A Series of Unfortunate Events: NYC

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > A Series of Unfortunate Events: NYC

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

...

Alder fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Sep 7, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 14:17

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Apr 26, 2024 04:13

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

I am not very familiar with NY min wage, but your goal does not seem to be very realistic. 30k is about 150% of the min wage in your city. Given your lack of education, what makes you think that that is feasible? Specially when you indicate that it must be a cushy office job. I think you should set your sights lower.

But to begin with, why do you refuse to go to college? It makes sense to take out a hefty loan if need be, so long as you computed the ROI on your major and it is reasonable. What was your SAT? Why can't you get a partial ride if you claim to be so poor?

# ? Jun 6, 2017 15:03

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

...

Alder fucked around with this message at 07:03 on Sep 7, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 15:21

Ancillary Character: Jul 25, 2007; Going about life as if I were a third-tier ancillary character

What about going to a CUNY? The tuition is fairly low, might even be entirely covered with a Pell grant, allowing you to use the Stafford loans to cover cost of living. You're over 24, so you're eligible for the higher loan limits for independent students. Worst case, you may need to take out a few thousand in private loans if you can't tighten your belt enough, but with a realistic career path in mind, it should be a manageable amount.

EDIT: I also remember getting a separate grant from NYS called TAP when I went to college, which should make a CUNY even more affordable.

Ancillary Character fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Jun 6, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 16:49

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

...

Alder fucked around with this message at 07:04 on Sep 7, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 17:20

Ancillary Character: Jul 25, 2007; Going about life as if I were a third-tier ancillary character

Is it that far out of reach though?

CUNY tuition: $6,330/year
Fees: ~$650/year
12 monthly Metrocards: $1452/year
Annual rent: 12x $650 = $7800
Total:$16,232

Pell Grant: $5,815
TAP Grant: $5,165
Max Stafford loans Juniors & Seniors: $12,500 ($5,500 are subsidized)
Total:$23, 580

You should be getting close to the max of these grants if you're as broke as you say.

That's $7,348 leftover or $612/month for food, utilities, other miscellaneous expenses when only considering the most basic of financial aid options. Budget is tight, but not impossible. Plus any small scholarships you get or other aid the school might offer increases this buffer, as well as if you manage to pay rent towards the lower end of your range. You can also see if you can get a job manning the library or whatever BS work they offer students to do part time.

EDIT: NYC's minimum wage is $10.50/hour for small employers (less than 10 employees) and $11/hour for large employers, are you sure your per diem is really worthwhile? You're probably not evading as much in taxes as you think.

Ancillary Character fucked around with this message at 18:51 on Jun 6, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 18:19

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

...

Alder fucked around with this message at 07:04 on Sep 7, 2017

# ? Jun 6, 2017 21:21

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

Alder posted:

I can't go to college because even with govt loans I can't afford it. The $30k is more of a very far away optimistic future goal than immediate one.

The only reason I could attend for 2 years is when I lived at home and my parent paid for the rest and I didn't need room & board.

Look, it is quite simple. ***IF*** you are suitable for college, then cost (in and of itself) should not be a concern. You should take out however much you require, at as low an interest rate as you can obtain. It is quite unlikely that somebody as poor as you claim to be is unable to qualify for sufficient grants and loans.

The more important question is whether you are suitable for college. If your SAT is above 1200 upon 1600 and you are willing to put in the work, then go for it. Just don't pick a poo poo major with no career prospects and a poor ROI.

You asking about how to get a better lovely job is really not seeing the big picture, because you shouldn't be looking for a lovely job to begin with!!! Unless your SAT is below 1200, in which case you need to disclose this. Hard to give advice when you don't tell us poo poo.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 13:30

A FUCKIN BONG BOMB: Apr 6, 2006

Work construction. For real.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 13:46

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

John Smith posted:

Look, it is quite simple. ***IF*** you are suitable for college, then cost (in and of itself) should not be a concern. You should take out however much you require, at as low an interest rate as you can obtain. It is quite unlikely that somebody as poor as you claim to be is unable to qualify for sufficient grants and loans.

