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I just got this game and can't help but wonder why doesn't anyone play it? I mean less than 24 hours after getting the game I've already made a ton of custom 2-sided counters for flaming oil jets, and I'm hoping to have a ton of modular road sections printed out tomorrow. All the various complaints I've heard about math and tedium kind of fall short. There's less things to keep track of than in Xwing, and all the design work can be made in an app to cut down on unnecessary bookeeping. Both the designing aspect and the setting things on fire part give off a vibe very similar to KSP. Instead of just combining the most "meta" parts like in Xwing, there is always a need to build vehicles for a specific task and budget. There is a lot of trial and error involved and the type of terrain you are using will influence what sort of vehicle you end up with. Sure, some components and weapons are nothing but a waste, but there is a lot of design space (comparable only to battletech, which plays much slower). About the only downsides I can see are the small scale (easily fixed by using HO-scale cars and multiplying everything by 2) and the lack of an in-depth campaign system like in battletech or mordheim. So why did this game go extinct? It's perfect in every way.
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Jun 14, 2018 21:32
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How Disgusting posted:I just got this game and can't help but wonder why doesn't anyone play it? I mean less than 24 hours after getting the game I've already made a ton of custom 2-sided counters for flaming oil jets, and I'm hoping to have a ton of modular road sections printed out tomorrow. I don't know why it went extinct, but I know the recently launched Gaslands is basically Car Wars but streamlined for faster play and more action. (Gaslands is also specifically specced to Hot Wheels/Matchbox/whatever else at roughly 1:64 scale.)
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Jun 18, 2018 17:45
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Reasons I’ve heard for Car Wars extinction include the rise of video games that could deliver the experience a bit more smoothly, industry downturns during the Great CCG 90s, the layers of rules and cruft getting to be too much for more casual folks, the whole Turning Key cutout, death of AADA, and all of the weird crap that happened at SJG over the years. Gaslands is loving rad, however. It plays like how I fondly remembered Car Wars, as opposed to when I actually got it on the table with people. Yeah, it’s more limited, but it’s an eminently modifiable game, and the recent Fury Road-inspired mini-campaign is fantastic. gently caress it, let’s talk car combat games. Just getting back into them myself.
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Jun 18, 2018 18:07
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It was too slow and too lethal (duels lasted six-ten seconds), power creep was a thing, and the game didn't really appeal to role players (they tried with Gurps Autoduel, but the horse had left the barn at that point. They continually think about rekickstarting it (like they did with OGRE), but they're betwixt and between. It needs a modern coat of paint to attract a new audience, but the grognards won't hear of it.
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Jun 18, 2018 19:46
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Car Wars also fell into a weird dead period in the 90s right when miniatures games were exploding all over. SJG didn't know what to do with it, made expansions for tanks, hovercraft, and (I think) zeppelins, GURPS Autoduel, and then a weird anime card game. The obvious thing would have been to jump to miniatures again (rare CW minis actually came out in the 80s), but it never materialized. There was also some in house drama between editions. You can still find the car X vs car Y starter books, but that's all that was ever produced for the latest edition. I collected the poo poo out of this stuff as an 80s kid. I remember trading photocopied Autoduel Quarterly magazines and loving the AADA key fob and kill stickers that I'd need for when I was old enough to for-real drive. There was also a janky PC game, which is probably responsible for SJG not trusting Interplay with the GURPS license for Fallout. Oops.
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Jun 18, 2018 20:29
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I got out of Car Wars right about the time they introduced metal armor, fixing my biggest problem with the game. Also, if you play Battletech, 1 die of car wars damage kind of works as 1 point of BT damage. (Scale armor appropriately)
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Jun 18, 2018 20:53
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As this thread is already about combat auto gaming, let’s expand it out a bit. As people have posted, Gaslands is the newest kid on the block, and it’s a really good game. Vehicle construction is simplified from its roots, everything moves via a set of custom templates, and the Gear Phase mechanic allows faster cars to feel faster. It’s available from Osprey, and it uses 1/64th scale cars like Matchbox or Hot Wheels. Since adding apocalyptic details can require removing paint, here’s a short guide on disassembling a car.  Get your car ready. This cost 50 cents at my local pharmacy.  Flip it over and locate the two pegs keeping the metal body attached to the plastic parts. These are our target.  Drill out the pegs. I use a 3/16” drill bit. Be careful while doing this, because if the drill skips, then you could be injured.  Once you’ve drilled out the pegs, pop the top off. You may need to try a few times to get through.  Pop them in your paint stripper of choice. I’m using acetone, because I had it in my basement. Watch for when the paint is bubbling out from the body - that’s a good sign for paint separation.  After about 30 minutes, pop them out of your solvent and scrub with a brush to remove the paint. Be sure to get in-between the panel lines with a toothpick or a dental pick. You may need to pop them back in your paint stripper and repeat the process, but in the end, you’ll have enough bare metal bodies to hack apart, add weapons to, and otherwise modify to your heart’s content.
