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My concern would absolutely be about the fascism. 40K has been an incredible, unintentional engine for making horrible nerds feel ok spouting fascist 'jokes' in relative public. If the setting isn't about how evil the Imperium is, and has even a vaguely Imperium-like Imperium, I don't want kids reading it, honestly.
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May 22, 2018 06:08
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Harry Potter has some very unformed and questionable stuff. The fascists are still the bad guys, even if wizarding society overall can be analyzed and found to be pretty terrible. That's a pretty straightforward distinction!
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May 22, 2018 06:26
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My favorite 'Nazi Superscience' story is the Hellboy history where the Nazis got desperate and stupid enough to fund 'literally the undying Rasputin' and a wide variety of bizarre pulp sorcerers and mad scientists. None of this was ever even close to being usefully deployed as anything but bizarre terror weapons (most of which fail on the launchpad, and the one that didn't was a giant rocket full of vampires and cyborg apes, and got blown up five minutes after launch in full view of the sun). In short, the reason there's a bunch of Nazi tech and sorcery is precisely the desperation behind historical wunderwaffen and it makes approximately as much difference in the war. On the other hand, if it weren't for Hellboy and the BPRD the results of Project Vampir Sturm and similar might well have killed all life on earth, so, there's definitely some real stakes to it.
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Jun 6, 2018 17:43
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I can't be the only one who likes Exalted 3e on this forum, can I? I mean, I guess I can. Kind of lonely, though.
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Jun 10, 2018 06:19
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Xarbala posted:Plutonis is, like, right there ...I'm pretty sure Plutonis was being sarcastic? That's a lot of exclamation points for sincerity.
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Jun 10, 2018 07:50
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Spire: The City Must Fall has five 'resistances' that you build up stress in - while you're accumulating a negative, it works very similarly to having a bunch of resources you can spend to do things. Spire uses Blood (physical), Mind (mental), Silver (monetary), Reputation (social) and Shadow (the coolest one, in my opinion: Your cover identities and secrecy as a member of a revolutionary cell). These build up Stress, which is abstract, and when you get enough of it it turns into fallout, which is concrete. So you might pick up a bunch of Blood stress and get the fallout 'broken limb' or 'bleeding' while comparable Shadow fallout would be 'cover identity in danger' or 'under suspicion.' And then the most serious Blood fallout would be 'dying' and Shadow might have 'the revolutionary organization you're part of cuts you off and burns your cover, deciding you're worth more dead than alive.' It's an interesting system but I haven't played it yet, so, I can't speak to its effectiveness.
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Jun 11, 2018 07:16
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Darksaber posted:Did you ever hear about the alt-furry who tried to sue for Battletech because it used one of his OCs? I must know more
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Jun 18, 2018 05:50
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I really feel like the 'everyone is miserable in Exalted' is kind of overstated. Like, it's the Age of Sorrows, but it's not really worse than the real-world Bronze Age for your average human.
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Jun 21, 2018 05:59
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I second Fellowship, or maybe Spire: The City Must Fall if you want a really dense little setting for new players, with more or less simple mechanics. I'd generally look at indie RPGs for a good start, D&D is a bit baroque.
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Jun 26, 2018 18:57
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Kai Tave posted:Exalted probably shines way more when everyone at the table is super fuckin into it. Just to draw this out, I had a Second Edition Exalted game (just Solars and one Lunar, so, none of the creepy grimdark nonsense, just Bronze Age mythic fantasy) that lasted years and played very well, because of enthusiasm. Do I think 2e was a good system? gently caress no. But all the players were at least interested in what they, personally, could do in it, so the complexity became a toolkit. Various other Exalted games I've run since were similar. But these aren't actually very crunch-enthusiastic players generally, the setting made understanding the crunch desirable. So I think that there's some other axes beyond just 'narrative vs. game' to this question. My players have always been way more willing to engage with mechanics that implement a setting they were interested in playing, which is why Mage the Awakening and Exalted have somehow become the core games of a very narrative-focused, not-crunch-loving group. It's honestly a little draining, even as the games are fantastic, because only one of my four regular players ever reads a drat rulebook themselves and retains any of it. I love them all but that's just baffling to me. Neopie posted:Also jesus christ Yawgmoth, I was going hey, man ,maybe I was kind of unfair to Yawgmoth the other day because I was in a bad mood but nope, nevermind. Agreed. King of Solomon posted:Every once in a while I think about LANCER, and I'm really excited to give it a shot one of these days. I'm a little hesitant because it's still in development and some of the changes have been pretty drastic, but it looks really cool. I'd definitely appreciate a LANCER thread, if only to get more thoughts and trip reports from people who have actually played it. Funnily enough, one of the LANCER authors is the Kill Six Billion Demons guy, whose first RPG foray was a PBTA Kill Six Billion Demons game, Broken World. I played a one-shot of a version of it, and it was fun enough, but it was a bit lacking. I'm glad to hear all this LANCER love, since it makes me consider going back and checking it out. Regardless of the outcome, the art will be killer. Ex3 is good though.
