Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Nooo I was trying to finish this one up before the old thread closed, now this is gonna look silly. :(

Kobolds Ate My Baby!: Part X - Mayor's Section & Wrap-Up



To be totally honest, I probably should have just made the last post a little longer and wrapped up the review there; while there is a solid chunk of book left, most of it is just charts and tables.

Being the Mayor

There is a GM advice section, which boils down to "if there is a chance of failure, assign a difficulty and a stat and start handing out KHDCs liberally if your players get sassy about it". Following that is a nice little section for making a town your kobolds will be causing a ruckus in, complete with lots of charts for a random town name, such as...

6, 3, 5 posted:

New Smallshire
or

4, 6, 6 posted:

South Crackerham
and populating it with buildings and inhabitants, which is fun.



Finishing out the book, we have the "monster manual" - which is just stats for various townsfolk and animals, as well as the VP for defeating them. Notably, the shitfarmer mentioned much earlier in-thread as being about on-par with the strongest possible starting kobold is worth 2 VP, which is the same as most townies or a chicken. Sheep and Baby are tied for lowest at 0 VP, as neither of them take any kind of offensive action. Blacksmith and Soldier are tied for highest at 6 VP; while the Soldier has Duel! (but obviously doesn't take KHDCs, what with not being a kobold), special attention should be drawn to the Blacksmith's 4 DAM hammer and 12 Brawn that can combine to easily paste a tiny dog-person. Also of note, the 4 VP dolphin, which is on these charts for some reason.

Horrible Kobold Deaths

The last section of the book covers the results of all those KHDCs that have been piling up; it begins by repeating the rules for KHDC checks, as well as the myriad ways to accumulate them. Following are five/six themed charts based on where your kobold was and what it was doing, as well as two Baby Horrible Death charts that apply to the "Baby Negligence" house rule mentioned last post. Not all of the Kobold Horrible Deaths actually result in guaranteed death; a number of them only inflict -Bogeys on the kobold who triggered it, bring an adversarial creature or group of creatures into play, or do technically-survivable amounts of damage. Surviving a Kobold Horrible Death doesn't wipe the KHDCs from the kobold's character sheet, of course - they just got lucky, this time.



So, How Does KAMB: In Color!!! Stack Up?

All in all, I'd say In Color!!! is the "best" version of the game, but not by a whole lot. In production value, for sure - the Kovalic art and color-coded charts make everything look a lot nicer (which is part of why I've been putting so many pictures into these reviews). In game mechanics? Eh, more of a lateral move. The Outfits have been improved for sure (although the new ones don't stack up, going right back to 1e territory for whatever reason) and the spells have been tightened up (and had their names modernized). The changes to the equipment charts to incorporate skills and Dangerous! charts have added more options to gameplay, but have definitely made character creation into a more complicated process. Which, when horrible deaths are a feature rather than a bug, is far from ideal - you want kobold creation to be like people who never played it imagine OD&D character creation was like, rolling down the line and having a new character in 90 seconds tops.

Which brings us to the end of our review. I started this due to my rekindled appreciation for this silly "beer & pretzels" game, and I've come out the other side a bit more cynical after looking critically, but also a bit more appreciative of In Color!!!'s general cleanup and modernization in a couple places - enough that I ordered a couple pads of character sheets and plan to run it again, for the first time in a decade or so.

Next Time: Another book! There are two "major" supplements or the In Color!!! edition I'd like to put a spotlight on, and after that I was thinking of taking a bit of a retrospective tour through the line, covering the highlights (and much more frequent lowlights) of past editions. Which is mostly adventures, which are mostly bad parodies that you're expected to subject your gaming group to for some reason.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Hostile V posted:

So wizard money is minted by Bitcoin-mining child slaves.
Okay, are we sure Monte Cook's Magical Realm isn't "subjecting people to ideas so terrible they have an aneurysm"?

People paid $300 and up for this. Actual real-life money that could have gone anywhere else.

