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Hi. I like Battletech.  Yeah. I've played countless iterations of the game over the years. Classic tabletop, the old MechWarrior games, Megamek, the various console offerings, and so on. I own a 3D printer and the only thing I use it for is making my own hex bases. My true love, as evidenced by the photo above, is tabletop Battletech. I first played as kid in the 90s and haven't really stopped since. I consider myself a top-tier tabletop player. So when I saw MechWarrior Online, I was pretty excited. Some people lean pretty heavily into the competitive end of it, but for me, I just want to recreate as many of my old favorite mechs and play pretend robot fights with them. So I decided to make my first LP with this purpose: 1. Talk about Battletech (specifically, the mechs and their variants). 2. I will use/create a canon BT variant in MWO and run them in quickplay while talking endlessly about how they compare them to their tabletop counterparts. I will also get shot and die a lot. 3. Repeat. I will try to make as many possible variants as I can (I don't know if I can reproduce the Thunderbolt 9NAIS, but I will sure as hell try). I'll take suggestions on what variants to try next. If necessary I'll grind out C-Bills to get whatever for my inventory, but I probably won't buy many  mechs. If you want I'll try dumb designs you guys make, but I prefer to stick to real BT stuff.Now, some canon mechs just can't be accurately reproduced. Either the equipment isn't allowed on the available chassis, the weaponry doesn't exist, the hardpoints are too far off, etc. But if I can get it close, I'll probably give it a try. I can live with a Hunchback 5S that's missing its jump jets and has an XL instead of Light XL engine. But the 5SS, which needs the unavailable Multi Missile Launcher weapon, is a deal-breaker. Terms I'll throw around a lot that might not be part of everyday BT talk: Tabletop: Classic Battletech. The game with hexes and dice. Level 1: The "3025" era of the game. No XL engines, no Clan tech, no double heatsinks, etc. While this is the tech level many purists stick to, for me it's just a bit too slow and "samey" after playing for so many years. Level 2: Years 3050+. Clan tech, XLs, gauss, pulse, CASE, and generally higher mobility and firepower across the board. This is also the era of MWO. Level 3: I might mention term this occasionally. It refers to high level tech that probably isn't present in MWO at all and only shows up rarely in Battletech (TSEMP cannons, hardened armor, center cockpit, and odd stuff like that). Megamek: Java-based software that replicates the tabletop version. Playable online using various Mekwars servers, although most have died off over the years  cheesy: Refers to overly optimized builds or mech designs (see Phoenix Hawk 3PL, Venom 9KC, the Hellstar, Pillager 4Z). boat: Mech that is fitted with lots of one weapon type. For example, an LRM boat might have two LRM 20s and two LRM 15s and nothing else. headchopper: A weapon that, in tabletop, will kill a mech in a single headshot - heavy/gauss rifle, Clan ERPPC, AC/LB/Ultra 20, the rarely seen blazer cannon, heavy large laser, heavy PPC... I think that's most of them. zombie: A mech that is very hard to kill. Has no XLs, no ammo to blow up, and a weapon in the head or center torso, meaning it fights to its last breath. core: Verb. To core a mech is to destroy its center torso. I'm sure there's more, but these are some that I expect will come up more frequently than others. Links: Battletech homepage - http://bg.battletech.com/ MechWarrior Online - http://www.mwomercs.com/ Ironwind Metals (current producers of the Battletech minis) http://ironwindmetals.com/store/index.php?cPath=16&osCsid=ta2qhn27lkthmb08rukjqai733 MechFactory (huge encyclopedia of mech designs, record sheets, and a ton more) - http://battletech.rpg.hu/mechfactory_frame.php Skippy McPants's MWO thread: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3846392 As I said, this is my first ever LP, so bear with me as I get through the learning curve. If there's anything specific you want me to talk about or try, just let me know. Eclipse12 posted:I guess I should clarify. That's pretty much the only run I'll do of the 4G. I want to see how many possible variants can be built with MWO and then play each one for just a few minutes to compare it to its tabletop counterpart. So next time I might build the 6X version of the