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Jun 27, 2018 06:53
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Well I just pitched two ideas to the Spire devs, wish me luck!
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Jun 28, 2018 03:38
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Kai Tave posted:Ideas for Spire supplements or something else? Got details you can share? They've asked for small pitches for supplements/campaign stuff. Little corners of the Spire to fill out for people to slot into their games, like Eidolon Sky and Blood and Dust, what they call campaign frames. My pitches were, basically, Sam Vimes as an antagonist and opportunity (a dedicated, heroic guardswoman is trying to start a movement to apply the laws equally and fairly. She's utterly doomed, and even if she succeeded she's a rival to the Ministry, so the Ministers will need to subvert or undermine the Guard). And 'there's no vampires in Spire - how about vampires who steal prayer, devouring the flame of magic divine and occult from their victims' - as an antagonistic cult who specifically are pursuing the Ministry because the Varcolac, their incomplete god, wants to devour the weakened dark moon. You know, that kind of stuff. E: It's an open call https://rowanrookanddecard.com/spire-call-for-writers/
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Jun 28, 2018 04:27
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Xiahou Dun posted:The Spire is so good and atmospheric and if they don’t at least try to talk China Mieville into doing a New Crobuzon version I will feel betrayed. It could be so good. Honestly I'd rather he didn't, they already have enough of his influence and his Pathfinder writing wasn't as good as I'd hope, from what I remember of reading it one time. Just not as good at plot hooks as he is at actual plots and storytelling. ...also, like, Pathfinder? He has extremely D&D tastes in RPGs, and Spire is fine as itself.
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Jun 28, 2018 06:10
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Well that's deeply disappointing. And morally gross.
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Jun 28, 2018 08:04
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It's very clearly referencing the woodblock style of the 'Dream of the Fisherman's Wife' design, which is basically historically interesting and very NSFW but also not, in my opinion, particularly attractive. Also, I can see the point of the game from an intellectual standpoint, as far as I understand it. It's about reading your 'partner' and attempting to work together to maximize positive results, despite having different preferences and not necessarily communicating directly. So, it's metaphorically functional and has a clear intent as like... an example of what a 'sexy' game can be like, as a certain extreme of cooperative play. So that's interesting. I pretty definitely wouldn't play it with anyone I wasn't both dating long-term and playing at least one TTRPG with, and even then I have no idea what it plays like, but the design context is really interesting to me. If they came out with a slightly more veiled version, maybe that's about romance or collaboration rather than sex but has similar/the same mechanical structure, I'd play that. Of course, knowing what the original was about, I might not have the guts, which is a shame.
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Jun 29, 2018 07:05
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Subjunctive posted:The problem is really that Bedlamdan is rhetorically really strong, and he chooses to use that to disrupt rather than reinforce discussion. Honest question, what about 'ur all body pillow having turbonerds with no sex life' and 'any work that attempts to make an ethical or value-driven statement is Christian Rock' was a rhetorical masterpiece in this last discussion? I really don't understand your post here.
