Koudelka - Shadow Hearts 0 - The Something Awful Forums

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Let's Play! > Koudelka - Shadow Hearts 0

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

As people have been bringing up, Koudelka's writing, voice-acting, music, and atmosphere is just frickin' fantastic. Like its one of the best-written JRPGs period and Koudelka is one of the very best protagonists. The party interaction in this game is superb too, the only RPG that I can think of where you have a team that really aren't friends is KOTOR 2.

The Shadow Hearts series is my favorite JRPG series and Covenant is one of all time favorite games, but I feel none of the Shadow Hearts games were as well-written as Koudelka was.

# ¿ Mar 29, 2018 00:58

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# ¿ May 19, 2024 03:17

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

The Vosgian Beast posted:

Hey he's probably an Anglican priest so he doesn't have to celibate...

He's an Irish Catholic.

# ¿ Mar 29, 2018 22:26

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

OutofSight posted:

I blame that strange miniskirt and boots combo, that got some guys confused.

Wasn't there some prequel comic (manga), that explained Koudelka's odd choice of adventure clothes? Someone in Niggurath's VLP posted something, i think.

There is a manga, but its a sequel that Shadow Hearts ended up retconning, not a prequel. It's a solid read, and its interesting to see some of the elements that Shadow Hearts 1 most likely took inspiration from, like the main villain.

# ¿ Mar 31, 2018 20:53

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Kavak posted:

I was kind of wishy-washy on this game so far, but now that we've had a man executed for no particularly good reason I'm coming around on the story.

The writing just keeps getting better from here.

# ¿ Apr 21, 2018 21:39

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Their Frank has yet to appear.

# ¿ Apr 21, 2018 22:46

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

It's a still pretty unique game when it comes to its writing and atmosphere even almost twenty years later.

# ¿ May 12, 2018 14:58

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

ZiegeDame posted:

I have been sitting on this quote for so long, waiting for this exact update.

KOUDELKA'S A BIRD

# ¿ May 13, 2018 23:51

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Andyzero posted:

http://mangakakalot.com/manga/koudelka

There's also a Koudelka manga. It clashes horribly with the Shadow Hearts series, but I liked it.

Headsup that the manga is a sequel to the game so there are some endgame spoilers. It also came out before Shadow Hearts did, so its interesting to see what the trilogy seemed to use from it.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 12:49 on May 17, 2018

# ¿ May 17, 2018 12:41

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Malachite_Dragon posted:

I vaguely recall that that actually comes up in the Shadow Hearts series. Or does it come up here? I forget.

I think its outright stated that Roger figured out a way to use the Emigre Manuscript to make himself immortal without sacrificing anyone but he refuses to share the method so others can't abuse it. For most of the series its also established that when it comes to using the manuscript to resurrecting someone it will either end up creating an undead abomination or just fail. Shadow Hearts 3 deviates from this by having Johnny be the first successful Emigre resurrection.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 14:39 on May 21, 2018

# ¿ May 21, 2018 14:32

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

amigolupus posted:

This makes Patrick sound like an even bigger dumbass. He tried the whole animal sacrifice thing, and when that didn't work he went straight to humans instead of consulting the recipe again. He probably thought that the ritual HAD to be evil since it needed animal sacrifices, and so it needed people.

It's not really a spoiler for this game because it only really comes up in the sequels, but its established in the manga as well as Shadow Hearts 1 that Patrick was being manipulated into it by an outside party; said party differs in both the manga and SH1, in the former its the British Royal Medical Society and in SH1 it's Albert Simon, Roger's rogue apprentice.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 16:34 on May 21, 2018

# ¿ May 21, 2018 16:29

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

The main character in Nioh is William Adams who is based off the real British sailor who ended up stranded in Japan after a disastrous voyage and became an advisor to Tokugawa.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 18:16 on May 30, 2018

# ¿ May 22, 2018 21:09

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Mazed posted:

I was kind of ambivalent at first, but now the depth of this narrative is making me want to play Shadow Hearts.

Presumably they actually manage to get wherever this game is going.

As Robindaybird said the trilogy's combat is head and shoulders above Koudelka's. The writing of the trilogy is weaker than Koudelka's though I feel, they're still mostly good (Though 3 tends to dip more into JRPG cliches compared to the other entries), they just rather lack the strong characterization and fantastic voice acting of Koudelka. Shadow Hearts Covenant is the best of the four games and is one of the JPRGs of all time too.

