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https://twitter.com/kenvogel/status/1176928995671257100?s=20
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Sep 25, 2019 20:19
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Ukraine president thought only U.S. side of Trump call would be published
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Sep 25, 2019 21:50
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we're just a big rotting albatross around the neck of that whole country
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Sep 25, 2019 21:54
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Comedic actor, to president, to a crucial part of a scandal in the world's most powerful country. Pretty wild.
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Sep 25, 2019 21:55
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More like Mekraine
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Sep 25, 2019 21:58
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the ukraine state university
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Sep 25, 2019 22:05
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laffo https://twitter.com/Reuters/status/1176966519751938049?s=20
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Sep 25, 2019 22:22
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You sweet summer child
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Sep 26, 2019 01:04
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Zelenskiy is amazing
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Sep 26, 2019 02:47
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Third World Reagan posted:Zelenskiy is amazing as an actor, he's ok https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZgvkmRAOj6c he is absolutely not a good rapper tho https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HjLk0wi5WrA
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Sep 26, 2019 05:02
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curb your enthusiasm rear end poo poo right here lol
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Sep 26, 2019 05:06
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ag1o3koTLWM e: need to read all posts befor eposting lol
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Sep 26, 2019 13:37
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https://twitter.com/LisaMei62/status/1176927143022026752?s=20 I'm guessing Q-heads believe this now because Trump asked Zelensky to investigate Crowd Strike. Plus Boomers think missing emails have to be somewhere and that they weren't just deleted.
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Sep 26, 2019 16:35
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https://twitter.com/saletan/status/1177766356990779392
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Sep 28, 2019 03:17
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https://twitter.com/akihheikkinen/status/1179085208802476033
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Oct 2, 2019 07:02
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https://twitter.com/JonahFisherBBC/status/1179005180777582592?s=19
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Oct 2, 2019 10:20
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At least he's pushing back against Trump's bullshit: "I had a meeting at the Pentagon with lots of generals. They were like from a movie. Better looking than Tom Cruise, and stronger. "
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Oct 2, 2019 11:22
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On one hand, I think some level of dialogue is good. But on the other hand, it's impossible to make any kind of good faith agreement with the Russians unless you are coming from a position of strength (which doesn't apply to Ukraine as things stand today). Russia is an authoritarian oligarch state where the majority of the population are hardcore chauvinists who don't care about anything; this requires a specific approach. Poll: Almost 70% of Ukrainians consider Russia to be aggressor Pretty embarrassing that only 40% in Eastern Ukraine recognize that the Russians are enemies. It's almost ironic considering they ruined the two main Russian-language regions under the pretext of "protecting Russian speakers."
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Oct 2, 2019 17:01
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i always heard cruise was a manlet so zelensky must be around danny devito stature
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Oct 2, 2019 17:27
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skeletors_condom posted:Russia is an authoritarian oligarch state where the majority of the population are hardcore chauvinists who don't care about anything; this requires a specific approach. Gonna need a source on your race science op
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Oct 2, 2019 17:32
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Frijolero posted:Gonna need a source on your race science op Race science? Since when is "Russian" a race? Perhaps the "don't care about anything" bit was a bit harsh, but there is some truth to that. IMO, it's pretty obvious that it's an authoritarian, oligarch state. You can look through multiple polls from Levada Centre (I would recommend using the main Russian site, not the english one): https://www.levada.ru/2019/04/01/prisoedinenie-kryma/ 86% of Russians support the annexation of Crimea. 65% believe that invading foreign countries (in this case Crimea) is good for Russia. https://www.levada.ru/2019/09/18/monitoring-ksenofobskih-nastroenij-2/ Full 48% of Russians support the phrase “Россия только для русских.” And this even though technically Russia is a multi-ethnic federation. https://www.levada.ru/cp/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/5.jpeg 88% of Russians functionally believe that imperialism is good (I am willing to discuss alternative interpretations of "виликая держава," but I would argue they are not referring to human rights or political pluralism). quote:A record 70 percent of Russians approve of Soviet leader Josef Stalin’s role in Russian history, according to a poll published by the independent Levada Center pollster on Tuesday. https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2019/04/16/stalins-approval-rating-among-russians-hits-record-high-poll-a65245 I believe Stalin killed more Russians than Hitler (or it was pretty close). I am definitely biased, but the attempt to pitch my views as being motivated by racial hatred are just plain ignorant. skeletors_condom has issued a correction as of 18:07 on Oct 2, 2019 |
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Oct 2, 2019 18:04
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man this is bringing me back to Balkan’s discussions in the 90s
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Oct 2, 2019 18:30
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CharlestheHammer posted:man this is bringing me back to Balkan’s discussions in the 90s
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Oct 2, 2019 18:34
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get that OUT of my face posted:lol you're old I post on SA, so yeah
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Oct 2, 2019 18:35
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skeletors_condom posted:Race science? Since when is "Russian" a race? Perhaps the "don't care about anything" bit was a bit harsh, but there is some truth to that. IMO, it's pretty obvious that it's an authoritarian, oligarch state. While I'm happy to hear that Russians still respect Stalin, I don't think basing your opinions on a whole populace from one poll is a good idea op.
