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Cloud Potato posted:OK, let me see if I follow your reasoning: Nb5 cxb5, Qa8+ Qb8, Rxd8+ Kxd8, Qxb8+ and that's where I lose the thread. Well, at that point we've traded a Knight for a Queen, their King is in the open and we can easily promote any pawn we wish. Not much else to see. If they don't take the Knight after Nb5 we check the King next turn with Nxa7+ and they are forced to take with their Queen, so we can easily move into Qxc6+ and then Qa8+
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Aug 7, 2017 11:16
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(Black to move, in check)
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Cloud Potato posted:OK, let me see if I follow your reasoning: Nb5 cxb5, Qa8+ Qb8, Rxd8+ Kxd8, Qxb8+ and that's where I lose the thread. I can't find a particularly tidy way to tie it up from there, but their position is absolutely shattered and we can easily push their King around until we find a mate. The game is pretty much ours. And the balance of pieces is far more in our favour than the outcome of Bf4 you posted earlier (we're up a Queen to a Knight, instead of a Knight and a Pawn to a Bishop.) e: As above sebzilla fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Aug 7, 2017 |
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Aug 7, 2017 11:18
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Surely in the example I posted, we lose our remaining knight and a rook in exchange for their queen? On the other hand, hopefully the threat of Nxc7 next turn will prevent Black from taking our bishop this turn. Voting Nb5.
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Aug 7, 2017 12:42
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There are definitely some good moves to follow, but I think I'll settle with Nb5.
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Aug 7, 2017 12:48
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Cloud Potato posted:Surely in the example I posted, we lose our remaining knight and a rook in exchange for their queen? Their queen AND their rook.
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Aug 7, 2017 12:51
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sebzilla posted:I can't find a particularly tidy way to tie it up from there, but their position is absolutely shattered and we can easily push their King around until we find a mate. The game is pretty much ours. And the balance of pieces is far more in our favour than the outcome of Bf4 you posted earlier (we're up a Queen to a Knight, instead of a Knight and a Pawn to a Bishop.) Even if the game is pretty much ours, we'd still have to be careful. Going for a stalemate is an option for Black if they want to stop us from winning. For you newbie players, that's definitely a valid option to take in Chess if you think winning isn't possible. (Stalemate is when the other player can't make a move because all of them will put their King in Check, but the King currently isn't in Check itself. This counts as a draw.)
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Aug 7, 2017 12:55
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 Nxc6 6.Nf3 Bxf3 7.Qxf3 Qd7 8.0-0 e6 9.c4 0-0-0 10.Be3 Qc7 11.Rd1 e5 12.Bxc6 bxc6 13.Nc3 h5 14.dxe5 Ng4 15.Nb5 Black has 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Aug 7, 2017 15:00
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 Nxc6 6.Nf3 Bxf3 7.Qxf3 Qd7 8.0-0 e6 9.c4 0-0-0 10.Be3 Qc7 11.Rd1 e5 12.Bxc6 bxc6 13.Nc3 h5 14.dxe5 Ng4 15.Nb5 Nxe5 You have 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Aug 8, 2017 15:14
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Seems we need to either move our Queen or put them in check. Why not both? Qf5+ does the job. Na7+ is an alternative but I think we struggle to follow it up with the knight there and will end up needing to move the Queen anyway. Thoughts?
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Aug 8, 2017 17:00
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Well, let's see what those moves get us. Here's what Qf5+ does for us. From what I can tell there are only 4 legal moves Black can makes in this situation. Moves 1 and 2: Ahhhhhh, mad Queen! Run away!   They move that King out of the way. Move 3: My castle will protect me!  They use that Rook as a shield. But all 3 of those moves can result in one thing.  We take their queen with our Knight. However, we'll most likely be losing that Knight in the process. We won't be able to do that if they make this move, though. Move 4: The Queenly Shield  They use their Queen to block our Queen.  At which point, we take that Queen with our Rook.(And will most likely lose it in their process.) But yeah, I don't see a way for them to take our Queen if we make that move, and we'll be snagging their Queen no matter what with this. Haven't pursued these lines all that well, so maybe there's something I'm missing. As for Na7+...  Well, we'll be putting that King in Check alright.  But they can just take with their Queen, and move her out of danger. At which point we'll have to give up either our Queen or Rook with pretty much nothing to gain. Yeah, I'm struggling to see what Na7+ does for us. But maybe I haven't pursued this line of thought enough.
