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Hedrigall
Mar 27, 2008

by vyelkin
Oh and Better Watch Out which started as teens vs a home invasion at Christmas and turned into something way more messed up. It does the paint can gag from Home Alone but with a much more hosed up result

Very disturbing and fun

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Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


Hedrigall posted:

Oh and Better Watch Out which started as teens vs a home invasion at Christmas and turned into something way more messed up. It does the paint can gag from Home Alone but with a much more hosed up result

Very disturbing and fun
holy poo poo BETTER WATCH OUT is in my top 50 movies of all time period, so glad other people have seen it.

the performance by the 14 yr old lead is stunning

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer
I watched the Zemeckis / Jim Carrey collab A Christmas Carol last night.

I would say it's almost a good movie, but it's ultimately an empty exercise in animation that forgets it's humanity and it's cinematic language in favor of amusement park thrills via the 3D effects of the time.

Here's stuff I genuinely appreciate:

Zemeckis does maintain some of the spookier elements with horror imagery. A Christmas Carol is a ghost story. It's been culturally watered-down, ironically commercialized, and given a family-friendly sheen through most of it's life now, and many forget that Scrooge should be an intimidating, cruel character and that some of the ghosts should be scary. Here, the Jacob Marley ghost look great and gets some horrific moments, while still colorful enough to be family friendly enough for Disney. I felt like there was a scarier cut with The Ghost of Christmas Future, but it was softened. I also thought the shadow work for Ghost of Christmas Future was a nice take on that looming figure of darkness.

Some of the art direction for the town(s) looks really nice. While Scrooge is framed rather boringly throughout the film, there is a surprising care in making the backgrounds really pretty.

Stuff that almost works:

The character design work here ranges from Good to Interesting to Weird As gently caress. I don't really understand the emphasis on pushing for aspects of the real actors faces for some characters and then dropping it for others. Jim Carrey's face is clearly inside the flame of The Ghost of Christmas Past but really only his eyes and his upper lip are in the Ghost of Christmas Present; Bob Crachett has Gary Oldman's eyes and mouth but Tiny Tim doesn't (more on Tiny Tim later) and Marley has none of his attributes; Belle looks like a plastic version of Robin Wright; Fezziwig looks closest to his actor, Bob Hoskins. For Scrooge, the effect they're going for is obvious, and I think a good idea. Having all the ghosts (besides Marley) being shades of Carrey/Scrooge is a good idea, and they use it explicitly for face-shifting effects, but I don't think you have to use it in the character design for the effect to work. I also don't know why some are so exaggerated, and others are pretty direct avatars. Go all the way with original designs! I don't need to recognize Jim Carrey in Scrooge's face. It's distracting, and the last thing we need is to spend 90+ minutes looking at these characters and wonder who's playing who and if I can recognize them in the design.

Zemeckis loves his zooms and free-roaming camera. He is obsessed with the audience's eyes being untethered in the world. He's been playing with it his entire career. However, that stuff is really fun and impressive when it's live action, and means nothing inside a computer animation. Often, the framing feels more like a video game than an animated film, and the editing style also emphasizes an attempt at immersion that really points more to the artifice of the animation style rather than being dropped inside a world.

My big problem with the animation in Zemeckis's CGI era is that he doesn't really have an animator's eye. There aren't a lot of gags and it seldom embraces the absurdity allowed in animation. There are a few. The dance number at Fezziwigs has actual animation gags that work, and it's so jarring that there's something dynamic and interesting happening that can only be done with cartoons, that it immediately reminded me that I was hungry for that, and the film returns to ignoring those possibilities.


It's a pretty lifeless affair, overall. It's not funny. The animation looks like a PS4-era graphics, and there's no weight to anything, there's a sheen that feels artificial. The biggest sin is perhaps how the film misses the heart of the story. A Christmas Carol isn't a classic because the ghosts are neat, but because there is a beautiful optimism in the idea that if Scrooge can find salvation and change, anyone could. But that idea is lost in translation. It's not in the performances. There's too much novelty in the casting decisions. Why is Gary Oldman Tiny Tim? Let's ignore that the character of purity and Christmas spirit has been compromised by an actor who has shown himself to be an unabashed bigot and rear end in a top hat. Why does Oldman need to be Tiny Tim? Why can't it be an actual child actor? That single question encapsulates what's wrong with the film. Why are we making more complicated technical choices and casting gimmicks while ignoring the important humanity to the story?