The more important question is whether you are suitable for college. If your SAT is above 1200 upon 1600 and you are willing to put in the work, then go for it. Just don't pick a poo poo major with no career prospects and a poor ROI.

You asking about how to get a better lovely job is really not seeing the big picture, because you shouldn't be looking for a lovely job to begin with!!! Unless your SAT is below 1200, in which case you need to disclose this. Hard to give advice when you don't tell us poo poo.

This odd obsession with my SAT is a bit extreme as it's been nearly one decade since I took the SATs and I'm already in enrolled college and not transferring out. Colleges don't care about my SAT? They do care if I can repay grants/loans if I don't graduate on time though.

Just because I can max out loans/grants does NOT mean it's the best idea because you need to repay them back even if it takes me the next 30-40 years.

I have the most boring major ever: It's Computer Information Systems part of Baruch's business program.

A FUCKIN BONG BOMB posted:

Work construction. For real.

My brother did construction but I don't think many companies would hire a woman over anyone else.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 14:00

Ancillary Character: Jul 25, 2007; Going about life as if I were a third-tier ancillary character

Alder posted:

This odd obsession with my SAT is a bit extreme as it's been nearly one decade since I took the SATs and I'm already in enrolled college and not transferring out. Colleges don't care about my SAT? They do care if I can repay grants/loans if I don't graduate on time though.

Just because I can max out loans/grants does NOT mean it's the best idea because you need to repay them back even if it takes me the next 30-40 years.

I have the most boring major ever: It's Computer Information Systems part of Baruch's business program.

Grants do not have to be repaid unless you obtained them fraudulently. You'd be on the hook for ~$25k of federal loans, which is very manageable. It's about $250/month on the 10 year repayment plan and unless you do something stupid like just ignore them and let them default, you have income based repayment plans.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 14:13

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

Alder posted:

This odd obsession with my SAT is a bit extreme as it's been nearly one decade since I took the SATs and I'm already in enrolled college and not transferring out. Colleges don't care about my SAT? They do care if I can repay grants/loans if I don't graduate on time though.

Just because I can max out loans/grants does NOT mean it's the best idea because you need to repay them back even if it takes me the next 30-40 years.

I have the most boring major ever: It's Computer Information Systems part of Baruch's business program.

My brother did construction but I don't think many companies would hire a woman over anyone else.

I am asking about SAT to estimate your chance of graduating from a good prospects major. Just because one college in the country allowed you to enroll does not actually mean that you are college ready. There is a massive difference between enrolling and actually graduating, as your own case so readily illustrates.

That being the case, given your SAT score, I withdraw my advice to consider college. The other posters will be better able to advise you on a suitable trade, as I am not familiar.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 14:17

BarbarianElephant: Feb 12, 2015; The fairy of forgiveness has removed your red text.

Alder posted:

This odd obsession with my SAT is a bit extreme as it's been nearly one decade since I took the SATs and I'm already in enrolled college and not transferring out. Colleges don't care about my SAT? They do care if I can repay grants/loans if I don't graduate on time though.

It's more a question of "Do you have the aptitude for college?" than whether the college cares about it. Are you a person who is good at studying, or do you sit down at a desk and hate every minute of it and dream of doing something more practical? You can't afford to take out big loans if you aren't going to finish. But if you *are* going to finish, it will benefit you.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 14:19

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

BarbarianElephant posted:

It's more a question of "Do you have the aptitude for college?" than whether the college cares about it. Are you a person who is good at studying, or do you sit down at a desk and hate every minute of it and dream of doing something more practical? You can't afford to take out big loans if you aren't going to finish. But if you *are* going to finish, it will benefit you.

I think her answer has already been clear enough on this. Makes me think of the other poster who asked here last week if it makes sense to go to film school in order to secure a stable well-paying career. Lol.