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Oct 2, 2019 18:37
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is it ukrane or the ukrane
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Oct 2, 2019 18:41
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skeletors_condom posted:Perhaps the "don't care about anything" bit was a bit harsh, but there is some truth to that. IMO, it's pretty obvious that it's an authoritarian, oligarch state.
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Oct 2, 2019 18:49
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Frijolero posted:While I'm happy to hear that Russians still respect Stalin, I don't think basing your opinions on a whole populace from one poll is a good idea op. It's not one poll. They are all different polls and the source pages provide data over time (including ~20 years back for some polls). I did reference only one polling agency, but there is a reason for that. It's one of the only independent, national agencies in Russia (but they've still been prosecuted). https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Levada_Center The funny thing is, I would be willing to bet decent $$$ that state polling agencies would show a very similar picture (if anything the approval of chauvinism would be higher). I would genuinely be interested in learning about other high-quality polling sources. I am open to criticism, but if you want to call me a "race science fan," I think you should explain your position and not just call people names. CharlestheHammer posted:man this is bringing me back to Balkan’s discussions in the 90s There are indeed some similarities.
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Oct 2, 2019 18:56
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Btw, Putin's approval rating is hovering around 30%, so maybe things are a little more complicated than they seem. Also, I have been living in Moscow for years. It isn't that nationalism doesn't exist in Russia...but it just isn't some special Russian attribute. If anything Ukraine and Russia are very similar but just working from different directions. Ardennes has issued a correction as of 19:02 on Oct 2, 2019 |
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Oct 2, 2019 18:57
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hmmquote:The Levada-Center is included in the list of independent analytical centers of Europe published by Freedom House. In collaboration with the Levada-Center, Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty weekly broadcasts the show Public Opinion (Общественное мнение: граждане России у микрофона Радио Свобода).[23] sounds extremely independant to me.
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Oct 2, 2019 19:00
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skeletors_condom posted:
Saying that Russians are evil and treacherous and that they cannot be negotiated with because "they only know strength" is fascist language. Maybe don't say stupid poo poo?
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Oct 2, 2019 19:02
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Ardennes posted:Btw, Putin's approval rating is hovering around 30%, so maybe things are a little more complicated than they seem. If you're referring to general approval ratings, that's incorrect. The latest approval rating is 67%: https://www.levada.ru/indikatory/ It has never been below 60% (dark blue line "Одобрение деятельности Владимира Путина") since he came to power. VCOIM (state run pollster) has him at 72.5% in the latest poll: https://wciom.ru/news/ratings/doverie_politikam_1/ Frijolero posted:Saying that Russians are evil and treacherous and that they cannot be negotiated with because "they only know strength" is fascist language. Maybe don't say stupid poo poo? I never said they are evil. I said the majority of Russians are chauvinist. skeletors_condom has issued a correction as of 19:15 on Oct 2, 2019 |
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Oct 2, 2019 19:08
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Btw, the state pollster came out with a result around 30% and literally had to redact it after the administration came after them. His approval is probably around 20-25% in reality. As for “chauvinism” , really how is that different than any other part of Eastern Europe? It isn’t that nationalism or xenophobia doesn’t exist in Russia...it just isn’t special. Look at Hungary or Poland for other examples. Also political polling is usually pretty poor at capturing broad social viewpoints due to phrasing.
