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Which House?
Black Eagles
Blue Lions
Golden Deer
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chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



My decisions will be partially based on who you can poach and how much of a pain in the butt it is. Right now, Bernadetta being a gimmee is a big bonus for the Eagles.

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chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Regy Rusty posted:

An axe fighter??? In smash?? Now thats funny

Simon Belmont is a joke to you now?

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012




I think you mean AEUG ace Quattro Bajeena. Wearing a mask like Char for some reason.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Randallteal posted:

That guy's pretty much just useful as a stat backpack for Kamille tbh

Amuro too, but thems the breaks with prepromotes.

Amuro's a bit awkward. His growths are insane, and his class bases are great, but his starting stats outside of his class are mediocre. He's great early on, but the time between his first and second promotion leaves him way less useful for a bit.

But then you get that third tier class, and he's basically able to solo maps.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



I'm going to say the characters helped, in the original writing and in the localization as well as the art. A cast people engage with makes them more likely to recommend a game to friends. And Awakening's success was notable for, well, people recommending it. Where most games (especially RPGs) sell a lot early on then taper off, Awakening sold a lot and kept selling for a long time.

Fates had a more standard pattern, partially since it was piggybacking on Awakening.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Neo_Crimson posted:

lol i completely forgot they turned camus into a char

I guess you can blame that on the misfortune of your birth

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Jerry Manderbilt posted:

https://mobile.twitter.com/FireEmblemJP/status/1147400285431783424

Trainee character? Or guy who goes down with Rhea and Shamia

Also love how he shares his VA with Mikazuki Augus

Hey Byleth, what should I do next? Is this our final? I won't stop until we get there. I can't stop.... Hey, how many should I kill? How many more until we get there? Tell me, Byleth. You'll give full course credits, right? What should I do next? Who should I kill next? What should I destroy next? If I can get an "A", I'll do anything.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



rannum posted:

Echoes & Heroes have generally solid translation work so I'm sticking to my theory that Fates was so uneven because of how much had to be translated at once.


Echoes, like Awakening, was 8-4.

Not saying that Three Houses is anywhere near doomed, the heroes stuff is a positive sign, just noting that Echoes isn't done by the same team as Fates.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Endorph posted:

it seems like hp in general in this game is high. theres a screenshot of level 20 dorothea with 40 hp, and i doubt her hp growth is especially high.

Probably a response to Fates putting HP way, way too low.

Seriously, those were the lowest HP growth rates in the series. In the game that had a staff that cuts HP in half with no way to fix it.

(Fates is a bad game.)

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012




Oh, crap. He IS McGillis.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Zore posted:

I mostly just wanted the stat backpack bit gone. Combo attacks are cool and fun, but Fates doubled down on making the most boring and bad part of Pair Up the mechanically best bit.

It also reduced the thematic elements. In Awakening, pairup was about how your characters were connected to each other. Your army could use it because it was made up of families and friends who would take a bullet for each other, no question. Meanwhile, your enemies weren't able to use the POWER OF FRIENDSHIP, giving you an edge. Not exactly new ground, but a nice way to mix themes and mechanics.

In Fates, meanwhile, any rear end in a top hat can do it, and instead of the strongest pairups being made by leveling both units as far as they go, you do best by insta-promoting and stat backpacking.

Also, Conquest is obsessed with gimmick maps for some reason.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Endorph posted:

Both sides having pair-up could have worked if Nohr and Hoshido were actually equals who were both fighting for people they love. But.

Even then, you'd want to restrict it to important units. It's hard to feel like your units have a unique and important personal bond when any two random ninjas can do all the same things if they happen to wander next to each other.

(In conclusion, Fates is a bad game.)

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Tired Moritz posted:

If Kaiji Tang doesnt voice someone in this game, I will kill God.

It's a JRPG. Even odds you'll kill a god anyway.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Hunt11 posted:

I will not see you insult fem-Morgan like this. She was an adorable god drat menace to society.

She was also probably one of the gods doing the damning.

Still the best Fire Emblem character, and nothing I've seen from three houses has said that's changing.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Looking at reviews, seems some of my worries were well founded. Graphics are bad, UI is messy, and the dialogue doesn't spark like in the 8-4 localized games. (That actually worries me more now, since people who were fine with Fates line by line dialogue are saying this feels stiff).