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
Bad Santa is the best Christmas movie because it has genuine heart and a real message about loving others and feeling the spirit of the season.

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



It's real good, and I absolutely refuse to watch Bad Santa 2.

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
Compare and contrast the very realistic scene with the neighbor trying to get Willie to go along with the neighborhood candle decorations vs unrealistic depictions of neighbors in some garbage like Christmas with the Kranks.

The guy has his polite little spiel he's obviously said a whole bunch of times, he's taken on a thankless volunteer job, and he's tired and just wants to get it done. He's got the Christmas spirit and wants his neighborhood to look nice but he's not a caricature.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer
I watched Trapped In Paradise last night. It was a regular on TV, probably TNT or TBS, back in the early 00's, so I've seen the first act multiple times, but can't remember sticking around the entire time.

Not all of the jokes land, and it's too long by at least 20 minutes, but I really love the cast, tone and overall sentiment. The town of Paradise is full of Christmas Spirit without ever feeling too saccharine. The multiple spinning plates of conflict--bank robbery, town kindness, FBI investigation, the brothers fighting, escaped convicts who also want the money--keeps things interesting and moving (despite also bogging the film down sometimes).

Oh, Dana Carvey is doing a weird Mickey Rourke on helium impersonation the entire time, and it's crazy.

I really liked it. Great supporting cast of Mädchen Amick, Florence Stanley, Donald Moffat, Angela Patton, and Richard Jenkins.

It's free on Tubi, if anyone wants to also watch it.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer
Does anyone watched Mixed Nuts every year?

I watched it for the first time last year. I thought it was abysmal, but in the most fascinating ways. I didn't like it, but here it is a year later, and I have the urge to rewatch it, maybe invite people over to watch it with me?

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


Franchescanado posted:

Does anyone watched Mixed Nuts every year?

I watched it for the first time last year. I thought it was abysmal, but in the most fascinating ways. I didn't like it, but here it is a year later, and I have the urge to rewatch it, maybe invite people over to watch it with me?

to this day Mixed Nuts is the only film I have walked out of in the theaters

NorgLyle
Sep 20, 2002

Do you think I posted to this forum because I value your companionship?

Franchescanado posted:

Does anyone watched Mixed Nuts every year?

I watched it for the first time last year. I thought it was abysmal, but in the most fascinating ways. I didn't like it, but here it is a year later, and I have the urge to rewatch it, maybe invite people over to watch it with me?
One of my favorite bits of Mixed Nuts trivia is that it is Liev Schreiber's first film role and it is fantastic.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer
Last night was my annual(ish) rewatch of the original Home Alone with my partner. This was the first time watching it on 4k UHD, and if you think you're gonna watch this movie every year, it is absolutely worth grabbing. The details are so precise that I noticed weird choices throughout the film for the first time. It's a nice, bright and warmly lit film and it benefits from the HDR. My only complaint has nothing to do with the film: it's a shame that Home Alone 2 doesn't have a 4k UHD yet. It would have the greater gain from HDR, New York is a more interesting setting, and I feel like it's a more colorful film.

The movie is sweet and good. I love John Candy, he steals every scene he is in with Catherine O'Hara, but she is a great straight-man to his bizarre rambling anecdotes. There's a moment where they are riding together down the highway and his polka band is playing a song. John Candy plays a clarinet. He offers it to O'Hara and says "Give it a try! C'mon!" He eventually gives up and goes back to playing it happily. I love it every time, it's so ridiculous and silly.

NorgLyle posted:

One of my favorite bits of Mixed Nuts trivia is that it is Liev Schreiber's first film role and it is fantastic.

I was surprised by how much pathos and grounded reality he gives that character. It's absolutely the right choice. Schreiber's really doing the best work in the film.

Shrecknet posted:

to this day Mixed Nuts is the only film I have walked out of in the theaters

This is completely unsurprising. I dunno if I'd walk out, but I absolutely understand it.

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


there was a promotion recently to win a night in the McAllister home to promote the new Home Alone, and that's when I discovered the McAllister home is a 2 bed, 1.5 bath which sehems insane

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer

Shrecknet posted:

there was a promotion recently to win a night in the McAllister home to promote the new Home Alone, and that's when I discovered the McAllister home is a 2 bed, 1.5 bath which sehems insane

That....That doesn't make any sense. It's a mansion!