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Jul 1, 2018 03:14
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Halloween Jack posted:Based on my experience, it seemed like Exalted just came out at the right time to attract a portion of anime fandom and some lousy cultural conventions that came with it. Do people under 30 play Exalted and inject a lot of fetishism into it? The closest my group (all under-30s) has ever gotten to that stuff in Exalted is people finding characters hot, a Zenith who was understood to be extremely built and handsome and everyone was attracted to him, and characters having romantic and sexual relationships (primarily offscreen, and when not, depicted in that rom-com L-shaped-sheet way). Broadly speaking I think it got handled in a more mature manner than the old D&D standby 'I seduce the barmaid' but sex-related stuff just didn't come up that much. And nobody's character concept was particularly sexy, except for the Zenith who was sort of incidentally sexy due to being kind of a 'dumb hunk' concept to start off. A dumb hunk with the charm that makes his Compassion virtue a pure utilitarian calculus of good for the many, not for the few.
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Jul 9, 2018 06:01
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fr0id posted:How about other goons? What games rock and more people should play? Well, I'm currently running a campaign of Mage: The Awakening and I'm hugely enjoying it. It's a Chronicles of Darkness, aka New World of Darkness, game so a lot of you will already know what kind of thing it is. I really like the Gnostic influences combined with social critique and radical organizing as the underlying structure to the game. It can be a bit pessimistic for me, but the setting overall if flavorful and flexible for telling modern wizard stories. It helps that my group has really leaned into the magical practice elements, which I love. Also OPP, my group plays and is kind of obsessed with Exalted Third Edition which is a huge improvement over Second Edition, which we did play but had to do a lot of work extricating good parts for use and throwing out bad parts. Ex3 hasn't had anything in actual published volumes that I feel the need to expressly delete from the setting as a GM fiat, which is nice, and all the stuff I do care about (Bronze Age societies with weird postapocalyptic bits, fantasy gundams, lots of cults, culture heroes going at it but being constrained not by a limit to their powers but the limits of culture and their own understanding of the world... all these things make for some fun games, IMO) is present and reinforced. Plus, the new developers, Vance and Minton, were my favorite writers for the line even before they became devs, and what they've produced, the artifacts collection and the Dragon-Blooded splatbook, are excellent. My group is planning to do a relatively light campaign set in a Dragon-Blooded secondary school with rotating GMs, for slice-of-life and coming-of-age kinds of stories in the matriarchal imperial society of the Scarlet Empire. I'd also really really really really like to play Spire: The City Must Fall both to have a less crunchy experience, and because that setting is killer. I haven't played it so I can't judge. ...I think at some point we bought the D10s for Exalted and as a result we've been very susceptible to 'hey we should play more OPP products' just because we already own the dice and we're used to the style of mechanics, but I'll defend them as being pretty decent crunchy games. Scion 2e looks very good to me, which further makes me wonder about that 'well I have the D10s' effect, but also it seems more suited to modern myths and somewhat lighter epic fantasy than Exalted, which always has at least an air of ancient-world amorality if not tragedy. I've also bumped up against Glorantha a few times and just, it never sticks, probably in no small part because the God Time stuff is less appealing to me than 'the gods literally exist as described in myth, and then mortal relationships to them are complicated and involve many layers of political and cultural interpretation such that people treat them much like myths.' I'm sure I'll think of something else I really like as soon as I press 'post'
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Jul 12, 2018 07:15
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My longest campaigns are actually currently just about tied: A college Exalted Second Edition campaign that began in late 2011 and went for about three years (or, rather, something like three school years of college - more like 2.5 years). That one went really well, and managed to develop through to the ending I'd had in mind. A lot changed on the way, of course, and there's a lot of great stories from that campaign, but in general it was a pretty light-hearted game about Solars taking command of a small nation in the Southeast and trying to run it, while the rest of Creation tried to make their lives difficult. Highlights include one of the players becoming the antagonist for the rest of the party for a while after killing sort of Ishtar for them, the one non-Solar Exalted PC - a Lunar - being mistaken for a demon and acquiring a demon cult, one PC being an actual sweetheart who just wanted to start an academy of medicine and was never proven to be a Solar by anyone but the Lunar, and an extremely buff but not very smart Zenith Caste utilitarian attempting to solve every problem by making people fall in love with him. It was far and away my most successful campaign, and it was started with the assumption that Exalted 3e would be out before I was halfway through so the PCs were all Solars to make that transition easier. Hahahahah sob. Obviously the system was pretty patched and errata'd and I was careful to trim the gross stuff out of the setting, but overall it was pretty manageable. One thing I realized is that I only had to