# ¿ May 29, 2018 17:28

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

CmdrKing posted:

Or really just if it wasn't the last one. The series jumping around history for Shadow Hearts-style historical hijinks, with tone changes in keeping with the period of history they're visiting, wouldn't be the worst thing to do with the whole concept. But having two games telling the story of one dude with a blend of character drama and comedy then suddenly the third is an entirely different set of people with an almost purely comedic tone through everyone for a loop. If you had another game with either a similar tone to From the New World or another tone entirely you'd get people on the same page of "Shadow Hearts is more about the world/magic system/combat style, not just Yuri's Story".
(Although I dunno that Shadow Hearts was such a firm name that changing it and doing "Shadow Hearts is Yuri's story, the series moves on to a new name for this new phase" wouldn't have been a better move, as you say. But I think if the series had made it one more entry it wouldn't have mattered much.)

They were actually planning a fourth game and it was going to be a prequel taking place before even Koudelka starring Yuri's dad, Ben. Apparently FTNW wasn't even going to be considered a mainline title if that game came out because the series director called it the real SH3.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 23:45 on May 29, 2018

# ¿ May 29, 2018 23:40

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Covenant is definitely lighter in tone than Koudelka and 1 but it still maintained a balance between zaniness and the series Gothic/Lovecraftian horror roots, Covenant shares that unique, dark, rather irreverent tone that its predecessors had that separated them from most JRPGS even to this day. FTNW was the one that threw more of that out of the window that it became more of a detriment. I do like most of FTNW's silliness mind you, like how can you not like oddball stuff like a Polish-American dude raised and trained by a secret clan of ninjas living in the Amazon, a giant talking cat that is a master of drunken boxing and is pals with Al Capone, or a character is essentially El Mariachi in 1920's Chicago? But ultimately FTNW did lose a good deal of the series' tone set by Koudelka to a fault. Also Johnny is such a bland and cliche protagonist compared to Koudelka and Yuri, who are still some of the best and most unique JRPG protagonists of all time, that's it not even funny.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 08:12 on May 30, 2018

# ¿ May 30, 2018 07:52

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Ubiquitous_ posted:

One of my favorite voice-acted cutscenes in gaming. Vivianna makes Koudelka�s pain so vivid and impactful.

Yeah, its not only the best scene in the game its still one of the best voice-acted scenes in the medium even twenty years later.

# ¿ Jun 1, 2018 20:37

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

EagerSleeper posted:

Koudelka along with Deadly Premonitions both had the actors in the same room together, and out came memorable games with a high level of charm and authenticity.

The Legacy of Kain games did too, it well and truly does show.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 02:42 on Jun 2, 2018

# ¿ Jun 2, 2018 02:36

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Fun fact, the Drake Sword in Dark Souls is a reference to the Sacnoth Sword. (I may be mistaken, but I remember reading that though.)

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 21:17 on Jun 4, 2018

# ¿ Jun 4, 2018 21:14

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Oh boy, here it comes. :allears:

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Jun 7, 2018

# ¿ Jun 7, 2018 19:20

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Leraika posted:

Hey, don't do that, please.

I thought it was vague enough, but I went back and made it vaguer.

# ¿ Jun 7, 2018 20:37

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Tuxedo Ted posted:

Another staple of the Covenant series: the bummer ending is canon.

That's only the case for SH1. FTNW strongly hints that Covenant's good ending is canon.

# ¿ Jun 14, 2018 02:37

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Tallgeese posted:

Covenant's good ending being canon means both SH1 endings are canon, if I recall an interview correctly.

Yup, Yuri gets sent back in time to the very beginning of SH 1 with all his memories intact so he's completely prepared to save Alice this time around. FTNW hints that most of the events of Covenant still happen because Nicholai still unleashed all that Malice but because Roger claims that's never seen an Emigre Manuscript resurrection first hand then it proves that Yuri saved Alice because Roger and Yuri try and bring her back in Covenant.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 14, 2018

# ¿ Jun 14, 2018 05:40

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Zagglezig posted:

It certainly makes some sense from a narrative point of view to use the bad endings as a jumping off point, since good endings tend to have things nicely wrapped up with no dangling plot hooks for a sequel to play with.

Funny thing is, very few games with multiple endings actually do this. The only ones I can think aside from Koudelka and SH1 is Legacy of Kain: Blood Omen and a good chunk of the Fatal Frames.

# ¿ Jun 14, 2018 21:32

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

PurpleXVI posted:

I still read that as him not remembering anything, personally. But I guess it's ambiguous unless the developers have chipped in on which is the correct interpretation.

