's 7th life that she realizes Sentinels are inevitable, so knowing that they must target Nimrod specifically has to come after. It isn't until Moira's 9th that she learns what pivotal moment Nimrod is "conceived" at, hence the destroy Mother Mold at all costs suicide mission.
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Sep 11, 2019 01:13
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The question that's been sitting on my mind since Moira's reveal is what happens when Moira dies a final death? Everything just resets, right? Mutants go back to being wholesale slaughtered and oppressed just sans Moira. Do they have to cure Moira before she dies? Does she have some kind of plan for when she dies what could be her final death? I feel this is what the 6th life is likely to be about. It's probably when she comes up with a contingency or she concocts some grand scheme that we haven't noticed yet.
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Sep 11, 2019 02:14
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Beerdeer posted:
5 is Logan and Mariko Yashida, I think.
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Sep 11, 2019 16:34
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Oh, I take that back. I forgot the Mutant Island is specifically mentioned so it's likely someone in the present and a mutant. If we want to get super technical, Cable counts as Jean's kid, right? e: ^
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Sep 11, 2019 17:36
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Is it just me or does Sinister seem to have some similarities with Nimrod x100 and x1000, and not just having a mad on for databases and cataloguing DNA but in his manner too?
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Sep 13, 2019 15:14
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McCloud posted:It's actually kind of difficult to overstate what Charles accomplishments would mean for the mutant population. I know it's a bit of a droll comparison to say the X-men are queer/minority coded, but as a queer person I can say that I can absolutely understand why the idea of Krakoa is so seductive. Speaking in very broad strokes, pretty much every single queer person lives in a society that otherizes them, and at best they live somewhere that accepts their otherness, and at worst..well you know. Even in the best case scenario we're constantly reminded that we're different from everyone else. We're practically non-existant in the culture around us, we're not the subject of love songs or the protagonists in block busters, we're an afterthought at best. Krakoa is a place where the others become the norm, where you're not an outsider looking in, where you are at the cultural centre. I recall the first time I went to a concert after Pride in brighton , and the feeling of liberation knowing everyone else was the same as you is impossible to describe, and it took me by surprise because I hadn't realized the extent to which I felt like an outsider in the society i was raised in. But more than that, Charles also gave them safety. They are beyond reprisal and punishment from bigots who wish to hurt them for simply being themselves. It's easy to see why they would be so fanatic in their devotion. I'm not queer but I've had similar experiences with being othered and how that is paralleled by the X-Men. This is why I don't want to dismiss their behavior as cult-ish. I can see how it comes off that way, and it may very well turn out to be as such, but I can also see this being about what mutants start to feel and act like when they "belong", that they're safe, and working toward unity without worrying about integrating or forcing themselves to live and act by the rules and norms of people that are attempting to exterminate them. I'm sure some X-Men will see it differently and it will be explored in the upcoming books but I think Hickman is trying to show what happens when mutants are coming together in solidarity, embracing what makes them weird and different. There's definitely some kind of pod people vibe but I get the sense more that they're being "re-born" through community and collaboration. Anyway, on something I noticed: the conversation between Emma and Charles followed by offering a clean slate to all mutants reminds me of the end of Millar's Ultimate X-Men. We can argue about how successful Millar was but he was trying to establish that mutants should have radically different views on society, ethics, and morality as humans, especially when it comes to rehabilitation. I'm not the first to say this in the thread but want to throw in: it's definitely Pax Romana Hickman where he is exploring heavy world building /mythology and setting the status quo, where I'm sure it will be explored more in his main X-Men book and the other X-Books. The big brush setups aren't everyone's thing, I don't blame people for finding it a little boring but I love it. Seting the stage for new X-Books has me super excited for this and everything after. thin blue whine fucked around with this message at 13:11 on Sep 19, 2019 |
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Sep 19, 2019 13:07
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danbanana posted:RE: the cult thing... I think there's a difference between finding a place to be excepted and creating a culture of isolation. I think this is especially true for a group who are actually superior to the rest of the world. In that case, I think there's a fine line between pride in yourself and ideas of supremacy. Not to get too political, but Hickman hasn't been shy about references to Israel, with Magneto literally telling human representatives that MUTANTS ARE THEIR NEW GODS NOW in Jerusalem. Israel is a good example of a group of people who have been brutally treated in the past, found a physical home, and since then, done some extremely questionable things in the belief that their way of life was endangered. This is especially true of the current far-right government. I definitely expect there to be trouble in paradise and I have no illusions that this could sour. The scene in Jerusalem with Magneto was great and was very cool (and kind of a quintessential Magneto moment) but I'm hoping this will have a deeper meaning than an eventual, hamfisted "all oppressed people turn into their oppressors" foreshadowing, though. Or if it is, that it's well done contemplation on why that is, you know? Interesting though that the line is thin between Cult and Community and that the issue can be interpreted as at least riding the line. I agree that Apocalypse being there could be a huge red flag but I'm REALLY curious where it will go, because it seems like Hickman is attempting to turn Apocalypse more complex. I mean everything he is shown to have done (waging an impossible war against machines into the far, far future, and battling demons at the dawn of time with magic swords alongside old mutant-gods on a sentient island) turns him into... I dunno a Frank Frazetta Heavy Metal cover badass instead of a Mustache Twirlingly Genocider. Of course, we'll see how it plays out.