make a few key fights really difficult or a challenge, and then let the players run roughshod over many antagonists. This made them feel powerful, and also made them focus more on the morality of their decisions and their long-term plans. There were multiple times the PCs realized they didn't actually want to do what they had set out to do, and had to find some way to fix it, and I tried very hard to make that not 'punishing' but 'interesting' and I think I more or less succeeded. And my current campaign, a Mage: The Awakening game about rooting out the Tremere infiltrators in a Pentacle-run city's Consilium. It's been running since I think early-ish 2016 and is likely to continue, so it'll be longer-running in the near future. I'm not going to go into too much detail because I don't want to spoil them, and there's a nonzero chance one of them might read this, but they just discovered that the source of the weird ichor in the Time Before labyrinth beneath the city is likely one of the Bound, and are now theorizing why the Tremere want to get at said Old God. They've also got a Strix in a glowing birdcage that absolutely cannot escape, which has led to them treating it as a lot less dangerous than it is, which is frankly a fantastic bit of Mage. This game's had some more rough spots than the Solars Campaign - because it's set in the modern day, people have stronger reactions to things that remind them of real frustrations (mostly around leftist organizing and murder, but also because a few of them had a really terrible GM in college who made them kind of paranoid and hyper-prepared to be morally castigated for loving up.) This means we've been delving into tools like the X Card and similar to try and keep things amiable and low-pressure, and I'm hopeful that we'll iron out most of the difficulties soon. The game also had one player drop out due to mental health issues and not being able to handle failure in a plan because of same, but she's actually been able to come back after a six month hiatus and has been a great addition once more, so... with a group of friends, campaigns don't have to go down in flames!
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Jul 14, 2018 04:52
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unseenlibrarian posted:It's not like Jedi don't die in numbers to massed ranks of troops using autofire in the movies either, so it's entirely possible for them to be overwhelmed. I too love for my games to assume I'm one of the nameless extras in scenes of mass slaughter rather than the main characters of the movies.
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Jul 21, 2018 17:41
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To me, pretty much every depiction of Jedi that focuses on their powers as special abilities rather than wu wei has already missed the boat, so I don't have a dog in that particular fight. But the basic idea of playing the actual heroes of a Star Wars movie seems apropos, and the argument that guns should be better than swords is silly in what is basically a samurai movie with cowboys in space. Joe Slowboat fucked around with this message at 22:47 on Jul 21, 2018 |
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Jul 21, 2018 22:43
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I realize it's not what most people want out of Star Wars but I would love a SW RPG where playing a Jedi meant having Fate point-style narrative tools and re-rolls rather than the showier force powers, which you maybe get one or two of (recovering your lightsaber or compelling the weak-minded are nice) and they're not your main power at all. Something that really leans into the Force as the Dao, an all-encompassing interconnectivity that allows its practioners to see the most efficient way to proceed and to know things like 'where a blaster is aimed' and 'the Rebellion is definitely on Hoth.' I think that second one is really Vader's most impressive show of power in the OT, when he proves that the power to destroy a planet is nothing compared to the power of the Force. The Empire would not have found the Rebellion without him, and thus all their martial power would have been useless. Similarly, a light saber is more 'elegant' and limited than a blaster, but if you know precisely how to apply it, it's far more effective - or how Yoda should not be judged by his size. This also fits my desire for a Star Wars game with more Kurosawa in its style.
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Jul 22, 2018 20:48
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Weirdly enough I don't actually think 'mystical martial artist with deep knowledge of the cosmos and subtle powers' is a boring concept, especially when it comes with a laser sword. Not everything is about ramping up power until things explode bigger. People seemed to like Donnie Yen in Rogue One a hell of a lot and his entire force power usage was 'not being hit by lasers just long enough to do his job' and being good at fighting with a stick. But then he's an actual martial arts and wuxia cinema veteran who was playing Star Wars Zatoichi, so clearly most people wouldnabsolutely not want to play him in an RPG I guess?
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Jul 23, 2018 05:04
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cheetah7071 posted:Puzzles where the GM says "okay I'm going to put A Puzzle here" can easily be bad but situations that invite creative problem solving or challenge the players to understand the fictional world and use that knowledge to accomplish a task are basically puzzles and they own This is the good take, it's only the weird context of D&D dungeons that turns puzzles into weird meta-objects. I run Mage which has free-form magic so basically every interaction with the setting is a puzzle in some sense, because I can just throw scenarios at players and let them compose magical solutions and mundane methods to get through.