Yuri's last few lines aren't ambiguous though, he recognizes the train and jokes about doing it all over again.

# ¿ Jun 15, 2018 00:56

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

rannum posted:

I woudln't call this a bad ending at all, honestly.
Like James dies I guess, but Koudelka & Edward come out of this just fine, Elaine gets to ascend to heaven with the lover who didnt butcher hundreds of women and ressurect you as a hellspawn, and hey dying didn't exactly turn out terribly for James either!

Well...Edward does knock up Koudelka and then runs off to America, abandoning his child for more than a decade. So Edward and Koudelka don't really come out of this completely fine.

# ¿ Jun 15, 2018 03:48

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Pesky Splinter posted:

Koudelka sequels

poo poo, I've never heard about these before. Man, now I want that version of 2.

I'm going to elaborate on the manga if anyone's interested. It will be a quick summary and I'll just leave it unspoilered. There's a decent English translation online and you should check it out if you're interested because its good.

Anyway, the manga takes place several months after the events of the game. The manga is super vague about which ending is canon, but because neither Edward or James are in it, I'd lean towards the bad ending being canon just like Shadow Hearts. (Because James would definitely get involved in the manga's plot if he was still alive, though it deviates from Shadow Hearts in that Edward didn't knock up Koudelka) The manga opens with Koudelka escaping from an asylum being guided by another mysterious voice. She eventually meets a plucky young orphan, Joshua, in a seaside town and the two escape Koudelka's pursuers, making their way to London and to the brothel that Joshua's deceased mother used to run. Koudelka befriends the prostitutes there and eventually becomes embroiled in another rash of mysterious murders of prostitutes similar to the ones ol' Patrick had committed. As she delves into the mystery and fights off mysterious assassins, Koudelka eventually uncovers that the British Royal Medical Society is behind it and they're trying to do a successful Emigre Manuscript resurrection that doesn't end in a horrible hell beast. The society members were the ones responsible for telling Patrick about the Manuscript as well helping him get it from the Vatican's vaults because they wanted Patrick to be their Emigre trial run. The Society leader, Lord Leslie, wants to resurrect his daughter who turns out to be Joshua's mom, who was the voice guiding Koudelka this time around. Koudelka returns to Nemeton to stop the ritual and reunites with Roger. Turns out though that both Patrick and Lord Leslie were just being used by society member De Gaulle (No relation to Charles) who turns out to be a rogue apprentice of Roger's and who seeks to use the Emigre ritual to summon The Author, one of the Formors, and to use The Author to destroy all life on Earth, because he just wants to see poo poo burn. Koudelka and Roger work together to stop him and it ends with Koudelka gaining control of The Author and crushing De Gaulle into dust.

Shadow Hearts definitely took some elements from the manga even if it didn't treat it as canon, mainly with De Gaulle, as the main villain of SH1, Albert Simon, is also a rogue apprentice of Roger that manipulated Patrick for his own ends and seeks to summon an ancient power, though their motivations are opposite of each other. Also T.E. Lawrence pops up in the epilogue and he's a recurring character in Covenant.

Also thanks for the LP, Id. Koudelka's gameplay is really flawed, but its writing, atmosphere, and voice-acting really are fantastic and it always deserves more love because of that.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 13:10 on Jun 15, 2018

# ¿ Jun 15, 2018 13:01

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

SH1 was originally planned to be a PS1 game as well.

# ¿ Jun 15, 2018 23:02

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

It's also kind of funny that the Bad Ending strongly hints that despite all the cosmic horrors, otherworldy terrors, and other Lovecraftian and Gothic trappings, God exists in the Shadow Hearts universe and is good in a genre where God tends to be a humongous rear end in a top hat.

# ¿ Jun 16, 2018 00:13

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Shitenshi posted:

That seriously makes me wonder if God and Meta-God are the same, since the bestiary description for the latter says that it's been worshipped by people as God, or if it's just another inconsistency when Kikuta left.

Don't think so, Meta-God is just supposed to be a sufficiently advanced alien that people thought was a god. Albert Simon claims its God, but he's not the most reliable source.

Accordion Man fucked around with this message at 01:16 on Jun 16, 2018

# ¿ Jun 16, 2018 01:11

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# ¿ May 19, 2024 03:17

Accordion Man: Nov 7, 2012; Buglord

Hey, I recognize that train and that dapper looking fellow...

# ¿ Jun 19, 2018 05:20

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