# ? Jun 8, 2017 15:20

fantastic in plastic: Jun 15, 2007; The Socialist Workers Party's newspaper proved to be a tough sell to downtown businessmen.

OP, I looked at your resume and have some ideas to help you improve it.

Move your skills to the top. If you're looking for a programming/IT/sysadmin type job, put things like HTML, CSS, Git and AWS in your skill section, along with any other technical things you've worked on. Given that you're looking for general office work as well as IT stuff, I would suggest writing two resumes, one focused on highlighting your technical skills and the other highlighting your office/customer service/sales skills.

Move your work experience to right under your skills. It's relatively clear what you did (which is better than some peoples' resumes, believe me!), but I don't get a sense of how those activities made an impact at your employer. It's obvious from your posts that you're good at writing; apply that skill to your resume. Keep in mind that it's a persuasive document, one intended to intrigue someone enough to make them want to pick up the phone and give you a call.

Get rid of the high school art club section. No one cares (unless you're specifically applying to be an artist, I suppose). From a corporate point of view, it makes you look like you don't know what professional norms are.

A general weakness of your resume as currently written is that you use vague terms where more specific ones would probably help you improve your callback rate. A few examples:

"Oversaw numerous repairs and maintenance of various computers, peripherals, and smartphones." - how many? what kinds of computers, peripherals, and smartphones? Did you "oversee" the repairs or did you actually perform the repairs?
"Deployed, installed, and configured various hardware." - What kinds of hardware? Computers? Televisions? Radios? Speak-and-spells?
"Managed the advertising and promotion of the business." - How much advertising budget were you responsible for as an ad manager? What kind of return did the store get as a result of your managerial activities?

Hopefully you get the idea.

Assuming that your resume is not fundamentally dishonest, I have every confidence you can leverage your technical skills and sales background to get some kind of a 9-5, especially in a market as big as NYC.

e: Also, don't do a loving unpaid internship unless you're a trust-fund kid trying to get into a niche that's entirely built on connections.

fantastic in plastic fucked around with this message at 16:14 on Jun 8, 2017

# ? Jun 8, 2017 16:11

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

BarbarianElephant posted:

It's more a question of "Do you have the aptitude for college?" than whether the college cares about it. Are you a person who is good at studying, or do you sit down at a desk and hate every minute of it and dream of doing something more practical? You can't afford to take out big loans if you aren't going to finish. But if you *are* going to finish, it will benefit you.

This would make more sense if one believed college were based on a meritocracy not a business. I have no doubt I will return to college once have extra money available and not 100% reliant on loans/grants. I don't recall writing anywhere how college is a Bad Idea or that I hated class? Just that I'm worried about other issues right now.

fantastic in plastic posted:

OP, I looked at your resume and have some ideas to help you improve it.

Move your skills to the top. If you're looking for a programming/IT/sysadmin type job, put things like HTML, CSS, Git and AWS in your skill section, along with any other technical things you've worked on. Given that you're looking for general office work as well as IT stuff, I would suggest writing two resumes, one focused on highlighting your technical skills and the other highlighting your office/customer service/sales skills.

Move your work experience to right under your skills. It's relatively clear what you did (which is better than some peoples' resumes, believe me!), but I don't get a sense of how those activities made an impact at your employer. It's obvious from your posts that you're good at writing; apply that skill to your resume. Keep in mind that it's a persuasive document, one intended to intrigue someone enough to make them want to pick up the phone and give you a call.

Get rid of the high school art club section. No one cares (unless you're specifically applying to be an artist, I suppose). From a corporate point of view, it makes you look like you don't know what professional norms are.

A general weakness of your resume as currently written is that you use vague terms where more specific ones would probably help you improve your callback rate. A few examples:

"Oversaw numerous repairs and maintenance of various computers, peripherals, and smartphones." - how many? what kinds of computers, peripherals, and smartphones? Did you "oversee" the repairs or did you actually perform the repairs?
"Deployed, installed, and configured various hardware." - What kinds of hardware? Computers? Televisions? Radios? Speak-and-spells?
"Managed the advertising and promotion of the business." - How much advertising budget were you responsible for as an ad manager? What kind of return did the store get as a result of your managerial activities?