Rifleman, and later the 12A of the Panther, and then the Widowmaker of the Dire Wolf. I just started with the 4G because it's an old favorite of mine. The goal isn't to use any mech long-term or make "optimized" versions of the MWO mechs, but instead to see how various... um.. variants... from BT translate to MWO. For people like me, who always loved mechs like the Thunderbolt 9NAIS, I always wished I could pilot it "for real," but it has only existed in tabletop. Getting to see how it would feel and play in a actiony, first person game seems like a cool experience. Mech Reviews 1. Hunchback 4G 2. Panther 12A 3. Commando 5S Eclipse12 fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Feb 21, 2018 |
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Feb 19, 2018 22:48
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Hunchback 4G   BATTLETECH TALK Stats (relative to weight class): Speed - Slow Armor - Nearly maxed out Firepower - One big AC20 cannon. 2 Medium lasers are a nice addition and fit the range bracket of the AC20. Small laser, lol. Role - Support friendly heavy and assault mechs by putting big holes in bigger mechs. Weakness - Getting a critical hit in either side torso takes him out almost instantly (either by losing his primary weapon or by getting blowed up by an ammo explosion). Good players shoot him just enough to take out the AC20 and then turn their attention elsewhere. Playing as the 4G, don't get sucked into chasing a faster mech or let yourself get separated from the pack. Anything that has better range or speed will pick you apart easily. Opinion: The Hunchback 4G is a badass. With a giant cannon strapped to his shoulder, he picks fights against mechs twice his size. This mech is meant to hang out in the middle lines then close the gap when the fighting heats up and pound on medium, heavy, and assault mechs with big ol' bullets. He's too dangerous to ignore, but taking the time to kill him means those heavies and assaults he's fighting alongside aren't taking damage instead. It's definitely the first mech that I fell in love with. I just loved his all-or-nothing approach, and in level 1 tech, the AC20 is seriously scary. It's the only headchopper of the 3025 era and the relatively slower and less armored mechs on the battlefield really feel the damage of that 20 point slug. Sure there's limited ammo, but if it survives ten turns of combat intact then there shouldn't be much left of its enemies anyway. Shoot 'em if you got 'em. Unfortunately, as tech increases the Hunchback 4G quickly becomes less and less impressive. 3050+ era mechs can soak up the damage of an AC20 with armor to spare. The very limited range and slow speed means you're frequently firing at long range and praying for 11s and 12s on your dice against enemies who are still in short range to hit you. Luckily, some of the level 2 variants of the HBK bring him back into contention, such as the awesome 5S (more on him another day). With a good gunner the 4G can stay viable, but ultimately, he won't shine as brightly against modern mechs. MechWarrior Online https://plays.tv/s/LchMyWlmVV9a <<<(This was my first ever LP recording... I think I'll get more comfortable with it as I get practice) The game nails the aesthetic of the HBK 4G and you don't have to "build" it; it's for sale in this exact configuration. Due to the nature of the game, the lower speed is not as detrimental, although you should still stick with a pack of bigger, scarier friendly mechs. The accuracy inherent in the video game is a huge plus, but the fact that the AC20 does less damage relative to its tabletop version definitely takes away that magical feeling of scoring a hit. Also, playing I noticed that I was often hitting targets way outside of my optimal range, so be careful of that. It doesn't carry enough ammo to get away with not getting full damage from each shot. The MWO Hunchback 4G plays similarly to its tabletop counterpart - short lifespan, a big gun that should be your sole focus, and the liability of needing both torsos intact at all times. The AC20 doesn't feel nearly as powerful but it is more accurate so that helps (I'd still rather have the raw damage be more aligned, but I get that they had to adjust that or else mechs wouldn't die even faster than they already do). Final verdict in the form of a metaphor: A classic muscle car that gets beat by a modern family sedan. What do you guys think about the 4G? Any suggestions on which mech to pilot next? Like I said in the first post, I'm interested in making variants that aren't directly available from the mech store. Eclipse12 fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 19, 2018 22:48