This article says it has "five bedrooms, including a four-room master suite, which spans the entire west wing of the home, and three-and-a-half bathrooms."

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



Michael Mann has a property here, and it's famously 1 bedroom. Dude doesn't like people staying over I guess!

https://www.flickr.com/photos/wallyg/6651134717

Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!

Fun Shoe

Franchescanado posted:

Last night was my annual(ish) rewatch of the original Home Alone with my partner. This was the first time watching it on 4k UHD, and if you think you're gonna watch this movie every year, it is absolutely worth grabbing. The details are so precise that I noticed weird choices throughout the film for the first time. It's a nice, bright and warmly lit film and it benefits from the HDR. My only complaint has nothing to do with the film: it's a shame that Home Alone 2 doesn't have a 4k UHD yet. It would have the greater gain from HDR, New York is a more interesting setting, and I feel like it's a more colorful film.

The movie is sweet and good. I love John Candy, he steals every scene he is in with Catherine O'Hara, but she is a great straight-man to his bizarre rambling anecdotes. There's a moment where they are riding together down the highway and his polka band is playing a song. John Candy plays a clarinet. He offers it to O'Hara and says "Give it a try! C'mon!" He eventually gives up and goes back to playing it happily. I love it every time, it's so ridiculous and silly.

I wasted my time with that terrible new Home Alone movie on Disney+ this week, and one thing that really struck me in comparison to the original and kinda bummed me out is that the original is like, a real movie. And so much of the stuff that gets made by streaming services today just doesn't have that feel. And it's not like Chris Columbus or the cinematographer were proven at that point, they really hadn't done a whole lot before then but they still produced a film with, like you said, warmth and texture to it that feels cinematic. There is production design, and there was obviously thought put into things like the costumes and music and the framing of shots. Fairly basic things that you want to expect from every film, but these days it's way too common to get stuff like Home Sweet Home Alone where everything feels like it was thrown together on the day of shooting and nothing has any style or any particular aesthetic.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer

Basebf555 posted:

I wasted my time with that terrible new Home Alone movie on Disney+ this week, and one thing that really struck me in comparison to the original and kinda bummed me out is that the original is like, a real movie. And so much of the stuff that gets made by streaming services today just doesn't have that feel. And it's not like Chris Columbus or the cinematographer were proven at that point, they really hadn't done a whole lot before then but they still produced a film with, like you said, warmth and texture to it that feels cinematic. There is production design, and there was obviously thought put into things like the costumes and music and the framing of shots. Fairly basic things that you want to expect from every film, but these days it's way too common to get stuff like Home Sweet Home Alone where everything feels like it was thrown together on the day of shooting and nothing has any style or any particular aesthetic.

I was really surprised with how the film manages to be methodical. There's a lot of quick establishing shots to connect the action, strange one-off split-second gags that took a whole set-up just to keep things kinetic and flowing. It's noticeable with scenes like Kevin shooting Marv in the head with the BB gun, to really mundane things. In the beginning, Kevin tackles Buzz for mocking him by pretending to throw up the last of the cheese pizza. There are all these quick shots to show how much damage is happening--milk spilling all over the counter, Pepsi pouring all over the pizza, Uncle Frank getting Pepsi all over his crotch, the chaos of everyone fleeing the table, the napkins getting thrown into the garbage can. It's like a less-pronounced (or robust?) Edgar Wright/Sam Raimi sequence. And it's all for, what? A ten second sequence maybe? And the film is FULL of these things. It's really interesting. This pays off, of course, in the final act, when the film goes full-on Home Invasion With Looney Tunes Logic. The film does a lot to show you Kevin setting up everything that is going to happen. It's easy to take for granted when you already know the gags coming up, but if you're trying to look at this with fresh eyes, it's neat seeing the logical groundwork Kevin has to implement for his plans to work, and it justifies a lot that happens. It feels important in retrospect, since we are breaking logic by making everything Kevin does survivable and not-bloody, and it lets a viewer enjoy watching a person get their skull smashed in with a paint can without gasping in horror at the implications. (The film sets up this logic early in the first act several times, which was also interesting to notice.)

I think the first two Home Alone's have stood the test of time, not just because of nostalgia, but there is a LOT of craft going on to make all of this work, from the fantastic cast in both films, to John William's Totally-Not-William-Tell-Overture Score, to all of the set-ups and gags and establishing shots.

