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Looks good but difficult to watch. I wonder, is there any truth to what I've read about Caroline Becker being revealed as a lesbian in this game? Certainly makes sense to highlight one of the... other... groups historically targeted for extermination by the Nazis.
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Nov 29, 2017 19:29
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Kadorhal posted:For me, at least, I think part of the reason why I had to look away from Engel's little celebration at the start of this video but then chuckled when BJ chopped a Nazi's shins off half the video later is the point behind the violence. You can already tell it's not going to be very pleasant when it's a Nazi trying to make a point, and in this case the point is that Engel is so firmly convinced of her moral and racial superiority over these degenerates, who have the gall to dislike their position at the bottom of society over completely inconsequential bullshit like hair or eye color, that she can do whatever she drat well pleases with them, alive or dead, and only similar degenerates, sociopaths and traitors to the Fatherland would ever have a problem with it. Even if, right here and right now, it's just lines of code being written to act that way, it's still a horrific idea that actual people at some point in history legitimately believed. This is a pretty good explanation of why I never bought The New Order or New Colossus and never will. I am just not comfortable with this level of violence.
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Dec 1, 2017 16:47
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Jetrauben posted:Understandable, but I think it is being used for a purpose. This is the world that Nazis build. This is what they do to us, what they take away from us. Engel's horrible sneering atrocities disturb me more because of her gleeful evil, her smug, self-centered attitude as she murders better men and women. And she's a coward, too - the second that she doesn't have the upper hand she flees screaming for protection. I know and appreciate that, yet I do not find ultra-violence and gore fun or something I want to see in my entertainment, so I'm content giving this series a pass. They look like good games that I'm glad exist yet have no desire to play. I'm especially peeved about who died in this last episode, considering that from what I've read she's revealed to be a lesbian in this game.
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Dec 1, 2017 17:47
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Kadorhal posted:Yeah, that's definitely understandable. With Nazis in power, any sort of diplomatic approach to make things better for the other 95% of the world would be met with "burn the degenerates", so taking the same sort of violence they enact and turning it against them is really the only way a player can reject the setting. It's just that there's some point where things get too dark for audiences to give a poo poo about anything that's going on, even if there's some sort of vague promise that it might possibly get better down the road. Oh, I do care about the story in this setting, unlike say Game of Thrones. "Kill Nazis" is a game plan I am 100% on board with, yay for belonging to a group targeted by the Holocaust (LGBT people), but my tolerance for on-screen violence and gore only extends so far.
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Dec 1, 2017 19:06
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Less related... poor show, BJ, not destroying the Nazi sky cruiser while you're on board. Seems to me that that's undoubtedly going to bite you on the rear in the future.
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Dec 1, 2017 21:14
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bman in 2288 posted:The robot broke her jaw. Graphically so. BJ's developing a real talent for not finishing the job. Failed to kill her when he had the chance, failed to blow up the Nazi sky cruiser when he was on board.
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Dec 3, 2017 14:29
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CommissarMega posted:Honestly, Gracebeing a blaxploitation character makes it even better, in my book. What better way to counter Nazi identity than with the blackest of black portrayals*? Modern views on blaxploitation in the US tend to be that it really depends on context. Here, we have a black woman and mother with a power afro as the leader of the American resistance against the Nazis, so I suspect Grace gets a pass outside that... certain segment of video game players.
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Dec 14, 2017 23:38
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I think the word you're looking for at the beginning of the video about the broken English would be patois or creole. Or pidgin.MJ12 posted:The game really does point out that the resistance to the Nazis is generally made up of minorities and other 'undesirables.' That's the point of Sigrun defecting once her mom outs her as a 'deviant' to the rest of the Nazis, I think, and part of why both Wyatt/Fergus get crippled in the game. And Caroline herself was apparently a lesbian. I'm surprised LGBT people haven't been more prominent in these games, given that they were targeted by the Holocaust. Cythereal fucked around with this message at 05:21 on Dec 15, 2017 |
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Dec 15, 2017 04:43
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The idea of white America going along with this is also frighteningly plausible. The modern idea of the concentration camp was invented by the British during the Boer War, and the USA was until WW2 the leading nation in the world at instituting eugenics laws - mainly aimed at forced sterilization of people with "incurable and inheritable criminal tendencies." If you think that's code for racial and sexual minorities, you're right on the money. Oh and the last of these forced sterilization laws wasn't struck down until the 1970s.
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Dec 15, 2017 14:45
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OAquinas posted:More like "work them until they drop, then liquidate" so it's really more of a semantic difference in the end. But yeah--it's been 20 years since WWII kicked into high gear and 15 years since the US surrendered...even with a stretched timetable there aren't many people left within Nazi borders who fall into the camp demographics. It's Nazis, and authoritarians in general. Once the obvious candidates are exterminated, they have a way of constantly finding new Others to blame for everything that goes wrong.
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Dec 16, 2017 22:48
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Chillgamesh posted:The only problem I have with Grace is that she kinda instantly becomes your boss, filling Caroline's shoes, which felt unearned even if she was cool and brought a huge intel network onto the Evas Hammer. She's definitely great overall though and earns the position over the course of the game and then some, it just feels wrong at first. I've rewatched the videos, and I think Grace instantly assumes leadership of the resistance because she has the personality, vision, and drive of a leader. BJ, Anya, and Max mostly seem to be in this to kill Nazis and have no particular ideas of what to do beyond killing every Nazi they can find and then looking for some more. Fergus is old, weary, and beaten down, he doesn't seem to have it in him to unify and lead even the Kriesau Circle much less the Americans as well. Set doesn't seem to be a leader type at all. Grace, on the other hand, steps in and immediately has ideas about what to do, how to do it, and gets everyone moving. There was a void of leadership on the SS Let's Nuke Nazis, and Grace filled it.