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Have you played much MWO in the past? Well I dont want to dump on your OP, but the canon builds in MWO's present state is going to be a rough go. You did mention you'll die a lot though I would however hazard a guess that the 4g is one of the better performing canon mediums in the game, they have given the mech some buffs to its hunch toroso Willfrey fucked around with this message at 00:49 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 20, 2018 00:44
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Yeah, the HBK-4G will do... alright stock, but if you're not going to tweak things at all, it's going to be rough going. If you're going to play mechs stock in MWO, I highly suggest that you at least tweak the front/rear armor setups. Tabletop tends to have about 2/1 front/rear bias, but in MWO that should be like 9/1. Running more than 5-10 points of rear armor is going to seriously impact your ability to play this game at all well. Keep the armor numbers the same if you want, but changing the distribution would be reasonable. The AC20 does actually do 20 damage in MWO, same as tabletop- but mechs have a lot more armor than they did in tabletop as well, which is why it lacks punch.
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Feb 20, 2018 00:52
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I guess I should clarify. That's pretty much the only run I'll do of the 4G. I want to see how many possible variants can be built with MWO and then play each one for just a few minutes to compare it to its tabletop counterpart. So next time I might build the 6X version of the Rifleman, and later the 12A of the Panther, and then the Widowmaker of the Dire Wolf. I just started with the 4G because it's an old favorite of mine. The goal isn't to use any mech long-term or make "optimized" versions of the MWO mechs, but instead to see how various... um.. variants... from BT translate to MWO. For people like me, who always loved mechs like the Thunderbolt 9NAIS, I always wished I could pilot it "for real," but it has only existed in tabletop. Getting to see how it would feel and play in a actiony, first person game seems like a cool experience. Aniviron, when I say that the AC20 doesn't do as much damage, I did mean relatively, due to the increased armor. It's rare to find medium and light mechs in tabletop that can take an AC20 round and still have armor remaining in that location. Many light mechs that take an AC20 to the arm or leg lose it entirely, armored or not. Thanks for the feedback, though. I can see that I need to explain my theme a little more clearly.
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Feb 20, 2018 01:41
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Yes sorry, I was at work but I've watched the video and you explain it all there. I'm also a huge fan of the Hunchback 4G, and AC20's in general in MWO. We've had a couple nights were we all dropped in hunchbacks which was pretty fun (the hunchbunch) Here I am running a more optimized version of the 4G one of those times Next canon build... Awesome 8Q 
Willfrey fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 20, 2018 01:57
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Willfrey posted:Yes sorry, I was at work but I've watched the video and you explain it all there. Yeah, the 4G is in no way optimized in its stock form, at least not for MWO. I noticed you brought more ammo and upped the speed. The flamers were a nice touch, too. Looks fun. I'll mess with some Awesome builds soon. I wish I could make the 8 light PPC variant, but MWO just won't give the hard points for it. I'm gonna do a non-standard variant first to help show that angle of the thread.
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Feb 20, 2018 02:06
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I was trying to go easy on you and think of something stock that would still be pretty effective. How about the Supernova SNV-1. Should be a decently effective laser boat/sniper, having all your weapons in the arms though makes me a bit nervous. DO NOT ALPHA STRIKE, fire in 2 groups of 3. Definitely strip armor off the back to put on the front, having lots of armor on the back is just so wasteful.