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Jul 27, 2018 00:05
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Dungeon World is maligned because PBTA excels at being a genre emulation engine, and Dungeon World's genre is 'D&D' which is not actually epic fantasy, swords and sorcery, swords and sandals, or dying earth. It's its own genre, which emerges from the simulation that is D&D not doing a great job simulating any of those genres. So Dungeon World is a PBTA genre emulator, emulating a genre defined by not being a genre emulation in any particular way. As such, Dungeon World emulates D&D rules more than anything else because the genre is just those rules. There is no D&D genre other than 'classes' and 'adventuring parties' and 'spell slots' and so on. The PBTA framework wasn't intended for that.
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Aug 22, 2018 06:54
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Sorry to extend the 'is playing an RPG possible' discussion around social mechanics, but I feel like an important option has been missed: there are systems that make social maneuvering comparably complex to combat, which then use mechanics to flesh out player actions. I'm specifically thinking of Exalted 3, though since I haven't played the social system in that much I can't speak to it more than to say 'it makes your approach mechanically depend on specific relationships the other character has, which you can use mechanical actions to learn about and target.' This seems like a more honest comparison to D&D combat than D&D diplomacy is, because it's a system that can actually support itself and generate outcomes. Single-roll no-caveats social rolls in a system that purports to allow 'I choose this explicit mechanical option from the list, I do it, that's what I do' seems like a basically incoherent design because it won't produce social outcomes that feel at all real or meaningful. Same with curing the plague- large actions being just one roll with no interaction devalues that part of play. Basically I feel like, the more actual effort spent on a thing at table, the more that thing actually matters. The problem with "I roll to cure cancer" is that it dismisses an entire story with no meaningful engagement. Joe Slowboat fucked around with this message at 16:24 on Aug 23, 2018 |
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Aug 23, 2018 16:21
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Meinberg posted:I’ll second Misspent Youth, and put forth Spire as a more fantasy take on the same subject. Both of these are good, and I got the Misspent Youth paperback and Sell Out With Me collection as a gift from a friend and it's great.
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Aug 24, 2018 23:32
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Ratoslov posted:The 'Vance' (Vancian) wizards have a sheet of paper that represents the amount of spells they can have in their brain, and cards that represent spells that have to physically fit on the page. This is sort of neat, but the spells are all either one or two times the size of the smallest card and they're all the same shapes. Furthermore, you can get a power that lets you make the big cards the same size as the little cards, which they suggest on the forums representing by physically folding the cards in half. (My GM said to just overlap them because that's stupid.) Why is this not a spell-point system? You're getting none of the cool stuff from the physical card format and all of the drawbacks. This frustrates me, as someone who's thought "having a physical card array to represent magical effects would be a cool way to make a system more visual and tactile" and then tried to do it. They have all the cash and production in the world to put in multi-shape, multi-size spell elements here! They even had the character sheets arranged in ridiculous manner! Why not do something cool with this, rather than 'cards and uhhhh double cards, all the same shape.' Is the shape at least not a rectangle?
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Aug 25, 2018 19:12
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Splicer posted:Are there any mech games where each combat round you take multiple turns firing off your various weapons at different initiative passes? Because if not why the gently caress not. This is a good question, but personally I feel like this ecosystem then needs to also support Barbatos-style "You have advanced weapon systems, I have a large metal object I am going to swing through your mech at high speed" melee beasts. Ideally with some semblance of balance.
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Aug 26, 2018 22:14
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Low fantasy was and is the term for Conan-style sword and sorcery, where the stakes are 'so you steal this treasure' rather than 'do you defeat the Dark Lord of Evil.' It's adventure fantasy, but the kind of adventure is not a quest modeled on ancient epics but more of a picaresque, heist, or pulp combat.
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Aug 30, 2018 23:10
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I mean personally I'd class Dying Earth as a very specific kind of low fantasy, which is extremely weird and high-magic but is absolutely about an idiot going by Cugel the Clever getting himself into poo poo that only matters to him and whomever he's dragging down with him. Conan's got some high-fantasy moments when he faces off against epochal threats but they're pretty rare; usually the stakes are as low as Conan's own life and friends. But yeah genre's not real.