There seems to be a lot that's interesting too, but it's disappointing if I was right on those.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



So, got the game despite my worries, seeing how everybody's talking about it. So far, it's good!

The Beagles are definitely more likable than anyone in Fates. But to be fair, that's not particularly hard.

Hyper Crab Tank posted:

I'm still pretty early in the game and I ran out of the certification seals real quick, and I'm not sure if the game told me how to get more of them and I spaced out on it or if it's just something that hasn't unlocked yet? It feels weird that half my class are still stuck as nobles/commoners.


You can buy 'em from the shop for 500 each.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Tae posted:

It's specifically students, yes. Poached students still count.

(Mercedes is an adult, technically)

A lot of students are legal adults by month nine. The game even updates ages after birthdays in a nice little touch.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Harrow posted:

The Death Knight, at least on the second encounter, send like he wouldn't be too bad on Casual. You could rush him down at the end of the map with little issue as long as you have something with bonus damage to him.

On Classic, though, I have no idea how you'd ever fight him there unless you're willing to lose units for that Dark Seal. I'm playing Classic so I took one look at that crit chance and immediately choose the other map objective and left him alone.

I used a bunch of gambits to weaken him without getting hit, then had Lysithea nuke him.

Then the next time he showed up, I also had Lysithea nuke him.

She was my number 1 priority for poaching to the Eagles, and I do not even slightly regret it.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Rand Brittain posted:

Cyril has the same funny thing as Hayato did where changing his class immediately inflates his muscles to a size that doesn't suit his character gimmick at all.

Since his Japanese VA is the same as Mikazuki in Gundam IBO, I've been working under the assumption that he's crazy ripped for such a small guy.

Also that I should never turn my back on him.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Taear posted:

I like making her stand and dance

Pixel Byleth can also jump. If you tilt at the same time you can do a running jump.

It makes loading less boring.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



W.T. Fits posted:

Spent most of this past weekend playing the hell out of this since my old computer died. I've been trying to keep up with the thread, but it just moves too goddamn fast for me (and I'm a terrible multitasker).

Playing as Black Eagles, so far I've only poached two students, though I'm planning on going for more now that I know how to do so.

Last I left off, I was about to start the Battle of the Eagle and the Lion, and I had a question: is it worth going for that chest all the way in the back of the map?

It's a killer lance. Nice, but it's not too big a deal.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



MarcusSA posted:

I love Petra she’s amazing and I want to marry her.

Question about battalions though if they all die do you lose all their levels or can you just replenish them with no issue.

Replenish with no issues.

Also, uh... just got to a big Black Eagles moment.

So, basically, I said I wasn't planning to kill the head of the Empire before at least asking her what the hell was going on, and now Rhea's a dragon and trying to kill me.

Got to say, if you want to make Eldie's case for her, you can do a lot worse than resorting to murder when your chosen one gets a little curious if you're the baddies.

Also, I think this is one of the difficulty jumps, because last level expected level 21 units, and this one expects level 25 with no time to grind between. Definitely busting out some relics for this one.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Megasabin posted:

I’m at the beginning of Chapter V and want to recruit Sylvain before the mission so I can get the lance (to give to my Ferdinand who is a stat monster).

I’ve already achieved B support level with him but my reason is still E+ (haven’t touched it). He refused my recruit attempt. Am I essentially screwed in terms of recruiting him before the end of the month?

I guess I could use every professor point on faculty training to get my reason to E and hope that works? Now that I’m B support is there any further point in eating meals/choir/giving him flowers?

Is there any other way to acquire that Lance?

Any boost to the stat as well as any further support points makes picking up a student easier. I've had cases where I couldn't recruit someone, reloaded, gave them a flower or two, and they joined up on the spot. So, you know. It's your call how to handle it. (but you can get the lance later if you want.)

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Evil Canadian posted:

Oh well thank you very much for telling me I had no idea that support actually mattered. Hopefully I have enough time left to get a few I haven't got support ranks with anyone outside my house :shobon:

You should be able to get a few. Just have meals with them and spam gifts like crazy. Lost items also help.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



That's definitely an edge for Edelgard.