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Feb 20, 2018 02:41
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Panther 12A  BATTLETECH TALK Stats (relative to weight class): Speed - Verrrry slow. Jump jets add a bit of mobility, but for a light mech, this is bottom-barrel. Luckily, speed isn't what he's about. Armor - Maxed Firepower - One ER Large plus a targeting computer makes for an effective camping, sniping little mech. Streak SRM4 and medium pulse can deter many light mechs who try to close in and harass him and, in tabletop, can do just enough damage to force a piloting roll. Role - Back line sniper. Keep him at medium or long range and fire away. Your opponent should have more important targets up close, meaning even with relatively little cover the Panther should stay fairly safe from retaliation. Weakness - Losing the ER Large means he has low firepower and speed. If he does get closed in on, especially by bigger mechs, his lack of speed can be a death sentence. Opinion: The Panther 12A is my favorite Panther build. It just feels like what he's meant to do. Some variants get real weird, like the 14S. Extra jump jets? Rocket launchers? No thanks. The 12A is the workhorse of the Panther family. Part of the trick is to not think of him as a light. Treat him like a medium, or better yet, a turret. Get behind partial cover, or in the woods, and then move as little as possible. When you only got one main weapon, you can't afford to miss. 8 damage isn't scary to very many mechs, but over time it builds up and messes with the strategy of your distant enemies. Remember, your job is not to get kills... you're trying to make it easier for your front line mechs to do so. And, at the end of the game, you should be unhurt enough to tip a close battle in your favor. Being a level 2/3050+ era mech, it holds up well on most battlefields. It's even better if you pair him with a heavy that has a similar build, like a Shootist 9C or Rifleman 7M. As I mention in the video, he doesn't use XLs, which means he can lose his entire left side and basically be fine. Just don't lose the right arm. MechWarrior Online https://plays.tv/video/5a8b7aaea7e928e135/panther-12a?from=user Can You Build It? Yes, but due to restrictive hardpoints, you have to move the medium pulse from the CT to the right arm (which makes protecting that arm all the more important). Consequently, you'll have to move a double heatsink to another location. Start with the 10K chassis. http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#modified I was really impressed by how similar the Panther 12A plays in MWO compared to tabletop. You can sit back and snipe relatively unbothered. The effectiveness does drop, though, due to the ease of being out-of-range and the fact that your laser won't consistently hit just one location. Spreading that 8 damage around definitely lessens its effectiveness. All the more reason to try and sit still and focus on staying on target. Be aware, however, that some people frown on this playstyle in MWO. If your team is getting its rear end kicked and you're sitting back going "pew pew" with a single laser, don't expect people to be very appreciative. It's one thing if you're running an entire lance yourself; with other human players on your team it can (and like is) not doing enough damage to be a significant factor in winning. Getting into medium range might be a better option, but be sure to stay beyond the front lines and don't get tunnel vision, leading some assault mech with gauss to make an easy target of you when you forget you're standing out in the open. Final verdict in the form of a metaphor: Grab the tent and marshmallows, because we're going camping. What mech + variant should I build next?
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Feb 20, 2018 03:00
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Axetrain posted:I was trying to go easy on you and think of something stock that would still be pretty effective. How about the Supernova SNV-1. Should be a decently effective laser boat/sniper, having all your weapons in the arms though makes me a bit nervous. DO NOT ALPHA STRIKE, fire in 2 groups of 3. Definitely strip armor off the back to put on the front, having lots of armor on the back is just so wasteful. I might give it a run. I wish it had more interesting variants. I don't run the Supernova in tabletop (I don't think I have the mini for it), so it might be nice to get in something new.
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Feb 20, 2018 03:08
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This is a neat thread  can I see a canonical metal babby? I am pretty sure I played a trial Commando that ran at 60 kph or something ridiculous like that at one point, that's the sort of thing I guess I'm hoping for, but whichever one you feel like.