CopywrightMMXI
Jun 1, 2011

One time a guy stole some downhill skis out of my jeep and I was so mad I punched a mailbox. I'm against crime, and I'm not ashamed to admit it.
The original Home Alone needs a short montage of the cops and old man helping clean all the damage immediately after the Wet Bandits get arrested. They neglect to clean up the gold tooth and Buzz’s room though.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer

CopywrightMMXI posted:

The original Home Alone needs a short montage of the cops and old man helping clean all the damage immediately after the Wet Bandits get arrested. They neglect to clean up the gold tooth and Buzz’s room though.

There really isn't too much damage to the house, outside of the tar/goo on the steps in the basement (which I assume Kevin cleans up) and the door frame Marv fucks up with the crowbar. There's no way Kevin could fix the doorframe before his parents got home. It's the basement doorframe, so maybe it'll take some time to notice.

Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!

Fun Shoe
They got Buzz back for the new movie and the actor is just trying so hard in his few scenes to make some sort of an impression and it's the cringiest stuff I've seen in a long time.

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine

Shrecknet posted:

there was a promotion recently to win a night in the McAllister home to promote the new Home Alone, and that's when I discovered the McAllister home is a 2 bed, 1.5 bath which sehems insane

That's because the house was only used for exterior shots, for the interior shots they used a set they built inside a shut down high school gym

Twin Cinema
Jun 1, 2006



Playoffs are no big deal,
don't have a crap attack.
I also agree the new Home Alone is bad. The first one establishes Kevin as a spoiled brat, but it also gets you to sympathize with him. When he says he wants his family to disappear, it makes sense. When he realizes he wants his family back, his growth feels natural. He becomes more independent, and in becoming so, starts to become less of a child. Part of this feels natural because the entire film mostly focuses on Kevin.

In the new film, the focuses shifts more towards the duo trying to rob new-Kevin, and instead of being sleazy criminals, they are parents trying to keep their house (which, makes the violence at the end feel a lot less fun). So, since the film spends less time with new-Kevin, everything feels rushed, and it feels like things happening because they have to happen. The busy family scene at the beginning is reduced to what feels like a few minutes, before new-Kevin retires to his family's brand new BMW in the garage.

I feel like this film started with the idea of "what if Kevin was the villain?" because the film doesn't make sense to me otherwise. And, that could have been fun, but this film seems to only half-heartedly go with this idea.

Timeless Appeal
May 28, 2006
I brought this pitch up in the trailer thread I think, but I feel like there is such an obvious Home Alone sequel set-up where you have grown-up Kevin abandoning his widowed mother during Christmas and just have like forty minutes of Katherine O'Hara improving while she plays tricks on a couple of thieves. It's right loving there.

Teriyaki Hairpiece
Dec 29, 2006

I'm nae the voice o' the darkened thistle, but th' darkened thistle cannae bear the sight o' our Bonnie Prince Bernie nae mair.
Just did my annual rewatch of Bad Santa and again, holy poo poo, I've been watching this movie for 18 years, I saw it twice in the theater, and it always surprises me.

Inside the cursing, and the sex, and the violence, and the cynicism, there's more heart than almost any other Christmas movie out there. It's about the people you love and loving them and how much you love them. What more could you want from a Christmas movie?

Also the one Bernie Mac/John Ritter scene is so sad.

Gaz2k21
Sep 1, 2006

MEGALA---WHO??!!??
There’s a newish Christmas movie out called 8-bit Christmas it seemed like it should be my jam and I was hoping for a lesser Jingle all the way but instead got anti video game propaganda


Okay maybe that’s a bit strong but it succcccked

Mourning Due
Oct 11, 2004

*~ missin u ~*
:canada:
Two of our absolute favourites that I haven't seen mentioned yet:

The Shop Around the Corner

An amazing film about strangers in love. I prefer it to It's A Wonderful Life in terms of Jimmy Stewart Christmas films, and it's vastly superior to You've Got Mail (which is based on it). I love not just the relationship that blossoms, but all the little friendships and dynamics between all of the shop workers. A charming Christmas jaunt.

The Blue Carbuncle

An episode rather than a movie: Jeremy Brett's Sherlock Holmes, trying to get an innocent man released from prison after a jewel heist. He's the best ever Sherlock, and him running around London at Christmas solving a crime gives a wonderful festive feel.