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Sep 19, 2019 14:39
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Considering the way most mutants look, most mutants are probably very body positive and probably wouldn't be too concerned with a little nudity is probably the Gooniest thing I've ever thought to post.
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Sep 23, 2019 11:05
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I'm not calling this issue the weakest so far but unlike the others, that have some kind of action or a ton of new lore packed in, it felt like it was largely a set for the final issue spike.
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Sep 26, 2019 04:45
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TwoPair posted:I know, right? When Namor said line about how Xavier doesn't think he's better, all I could think is "coulda fuckin' fooled me" My guess: Namor would have never said this to Apocalypse or Magneto. In all of the potential futures it seems Xavier is actually the only mutant leader who doesn't radicalize. Despite how it might appear, I don't think he is in the current timeline either. I think he genuinely believes that, even with the measures he's taking, that this is about proving to the humans that they can be equals. It reads to me Namor is telling us that he believes Krakoa-nation is flawed until Xavier sees things like he does (a king) or it's foreshadowing that something will happen to push Xavier in a more radical direction.
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Sep 26, 2019 06:28
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wielder posted:
I think the Avengers run, if you consider that the outcome is the end of Secret Wars, then it's incredibly optimistic. Everything is resurrected because selfish, egotistical men who believed they were more concerned with being better than everyone else and at each other's throats realized the need for sacrificing their self-importance. You know, letting go of old, stale ideals to make room for a younger, different generation and bigger, better, and possibly drastically different things and an infinite number of worlds where all sorts of things are possible.
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Oct 4, 2019 17:05
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Android Blues posted:No, you don't, because your brain doesn't "power down" when you go to sleep. This is a common argument in continuity of consciousness debates, but sleep is not analogous to death. Your brain is active while you're sleeping, it's just in a different mode. You might as well say you lose continuity of consciousness when you blink. I could see this last part being shown to be an issue but, in defense of it, being horrifically murdered wouldn't be as traumatizing for me and everyone else if I could wake up the next morning and beat the poo poo out of the person that did it.
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Oct 8, 2019 10:08
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Parallax posted:also not sure where Hickman is going with this posthuman stuff. if humans can genetically modify themselves into being something equal to, or greater than mutants, then what really separates them? welcome to bigotry.
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Oct 10, 2019 10:21
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DivineCoffeeBinge posted:The key was that you'd see characters inheriting similar but not identical powers, was the thing - but since this was the '80s and early '90s, there weren't nearly so many time-displaced or alternate future kids of extant characters running around, so it was mostly a moot point. Yeah, Franklin has been a mutant for as long as I've been reading comics which stretches back to the 80s. Power Pack to Days of Future Past and Days of Future Present, to Onslaught, and Hickman has even mentioned that he is a mutant a couple times in his Fantastic Four/FF run before it was mentioned again in the House of X. Billzasilver posted:Do you think Hickman is on team Magneto Was Right? Hickman's work has always had a healthy amount of cynicism to it, with the exception of MAYBE his Fantastic Four run? So I think yes, kind of, is probably the right answer. We'll see but I think what was interesting about the Magneto / Xavier interactions is Xavier became more like Magneto but I think Magneto also moved toward Xavier. Magneto's shown a willingness to differ to Xavier and he also backed Jean Grey's "killing humans is a high crime" proposition by Jean, both these things make me think he's softened some of his approach.
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Oct 12, 2019 15:13
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Laughing Zealot posted:The costume thing appears to be Hickman just having a thing for that outfit, but I agree that it feels wildly out of place. She's gonna be in both the main X-men title and X-force. He's said in an interview that the X-Men outfits will be from a wardrobe that consists of all their outfits (I think he may have hinted at new ones, too?) and not a static costume, which has been the case in the past. Honestly, I don't blame him for favoring the traditional one. I think all of Jean's costumes have sucked and the traditional is probably the only one looks the best, aside from her Phoenix costume of course.
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Oct 13, 2019 01:26
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Gymer posted:An imitation Shiar logic diamond. So either they're resurrecting Gregor's husband or using his imprint to attempt another Nimrod or some type of New Nimrod. I say this because when Killian (a cyborg) refers to Gregor's husband as a "great hunter" struck me as a kind of weird thing to say about someone. He does hunt mutants but referring to a military strategist as a great hunter is still off, I dunno. That's until I saw the crystal and the implied plans to resurrect him somehow. I think it's a hint: Nimrod can refer to someone stupid or inept, but it also means great hunter.
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Oct 17, 2019 01:12
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Wanderer posted:He's like Nightcrawler in that he comes from a period where you didn't necessarily have to have just one primary mutation. You're right, originally it was attributed to his healing factor keeping his sense at their peak. I'd also add that since he relies a lot on his other senses that he's very experienced in using them, so that adds to them seeming more super-human.
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Oct 27, 2019 12:10
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