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Aug 31, 2018 01:31
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Kai Tave posted:Is it a part of euroracist narratives that the US is sending immigrant hordes to Europe? Actually never mind, the answer's probably real dumb. Well, the USA is the hegemonic world power at the moment, so any conspiracy theory has to explain what that power is doing about stuff. Plus, the US is seen by many racists as pushing multiculturalism, which to them means something a lot more involved than 'a full selection of ethnic restaurants.' Which is to say, yes, it's a common racist trope that the 'liberal elite' (read, Jews and intellectuals and so on) are encouraging immigration and pushing countries to accept refugees, for sinister purposes. American racists believe the same thing.
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Sep 10, 2018 04:41
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I'd like an AP podcast that's primarily about friends actually negotiating what they want out of a game, working together to understand complicated or novel rules systems, and sometimes having to X-card out of the room for a bit. Basically I want edutainment RPG podcasting, focused on actually showing the hard work that goes into making a game work, which is totally different from the hard work that goes into writing a campaign or designing mechanical challenges. This is the most boring possible AP, but also, I think it would be like manna from heaven for the RPG community as a whole if it took off.
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Sep 19, 2018 18:13
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Xiahou Dun posted:Agree to disagree? They make good settings/characters. My issue is that Session 0 to generate characters and setting is really different from pre-game social efforts to make the group function. Discussing tone, style, engagement and expectations explicitly and frankly, talking about lines and veils and so on, all the things that one can do to make a game work that have nothing to do with specifics of setting or mechanics.
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Sep 20, 2018 03:56
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And so it begins again; we are thrust once more into the archetypal roles of debates about God Time, in the hopes that we will change the qualities of God Time and the world to end the debates.
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Sep 20, 2018 21:26
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Coolness Averted posted:does every joke get mistaken for fightin' words now? I just wanted to make a joke about Heroquesting the myth of Arguments About God Time, myself.
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Sep 20, 2018 21:36
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Yawgmoth posted:Similarly, I just wanted to make a Zybourne Clock reference. It was very good. Now, we just need two more abstruse fictional metaphysics references, on the edge of a cliff...
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Sep 20, 2018 23:05
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But it's by the Spire and Honey Heist team, surely they can do it. Also Cultist Simulator is good.
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Sep 22, 2018 20:42
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I've clearly had the polar opposite experience of Cultist Simulator. I found the game engaging; figuring out the economy and how to juggle things was more fun than most classic roguelikes have been for me (it's more of a roguelite), and while I did have a number of runs that fell apart early, I always enjoyed learning new things about how to juggle the elements. I'm probably only going to play one more before the next patch expands the available options, but for now the writing has more than carried the workmanlike gameplay. I play it like FTL, real time with pausing. Also, always play on fast forward; I do wish there were higher speeds one could set the timers to. The lore is also quite detailed and quite elaborate, such that I have about one page of mechanics notes and five pages of lore notes. If you enjoy doing research and want a miniaturized facsimile of research from varied texts, it's a good simulation of that. Also after a few runs I found that I could really easily juggle most mechanical challenges with any Legacy or job except Detective, which is kind of hellish. My most recent runs have all been pretty assured of eventual victory, so I could take my time and acquire new knowledge of mechanics and read rare texts.
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Sep 22, 2018 23:56
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Hm, I've never had that much trouble keeping the board organized? New cards always appear in the center of the board, and cards always return to where you picked them up from when they come out of a timer. I've actually gotten a little annoyed at how similar my boards always end up looking as I get to mid-game, and so I've been trying out different arrangement schemes. I will agree that the back end of a run becomes long and drawn out; there's no real danger or excitement (though, uh, my current Detective run has been edge-of-my-seat every single second, so, there's exceptions caused by infinite despair). However, there is new lore and rare texts, and I generally use the period before a final Ascension for messing around a bit. I didn't find it horribly slow. EDIT: I also benefit from having friends who started playing at the same time, and we discuss lore and strategies together while we play. It makes chatting feel like occult correspondence, and we've been able to back each other up without any major spoiler issues.
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Sep 23, 2018 00:33
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