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(Thread IKs: fart simpson)
 
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tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

LimburgLimbo posted:

Already mentioned but they'll call you randomly, frequently, already nearby so if you're outside you're hosed, and they give you fines in the range of 20k+ USD for violations.

It's overall quite effective (clearly from the results) without going to the level of tracking every single person, which is pretty good imo

Taiwan didn't gently caress up its initial virus response like China did, so they can just enforce quarantine and do contact tracing without having the severe lockdowns that China implemented since they don't have a huge reservoir of undetected cases. Unfortunately the Taiwan model is going to be ineffective here in the US for the time being.

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tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Centrist Committee posted:

“is going to be ineffective” is doing a whole lot of lifting here lol

lol i mean even if we had their competence i think it's too late to attempt it

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
just popping in to say the gbs china thread is the funniest thread on the forums

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Forceholy posted:

Didn't the military come out a few years ago with worry that they wouldn't meet their recruitment quotas because if lot of high school graduates are too fat? Isn't there a boot camp equivalent of fat camp or something?

iirc they blamed tattoos and antidepressants. fat is also probably a big problem

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

PawParole posted:

What’s that from?

The artist's name is Hu Ming, and her stuff got posted alot back in LF

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

genericnick posted:

Does getting the Taiwanese cores back unlock some overpowered decisions? Otherwise why bother, the status quo seems to serve everyone involved quite handily.

The younger generation in Taiwan has a strong national identity and has no interest in reunification no matter the government in Beijing, so it's slowly becoming a now-or-never issue for the mainland. Taiwan also blocks the mainland's access to the Pacific, which is a big deal for their nuclear subs in an increasingly tense cold war.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
I'm pretty sure it's just Chinese people using bitcoin for capital flight and it's kind of hard to just ban bitcoin

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

indigi posted:

it's a completely transparent system, a few forensic accountants and you'd be able to track down anyone moving it in quantity

i don't think it's the uber wealthy chinese doing it, i think it's more henry types who want it as an insurance policy and are too numerous to bother with much

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
it still sounds like you're conflating the PRC with a bunch of random chinese people

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Rutibex posted:

to be clear i am talking about the sovereign nation state of china, which is controlled by a one party system known as the PRC. thats why i said "china" and not "chinese people"

i am also not talking about taiwan, which also claims to be china. im sorry for the confusion

sorry, i meant this quote:

gradenko_2000 posted:

I tend to believe that if China ever had enough combined hashing power to do a 51% attack on bitcoin*, or some other dumping scheme that would hurt its value at a time when it'd be advantageous to do so, that they'd pull the trigger.

* I imagine it's possible that China already has enough compute to do this, and it's more a matter of opportunity.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
Afaik the PLA considered the Soviet Union to be its main adversary until it shifted to Taiwan and the US in the '90s

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
Conspiracies aside, the only reasonable theory is that the virus came from Southern China. People have been researching bat viruses there for the past 15 years and they've found all kinds of strains extremely similar to SARS 2 and SARS 1

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

hexate posted:

With virus' traits as they are, it'll prove difficult for any nation, and particularly any urban center, to contain the spread of this virus. Weeks long incubation period? Airborne, likely asymptomatic transmission? Good luck.

In China, the state controlled media channels, centralized government, and anti-intellectualism of CCP party elders are all contributing to kneecap a functioning society through poor decisions. The response hasn't only been counter-productive in terms of stopping the spread of the virus, but has actively broken down other systems required in a mechanized society: illusion of safety, transportation of goods, medical response to non-COVID illnesses, to name a few.

These are not problems unique to China or the CCP, though. Consider which of these problems might also apply to the US (or other nations), and how? How would corporate media in the US report on this today, vs the US's media of 20-25 years ago? America's media channels are much more consolidated and coordinated by status-quo powers than in years past, and Trump is only the latest flavor of a burgeoning anti-intellectualism at home (following Nixon, Reagan, Bush, Bush, and to a lesser extent, even Clinton and Obama).