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Aug 8, 2017 17:45
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I'd thought we could follow up with Qxc6+ but forgot about the Knight. Oops! Yeah Qf5+ seems a simple choice then unless anyone else has something better? They can also block with Nd7 but in that case we still take their Queen so it's all good.
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Aug 8, 2017 18:10
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Yeah, if anyone has something better, or can point out a potential benefit of Na7+, I'm all ears. Until then, let us prepare to commit regicide! Qf5+ 
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Aug 8, 2017 18:16
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Dr. Fetus posted:Yeah, if anyone has something better, or can point out a potential benefit of Na7+, I'm all ears. I like the way you said this. Qf5+!
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Aug 8, 2017 18:27
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Qf5+ Probably going to end up trading queens, but we would certainly trade queens with the knight move so...
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Aug 8, 2017 19:19
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Qf5+ Seems to be the best we can do with the lest risk and if they block with queen we can take it with rook. Also leaves us with the chance to use our knight for another check in a few turns.
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Aug 8, 2017 20:53
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Qf5+
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Aug 8, 2017 21:33
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Oh, here's the Lichess link. Also, minor discovery. There's actually a 5th legal move Black can make if we go Qf5+. It's not that big a deal, though. Move 5: Protect me, oh valiant Knight!  They block our Queen with their Knight. Doesn't change the fact that their Queen is still royally screwed, since we can snag it with our Knight. To be honest, I'm not sure what this move would do for them, but I just felt like pointing it out so we aren't taken by surprise if they go with this. EDIT: And sebzilla already pointed this out. Whoops! I know how to read good. 
Araxxor fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 8, 2017 22:00
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Yeah, Qf5+ looks good to me.
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Aug 8, 2017 23:45
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There's a part of me that wants to play Qf4 (instead of taking our knight, Black somehow moves theirs), Qxc6#. But we can't make their moves for them. Voting Qf5+.Dr. Fetus posted:As for Na7+... Bxa7 seems the next logical move here. Then Nxf3, gxf3 and then it's 2 rooks, bishop and 6 pawns against 2 rooks, bishop and 4 pawns.
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Aug 9, 2017 00:22
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Qf5+ is a winner.
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Aug 9, 2017 00:35
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Qf5+ is good. We've been trying to capture their queen without losing ours all game. The one thing nD7 gets them is that if they don't do that we more than likely take the knight for free next turn if they don't. oath2order fucked around with this message at 04:21 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 04:00
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oath2order posted:Qf5+ is good. We've been trying to capture their queen without losing ours all game. Good point. Not having that Knight would be yet another blow to them. (On the other hand, moving it back could potentially restrict the King's movement.) Should we start looking for ways to force a Checkmate now? Depending on what they do next, I feel like we have a decent advantage at this point. Or is it too soon for that? Oh and that should be 10 votes. I think it's been a while since we've hit that. I see the majority is all for a potential act of regicide. 
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Aug 9, 2017 04:54
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 Nxc6 6.Nf3 Bxf3 7.Qxf3 Qd7 8.0-0 e6 9.c4 0-0-0 10.Be3 Qc7 11.Rd1 e5 12.Bxc6 bxc6 13.Nc3 h5 14.dxe5 Ng4 15.Nb5 Nxe5 16.Qf5+ Black has 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Aug 9, 2017 11:00
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So, if they do anything other than Qd7 we can Nxc7 next turn. And if they do go for Qd7 our move is Rxd7. Whatever happens, their Queen is going down while ours sits pretty.
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Aug 9, 2017 12:00
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sebzilla posted:So, if they do anything other than Qd7 we can Nxc7 next turn. 16 ... Qd7 17. Nxa7+ to keep on being assholes and take our Knight out of the line of fire. We can Rxd7 after that. EDIT: Wait, it's basically the same, we have a move if we go 16 ... Qd7 17. Rxd7+ Rxd7 anyway. Still I prefer being a jerk and making them move their King NOW. 