I'm sad now. :sigh:

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
So, I let myself get waaay behind on this thread while staring in mute glassy-eyed horror at the hellscape of 2020. When I finally started scrolling through again, I noticed a few topics coming up consistently (besides “Age of Sigmar”). Of course, now hundreds of pages behind, I wanted to scan through and make sure I wasn’t beaten to it, mentally kicking myself about all the things I couldn’t reply to without necroposting. Here, I saved a more recent one, specifically for this purpose:

TheGreatEvilKing posted:

Dammit! I bought it for $50 at the local game store, then googled the price. They got me! Wizards, I mean, I'd support the Dice Dojo again in a heartbeat.
Hell yeah, fellow Dice Dojo enjoyer!

Anyway. This has all been intended as a preamble to keep my next post as a more on-topic review of:

That time I played

at GenCon 2019!


For whatever stupid reason, I've kinda liked CthulhuTech from back in the days of Ettin's reviews. Enough to own all the books, do a review of my own on a side-book after Ettin stopped covering them, and to run a game of my own (houseruled all to gently caress, of course, because that system was busted).

But hey! GenCon 2019! I was there, playing games, spending way too much money, personally disappointing Grant Howitt by not actually being a Japanese pop duo, all the things you'd expect. And during reservation, I saw two CthulhuTech games on the docket - the one hour Lightning Mission (which I got into), and the more involved Shadow War (which I did not, although I tried). Never having given V2 much of a look other than "oh tagers are customizable now, neat" but figuring it would be a quickstart, I signed up - and then, due to a weird timing thing, I was early. Early enough that I was the only player there, and the ST let me look over a huge printed binder while we waited, all typeset and full of art assets and neat things. This review is based on my memories of that, and this, which came out in all its "Zoom call where one guy has the other on speaker" glory as I noodling this review over in my head.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
That time I played

at GenCon 2019!


To address the biggest gripe I saw about the game whenever it came up in this thread, the playtest and binder I got a chance to look at heavily addressed the "where are my cool Mythos racial options" issue. The character I selected was a Widow tager (because I remembered it being busted in 1e), which turned out to be a ghoul. Well, a "high ghoul", which seemed to hit the "half-orc" sort of point in ghoul society - I was prettier and smarter than most ghouls, so I was the one sent up as an envoy. I had a few character abilities based on having a big network of ghoul allies, which I tried to use in the adventure but wasn't able to do much with (as it was about infiltrating a Chrysalis Corp facility).

I remember also seeing a Deep One Hybrid race, which I recall being more "you haven't gone full fish yet" but according to the interview has been turned into the "waveborn" who had the hybridization process go wrong - disappointing, IMO.

There was also at least one other race I remember, something more alien, and the interview mentioned above noted seven "Stranger Races" including Cats of Ulthar (gently caress yeah!) and a redesigned Nazzadi whose flesh tones are tinged by "local minerals" near the clone vats and I can’t think of anything besides Crystal Gems now :confuoot:

Anyway, remember how I mentioned picking the Widow because it was busted in 1e? My god was that still true - I spent the hour skittering on walls and ceilings, one-shotting everything I attacked as the rest of the party struggled. Which is a good time to go over basic rules; the "poker dice" of 1e has given way to a very basic system of "roll whatever you want and count the evens", aka "flip a coin". I had hoped that was just for the convention, but apparently that is the system going forward. :sigh:

More interesting bits digging into the system included a "party leader" role (I was chosen due to familiarity with the setting) who gets to assign initiative order and suggest strategy, and a system of aggro I can't quite remember but was definitely game-able (one of the tagers was very much a tank, not able to do much damage but able to draw aggro and absorb damage much better than the rest of us). There was also some sort of "degrees of success" in the combat a la PBtA, and most attacks ended up with an exchange of blows where both sides took a hit.

That's about it, mechanically - like I said, this was a one-hour game, from back in 2019, so even though I got to flip through the book for a bit it's not at the forefront of my mind. There are a few more details from that interview, at least:

The dreamlands are back! No specifics given.

Tager sorcery is explicitly gone, which is both "boo!" because one of my PCs played a John Constantine type (with much houserule intervention) and because "no access to magical energy" was supposed to be the one drawback of the stronger tagers in 1e.

