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SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

jit bull transpile posted:

i think you're being way too cynical. like, how can you prove such a proposition anyway? when someone says they're pan you just demand they do a train of several different gender people on the spot? i try to take people at their word unless they're trying to pimp some obviously made up stuff like "graysexual" (e.g. "i'm only attracted to people i'm emotionally attracted to"), which even if it's real isn't a sexual orientation or gender identity at all and doesn't belong in the queer space.

I'm another of the bi men who feel they barely belong in any queer space, and I respect the hell out of you in particular. I would love it if you could elaborate on the "obviously made up stuff", because I suspect I feel the same way but struggle with drawing lines between that stuff and the "real" stuff (like mine).

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SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

ate all the Oreos posted:

also since you're here, want a new avatar? the hp hovercraft forums brand is confusing the hell out of me now that you're in the 'pos too

Yeah, uh, sorry about that, I made the mistake of having a friend computer avatar back when that was stymie's forums brand and someone bought this to gently caress with me. Or to gently caress with HPH I guess. I think the joke has run its course since it's been a long time now

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

jit bull transpile posted:

Graysexual is the biggie right now. I think "demisexual" is another term those people use. There's also some really insidious attempts to associate furries and otherkin with queer identities. I've also seen some people try to tie crossdressing to sexual orientation as an overture to saying that trans women are gay male cross dressers. In reality there's lots of cis het cross dressers who do it purely for kink.

Like someone up thread said, there's a lot of people who try to describe their particular type of being a normal rear end cis het person as queer (e.g. "I don't do one night stands, I'm queer" or "I only gently caress people I'm in love with, I'm queer") because the cis het white person desperately wants to feel "special" in any way and is jealous of all the (negative) attention minorities get. I'm loving shocked incels haven't tried to claim queer identity.

Bi people absolutely belong in queer spaces and it's loving bullshit that people try to gate check them just because their current partnership is hetero. It grosses me out when I see bi friends get pushed with poo poo like "but what way do you really lean?" and such.

Pls be welcome here.

Ps: I didn't see your name at first and almost instinctively started yelling at you to gtfo because of your av, lol.

I really appreciate this. I used to date someone who identified along those lines. I found it confusing, and partially because of that, I'm still unraveling where I stand on the issue of gatekeeping. It helps to see where people I respect on queer issues stand. My ex started out by claiming to be asexual, which they called a queer identity. I'm aware that asexuality is real (I don't know whether it's widely considered queer, but I wouldn't feel like i was on solid ground arguing the point in either direction). Still, I found it very confusing because we were having a lot of sex at the time, and I didn't think that was normal for asexual people. After a while they started using the word greysexual, and later changed it again to demisexual, and all of those things were very confusing to me because it seemed like a stretch to describe average, or even high-libido behavior, as inherently queer.

We talked a lot about whether it was a good idea to use the language of identity to talk about that, and I ended up thinking that it really wasn't. As an alternative, I really like the model of Emily Nagoski, which she wrote about in Come As You Are. I recommend that book and Emily Nagoski highly, and it provides nuanced language for discussing the spectrum of sexual response and desire in (what I saw as) a relatively clean and straightforward way. The author is a sex researcher at Smith College, and the book emphasizes that most experiences of sexual desire and response are "normal", including and especially "low-libido, responsive desire", which (I think) is the term that she'd use for the folks who describe themselves as demisexual.

In that light, I don't really want to count the demisexual folks as queer, but ... I don't know. As a guy who gets left out of queer spaces, is it fair for me to turn around and do the same thing? Is there a chance I'll find myself on the wrong side of history on this one? It seems like some people feel I already am - in my circles, you hear a lot of calls to just let anyone identify as queer, and anything that smacks of gatekeeping at all is villified. I guess that's because my circles are exactly these people:

END ME SCOOB posted:

there's a part of me that does decidedly loathe Tumblr for how it, intentionally and unintentionally, muddies these waters

Back when I was in that relationship I did a bunch of quick googling and sure enough, exactly as you describe, I found out that I was a real monster for doubting someone's asexuality just because they were initiating sex with me a lot. I took that very seriously at the time, and I'm genuinely, earnestly not sure if I'm still supposed to?

And thanks for being so welcoming, JBT - I feel real uneasy posting in any sort of queer space and it's good of you to focus on being welcoming. I apologise if I've got any of this wrong - I'm genuine in my confusion here.

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

ate all the Oreos posted:

also i guess gift certs can't be sent directly to a forums account anyway so w/e SolTerassa just let me know what you want and i'll do it directly and lowtax will just get :10bux: for his bionic spine instead of five

Ah, heck, that's real nice of you. Thanks! Don't have pms either so I'm just gonna post it here and sorry for the thread noise.

There's this thing, which I can't really find in any higher resolution.



If that won't work for whatever reason, a co-workers' kid drew this thing last year and I love it. He hung it at his desk and it's awesome.

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

Pollyanna posted:

good point


i guess i would also call it "please get therapy and let yourself be vulnerable you loser"

It sounds like you do want a romantic relationship or some kind of similar closeness, but you don't feel like you can do that right now, so you're choosing not to pursue it. I want to affirm that that's an okay choice to make, because you sound like you're beating yourself up about it - I remember some of what you've said about your reasons for not pursuing relationships further back in the thread. It's completely okay not to pursue something right now, even if you know you want it.

But I also know sometimes it feels weird as hell to want something and not be working towards it - I see you poo poo-talking yourself from time to time on this topic. A lot of us have that habit; my therapist still calls me out on it from time to time even though I've been working on it. It's not easy - those negative thought patterns can be hard to get rid of - but if you do decide to, y'know,

Pollyanna posted:

"get therapy and let yourself be vulnerable"

then that's another thing your therapist might be able to help you with.

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

iospace posted:

How much does it cost to have your facial hair lasered off? Asking for a friend.

Mine cost about $1700 for ten sessions in Seattle, which seems lower than other people are reporting. It was a package deal thing. The company doesn't post prices on their website, either, so I can't tell if I got some kind of weird price.

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

Shifty Pony posted:

people volunteering pronouns is one thing but everyone being required to give pronouns as part of an organized introduction or just due to social pressure is legit something I've had nightmares about since it would be "come out as non-binary to everyone here right now or publicly misgender yourself".

This sucks, just a little, every goddamn time. It's like, is this meeting of the Whatever Society of Progressive Local Politics really the place I want to come out? Is this going to be the time I fall on my face trying to explain my Gender Feelings, or am I just going to feel another twinge of discomfort again?

I think about how it'd make my friends in the room feel, how it'd distract from the reason we're *at* this meeting in the first place, center me instead of the stuff we're trying to do, and, ugh.

So far it's always the discomfort one. So, I hate it, but when I'm running the Something Or Other Club meetings I start with it anyway. This conversation has me reconsidering whether I should do that so uncritically.

SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

Improbable Lobster posted:

i'd consider hrt if there was some kinda nonbiney option that sorta stops in the middle where it'll confuse everyone

that’s basically what I have going on at the moment, it’s cool as hell

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SolTerrasa
Sep 2, 2011

happy belated injection Sunday but it’s ok cause they got me doing two of these shots a week which means my levels chart looks like a straight line

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