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Oct 2, 2019 19:25
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yeah, 73% approval rating doesn't square with the way that putin had to ban parties from the moscow local elections, just to maintain a very slim majority for his party there.
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Oct 2, 2019 19:34
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Ardennes posted:Btw, the state pollster came out with a result around 30% and literally had to redact it after the administration came after them. His approval is probably around 20-25% in reality. I don't think it's fair to reflexively dismiss polling if you can't come up with a non-subjective alternative analysis. Let's say everyone is concerned about saying the right thing when discussing their opinion on Putin. That's a fair point (although somewhat of a cop out IMHO). So does this principle apply when polls ask about the role of Stalin in Russia? Surely attitudes towards Stalin is a less "sensitive" polling question? No? I don't mean to imply that nationalism is limited to Russia. However Russia is unique in that its population is unusually supportive of violence and invasions of its neighbours. Currently they are occupying two regions in Georgia (Abkhazia, South Ossetia), three in Ukraine (Crimea, Lugansk, Donetsk) and one in Moldova (Transnistria). They also murdered 50,000 civilians during the First Chechen war (~5% of the population at that time). You don't really see Poland or Hungary doing this sort of stuff do you? Another poster criticized me for suggesting that dialogue with Russia is only possible when you come from a position of force. If that's not the case, why hasn't the Transnistria conflict been resolved? It's been almost 30 years, surely Russia would put in a good faith effort to resolve it, no?
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Oct 2, 2019 20:01
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skeletors_condom posted:You don't really see Poland or Hungary doing this sort of stuff do you?
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Oct 2, 2019 20:12
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skeletors_condom posted:I don't think it's fair to reflexively dismiss polling if you can't come up with a non-subjective alternative analysis. As far as Russian polling goes it is.::.it is very unreliable and hardly good evidence except it a broad sense. On Stalin, his renewed popularity is for a mix of reasons including fond memories of the stability of the Soviet period. He is more popular than he was but it isn’t necessarily about “chauvinism.” As for the rest, that seems more of a legacy of the break up of the Soviet Union than really a social or cultural issue. I mean you could easily use the same methodology against Americans or any large historical state. Hungary especially would probably try something if they could but the EU and NATO made they impossible. Yeah so...no. Ardennes has issued a correction as of 20:33 on Oct 2, 2019 |
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Oct 2, 2019 20:27
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get that OUT of my face posted:not only do these two countries not have the means to engage in irredentist politics, they have everything to lose by doing so. they're EU members and they're not about to give up all the money that gives them This doesn't change the fact that they are not currently occupying 7 regions and they weren't involved in a war where they murdered 5% of the local civilian population. I said Russians are highly chauvinistic. I gave some polling numbers including 48% support for the phrase "Russia for ethnic Russians only!" [*] Turns out all polls are wrong. I then listed all the places they invaded in the past 30 years and mentioned how they murdered 50,000 Chechens (people who they believe are their fellow co-nationals). That also seems to be not a sign of inherent chauvinism as per the posters in this thread. So what is chauvinism then? * Note that even if we go by Ardennes's "All polls are wrong!" theory, that particular question also had the option to say "I am not interested" or "I don't know." Ardennes posted:
Bingo! OK, now it all makes sense. Invading and killing people is OK cuz "reasons." My bad for attempting a good faith discussion. skeletors_condom has issued a correction as of 20:44 on Oct 2, 2019 |
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Oct 2, 2019 20:42
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Friends, we found him. The purpose of the thread is complete. We found the idiot. e: It's obviously me! Not anybody else in here!
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Oct 2, 2019 20:47
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skeletors_condom posted:Bingo! OK, now it all makes sense. Invading and killing people is OK cuz "reasons." My bad for attempting a good faith discussion.
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Oct 2, 2019 21:12
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