No one has any clue how to pronounce tager; even the dev pronounced in three different ways. Tagger, Tay grrr, Tuh gay-er. :eng99:

That’s...kinda it, unfortunately. The rules binder surprised me in its thoroughness when the devs have been neglectfully quiet - the social media presence is almost nil, the Wildfire site looks abandoned, and that interview I linked is the only one I’ve seen in years.

Will I get the new edition of the game? Yeah, probably - I’ve backed worse Kickstarters. But will I even know they’re running one in time? Maybe not.

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Apr 8, 2021

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Leraika posted:

So, uh, to dance around the subject some, are the reasons a lot of people would be unwilling to play Ctech that aren't the extremely poor mechanical decisions still an issue? It sounds like you had some access to setting stuff.
If you mean the over-the-top grimdark, signs point to that not being an issue as bad - the last setting book to come out for 1e was overall hopeful, and the devs’ tone is more the right side of that nihilism meme where “Nothing Matters” is now a sweet 90s skateboard kid.

If you mean the “stop having fun” stance the devs took, frequently, that is also looking better - opening play up to things other than humans and drow, wearing the anime influences more openly instead of fighting back on teenage mech pilots so hard; it remains to be seen, but I think explicitly pulling apart the different tiers of play will help.

If you mean all the bad sex stuff? Uh, gently caress. I don’t know on that one; the presence of player-side Deep One hybrids makes me hopeful, but I’ve got nothing to go on as far as the “lolbertarian sex fantasy” and “rape everywhere” aspects of 1e are concerned. The dev interview mentioned rewriting at lot of the setting that’s cringeworthy in retrospect, hopefully they meant more than just renaming “race” to “ancestry”.

[Edit to clarify: there was definitely a “let’s come together, because there’s way worse poo poo out there” vibe coming across from all the different ancestries - which I am well aware could go either way, depending on how much detail and “making HARD CHOICES” they go into. :sigh:]

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 00:48 on Apr 9, 2021

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
I know I’m just some random rear end in a top hat on the internet, and TBF the only amount of Warhammer I knew before this thread was “Dark Heresy, but got bored of the setting section real quick and just kinda ran Judge Dredd in space”. With that level of unfamiliarity in mind, reading about Fantasy in this thread has been like reuniting with your old college group, yeah some of it you don’t remember and a lot of it’s dumb but it’s FUN. Reading about AoS, to me, is looking at a wiki of someone’s homebrew of D&D based of 40k; if I really tried I could figure out what all the proper nouns were and glean what the campaigns were, but why would I want to

Is it weird that my main takeaway from this book so far as been “huh, I guess I do want to see an otherwise-normal fantasy RPG that accidentally hired nothing but furry artists”? Like, give me something completely clean and polished, yet still as uncomfortably horny as RPG art and furry artists trying to keep SFW. This book isn’t trying hard enough!

There are probably more guaranteed heartbreakers than “it’s D&D, with superheroes!” but I’m blanking right now on what they’d be.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Josef bugman posted:

I'm a big fan of "someone else collating someones notes with marginalia pointing out problems/ differences" alongside "Collection of different accounts and trying to work out which one is the most accurate"
Some of the old White Wolf books were like 95% “one NPC’s inconsistent and contradictory report + catty commentary from other NPCs all sniping at each other”, 5% game book, 0% index

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Libertad! posted:

The Edgecutioner
There has got to be a better way to get across, both in spelling and description, the idea of a educator + executioner.

Now I’m inspired to create some kind of Lawful Neutral Ms. Frizzle, stalking the multiverse with a bloody greataxe

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Libertad! posted:

And here I thought it was meant to be an edgy executioner.
You’re probably right, but the idea of asking questions -> murder has still led me down the line of some sort of “How many layers of Utilitarianism are you on? You are a little baby, watch this” race of extraplanar weirdos

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Everything about The Scoundrel sounds like being the worst kind of player, but in the best way. :allears:

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

JcDent posted:

Oh poo poo, I'm ready to play a giant angry cyborg just crushing my way through everything.

The hero is cool too, who doesn't want to be a Firebrand AND lead from the front?