Everybody was at the monastery waiting the second Byleth got back. Not even one mission apart.

I guess it's true what they say. Once you commit high treason for someone, you're pretty much committed. Or, to quote Milton, "Devil with devil damned firm concord holds."

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Endorph posted:

heres how you deal with monsters:

gambit open some bit of them

have everyone hit it

done

Stunning them means better loot, though.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



DC Murderverse posted:

Hilda is the queen of getting other people to do her poo poo for her and it's pretty wonderful

Sadly, she couldn't get anyone else to

die for her.

I know I could have spared Claude if Lysithea hadn't nuked him to ashes in one attack, but is there a way to spare her other than just not fighting? Because the way she charged in, the alternatives were hard to see.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Fojar38 posted:

I just realized that the sauna is never used for anything

Well, no-one wants to go in.

There's an iguana in the sauna.

Because the school is secretly run by lizard people.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Drakenel posted:

Not unless you count parking their dumb asses next to each other GBA-era style while you fight in repeatable battles.

Which is a shame, cause their bickering and flailing is charming enough to make me want to poach everyone possible. They are all my stupid war babies and -they need me.-

You can have them sing and eat meals together for a boost in every exploration period. That helps, at least.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



RealFoxy posted:

I'm aware of the split between Black Eagle route, which chapter should I make a hard-save at to minimize playing it more than once.

Just before the February mission. The choice comes at the end of it.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Jerry Manderbilt posted:

Lysithea went through the exact same poo poo Edelgard did but resolves to work as hard as she can and be her best so she make the most of her shortened lifespan, and heck in the Golden Deer route when the time comes to invade the empire she’s raring to get back at the people who destroyed her family

Similar, but not quite the same.

For Lysithea, it's external invaders killing her neighbors with the horrific experiments that shortened her life. Eventually they were driven off, but she's left to carry the weight.

With Edelgard, it's her siblings, and the culprit is her uncle, with her father powerless. A foreign invader is different from the people who were supposed to protect you, and your closest family is different from neighbors.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



TheOneAndOnlyT posted:

Are some non-student characters only recruitable on certain routes? Catherine is queen shitwrecker on my GD run but my wife is playing BE and she's not recruitable. The Recruit option doesn't even show up.

Black Eagles don't let you get anyone who's part of the church until after the big choice, due to Plot Reasons.

If you join the church, you can pick them up in exchange for losing Hubert and El.

You can still get some of the other teachers and staff.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Tired Moritz posted:

Make Hubert a brawler like God intended.

Bluntly, the Black Eagles and what God intended don't really seem to get along that well.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Eimi posted:

Here is how you make Lysithea a goddess. Get Lorenz, ignore him as a unit, just steal his staff from his paralogue and give it to her. She now has range 3 on all her spells and is death incarnate.

As for what people are talking about wrt to Edie's route do you have to beat him with Edie or Byleth or something? I had Ferdie deal the finishing blow and he just died. No choice to spare him or anything. It opened up some neat dialogue, and none of the Deer's actually seemed sad about it. Everyone was just like "Wow he had a clever plan to smoothly integrate the Alliance into the Empire if he lost." Instead of everyone being like dude could've surrendered when it was clear his alliance was crumbling. He had no dog in this fight beyond being independent.


Late game Edel.

As others said, you have to let El or Byleth get the takedown to get a chance to spare him. I went back and redid the map after seeing a lot of people going "Well, gently caress." about Claude dying. The dialog is similar with him alive, but with more "At least he's alive" or "I'm so relieved he didn't die."

Also spared Hilda thanks to Bernie just pinning her to the ground with arrows for the whole fight.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



JBP posted:

I'm not looking forward to doing black eagles. I love the deer and lions and I didn't kill any golden deer this run. gently caress Edelgard! (I'm sure I'll learn to love her plan and I think Hubert is going to be a lot of fun)

I haven't killed any Deer in my Black Eagles run. Don't think I ever will.