This is an existential threat to post-truth boomer governments, the world over. I doubt that it will collapse the CCP, especially given the size of China's populace, but it may well fracture it, decentralize it, or begin a power transfer to younger generations.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
is wddp still around

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Ardennes posted:

I am less convinced that larger powers won't be able to design cost effective counter-measures (remember these drones are going pretty slow/have a limited range compared to something like a hypersonic missile.)

Cheap drones aren't fast and naval actions occur over hundreds of miles of open sea. A CBG can probably avoid a drone swarm by just leisurely steaming away from it.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
someone explain to me how "fauci is responsible for a wuhan lab leak" makes any sense at all without being incredibly racist

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
for one thing, the army is totally useless in a potential conflict with China

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Some Guy TT posted:

actually i think youll find that people pushing the lab leak theory are dangerous sinophiles

https://mobile.twitter.com/MJGerson/status/1397148932178944007

ok so how does "a us government official is responsible for a chinese lab" make any sense?

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
Isn't Space X just straight up better than the other MIC space solutions anyways in this country? It's not like it's Musk vs NASA, it's Musk vs just as parasitical defense contractors

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

fart simpson posted:

what if it comes out that the lab was doing it under an american advisory, with american funding, as fauci's pet project? should we also take action against ourselves?

why do people keep saying this? China had every reason to do this research themselves anyways because sars hosed them up so bad

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Antonymous posted:

I think the claim is that the lab in China, USA funded or no, was making super powered versions of SARS that looked like natural evolution and it leaked. I saw a video of Rand grilling Fauci and that was what he seemed to believe. it's literally a comic book story where you can't have conclusive evidence (unless you find that covid 19's DNA was in a lab before the outbreak but ~china~ won't let our inspectors into every one of their labs to go through their files) but it sounds incredibly evil so it's a good narrative if you hate fauci and china

I mean without US involvement it's just a red scare narrative but if you think fauci is involved you're arguing that the us was developing bioweapons in a Chinese lab which is just beyond stupid

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

gradenko_2000 posted:

in all seriousness "the US is doing extremely unethical poo poo abroad" is not far-fetched - they do it with CIA black sites and the like because you want that poo poo outside of the mainland so that it's easier to hide, easier to deny, and difficult to prosecute even if it was discovered

sure, that all makes sense for why secret evil poo poo is happening in like Guantanamo or something, but not America's main geopolitical adversary

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

LimburgLimbo posted:

Singapore is super nice. It's institutionally homophobic but its also functionally pretty open and it's not like the US where you're liable to be killed by some homophobic rear end in a top hat because it's in general not a failed society.

It is super capitalistic but in general pay is high and they've controlled some stuff like skyrocketing housing better than a lot of places (still going up but not as insane).

Corona too, the pattern you see there, is probably going to repeat itself everywhere you had it well controlled so you had few cases in the wild, then you open back up after you have high rates of vaccination. Delta is gonna spread but deaths will be limited to a few breakthrough cases and the unvaccinated. Unless they develop some really good prophylactics probably going to see the same in Korea and Taiwan once they open up.

What is Taiwan's covid plan now? They're covid free, right? Are they just going to wait for vaccination and then let the chips fall where they may?

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Torpor posted:

the Soviet’s fielded a system like that for like 15 years and abandoned it because it isn’t really a practical system.

I think it was the r-36(O).

It is also a sign that the Chinese deem a nuclear first strike a viable strategy.

Missile defense systems are inherently aggressive in a MAD scenario, since missile defense cannot possibly stop a first strike, but they might be able to stop a weakened second strike. The Chinese building systems to defeat missile defense is a defensive move to maintain a nuclear deterrent. Crazy weapons delivery systems are meant to keep MAD functioning.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
ai weiwei is good and that han dynasty vase (which was probably a fake anyways) is 100x more interesting for having been broken

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Atopian posted:

I also post there, and the gbs thread has really become quite relaxed since a couple of strident guys left.
Different atmosphere, different topics, but not so bad.

did fojar get banned

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
i wonder why iran missiled a bunch of US bases

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
this thread was better back when sincx was still around

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Torpor posted:

No counter escalating could have stopped Putin since he also doesnt want to get pulled into a huge war just like we don't want to get pulled into a war, as it stands we gave clear signals that he could basically invade ukraine. and now that invasion is happening and now those people are dying.