And of course, this would be extremely thematically unfitting, but it would probably be a better IG Kill Team experience than Only War.
I can’t tell if I’d rather play the Final Fantasy hack of Spire as Teen Titans or Josie & the Pussycats; tabletop roleplaying is a hot gay mess and I’m here for it.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

JcDent posted:

E: the only downside to Our Stormy Present is that you can't play WFRP with it as anything other than the Empire is not really worth the name, and I don't want to fight the Empire.

The airship can just be a one-off invention of an annoying dwarf :v:
I started writing a post about combining all my ideas with this one and being a plucky combo of humans and non-humans fighting Imperialism and demonic invasion with the POWER OF SONG

...then I realized, poo poo, did I invent Macross again?

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

MonsterEnvy posted:

It has no reason to exist.

God now I am reminded of that horror story, were a convention GM decided to just have everyone’s characters get forced into a satyr orgy.
A CthulhuTech “this is the default adventure path for your guyver PCs for some reason” satyr orgy, or a Changeling: The Dreaming “if you’re very lucky these characters are post-pubescent” satyr orgy?

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Libertad! posted:

He likes it more than I do, but a YouTuber did an in-depth review of Monsters of Murka.

He's not showing the whole book, but he opens up the book in a 2-page format to show off a lot of the stuff. Figured it'd be appropriate to post here.

For those not in the know, it's a rather cringy political satire of a D&D fantasy setting riffing hard off of modern US culture.
I backed the KS of their monster book knowing nothing about the setting, and their updates have been...something.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
I let myself get a month behind on this thread and I miss Ettin coming back (thanks for somehow convincing me to buy CthulhuTech years ago and start writing F&F reviews, senpai!) and also catch up after this review is finished:

Lemony posted:


Ninja Burger: The Role Playing Game
I'm not about to defend this RPG, it's worse than I remembered as well! HOWEVER, played in the best appropriate context of "it's 1am, at Waffle House, in the early 2000s, and the nerds you met at the anime club also like TTRPGs and want to play something like KAMB! but more meme-ey"...it was a blast. Most of it was yelling things in Engrish, referencing movies we'd just seen, and then switching to a more "serious" game of L5R (which is a whole other kettle of worms), TB as F as I can be to that game. It probably also would have been as much or more fun to play anything else, with that crew!

Also:

wdarkk posted:

Has the other BEER engine game, Kobolds Ate My Baby, been reviewed?
That was me! I did that!
Actually, I started catching back up to this thread because I finally got my hands on some other stuff I want to review, but that's for later.

Wapole Languray posted:


I started reading about this book in the morning, and I've had diarrhea all day. Coincidence? CLEARLY NOT.

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 15:10 on Nov 11, 2021

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Mors Rattus posted:

I suspect mostly because the authors angrily insist it cannot be done and then have NPCs that do it.
In the very first adventure in the core book, right?

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Ettin posted:

CthulhuTech is anime inspired and if there's one thing anime fans love it's childrcombining cool concepts.
I really have missed you talking CthulhuTech :allears:

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Covermeinsunshine posted:

They could have go for "Humanity needs to embrace the eldrith to become on par with other races, but it will likely lose itself in the process". I mean, I can play tentacled transhuman punching space fungus. What I can't enjoy when someone tells me to participate in rape-on-rails adventure and read bad metaplot.
This is kinda where the line of metaplot books was going? It’s hard to say for sure, they barely got the 2nd (“of 6”) out before going quiet for all these years, but the second book was heavy on humanity striking back in ways that’d have wider implications no one had the time/space to think through in-universe.

Covermeinsunshine posted:

You could spin it as ancient alien migou being just a bunch of grumpy old people who can't deal with the idea of uppity monkeys being space power so will keep trying to own the libs I mean humans even as climate change I mean chtulhu is going to eat everyone
This is literally the answer the gameline provides, the migou stopped paying attention to us backwards Earthers long enough for us to build tech better than theirs, which gave the migou a species-wide Boomer grievance. Everything from then on has been viewed through the lens of “humans, hate ‘em” so even as circumstances change they can’t move on.

Also some of them are Nyarlathotep/Hastur cultists that team up with humans regularly, gotta have that Legion of Doom teamup :shrug:

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Honestly, it’s baffling to me that it took CthulhuTech - a game that leads with its anime - until whenever it is the new edition actually comes out to embrace a “Chinaman on the moon” view of humanity in the face of Lovecraftian alien gods.