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Dec 18, 2017 22:57
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GunnerJ posted:I'm not sure anyone is aware that BJ is Jewish. Does he self-identify as Jewish? There was a scene where Engel praised his good Aryan features. I don't think anyone knows they're treating one of the last living Jews as complicit by association with other whiteys. (eta: Unless there were scenes in the first game I missed/forgot.) The point of that was Engel being a moron - BJ is a Polish-American (remember that Nazis didn't consider Poles to be Aryan and intended to more or less eradicate them) Jew, but Engel assumed this big tough white dude obviously must be of the Master Race.
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Dec 19, 2017 14:34
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tarbrush posted:Which is also wierd as neither of his parents are at all Aryan. Further evidence that "Aryan" as a concept is full of poo poo, and the leader of the ideology is not Aryan himself.
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Dec 19, 2017 15:19
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Lazyfire posted:The Nazis hated the KKK, from what I've been made to understand (because internet Nazi historians said so after the game was announced), but as Grace has mentioned, the Nazis more or less gave the KKK the South. My guess is that they simply co-opted the KKK to serve their purpose and establish a Vichy France-style puppet state fronted by a familiar face. From what I've read before this game came out, it was a bit more complicated than that. The KKK has always had a strong aspect of "MURICA gently caress YEAH!" which didn't exactly play well with Nazism, and the KKK historically has always been far more concerned with black and brown people than with the Jews and Slavs that were Nazism's biggest bugbears. The KKK has also always had an element of Christian Dominionism (ranging from downright espousing a theocracy to just using Christianity as an excuse), whereas Nazism was much less friendly to religion and only co-opted mainly Christian religion to serve its own purposes but like most of the major fascist movement tended strongly towards atheism in the movement's own philosophical musings - Nazism also flirted some with Germanic and Norse neo-paganism. Not hard to believe that the Nazis and KKK in the Wolfenstein timeline more or less met in the middle, the KKK is probably the closest the USA has had to a major home-grown fascist movement until modern times. I'd have no trouble believing that in this timeline the KKK itself began to adopt more Nazi-like ideals to receive support from the Nazis even before America officially surrendered.
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Dec 20, 2017 02:33
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Kadorhal posted:Way I heard it was a lot simpler than that, and about as simple-minded as you'd expect from people that make decisions based on being racist - the Klan hated the Nazis because the Nazis sided with Japan after Pearl Harbor. It varied some from what I read - some in the KKK believed the Nazi-Japan alliance was merely one of convenience and Germany would dispose of Japan once its geographically immediate neighbors were dealt with. They probably weren't wrong, and indeed weren't in this series.
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Dec 20, 2017 04:05
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Poil posted:By any chance did the charges involve a lot of violence against nazis? I really like Grace, on the other hand. She's an angry, angry woman and it's not hard to understand why. She wants to get poo poo done and is working very hard to get said poo poo done.
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Dec 20, 2017 14:58
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GunnerJ posted:Did I miss a scene that established that he's dying of something beyond the healing ability of the techno-wizard who can attach a cat's head to a monkey's body? My impression is that BJ's been beaten down psychologically more than physically. Mentally and emotionally, he's running on fumes and starting to break down. His body is probably more or less okay, but BJ needs a vacation and therapy rather than a hospital.
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Dec 20, 2017 17:41
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Also Nazis: let's use slave labor to refine our resources and produce our war material, I'm sure this won't be a problem.
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Dec 22, 2017 16:43
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Chillgamesh posted:The Ausmerzer is basically a flying Ratte. You guys gotta think bigger, dumber, and flashier to make something truly fitting for the Nazis in this setting to use as a superweapon. ESPECIALLY dumber, even irl Nazis were 100% about style over effectiveness. And it still baffles me that BJ didn't destroy it.
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Dec 25, 2017 01:51
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Honestly, I'm emotionally checked out of the series now. New Order went from fun to emotionally fatiguing, and now... nope, I am not even pretending to give a crap about these people anymore. Less grimdark, more Indiana Jones Weird War Two poo poo, please.
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Dec 27, 2017 16:13
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Tasteful Dickpic posted:Miriam was played by a Swedish VA, Malin Barr, so her accent is legit. Something I always think is funny is when video game developers make sure to get an actual native speaker of whatever language or accent they're going for, only for fans to rage about how unrealistic the character's accent is. From the Bioware files, for example, there's Miranda (VA is from Australia), Leliana (France), and Sera (England), all of which I've seen prolonged rants about how fake their accents are.
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Dec 29, 2017 14:15
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Nalesh posted:It's also simple things like the VA not being from the region that most popular VA's from that country would be from. Which I seem to recall happening with tracer's VA being called out for being a fake accent even though she was born in yorkshire. This was also the case with Sera over in Dragon Age. Her VA is from Derbyshire and speaks with her native accent, but it's not an accent you hear outside England much.
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Dec 29, 2017 15:37
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Lazyfire posted:I thought it was interesting that Agent One mentioned how bad his German was in Old Blood but at the start of The New Order he could speak Polish when he first spoke to Anya. You could make the case that it was foreshadowing his mom's heritage and influence. IIRC it's always been a thing in the Wolfenstein series that BJ is Polish-American. Just look at his last name.
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Dec 31, 2017 17:35
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