Hopefully you get the idea.

Assuming that your resume is not fundamentally dishonest, I have every confidence you can leverage your technical skills and sales background to get some kind of a 9-5, especially in a market as big as NYC.

e: Also, don't do a loving unpaid internship unless you're a trust-fund kid trying to get into a niche that's entirely built on connections.

Thanks for the advice, I'll update my resume soon. Unfortunately, the internship is required to be considered for a shot at PT/FT employment from the work program. I'll still be working on weekends to cover rent/bills.

I've considered splitting my resume b/t IT and Customer Service parts but I don't think I have enough info to cover 1 page.

Alder fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Jun 8, 2017

# ? Jun 8, 2017 19:27

BadSamaritan: May 2, 2008; crumb by crumb in this big black forest

Hey, I went to a CUNY on the Pell Grant, because I was an independent student with very low income. My student loans and $12/hr part time retail job covered my expenses, and I went full time and sprinted as fast as I possibly could toward that high ROI degree (a licensed allied health field). I would be in a much worse situation if I hadn't gone full time- taking out the loans to finish faster was absolutely the right call.

Like some of the other posters have said, borrowing money for school isn't, by itself, a bad thing. It is bad if you don't finish your degree, or don't leverage it into a 'real' job.

CUNY is good and extremely affordable if you pick a major and get a paid summer internship so you have something worthwhile to apply to real jobs with. Baruch has a pretty strong hiring network in the city if you don't goof off there.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 00:30

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

Alder posted:

This would make more sense if one believed college were based on a meritocracy not a business

This is very true and applicable within the context of enrolling into college. I am not a SJW by far, but I quite agree with your sentiment here.

That is not what we are saying. We are saying that someone of your ability has little realistic hope of ***GRADUATING*** from college with a valuable major because of your intellectual constraints. Do you get the difference? There is a big difference between signing up for those "eat the 2kg steak in 30mins and it is free" challenges and actually completing the challenges. Signing up is the easy part here.

You do realise what the 6 years graduation rate is for students with SAT below 1200/1600, right? What makes you think you are different when so many of your intellectual peers have flunked out? Just as you yourself have, actually. What? Second try makes good?

# ? Jun 9, 2017 01:06

BarbarianElephant: Feb 12, 2015; The fairy of forgiveness has removed your red text.

That's not very nice, John Smith. I see where you got your avatar! I'm more concerned about calling the major "boring" than wanting to imply the OP is a moron. If a person doesn't like to study, then studying with so many many financial challenges will be extra hard.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 03:16

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

BarbarianElephant posted:

That's not very nice, John Smith. I see where you got your avatar! I'm more concerned about calling the major "boring" than wanting to imply the OP is a moron. If a person doesn't like to study, then studying with so many many financial challenges will be extra hard.

That is because I am not a very nice person. And I would justify that I am the good guy in this specific context. SA is often a cesspool of unjustified encouragement. Encouraging a child to go for it and try to fly off a roof like Superman isn't very nice either.

I don't think the OP is a moron since she has the ability to post and morons are generally illiterate. I do think she is outright stupid or at least of limited intellect. And stupid people shouldn't go to college. When said stupid person asks you, you should honestly and forthrightly advise them ***NOT TO*** go to college.

PS: I mean seriously. Can you believe her line of reasoning that it doesn't matter how poo poo her SAT is, the mere fact that she found a college in the US willing to enroll her demonstrates that she is fit for college?!?!? Specially after she already flunked out the first time around. Clearly aspiring stupid material.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 14:44

BarbarianElephant: Feb 12, 2015; The fairy of forgiveness has removed your red text.

John Smith posted:

That is because I am not a very nice person. And I would justify that I am the good guy in this specific context. SA is often a cesspool of unjustified encouragement. Encouraging a child to go for it and try to fly off a roof like Superman isn't very nice either.