Edelgard's reign is harsh, but fair.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Fojar38 posted:

Here's a hot take; she should have loving died rather than serve as their puppet at all. Her individual freedom is not worth embarking on a continent-wide bloodbath in the hopes that maybe if she does enough genocide and conquest her masters will be complacent enough for her to stop them. Even if she succeeds in this wildly unlikely circumstance it does not retroactively undo the horrors that she unleashed willingly by her own hand.

So, it's better to die doing nothing than to actually solve problems?

You keep ignoring that El's view is that the worst things about Fodlan are

1) The immortal god-queen dragon forcing everyone into medieval stasis
2) The evil cult
3) The nobility as a class system in general.

In that order.

Your "plan" is that she should get killed by the evil cult, doing nothing to prevent either them starting a war later or the church's dominance, because then she... forces them to use a different puppet?

Basically, her plan seemed to be trying to fake out the Slithers as her being on their side for the church war so she could moderate them somewhat (cutting into the number of whole villages used for horrific experiments thing) before getting in position to stab them in the back. It's a Yalta Conference deal, where people who hate each other agree they hate someone else more for the moment.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Caidin posted:

I think people in Fodlan just like setting poo poo on fire, Blue Lions route Gilbert of all people essentially tricks you into lighting up like half the loving monastery to give the empire some 3rd degree burns. And also the dudes I had FIGHTING the empire out there...

It's kind of a shame that there's no way to use Amiibo characters, now that you mention it.

Robin would feel right at home.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Viscardus posted:

I think you make some good points here, but I fundamentally disagree with your assessment of Edelgard. She has flaws, of course, and there are certainly valid criticisms to be made about her plans, but I would argue very strongly that she is fundamentally a morally better person than anyone else in the story. If that sounds like an absurd claim, I suspect it's because of a drastic difference in how we think about morality. I'm reminded of Mark Twain's quote about the two "Reigns of Terror"; people are taught to recoil in horror at aggressive violence, but we are likewise taught to be complacent about systemic violence. Unlike everyone else in Fódlan, Edelgard really does see "that unspeakably bitter and awful Terror which none of us has been taught to see in its vastness or pity as it deserves". You act like Edelgard is motivated by her pain, but that's a fundamental difference between her and Dimitri or Rhea. If Edelgard were merely motivated by her pain, she would simply work against Those Who Slither and leave the Church alone. But she is not (primarily) motivated by her pain; more than any other character she is motivated fundamentally by her ideals. She knows that the Church is built on lies and oppression, and that the nobility is the same, and she wants to fix it.

The best way to think of Edelgard, frankly, is as a revolutionary. It's counter-intuitive because she's an emperor, of course, and because on a surface level she evokes aggressive, self-aggrandizing rulers that are so common not only in Fire Emblem games but in fiction more generally. But she does call herself a revolutionary at one point, and that is fundamentally the best metaphor for what she's doing: she is using temporarily violence to end a system of permanent violence. She doesn't care about her own power except insofar as it allows her to fix the world; her greatest desire is to finally have the ability to give it all up and live peacefully. But she is so strongly motivated by her own moral compass that she simply wouldn't be able to live with herself if she did that. And yes, she is willing to sacrifice people along the way for the greater good (although on the Black Eagle route, at least, she is consistently shown as being hyper-aware of the human cost of what she's doing, and never does anything lightly). It's very easy to see any reference to the greater good as an excuse, of course, but personally I think that the attitude that political change should never be remotely violent is a little naive. I don't want to veer too far into real-life politics, so I'll leave it at that, but in the end I feel like anyone who thinks that Edelgard is automatically the bad guy because she started the war should really think about the implications of delegitimizing all political violence.