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Jun 19, 2018 01:46
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I've yet to play gaslands but I've been having a blast with car wars for the past week.SirFozzie posted:It was too slow and too lethal (duels lasted six-ten seconds), power creep was a thing, and the game didn't really appeal to role players (they tried with Gurps Autoduel, but the horse had left the barn at that point. It doesn't need to be an rpg, what it needs is a robust campaign system like necromunda. If I wanted to run a campaign I'd directly rip off necromunda and adjust the costs and expenses to match car wars prices. There's plenty of rpgs on the market, I want to come up with poo poo and figure out how to set it on fire. The slow motion, all-in combat can be part of the appeal, depending on how you present it. People loved hotline miami and max payne when those came out, and they're more than happy to crash and burn hundreds of times in KSP until they get it right. I'll agree on the power creep though. A lot of parts and weapons are so efficient in terms of cost and weight/space there's no reason not to use them, and a lot of others are only useful on specialized designs. I can see how always playing the same div20-25 match in an empty arena could get old fast. I use a ton of tiles for roads and intersections (30 so far), when someone is trying to run and gets to the edge of a tile, the other player chooses which tile to place in front of the escapee.
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Jun 19, 2018 10:09
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Campaign rules would be good. Something more robust than the simple notoriety system they had in the version I played in high school. I remember that version didn't have any real demarcation between the basic rules and weird cases like 'driving on rims', which didn't help rekindle interest once we played the poo poo out of it the first time.
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Jun 19, 2018 16:48
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Yeah, figuring out and iterating different designs is fun for a while but to keep people interested for more than a couple of weeks it needs to have some sort of persistence. It doesn't need to be as elaborate as mordheim or necromunda, it just needs to be good enough. A bad example of this is is Darkwind, the online CW clone. The dev spent hundreds of hours making a campaign system that is miles wide and inches deep, and it ultimately drove people away from the game. Giving players the option to run an entire gang and gain loot and experience would add to the appeal of CW a lot. Rudimentary rules for this exist scattered in various ADQ's, but they were never combined and refined into a finished product as far as I know. There's a supplement called Convoy where you take a bunch of characters and cars through some linear, and heavily scripted encounters, but that's it. Figuring out the basic tactics and game loop for CW is a rather large time investment compared to X Wing or even most special kids games. It wasn't a problem when the game was made since there was much less competition. Without long-term rewards and progression, people are simply going to leave and do something else.
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Jun 19, 2018 17:40
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Because I can’t avoid discussing vehicular combat games, here’s a crosspost of vehicles on my bench for Gaslands.  All random Hot Wheels, with some scratchbuilt parts and some equipment from Brigade Games. Definitely need to either start making my own tires or find a good supplier.
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Jun 25, 2018 00:46
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moths posted:There was also a janky PC game, which is probably responsible for SJG not trusting Interplay with the GURPS license for Fallout. Oops. The PC game (Autoduel) was fun up until I left the first city and my car immediately got machine-gunned to death. Happened every single time I played, regardless of how much I armor up the car. And I thought the whole reason GURPS fell through with Fallout was because Steve found out the Vault Dweller was allowed to kill children.
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Jun 25, 2018 01:03
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I've never seen the child killer thing before - the story I'd always heard was that he didn't feel that any CRPG could capture the scope and feel of a tabletop RPG and that this would somehow be a shallower experience, seen as selling out, or otherwise be bad for the brand. Which seems insane by today's expectations, but Fallout 1 / 2 essentially set those expectations for the whole industry. But when your only experience was Autoduel, maybe you'd be forgiven for low expectations.