I don't think the OP is a moron since she has the ability to post and morons are generally illiterate. I do think she is outright stupid or at least of limited intellect. And stupid people shouldn't go to college. When said stupid person asks you, you should honestly and forthrightly advise them ***NOT TO*** go to college.

PS: I mean seriously. Can you believe her line of reasoning that it doesn't matter how poo poo her SAT is, the mere fact that she found a college in the US willing to enroll her demonstrates that she is fit for college?!?!? Specially after she already flunked out the first time around. Clearly aspiring stupid material.

I hope reverse psychology drives the OP to succeed just to spite you.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 14:55

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

BadSamaritan posted:

Hey, I went to a CUNY on the Pell Grant, because I was an independent student with very low income. My student loans and $12/hr part time retail job covered my expenses, and I went full time and sprinted as fast as I possibly could toward that high ROI degree (a licensed allied health field). I would be in a much worse situation if I hadn't gone full time- taking out the loans to finish faster was absolutely the right call.

Like some of the other posters have said, borrowing money for school isn't, by itself, a bad thing. It is bad if you don't finish your degree, or don't leverage it into a 'real' job.

CUNY is good and extremely affordable if you pick a major and get a paid summer internship so you have something worthwhile to apply to real jobs with. Baruch has a pretty strong hiring network in the city if you don't goof off there.

Thanks, I'm glad you were able to complete your degree with loans. TBH, I didn't know many people (within my family) who attended college so the entire college grant/loan process was a bit of a mystery until I got accepted. I'm glad CUNY/SUNY are providing free tuition next year which made me wonder if it's more than just a pipe dream.

BarbarianElephant posted:

That's not very nice, John Smith. I see where you got your avatar! I'm more concerned about calling the major "boring" than wanting to imply the OP is a moron. If a person doesn't like to study, then studying with so many many financial challenges will be extra hard.

Please refrain from quoting/replying to him since he's been blocked for going OT/spam.

Sigh, I don't mean boring as in I dislike the subject. Actually, I like coding and learning about networking/IT as a career. I just want a effective way to jumpstart it if I don't have a degree right now. For example, a good portion of my resume is self-taught knowledge but I'm always wondering if I'm lacking a good foundation for hiring.

I much rather prefer working with machines than service jobs which I've had for the last 3-5 years and I'm aware how some businesses look down on people w/o formal degrees.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 16:43

BarbarianElephant: Feb 12, 2015; The fairy of forgiveness has removed your red text.

Alder posted:

Sigh, I don't mean boring as in I dislike the subject. Actually, I like coding and learning about networking/IT as a career. I just want a effective way to jumpstart it if I don't have a degree right now. For example, a good portion of my resume is self-taught knowledge but I'm always wondering if I'm lacking a good foundation for hiring.

I much rather prefer working with machines than service jobs which I've had for the last 3-5 years and I'm aware how some businesses look down on people w/o formal degrees.

AFAIK coding is a more in-demand topic than general IT. Are you more interested in code or IT? Very different jobs.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 17:05

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

BarbarianElephant posted:

AFAIK coding is a more in-demand topic than general IT. Are you more interested in code or IT? Very different jobs.

I started reading up on IT/Networking threads for a career direction a few years ago and then I picked up coding with my friend who encouraged me to look into web development careers.

However, I'm at a significant disadvantage compared to newly minted CS majors who have a formal foundation and basics completed. Also, not to mention the amount of boot camp grads who paid $10,000 for a rushed intro to full-stack dev and job hunting too.

Yes, I'm aware of tons of free coding lessons/courses online and Meetups. Coding is always something I do on the side like updating my site or trying to build simple widgets.

IT/Networking seems to be more approachable as in you can go complete certs and/or related degrees and find a job. Then again I lack both networking and work exp so my resume is a desert.

If I had to decide on one topic I would say IT/Networking since my college has a related major and I'm not exactly the world's best self-taught coder who can compete on the job market.

