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I think it's important that you portray gay characters not only as friends but also as lovers. Lots of anime pretends to be about romance, but it's actually really prudish when it comes to sex. It's really lazy because then you can always skirt around the issue of showing humans as physical beings.Inio Asano posted:It's a turn that you can easily see in popular opinions of Goodnight Punpun and A Girl on the Shore. […] There is a tendency to separate everything into genre. I mean, if a manga is about action, it's just meant to be action, and there's no space for sex scenes in there. […] What bothers me is the question of why you can't put sex scenes in a normal manga, since it's the most normal thing in the world. But that's why I think it's going to be harder and harder to put those scenes in my manga, because editors and readers don't expect or don't want to find some kinds of content in a story when they think it's going to be something different. Just imagine how much worse it is in a queer context. Crybaby is great because it is really explicitly about sex. If you ask me, it could stand to be a bit more clearly about LGBT sex, though. Has Clive Barker's Nightbreed come up, yet? I feel that's a very logical Western equivalent to Devilman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F-EYyYEu0LY
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Jan 28, 2018 00:10
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:Apparently Miko is a lesbian because lesbians can't be trans, if the last several pages are anything to go on. I feel like you need to read Judith Halberstam some time. Butch lesbians are not trans by default. For reference, here are two lesbians: 
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Jan 28, 2018 09:46
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Btw, I don't think it's reasonable to call Miko Bi just because she went to a rave with a dude and was forced at gunpoint to gently caress (and devour) some creepy hobo.
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Jan 28, 2018 11:00
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Nina posted:That made me remember there are three identical looking characters in the show and I can’t figure out what the idea behind that was at all. I didn’t even realize Kukun died until someone told me hey these are totally unrelated people. How sad That's some serious hairstyle racism     I know what you mean, though.
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Jan 28, 2018 11:14
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like a cigarette should posted:Are all anime threads this bad or is this an especially bad one Literally everyone died horrifically, though. Miko and Miki were just utter badasses while doing so. Devilman reminds me of Halberstam's The Queer Art of Failure, in which she basically argues that being queer inevitably fails because it's not productive in a capitalist sense. There is no way to win, so you might as well make failing an art form: "If at first you don’t succeed, failure may be your style." Everyone including Ryo and Akira fail gloriously, and they almost manage to turn things around. I think there is even some optimism in the loop indicated by the final moments of the show. They're just gonna fail over and over, until Ryo picks up that goddamn baton.
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Jan 28, 2018 21:25
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Smoking Crow posted:I'm glad Ryo got owned by God It's really funny that god briefly interferes to screw over Ryo's plan, and then just lets things play out for the rest of the show. What's His deal, anyway?
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Jan 28, 2018 21:52
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Kokoro Wish posted:I always thought that the Miki/Miko thing was actually too direct a translation of the terms Suki and Daisuki , which while they can be used as an allusion to romantic affection, can also just mean that the person likes the other person alot, in a non-romantic way. That's how it was explained to me at least. It's true, though. You're not gay, as long as you're fondling his breasts while your dicks are touching. edit: We're starting poo poo? Kind of seems like a normal Crybaby discussion to me. 
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Feb 9, 2018 01:50
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Kokoro Wish posted:I tell my close friends I love them all the time. Doesn't mean I want to have a romantic relationship with all of them. There's alot of different types of love. Oh, this is the poo poo that's being started.  Man, I was looking forward to discussing whether satan's penis + breasts combo made him gay by default.  edit: Seriously, dude. Just go back like ten pages, and you'll get all the discussion you desire.
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Feb 9, 2018 02:06
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Kokoro Wish posted:To me it was pretty obvious that Akira was not necessarily into Ryo like that, and the two Miki's felt like a similar thing, to the point where while I could get the whole Miki K coming out thing narratively, Miki M was presented as far too sexless and angelic for me to get that from them in that moment. From a character like Miki M it felt almost out of place. The main thing I took away from their exchange was that Miki knew that Miko hated her, and it was really devastating for her to hear Miko spell it out so explicitly. For me, at least, this reframes all of Miki's "sexless" behaviour into being really withdrawn. She is terrified of being rejected, and that's why her feelings only become apparent in that final scene.
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Feb 9, 2018 03:26
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tithin posted:Can we have a version of Devilman where Miki and Miko mash spider clams just to kill this cycle I feel like that's the natural outcome, if Ryo finally picks up the baton: everybody gets to gently caress and be happy.
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Feb 9, 2018 10:38
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Expect My Mom posted:Yeah I feel the running metaphor isn't as fleshed out as it could be despite it being reoccurring, it isn't like they make it and drop it, but still Passing the baton is basically a metaphor for saving the world in the finale, so I think you've hit the nail on the head. These people love running in a way we normal people can't fathom. It's like Vin Diesel's love for cars in The Fast and the Furious. He doesn't love cars like a normal person, not even like a big car nerd. There is some intense "I can't live without cars"-type situation going on there. 100 degrees Calcium posted:When Princess Leia tells Han Solo "I love you", he responds, "I know." Is Han Solo gay? Let's not forget that Han Solo is a real piece of poo poo. His love confession sucks. edit: Also, obviously he hosed the Wookie. That soundtrack could make anything sound badass. 
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Feb 9, 2018 23:13
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Crabtree posted:Miki wants love and settled on the allure of a giant spider. It's almost sad that she seemed more desperate for anyone to return that kind of feeling to her, but the world was ending, so I'm not holding it against her. Miki just wanted to pass that baton, but they horribly murdered her instead. If you ask me, she got shafted. 