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer

Twin Cinema posted:

I also agree the new Home Alone is bad. The first one establishes Kevin as a spoiled brat, but it also gets you to sympathize with him. When he says he wants his family to disappear, it makes sense. When he realizes he wants his family back, his growth feels natural. He becomes more independent, and in becoming so, starts to become less of a child. Part of this feels natural because the entire film mostly focuses on Kevin.

In the new film, the focuses shifts more towards the duo trying to rob new-Kevin, and instead of being sleazy criminals, they are parents trying to keep their house (which, makes the violence at the end feel a lot less fun). So, since the film spends less time with new-Kevin, everything feels rushed, and it feels like things happening because they have to happen. The busy family scene at the beginning is reduced to what feels like a few minutes, before new-Kevin retires to his family's brand new BMW in the garage.

I feel like this film started with the idea of "what if Kevin was the villain?" because the film doesn't make sense to me otherwise. And, that could have been fun, but this film seems to only half-heartedly go with this idea.

Is Kevin a spoiled brat, though? In the first film, I don't think he is. (Second film, yeah, probably.)

He gets in trouble because Buzz sucks and his parents are negligent and his cousins are rude.

Kevin is eight years old. The first argument of the film is everyone yelling at him to pack his bag. What reasonable parent is going to let their 8 year old pack a suitcase for an international flight? At most he should pack a backpack for like books and games to entertain him. I don't know for sure how long they were planning to be in Paris. A week? You're telling me it's responsible for a parent to let their eight year old child pack for a trip like that without any help?

Next, Kevin complains because he has to sleep in the attic with his cousin who pisses the bed if he drinks liquids at night, the night before a flight in which they have to leave early in the morning. If your child doesn't want to share a bed with someone for a reason as specific as "I don't want to get covered in piss", and the piss-child's parents are irresponsible enough to let him chug Pepsi at night fully knowing the consequences, then guess what? Listen to your child. Let him sleep in your bed with you, or find a new arrangement. A part of parenting is listening to and respecting your kids boundaries, and forcing your child into sleeping in a bed with someone else's piss is absolutely not doing that.

Then there's the pizza thing. Kevin only wants to eat cheese pizza. If you're ordering food for the family, and you know your child is a picky eater about specific things, just take thirty seconds to grab two slices of pie he likes so he can eat. Buzz knows this, took the cheese pizza, ate it disgustingly, then taunted Kevin for the knowing power-move he's committed. He pretends to projectile vomit pizza in Kevin's face! Kevin reacted with anger because he's been hosed with ALL NIGHT at that point. Of course he attacks Buzz with anger, tackling him. Communication does not work in this family, so the 8 year old child turns to violence because he literally isn't having his needs heard or met by his family, and Buzz is bullying him even further. (I also think Kevin is justified in punching Buzz in the sequel.) Buzz is genuinely an awful kid, and as often as fans joke about Kevin being a psychopath, Buzz shows a complete lack of empathy, manipulation, cruelty, and only shows a positive action--complimenting Kevin for "not blowing up the house" (backhanded as gently caress)--because everyone else is being nice to Kevin. He's blending in.

Then Kevin's mom forces Kevin to go to bed, in trouble, without food. This is an antiquated and terrible parenting tactic that really only breeds resentment. It's a power move of withholding that punishes a child physically, emotionally and psychologically when they are at a point where their growing body needs food more than any other time in their life.

Kevin absolutely wants his family to disappear, because when his verbally abusive Uncle Frank and his cousins visit, Kevin knows he is either invisible or a target. And it's why Catherine O'Hara is willing to travel so much to get home and find Kevin. It's not just because she forgot him. That's just a culmination of bad parenting for her, not the start. It's her rock bottom, not an isolated incident. A major aspect of the inciting incident--leaving Kevin--is simply that not a single adult double-checked the head count to make sure every child was there. They left it to another child, albeit one of the older ones. Abysmal.

Edit: I think there's a bit of classism to some arguments (not necessarily yours) about Kevin being spoiled. Just because he lives in a big house in a nice neighborhood with affluent parents doesn't mean Kevin has a good upbringing or family life.