Alder fucked around with this message at 17:46 on Jun 9, 2017

# ? Jun 9, 2017 17:38

John Smith: Feb 26, 2015; by LITERALLY AN ADMIN

BarbarianElephant posted:

I hope reverse psychology drives the OP to succeed just to spite you.

If it was within her ability, then I would be wrong to begin with. Stupid is as stupid does. Those inspirational stories in the movies of how literal idiots overcame their challenges in life and pull through despite everything are inspirational precisely because that is not the norm. You don't often see movies about stupid people who flunk out of college.

Alder posted:

Please refrain from quoting/replying to him since he's been blocked for going OT/spam.

Truth hurts huh. Why even bother coming to ask advice when you cannot emotionally accept advice pointing out that you are not suitable for college?

# ? Jun 9, 2017 19:14

xpander: Sep 2, 2004

Here's my hot take: ditch the post-secondary plans and learn by doing. You could spend a fraction of the cost of a single semester of post-secondary on some elearning stuff and bootstrap yourself into a real career much faster. This isn't necessarily for everyone, but it feels like it fits what I've read of your story so far. I work in devops/cloud infrastructure, and while the learning curve can be steep(it requires both coding *and* systems skills) I think it has the kind of job future-proofing that makes the time investment worthwhile. I bought some courses from A Cloud Guru during a Slashdot flash sale last year, and the company I work for uses them as its main training resource. I had a lot more experience already under my belt, but getting a certification combined with a personal project or two could be enough to get your foot in the door somewhere. I have some additional resources if this interests you at all - PM me and I'll gladly provide them.

Given all of that, you could still easily go back to college at some point after learning some of this stuff on your own, if you felt it was necessary(or wanted to switch careers entirely). It requires some self-direction(so the polar opposite of traditional learning) but can be a good alternative to the structured format of the classroom.

# ? Jun 9, 2017 19:33

Alder: Sep 24, 2013

xpander posted:

Here's my hot take: ditch the post-secondary plans and learn by doing. You could spend a fraction of the cost of a single semester of post-secondary on some elearning stuff and bootstrap yourself into a real career much faster. This isn't necessarily for everyone, but it feels like it fits what I've read of your story so far. I work in devops/cloud infrastructure, and while the learning curve can be steep(it requires both coding *and* systems skills) I think it has the kind of job future-proofing that makes the time investment worthwhile.

Thanks, I'll check out the guides later as I'm currently hosting my site on AWS and it can't hurt to know more about new tech. I confess, I've never paid for a online course before other than the free coding courses available so this will be a new exp too.

# ? Jun 11, 2017 15:56

Pryor on Fire: May 14, 2013; they don't know all alien abduction experiences can be explained by people thinking saving private ryan was a documentary

Don't always start with the goal of completing some guide or tutorial, instead start with the goal of building something real that does a thing. Whatever you're interested in, you can plug x into y and just watch data flow between machines on the command line, it doesn't really matter, you just need to do that real stuff. If you have no ideas or aspirations then just work through these in a new programming language: https://projecteuler.net/archives

# ? Jun 11, 2017 16:11

litany of gulps: Jun 11, 2001; Fun Shoe

I've taught high school seniors for a few years now. Almost all of them are from families where the parents don't have much income and nobody has a degree. A huge portion of them don't ever actually end up getting a degree because they're afraid of loans. It's always the same line - "I'm going to save up some money then go to school."

It doesn't work like that, though. There's money out there, even if you don't believe it. You're probably never going to save enough money working poo poo jobs, because nobody does. That's the trap. Good luck, though.

# ? Jun 12, 2017 00:06

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? Apr 26, 2024 04:13

EugeneJ: Feb 5, 2012; by FactsAreUseless

Good news - NY in-state college tuition is free now as long as you stay in-state after you graduate:

https://www.hesc.ny.gov/excelsior/

# ? Jun 12, 2017 00:27

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > A Series of Unfortunate Events: NYC