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Feb 20, 2018 04:18
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I probably shouldn't be suggesting clan assaults anyway since they absolutely break the bank when it comes to C-Bills. I tried to make a 9NAIS but realized there isn't a Thunderbolt variant in MWO that has a slot for ECM . E: This TDR-5S variant is as close as I think I could get. I don't have the tabletop readout for it but going off some googling here's how it's different from canon. . 1. No ECM, I used the extra ton to add another ton of RAC ammo 2. The RAC5 was supposed to be in the right arm on the 9NAIS but this things ballistics slots are on the left arm so that's where it has to be 3. Engine cap on this mech is 315 so I couldn't give it the XL325 it actually had. Everything else looks mostly accurate. You get a targeting computer, 15 single heat sinks, and even the completely useless CASE protection! Axetrain fucked around with this message at 04:59 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 20, 2018 04:25
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For the love of god don't run an Urbanmech with a stock engine if you get around to it. It's painful.
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Feb 20, 2018 04:27
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TheKingslayer posted:For the love of god
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Feb 20, 2018 04:58
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sebmojo posted:This is a neat thread I can probably throw in a Commando run today or tomorrow. This will be fun for me, because I have a very bad tabletop relationship with the Commando (it's made of tissue paper and stuffed with gunpowder). It's got a lot of variants, and I'm up for trying to make any of them. Some I noticed, like the 4H, I can't make because it doesn't have the hardpoints (6 rocket launchers... heh). The 7S almost looks usable. It has two ER mediums, two streak 2s, and an SRM 4 w/ artemis. Not sure how it'd go in MWO, but in tabletop, it's not terrible. Or I could go the 5S, which is a straight 3050 tech upgrade compared to the classic 2D. Either way, I'm sure I'll blow up real good.
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Feb 20, 2018 12:21
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Axetrain posted:I probably shouldn't be suggesting clan assaults anyway since they absolutely break the bank when it comes to C-Bills. I tried to make a 9NAIS but realized there isn't a Thunderbolt variant in MWO that has a slot for ECM Hmm... I can live without the ECM (although it's waaay more useful in MWO). The RAC in the wrong arm is unfortunate, but not a deal-breaker. The slower engine sucks, because that was a highlight of the NAIS, but it's fairly close, and the game plays differently, so it should be okay. What the hell, I'll give it a try. Thanks for mocking it up. I'll drop some C-Bills on it and post my results. I do loooooove the Thunderbolt.
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Feb 20, 2018 12:24
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TheKingslayer posted:For the love of god don't run an Urbanmech with a stock engine if you get around to it. It's painful. Actually, do this. Stock engine urbies are hilariously fun and make everyone around you furious.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:24
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Good luck, and goonspeed mechwarrior. This thread will truly test your will and I respect you for suffering through for the entertainment. Also chiming in that at some point a stock urbie run should be included. While likely one of the worst to do, if you can pull a Mining Collective or something, and be a sneaky snake with that AC, you might do some work.
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Feb 20, 2018 15:59
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Sebmojo, you encouraged me to do this thread in the first place, so I'm gonna do that Commando run. Even though I haaaaaaaate the Commando in tabletop. I can only assume he's better in MWO? Coming soon: Thunderbolt 9NAIS, Urbanmech Update: Played Commando 5S. It/I sucked. Eclipse12 fucked around with this message at 22:52 on Feb 20, 2018 |
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Feb 20, 2018 22:03
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No, that was solely to hear you swear. I'm sorry. Realtalk i'd like to see a Jaeger: one of my favorite builds is the DD with 2 Lbx10 and 4 machine guns/2ml, it's that anything like any canon builds? Play style is stick with an assault until the end of the match and emerge to murder the wounded remnants.
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Feb 20, 2018 23:17
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sebmojo posted:No, that was solely to hear you swear. I'm sorry. There's a Rifleman with two LB10X, but not a Jager that I can think of off the top of my head. I'll double check. Probably not getting the MGs on it either way.