Franchescanado fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Dec 16, 2021

Shrecknet
Jan 2, 2005


Timeless Appeal posted:

there is such an obvious Home Alone sequel set-up where you have grown-up Kevin abandoning his widowed mother during Christmas
grown up Kevin John McAllister marries Jill Kramer, takes her last name and then John Kramer has his own movie series :v:

FlavoFibe
Nov 9, 2015

Mourning Due posted:

The Blue Carbuncle

An episode rather than a movie: Jeremy Brett's Sherlock Holmes, trying to get an innocent man released from prison after a jewel heist. He's the best ever Sherlock, and him running around London at Christmas solving a crime gives a wonderful festive feel.

Seconding this, and I'd also recommend the bbc radio play version that I posted about a forever ago. It's got that festive heart with radio play charm. I love the atmosphere.

Thankfully someone uploaded it to soundcloud.

Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.
Yeah Franchescanado's right. Kevin's family sucks rear end but they suck rear end because they have obnoxious relatives with them and the situation is just chaos. The movie does a good job with that except the parents sitting there and letting Buzz quite obviously torment him to his face! To his face!!!!!

Well that and letting your brother call your son "a little jerk". I have a pretty "frank" (read: rude) family in all honestly but if an adult talks like that to a kid we're gonna get into it. Doesn't seem like a thing that would just go past unnoticed.

Timeless Appeal posted:

I brought this pitch up in the trailer thread I think, but I feel like there is such an obvious Home Alone sequel set-up where you have grown-up Kevin abandoning his widowed mother during Christmas and just have like forty minutes of Katherine O'Hara improving while she plays tricks on a couple of thieves. It's right loving there.

I love it!

Franchescanado
Feb 23, 2013

If it wasn't for disappointment
I wouldn't have any appointment

Grimey Drawer

Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

Yeah Franchescanado's right. Kevin's family sucks rear end but they suck rear end because they have obnoxious relatives with them and the situation is just chaos. The movie does a good job with that except the parents sitting there and letting Buzz quite obviously torment him to his face! To his face!!!!!

Well that and letting your brother call your son "a little jerk". I have a pretty "frank" (read: rude) family in all honestly but if an adult talks like that to a kid we're gonna get into it. Doesn't seem like a thing that would just go past unnoticed.

I love it!

I noticed that too. Bare minimum, someone should say "Don't talk to my son that way. I will address it myself." And then address Kevin. Instead, the selfish and horrible uncle calls Kevin a jerk, and they're immediately in agreement. "Yeah Kevin, you ARE a jerk. Now starve in isolation."

Megaman's Jockstrap
Jul 16, 2000

What a horrible thread to have a post.
gently caress yeah that's right! They starve the kid. OF PIZZA! Absolutely devastating when you're eight years old. Buzz should have been forced to use his money to buy him another pizza.

edit: you can tell we're parents because we're sitting here trying to problem solve the fictional problems of Kevin McCallister. heh

Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Dec 16, 2021

Twin Cinema
Jun 1, 2006



Playoffs are no big deal,
don't have a crap attack.
I agree with Franchescanado. I used the word "spoiled brat" because that is how his family sees him, but like I mentioned, the film gets us to sympathize with Kevin. Franch does a good job at explaining all the reasons why.

In the new one, I feel like the film doesn't do a good job at making you sympathize with new-Kevin. Like I said, if it's an attempt at making him the villain, then the film doesn't really do a great job of that, either. It feels half-hearted.

Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!

Fun Shoe
It's just an over the top situation with every possible "lovely family" moment packed into about 5 minutes of screentime. Individually none of them are all that egregious but it all piles on so that it makes perfect sense that Kevin would be tempted to wish away his family. Like, clearly at the end you see that the family aren't complete sociopaths they actually do have affection for Kevin and they're proud of him. The movie needed Kevin to be pushed towards wishing his family away, but not so horribly that he wouldn't later regret it and be happy to see them when they return. So you have this comically relentless series of events at the beginning that make him feel like his family is worse than it really is.

So I wouldn't call Kevin spoiled, but he does have a skewed perception of his family that night because it was just a particularly hellish, chaotic night. I know I've been there with my own family in the past.

Meaty Ore
Dec 17, 2011

My God, it's full of cat pictures!

Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

Buzz should have been forced to use his money to buy him another pizza.

if you think about it, this does happen, in a way.