But of course even then, it depends on agreeing that what Edelgard wants is right. And this is the part I find even more interesting, frankly, because it really gets into the great contradiction at the heart of so much fantasy fiction, not least of all pretty much every previous Fire Emblem game. The fact of the matter is that regardless of what you think of her methods, everyone should be able to agree that Edelgard's goals are far, far better than those of anyone else in the game, because she has a far more modern moral compass than anyone else in the story. In a series built on inherited powers and superior noble bloodlines, she recognizes how awful that is. She sees the absolute horror inherent in feudalism, in state religion, in quasi-eugenic breeding programs. All of these are things that should horrify any decent person in real life, and yet we accept them in stories and games in large part because it's fun to put ourselves in the position of the destined lord or the chosen one or whatever else. And to be clear, that's okay in and of itself, but when confronted with a story that actually challenges those things, it's kind of horrifying to me that so many people think that fighting to preserve all that is morally righteous as long as you're nominally on the defensive. Fundamentally, all of the other routes are fighting to preserve a broken world that none of us would be willing to accept in real life (unless maybe we were lucky enough to be the ones in power - and even then we'd be lovely people for doing so). Sure, all of the other routes nominally end with things improving, and Claude, Dimitri, and even Rhea can turn into decent enough people with Byleth's help. But none of them fix what is fundamentally broken; many of the characters reject nobility and the crest system personally, but only Edelgard is willing to try to destroy it entirely.

I think it's telling that in the other three routes Byleth keeps Sothis's power and ends up as the ruler of Fódlan, the Church, or both. You get to be the big special hero - the most important person in the world - forever. But if you help Edelgard, you are rejecting that. Byleth stops being some destined chosen one and reverts into a regular mortal. You don't rule over anything, even if you marry Edelgard, because she only stays emperor as long as she needs to to complete her goals. You're still a hero, of course, but because of what you do, not who you are. It's honestly amazingly refreshing, and to me it is unambiguously the best ending (even despite feeling like it was cut a bit short).

So yeah, that's basically my take on Edelgard. I genuinely think that she is the morally best person in the game, and for that matter she's probably one of my favourite video game characters ever (for more reasons than just that, of course, though a large part of it is how much it makes her stand out).



I think this covers, in addition to other matters, why the comparison earlier felt unfair.


Like McGillis, Edelgard wants to destroy the system she feels made her childhood a living hell. But unlike McGillis, she actually noted Rustal's observation that there was no value in challenging a system while deriving legitimacy entirely from the system.

McGillis, ultimately, was motivated by a personal vendetta. He wanted to make sure no-one would hurt him any more, so he tried to rewrite the system to be king of the mountain forever.

El, meanwhile, tosses her power aside at the first chance she gets, and delays hunting her personal demons because she believes the system in general (the one that could be working for her) is worse.

Also, unlike McGillis, on her route she actually has someone she trusts as an equal.

chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Rand Brittain posted:

Do any of the routes involve Cyril becoming disillusioned with Rhea? Because man, she is really not worthy of the level of obsessive devotion he shows her.

I'm more disappointed he never one-handed chokeholds her and demands that she gives him more people to kill.

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chiasaur11
Oct 22, 2012



Eimi posted:

AAAAH FINALLY BEAT IT. That level was a loving step above everything else in difficulty. Such a loving amazing game....the only bad thing was that somehow Ferdie got more affection with Dorothea than Marienne ruining my perfectly planned shipping!!!!

Please tell me Ferdie and Marienne have a paired ending and I just hosed up because Dorothea's huge rain gives support points out the rear end with everyone. But in NG+ should be MUCH easier to engineer proper paired endings with all the lunches you give out.

I just finished too. Got all the pairings I meant to get, even if I swerved to pair up Hubert and Shamir when Ferdie and Bernie seemed to work better.

Managed to finish Seiros off before any of her troops could arrive. First turn was spent nuking down her shields and doing damage. Turn 2 was finishing her off.

Hubert actually got the final blow after El detonated a cart full of explosives in her face. Felt more fitting than ending things with divinely empowered superweapons.

Ending cutscene was good, even if the last CG was wonky, and Byleth and El's S rank was sweet. Still, I prefer how Awakening handled S ranks in terms of timing. Characters being able to hook up in the middle of the game meant that you could have time seeing them just being together instead of just kissing before the end credits.

Honestly, given the horror stories I'd heard about the last two missions, I expected even worse. Cyril was a dodge machine, pegasus attacked from everywhere, and Rhea was a big wall of HP, sure, but I got through with a decent number of pulse charges left.

Oh, and it's nice that Edelgard offered a chance at surrender and confirmed that the dragon god was in total rear end in a top hat mode before killing everyone. With Byleth around, she's really keeping those evil overlord impulses in check. Good for her!

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