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Feb 20, 2018 23:57
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Requesting a King Crab KGC-000b, which is: 12 double heatsinks 2 AC/20s (one per arm) 4 tons of AC ammo (two per side torso) 1 LRM-15 (left torso) 1 ton of LRM ammo (left torso) 1 Large Laser (right torso) Artemis IV FCS CASE 16 tons of Ferro-Fibrous armor 300 engine I recall someone saying that the King Crab was an incredibly dangerous urban brawler, with a zone of death equal to the range of its dual AC/20s. They also mentioned that because of MWO's loadout system, and armor being stronger in game than tabletop, dual AC/20s is nowhere near as scary as in tabletop, and available on mechs that should not have them, like the Jeager, both of which make the King Crab somewhat less dangerous and intimidating than on tabletop. The new design looks MUCH better than the rather silly old design, however, I'll give the game that.   legioN7 fucked around with this message at 02:43 on Feb 21, 2018 |
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Feb 21, 2018 02:25
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Commando 5S A mech too lame to paint  Look at that weird butt. What's up with that?  I have a monocle!  BATTLETECH TALK Stats (relative to weight class): Speed - Frozen turd Armor - Would be nice Firepower - Sound and fury, signifying nothing Role - Free kill for opponent Weakness - The Commando struggles when it has to participate in combat in any way, shape, or form Opinion: There were a few Commando builds that almost looked cool, such as the quirky 4H with a bunch of rocket launchers or the 7S with ER mediums, but MWO won't let you build them accurately enough. The 1D has a large laser, but if you're going to use that, just pick a Panther instead. So I used the lovely 5S. Have I mentioned that I haaaate the Commando? I thought, "Hey. It can't be that bad. Maybe they made it good for MWO." They didn't. The Commando suffers from being a neat idea in theory that doesn't work in practice. I can't stress enough how much a mech with this armor level needs speed. His weapons are all spread out which means he has no "dead" side. Even when hitting with all his weapons, it lacks the punch or consistent ability to hit the same location necessary to be effective. You can't put him with other slow mechs because he becomes a target or gets in their way. You can't send him to the sides to flank because he'll lose almost any fight he gets in. When the best thing you can say about a mech is that opponents probably aren't worried enough to even bother shooting at you, well, that's a problem. Here's a single turn from tabletop: Me: I have a streak, SRM6, and medium laser at long range on 11s. Miss, miss, miss. Opponent: I have an ER PPC at short range on an 8. I hit. Location is right torso. Your armor is unhurt, but I get into your internal structure by two points. Critical hit. Ammo explosion. You lose your torso, arm, all of your ammo, and take two pilot hits. Me: Wow, this sure is fun. I hate the Commando. MechWarrior Online https://plays.tv/video/5a8cd1dba364e4a218/commando-5s?from=user Can You Build It? Yes, but why would you? https://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab#modified If the Commando is a poor pick in tabletop, it feels doubly so here. I still feel very fragile and the offense feels even less effective. In theory, hitting an SRM6, medium laser, and streak 2 should be notable. But the missile spreads, potential to overheat, and general "spread" of damage really limits its effectiveness. Against a crappy team you could probably gang up on some schlub or do a hit-and-run tactic, but frankly, I don't have the patience to wait for that one game out of ten where the stars align and this becomes a viable build. MWO does not take kindly to mechs that are slow, poorly armored, and lacking in range (especially all at once). I'm looking forward to something decent for the next run. Final verdict in the form of a metaphor: A less threatening version of Tin Man from Wizard of Oz
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Feb 21, 2018 03:32
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legioN7 posted:Requesting a King Crab KGC-000b, which is: Yeeeeeesssssssssssssss
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Feb 21, 2018 03:32
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I would love to see some variant of the Catapult, just because I fell in love with shoving a ton of missiles on the dumb thing when MWO first came out. The explosions were very pretty, and sometimes they were me.
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Feb 21, 2018 04:12
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quote:BATTLETECH TALK This is a stat block description style I can really get behind
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May 3, 2018 21:00
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