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Feb 11, 2018 21:20
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AnEdgelord posted:In revelation the good keep faith with God and are rewarded in the end while the wicked are punished and cast out. In Devilman the good are punished for their faith and the wicked are left to run riot. They are almost a complete thematic inverse. I don't care about apocalyptic themes, I like stories with apocalyptic themes, what I care about is the raw misanthropy the show exudes where the possibility of salvation, redemption, and a brighter future are spat upon. I think failure does not imply the author's disdain for goodness. There is a triumphant theme playing, as they try to pass the baton. It's the soundtrack equivalent of cheering them on as they try to save humanity. Game of Thrones may present people getting gruesomely murdered as failure (and its soundtrack accordingly plays the theme of the Lannisters when the Starks lose), but Devilman does not. It applauds the Mikis and Akira for trying their hardest, and failing gloriously. They do not regret dying for what they believe is right: "I'm glad we ran." ninjewtsu posted:I saw it as more of a "jesus on the cross" kind of thing, except that miki's death was less a "she died for mankind" and more "she died because she was too good for mankind" kind of thing. She wasn't naive, she knew exactly what the consequences of her actions would be, she literally watched it happen to others in real time and sent them encouragement as lynch mobs formed on their doorsteps. Her death signifies that humanity is now too far gone to be worth saving, not that it never was Turning them into martyrs is maybe taking it too for, but I think this is basically on the right track. There are very few heroes in the Bible who actually get to live a good life. Moses doesn't enter the Promised Land, Samson kills himself along with his enemies, Jesus is tortured and humiliated, and finally dies an agonising death for the sins of mankind. Why should Devilman's heroes be any luckier? AnEdgelord posted:Ok not only are you wrong but you are so wrong that I literally just need to post direct quotes from the book of revelation to disprove this bullshit Yeah, not sure what they're talking about. The book may be vague, but not that vague. You're kind of leaving out that all humans are probably undead at this point since there's been a massive war with the devil. Kind of irrelevant to Devilman, though. Imo, it's not the revelations apocalypse unless Jesus shows up.
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Feb 16, 2018 19:56
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ninjewtsu posted:i thought there was visual implication of the cycle in the acidtrip image flurries from the beginning of the show or something, but i might be thinking of it just showing satan's previous defeat I think the most clear indication of the cycle is Akira trying to pass the baton (repeated over and over again). There is also the Devilman TV show, which Ryo watches at the orphanage. The existence of that show implies changes between cycles, though, not eternal punishment.
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Feb 16, 2018 20:14
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Oxxidation posted:That theme's meant to be melancholy, not triumphant. It intersperses Ryo's and Akira's battle with Ryo's fundamental inability to sympathize or cooperate with others until it's too late to take back his mistakes. The theme From Here to Eternity is not melancholy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xs-PzathtLA It plays during both baton scenes, and is accompanied by children cheerfully passing batons to one another. It's slowly rising in intensity. You expect it to grow even more intense, but then it cuts off before that moment because Lucifer doesn't pick up the drat baton. And More fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Feb 16, 2018 |
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Feb 16, 2018 21:17
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DisDisDis posted:from last page Just a little reminder that Devilman Lady may very well tell a completely different story with a different message from the original Devilman. Just because one story is explicitly about something doesn't mean the other (related) story is about the same thing. Additionally, this isn't the original Devilman, anyway. It's Devilman as told by Yuasa, who has barely any biblical concerns to begin with, imo. Darth Walrus posted:Ah, whoops, missed that. Yep, thought so. He can just neglect Lucifer's male half? What a copout.  turtlecrunch posted:4) Aside from Akira, are all demon-possessed people sinners in a very strict sense (Miko going to the party and being jealous, Taro sneaking on the computer to look at party boobs)? Are there any innocent people that become demons? Akira's dad said he wanted to eat his mom, but I wasn't sure if that was the demon talking or not. I think most people might say Taro was innocent, but I am trying to gauge the in-universe definition of sin. It seems to me like none of the demons were actually sinners because the show doesn't condemn them for their sins. Real sinners, such as the rapist, end up staying human. This is why hunting down the demons is so futile. You can't tell how sinful someone is just because they look weird. Giving into your sexual desires during the ritual just seemed to awaken the demonic side in some people. For Miko, it is her repressed romantic love for Miki that translates into really horrible toxic relationships with men. This is why she turns into a spider. Black widows kill the male during sex. So, only a lesbian spider can have a healthy relationship.  We don't really have enough context to understand what was going on with Akira's dad, I think. And More fucked around with this message at 23:46 on Feb 16, 2018 |
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Feb 16, 2018 23:38
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ninjewtsu posted:imo miko and koda mostly show the two possible paths a devilman can take. miko is crazy vain and petty and that's her primary motivation until she realizes that there's someone she loves, while koda lost his love and thus succumbed to base temptation and a desire to just be on the "winning" side. And the Devilman Cat was a cat that had no food, which is pretty unacceptable.
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Feb 16, 2018 23:41
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MonsterEnvy posted:The hand was in the party area if you take a look. Wink wink nudge nudge, say no more.  Kokoro Wish posted:Yes, for the most part. It's messy as gently caress, needs editing and could tell its story better, but overall, more good than there is bad and has a fantastic soundtrack. On a scale from one to hot gay giant spider sex, I'd give it a ten.
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Feb 20, 2018 20:13
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If you enjoyed the rapping, I'd like to recommend Tokyo Tribe by Sion Sono: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAKDrBe38Qo It's this, but a feature film. edit: Kind of hard to find a good clip. The mumbling guy isn't the best, but y'know, it evens out because nearly everyone raps all the time. And More fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Feb 22, 2018 |
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Feb 22, 2018 18:12
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