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Jun 25, 2018 11:32
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Snorb posted:The PC game (Autoduel) was fun up until I left the first city and my car immediately got machine-gunned to death. Happened every single time I played, regardless of how much I armor up the car. And this is somehow better than Assassin's Creed, where children are basically Q, except they don't open their mouth as much.
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Jun 25, 2018 12:22
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I've heard a few different stories about Fallout. One was he wanted more editorial control (something about the opening cutscene), and from notes posted to the SJG frontpage at the time, he claimed that he was caught completely off-guard by the change. As much as I was a huge SJG fangirl at that point, it says a lot that they went from 'we've even got a guy converting all of the hundreds of GURPS magic spells in his spare time!' to 'welp, we had to come up with this at the very last minute'.
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Jun 25, 2018 16:12
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SJG is like that one friend or relative who used to make a ton of money as a DJ in the 90s, only to end up living on benefits and looking like a stoned, slightly overweight vampire.
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Jun 27, 2018 08:39
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Games Workshop made hot wheels scale game called Dark Future which got some expansion White Line Fever and some campaign rules in White Dwarf. There was a very extensive multi page list of rules for giving your Operative Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and painting his car in a hideous two tone colour scheme that gave a negative modifier to anyone looking at it. From what I heard, they got sued for using Hot Wheels cars and discontinued it after the lawsuit. I'm surprised there's a game out allowed to use it. Edit- I hadn't realised there was that many books or extra rules published. I presume Trump followed after President Oliver North, and the timelines will soon merge. Comstar fucked around with this message at 11:10 on Jun 27, 2018 |
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Jun 27, 2018 11:03
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Gaslands looks rad as gently caress and i am totally gonna convince my gamer group to pick it up as a hobby for when we aren't playing D&D. i noticed when i was looking at cars that a lot of people complained about the difficulty of finding tires that didn't look like the crappy hot wheels ones and i found this site: https://www.bossenimp.com/catalog/category/view/s/wheels-tires-rims/id/411/?scale=368 1/64 scale is the scale of Hot Wheels, and you can get a pack of like 40 rubber tires + rims (so like 10 cars' worth) for $4, which is a steal. i was looking around if there's anywhere that sells decent looking tank treads but i'm having difficulty with that, anyone know of a good place to buy some, or a good guide to make some?
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Jun 27, 2018 16:17
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Syndlig posted:Gaslands looks rad as gently caress and i am totally gonna convince my gamer group to pick it up as a hobby for when we aren't playing D&D. i noticed when i was looking at cars that a lot of people complained about the difficulty of finding tires that didn't look like the crappy hot wheels ones and i found this site: https://www.bossenimp.com/catalog/category/view/s/wheels-tires-rims/id/411/?scale=368 Where are you seeing this large pack of tires/rims? From what I can tell, they’re only selling pairs of tires for $4, which is a lot less worth it. I know there’s a guy on FB selling tires for $5/set, which strikes me as close to this. I hate that decent tires are so hard to find: I’m either gonna need to mold and cast my own, or learn how 3D printers work and get one. Oh yeah, resources for add-ons that I can vouch for:
I should look for more, and actually write up some useful conversion notes.
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Jun 27, 2018 16:51
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Hedningen posted:Where are you seeing this large pack of tires/rims? From what I can tell, they’re only selling pairs of tires for $4, which is a lot less worth it. unless i'm misreading the really horribly named product title, this is 42 pairs for $4.00: https://www.bossenimp.com/catalog/product/view/id/10571/s/64-18-4-42-tire-rim-st82707/category/411/ those sites are definitely rad as gently caress, bookmarked. EDIT: oh i see now, that's the dimension of the tires, so yeah it's $4.00 for a pair. gently caress me that's expensive, you can probably spend less by just buying monster truck hot wheels and stripping them for parts. surfacelevelspeck fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Jun 27, 2018 |
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Jun 27, 2018 17:20
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Syndlig posted:unless i'm misreading the really horribly named product title, this is 42 pairs for $4.00: https://www.bossenimp.com/catalog/product/view/id/10571/s/64-18-4-42-tire-rim-st82707/category/411/ Yeah, welcome to learning why this poo poo is expensive. Frankly, I’m probably going to use this wonderful resource to order some tires and then cast them in resin. I figure a basic 1-part half-mold oughta churn out the initial copies, then some resculpting and custom additions leading to proper production-line molding.