If the entire Russian goal was to keep Ukraine out of NATO (not so clear after the Putin speech), then putting NATO forces there as a tripwire is just effectively making them part of NATO and immediately forcing a confrontation. We wouldn't be wondering if the Russians would start shooting at us, we'd be wondering when the nukes would drop

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
The Taiwanese ADIZ extends into the mainland but they never care about mainland overflights. What China has been doing is flights over the sea near Pratas island

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Skyl3lazer posted:

I mean, the fact this actually happened doesn't mean those people were wrong in *thinking* it wouldn't. Like there's no particular reason visible to anyone besides Putin as to why he actually still went through with this invasion as it seemed like he was going to get what he wanted re: nato anyway, and there's absolutely no way that he has any idea how this could even end. There's just no way to even try to predict possible outcomes nevermind betting odds on what will actually occur.

Like it's total madman poo poo, risking literal nuclear annihilation to get a few months popularity boost at home and some generally worthless territory.

I didn't think Russia would actually invade either, but it turns out we were wrong and US intelligence was right. It's just denial to claim otherwise

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

oscarthewilde posted:

as funny as it is that china just immediately cucked the state department, I don't think it's a good thing. it's just gonna intensify an already pretty intense anti-china atmosphere in the west. The US playing hardball and convincing Ukraine negotiation wasn't an option got us in this mess the first place, the last thing we need is US administration and media convinced diplomacy is a relic of the past and resorting to force as the only way forward.

yeah that story pretty clearly signals china is not going to be a partner in diplomacy

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

wow really pushing the "ally with russia against china" line there

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

gradenko_2000 posted:

the people who instigated the "pretty intense anti-china atmosphere" were also the same people that asked China to give them a hand

which is why they leaked it

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

indigi posted:

I wonder if d&d will ever understand that people’s support of Russia boils down to mostly thinking they took reasonable steps to try to avoid what to Moscow was an unreasonable outcome (Ukraine joining nato)

like the beginning and end of my - and I bet most people here - “support” is saying well in this specific case I don’t think Putin acted evilly or even unreasonably given the circumstances. I wasn’t hoping for an invasion, I don’t think Russia is acting “morally” (whatever that means), and I know it’s not gonna have some great outcome where Ukraine is denazified and the neoliberal conservatives put in prison. it all stinks. but the narrative NATO/US are pushing about all of these events is obviously complete bullshit

launching a war in support of entirely legitimate state security concerns is evil

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

genericnick posted:

We're not yet completely sure the war has limited goals. If I had to guess the Russians want to implement something like Minsk 2 at the point of a gun, but I've been wrong before. And fairly recently at that.

Minsk 2 was not worth an invasion. They clearly want more

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

MLK Ultra posted:

like how did this thread turn into the bootlicking thread?

this thread used to be the china thread, where a bunch of people fed up with GBS racism posted. then it turned into the china/russia geopolitics thread, and then everyone here thought the war wouldn't happen. and now, rather than admit they were wrong, they've all just doubled down into insanity

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug

Joementum posted:

the only objective that makes sense is to capture the government, destroy or capture any military equipment, and force some terms of surrender that involve a ban on re-militarization, and then leave

but putin really could be aiming for objectives that don't make sense

KitConstantine posted:

Here's the Russian take on events.

Click through the quoted tweet to get to the article, its loving wild.

https://twitter.com/olgatokariuk/status/1497720524885082113?t=ys8e93e9KAzUprUOZKojVQ&s=19

To be explicit, it's a loving manifesto.

"Vladimir Putin has assumed, without a drop of exaggeration, a historic responsibility by deciding not to leave the solution of the Ukrainian question to future generations."

I would recommend people read it.

tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
seems like china is going to come out of this a winner no matter how it goes. even funnier if they end up moving closer to the EU while vassalizing russia

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tractor fanatic
Sep 9, 2005

Pillbug
i think there's a interesting discussion if this war is an argument against xi getting another term in zhongnanhai. regardless of whether putin's crazy, he has at least seriously miscalculated, and having so much power for so long probably makes you more prone to these mistakes. probably a concern for top chinese leadership especially if they're angling for a military confrontation with taiwan/the us during his tenure

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