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine
Overall I love Home Alone but I won't deny that I hate most of the first 15 to 20 minutes or so of the movie due to how much of assholes Kevin's family are in the opening act, rest of the movie is fantastic enough to make up for it though

Timeless Appeal
May 28, 2006
Did anyone else miss the plotbeat that Kevin thought he magically vanished his family as a kid? It's obviously very clearly established, but the movie doesn't really bring it up up that often. I feel like as a kid, I liked staying home alone from school and the family was so lovely, my main ran right pass "I made my family disappear" and just accepted that Kevin was going to roll with his family being gone.

Thanx!

Edit: Also want to give a shoutout again that everyone should watch Mrs. Santa Claus, the movie in which Ms. Claus leads a labor strike and fights for suffrage.

Timeless Appeal fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Dec 17, 2021

STAC Goat
Mar 12, 2008

Watching you sleep.

Butt first, let's
check the feeds.

I'm late to this (but I'm way behind on all my Christmas stuff) but I only think Kevin is a brat in the way all 8 year olds reasonably are. His parents are doing a bad job but they're obviously just trying to put up with their annoying relatives and the chaotic situation to get through this. They're doing that thing adults do. Shutting up and dealing and making the best of it. And they expect Kevin to do the same but of course he's 8 years old so he won't and can't do that. And he's not really "wrong" he's just making things more difficult by not finding his own solutions to the problems the parents can't easily fix like "too many people in the house" and "there's no cheese pizza left" and "Buzz is an rear end in a top hat".

And of course his mom feels like poo poo about all of that when her nightmare happens. Because she's basically a good person and a good mom. She just had a bad day and she'll probably never fully forgive herself for it.

Hedrigall
Mar 27, 2008

by vyelkin
I've been watching a bunch of christmas movies, I'll post about em soon, but I just wanted to say (even though it's not a movie) the Ted Lasso christmas episode (s2e04) is the feel-goodest thing ever, it rules so much :h:

Also I think there was a Ted Lasso stop motion Christmas short released this year, I gotta watch that

Darth TNT
Sep 20, 2013
I watched Home Alone 1 and 2 during Xmas. I haven’t watched either of them in full and with full attention for ages. They’re just those movies that are om tv every year that you see the last bits of.
But I have a 9 year old son who hadn’t seen them yet, so we decided to suffer through them for him.

But drat, those movies are solid. No suffering was had.
The first movie is just a good movie with so many little details. If it wasn’t for the outdated tech, this movie has certainly survived time.
There was some back and forth here about Kevin and the Family’s expectations of an 8 year old.
They do so much in those first scenes to make us feel for Kevin. The way whenever an older person puts him down they cut to his POV.
But at the same time, Kevin isn’t trying to do anything to help either. I don’t know about other kids, but I had my kid help pack whenever we went on a trip. :shrug:
This kind of comes to a head more when he goes to the basement and is scared off by his own fear. But also the way he briefly believes he wished his family gone. He is a bit naive for his age. Not enormously, or alarmingly. Just a little.
The camera POV shifts are also used brilliantly to make Marv and Harry threatening again after slapsticking them around.

There’s basically 2 good morales woven subtly in this movie. With Kevin (and his parents) learning to respect their family.
Learning to overcome fear and respect that everyone has fears. (Kevin’s basement and the old man’s family problems)
It’s all handled quite nicely with Kevin learning as he goes.

One of my favorite details is certainly the way Harry points out when the lights of the houses turn on based on the clock, which we then see again in the background nearing the climax as Kevin runs home to protect his home. The exact time is never said at that point, but the bell tower and those lights in the background tell us it’s nearly time.

The second movie is another solid movie. Less details as far as I could spot. Still nice use of the clown float. Less moralistic then the first. It’s basically the first movie but not set in a house.

And Marv and Harry are fantastic. Especially in the second movie, it feels like the actors were having a good time bungling about.

Amusingly, at the end of the second movie my son pointed out that everything that had happened was Kevin’s own fault for going after the batteries when he didn’t need them at the airport. (Que parent moment to point out listening to mom and dad is a good idea sometimes)

The biggest thing though, Kevin is never portrayed as more than just a normal and technically good kid. That’s important. He’s not dumb and causing damage like say Dennis the Menace.

I’ve never seen any of the more recent films. I vaguely remember seeing part of 3 and being very unimpressed.

These 2 movies come across very much like the accidental sum is larger than the whole.

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EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!
🥷🐢😬



Now watch Deadly Games, the movie John Hughes definitely did not watch before he made Home Alone.

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