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Jun 27, 2018 18:18
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Hedningen posted:Yeah, welcome to learning why this poo poo is expensive. once you figure out a process that makes good looking tires you should post it here so we can shamelessly steal your techniques
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Jun 27, 2018 18:25
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Yeah, I think someone needs to make a Gaslands Tabletop Simulator thing. That would be neat.
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Jun 29, 2018 02:17
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so I was at walmart picking up some stuff and decided to grab a hot wheels 20-pack and one of their big rigs because gently caress yeah i wanna play this game. say hello to my team: dunno what i'm doing with them yet, but these looked the most promising. was thinking of trying to make sure none of them cost more than 25 points (aside from the big rig which is gonna cost a fuckload no matter what I do) so i can swap in any combination of 2 i want. maybe i should do some 15-pointers too so i can have 3 cars? dunno! got all of next week off because our offices are closed so i'mma learn how the gently caress to paint me some road warriors 
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Jun 29, 2018 17:53
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Is this now the gaslands thread? Serious question, because I couldn't find one. I picked up the rule book after playing once last weekend. Picked up 8 hot wheels today because I can't bring myself to modify the collection of the ones I played with as a kid even though there are some perfect ones in there. Also picked up some plastruct for making guard rails and 3d printed some jersey barriers. I need to get a board ready before the 13th because I'm going on a vacation with board game people and want to get them to try. Gonna CNC some templates out of plexiglass, too.
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Jun 30, 2018 03:15
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Mr. Powers posted:Is this now the gaslands thread? Serious question, because I couldn't find one. I picked up the rule book after playing once last weekend. Picked up 8 hot wheels today because I can't bring myself to modify the collection of the ones I played with as a kid even though there are some perfect ones in there. Also picked up some plastruct for making guard rails and 3d printed some jersey barriers. It apparently is now! On tire experiments: I’ve caved and bought a 3d printer, because it seems like there is a ton of stuff out there for Gaslands for 3d printing, plus it’s always seemed kinda cool. My plan, in three phases:
My experiments with building a “tread-jig” are stalling because it has to have an even pattern, plus an even layer of modeling putty, plus really smooth release to not look like poo poo. It . . . sort of works in concept? However, the physical process is a bitch, so I’m thinking that another option would be modeling and printing a jig. Should we PM Ettin to get the thread title changed? Because it seems like we’ve drifted into Gaslands/general automotive combat game territory.
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Jun 30, 2018 04:20
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does anyone know if there are decent weapons you can get from, like, Amazon? i was hoping to mod my cars while i'm off work next week but all the sites seem to have a minimum delivery time of a month, which is insane. i was looking at these weapons on Amazon but their scale is 1:35. is that gonna be too big and look weird?Hedningen posted:Should we PM Ettin to get the thread title changed? Because it seems like we’ve drifted into Gaslands/general automotive combat game territory. not a bad idea, actually.
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Jun 30, 2018 05:44
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3D printing stuff for this looks like it could be fun.
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Jun 30, 2018 07:06
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I am going to be 3D printing a batch of weapons today. If anyone wants me to print some stuff off thingiverse (or other small STL files), PM me, and I'll put it in the run and mail it out.
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Jun 30, 2018 13:33
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Mr. Powers posted:I am going to be 3D printing a batch of weapons today. If anyone wants me to print some stuff off thingiverse (or other small STL files), PM me, and I'll put it in the run and mail it out. What printer are you using?
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Jun 30, 2018 13:41
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Depending on how many requests, either a TAZ Mini or a TAZ 6, printed in HIPS of various colors.
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Jun 30, 2018 14:31
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E: gonna start a run in about 2 hours, but I can do other runs, too. real edit: post is not edit.
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Jun 30, 2018 15:06
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Sell me on Gaslands? Mad Max setting and car combat is extremely my poo poo, but how does it work in practice? Also, scenarios? Are those closed-circuit death-races or arenas only, or can it handle highway combat too? Also, post your tables. Hedningen posted:Should we PM Ettin to get the thread title changed? Because it seems like we’ve drifted into Gaslands/general automotive combat game territory.