Fat Samurai fucked around with this message at 13:42 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 13:39
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Fat Samurai posted:16 ... Qd7 17. Nxa7+ to keep on being assholes and take our Knight out of the line of fire. We can Rxd7 after that. I like the idea of: 16. ...Qd7 17. Nxa7+. But if they decide to move their rook down, Rd7, instead of moving their Queen, we can take advantage of that by using Knight to take their Queen, Nxc7. Easy Queen kill that easy. But what options do we have if they move their King? Can we just take their Queen with our Knight (Nxc7) and go from there?
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Aug 9, 2017 23:28
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forgive me if this was already discussed, but here is an interesting path 16. Qd7 17. rxd7 rxd7 18 na7+ and the board looks as follows with black to move. From where they need to move the king, as no other move is legal.
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Aug 9, 2017 23:44
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I just had to share this Chess by Post game I played. My opponent was oddly defensive while my Queen's pawn rampaged across the board capturing four pieces, resulting in this state on move 23. What a brave soldier. 
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Aug 10, 2017 06:49
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Chessty Puller salutes your brave efforts.
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Aug 10, 2017 07:14
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That's deep into enemy territory. A brave soldier indeed.
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Aug 10, 2017 11:15
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 1.e4 d5 2.exd5 Nf6 3.d4 Bg4 4.Bb5+ c6 5.dxc6 Nxc6 6.Nf3 Bxf3 7.Qxf3 Qd7 8.0-0 e6 9.c4 0-0-0 10.Be3 Qc7 11.Rd1 e5 12.Bxc6 bxc6 13.Nc3 h5 14.dxe5 Ng4 15.Nb5 Nxe5 16.Qf5+ Qd7 You have 24 hours to decide on a move.
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Aug 10, 2017 12:23
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So they went Qd7 after all. So do we perform the execution now, or go with a different move? Rxd7 will snag us the Queen right away. Though come to think of it, Nxa7+ is also worth considering. There are only 3 legal moves that Black can make there, all of which involve moving the King out of the way. They can't take the Knight with their Queen, or move their Queen at all since it's currently pinned by our Queen. So I guess the question is, do we want their Queen out of the picture now, or do we want their King in a different position? Araxxor fucked around with this message at 12:31 on Aug 10, 2017 |
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Aug 10, 2017 12:27
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Dr. Fetus posted:So they went Qd7 after all. So do we perform the execution now, or go with a different move? Both end up with us taking their Queen with our Rook, but I kinda prefer their King as cornered as possible. Plus, if they move it to a dark square after Nxa7+, we can check it again after taking their Knight with our Queen, which keeps on giving free moves to us. Giving them time will mean that they can finally get their Bishop and other Rook into play. No reason not to keep piling up the pressure. In the end, I don't think it matters much, but I'm leaning towards Nxa7+
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Aug 10, 2017 12:51
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Nxa7+ for the reasons above
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Aug 10, 2017 13:58
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Nxa7+ It gives us everything we want and more.
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Aug 10, 2017 17:32
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I'm concerned that leaves our knight out on a limb, and two of the legal moves involve placing the king right next to it. Most likely they'll go Kb7, which makes it difficult for the knight to escape. At best it's a neutral move imo. Rxd7
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Aug 10, 2017 18:37
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Added Space posted:I'm concerned that leaves our knight out on a limb, and two of the legal moves involve placing the king right next to it. Most likely they'll go Kb7, which makes it difficult for the knight to escape. At best it's a neutral move imo. It's protected by our bishop. Nxa7+
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Aug 10, 2017 19:01
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NxA7+
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Aug 10, 2017 20:35
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nxa7+
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Aug 10, 2017 21:21
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Yeah, that Knight is safe. They can't take it with the Queen (not right away) because moving it means their King is still in Check by our Queen. Taking it with the King is out of the question since our Bishop is covering that square. At the very least, our Knight will restrict where the King can currently move. Let's tighten that noose a bit more. Nax7+. Then we can go with Rxd7 since that Queen is still a sitting duck.
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Aug 10, 2017 21:34
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