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Jun 30, 2018 15:32
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I've only played closed course death race, but I don't see why it couldn't be done in a highway setting. Maneuvering might just be a bit boring if it's straight line.
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Jun 30, 2018 15:36
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Mr. Powers posted:Depending on how many requests, either a TAZ Mini or a TAZ 6, printed in HIPS of various colors. I have an Anycubic Photon which has some incredible build quality.
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Jun 30, 2018 16:50
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:I have an Anycubic Photon which has some incredible build quality. SLA will always beat FDM for detail. E: more jersey barriers left, miscellaneous weapons right. 
carticket fucked around with this message at 18:25 on Jun 30, 2018 |
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Jun 30, 2018 17:45
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Pierzak posted:Sell me on Gaslands? Mad Max setting and car combat is extremely my poo poo, but how does it work in practice? Also, scenarios? Are those closed-circuit death-races or arenas only, or can it handle highway combat too? You can totally have this one and change the title and op to whatever.
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Jun 30, 2018 22:53
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How Disgusting posted:You can totally have this one and change the title and op to whatever. So I guess the answer to your question is “It didn’t die, people moved on to its spiritual successor, Gaslands”. As someone who was really excited by Car Wars, have you had a chance to take a look at this? I think it hits a lot of the points you were looking at in Car Wars, with a lot of streamlining. As long as we’re here, might as well give the elevator pitch for Gaslands. Gaslands? Never Heard of It! Gaslands is Osprey Game’s tabletop wargame of vehicular mayhem, built as a spiritual successor to a host of systems involving car combat in the near-future: there are traces of Car Wars, Dark Future, Autoduel, and Devil’s Run in its gaming DNA. Designed for Matchbox/Hot Wheels scale (roughly 1/64), players are competing in deadly vehicular competition for the entertainment of the viewers at home. The basic fluff (which can be ignored or modified as per the creator’s suggestions) is the usual: Earth has gone to poo poo, violent combat sports are a big part of what keeps the population from getting too riot-y, and there’s a better life promised on Martian colonies for whoever can survive and win the season. How’s It Play The game is very streamlined - players build a team of vehicles and compete in any number of scenarios, with the default being a death race through a series of gates where the first one through is the victor. The mechanics are relatively simple - all vehicles act once in every gear phase equal to or lower than their current gear. A series of movement templates dictate how (and where) you can move, and each has gear restrictions and can get riskier as you shift up. When moving, you roll shift dice, which let you change gear, as well as cause you to risk spinning out, accumulate hazards, or slide off your selected template. Beyond the basic game, there are optional advanced rules for sponsors, driver perks, and audience votes for in-game effects that act as a handicap to keep things interesting. The sponsors are a big part - they alter available weapons, vehicles, and perks, as well as suggesting a particular playstyle. They are:
Apparently, more sponsors are in the works. How Expensive Is It? Cheap as hell. To play, all you need is the book, movement templates (easily made by printing out the templates and gluing them to thin cardboard/cardstock), and some six-sided dice, as well as your cars. Cars are typically heavily-modified 1/64 cars (though if you want to scale up or down, there’s instructions for that - it can do anywhere from 6mm scale to 1/24). They’re cheap, usually about $1/car, and while some people like WYSIWYG, there’s no requirement if you’re clear. If you want weapons or armor, you can scratchbuild them or buy from any number of people with the Friends of Gaslands banner, which is a neat sort of co-op business model where various businesses pay a small fee to the game’s creator for official recognition. A lot of companies even make acrylic movement templates, shift dice, and counters alongside the generic weapons. Any Support? Tons. There’s already a free expansion, Time Extended!, that has new scenarios and a mini-campaign that’s designed to recreate Fury Road, and more is promised. There’s also a pretty large online community. Hedningen fucked around with this message at 01:53 on Jul 1, 2018 |
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Jul 1, 2018 00:39
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Mr. Powers posted:I am going to be 3D printing a batch of weapons today. If anyone wants me to print some stuff off thingiverse (or other small STL files), PM me, and I'll put it in the run and mail it out. I don't don't have PMs and have never done any thingiverse poo poo before, what do I need to do to make this happen?
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Jul 1, 2018 06:32
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Go to thingiverse and find what you want printed, and I guess post it here.
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Jul 1, 2018 08:35
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