Do you know how many anime have “monsters are better waifupeople than humans, who are the REAL monsters” as their central thesis

[Edit: I think I was watching 3 of them last season alone]

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Fivemarks posted:

Okay you joke but this is basically just Demonbane (don't watch it, its bad)
Anything that has Dr. Herbert West, Reanimator, piloting a giant robot via electric guitar and crotch-thrusting is by definition good :colbert:

Fivemarks posted:

Nyaruko-chan (Actually a straight up comedy, its decent).
I bought this so that I could play “Project Diva, but with Nyaruko instead of Miku”, which I believe makes me Queen of Animé and probably on several watchlists

[Edit: the Nyaruko anime is full of references to the Call of Cthulhu TRPG, bringing us back ‘round as the serpent endlessly devours its tail]

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Nov 16, 2021

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
It’s interesting to be reminded of how much 1e White Wolf cores pushed crossover, even with games that weren’t out yet. It really helps emphasize the “you’re brand new to this secret society of monsters that think you’re a dumb baby and live by a stodgy code of rules that say they’re better than you”, PUNK aspect of the Gothic-Punk that WoD games were supposed to espouse.

Of course, that all got filed away over time, and iirc the Revised book’s views on crossover are “vampires and dead things that reek of Wyrm (Gangrel are no exception, them crudely mimicking our claws and a wolf shape using stolen blood is more offensive if anything), mages break reality and steal caerns, ghosts are just dark spirits, changelings are irrelevant”, we’re deeply disappointed you even thought about it.

Only other big 1e thing I remember is how many Lugus Ahroun Stargazers there were, for the 5/5/6 stat spread alone. Only 500 in the world, but every table had a kung fu murderhobo.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

OtspIII posted:

The books really press on having all sorts of spirits and umbral creatures and doppelganger Chimera and things like that, creating this world that's full of all sorts of weird and unclassifiable monsters, but I'm not sure I've ever actually seen anything get used in a game that wasn't from one of the splatbooks. Vampires, Werewolves, Mages, Hunters--all over the place. Technocracy--sure. Spirits--basically never. Weird custom monsters in the vein of things from folklore or an episode of the X-Files--absolutely never. Did I just play with weird groups, or is this how other peoples' games went too?
The Hunter: The Reckoning line was really great about this, actually! Every one of the adversary books was essentially a combo “here’s how to use the other lines” and “here’s a bunch of crazy poo poo to ruin the day of players who know the major splats of every line and are metagaming all ta hell”. You’re playing as randos who very explicitly don’t know anything but the broad strokes of the things they’re fighting, what the hell even is a “Tremere”??

One of the later books was fully dedicated to that concept - I want to say it was called Urban Legends - and all about how the WoD was full of poo poo that a Hunter would go “huh, that was weird” and never be able to identify IC or OOC.

Also reminded of one of the Kindred of the East books, where the intro fiction was for once a Kuei-jin getting absolutely wrecked by a western vamp, sucker-punched coming out of the Umbra and dying to something like “Embarrassing, does the Prince think I’ve never dealt with woofs before?”

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

The Lone Badger posted:

In particular awoos are super strong out-of-the-gate. They get massively buffed strength and soak, aggravated-damage claws and multiple actions per turn as part of the welcome basket before they even spend a single point on Gifts. Other splats could do these things too but not until well past chargen and only if they focused on them.
Yeah, the only other splat as good at what it does right out of the gate is Demons, and their base powers are so strong because the writer used “m” for “meters” and an editor interpreted it as “miles”.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

srhall79 posted:

The Knights of the Crown and Their Measure
Loyalty and Obedience. Loyalty to those who are just before Habbakuk, to all that is good, to those oppressed by evil, to those monarchs deemed good by the Knightly Council, and of course, loyalty to your brother knights and fellow orders. Which means if you see your brother knight doing ill, are you then breaking the Measure to condemn them, or should you support them?

Responsibilities include a tithe of 10%, service and aid to fellow knights and kingdoms on the List of Loyalty.
This reads like “Babby Grog’s 1st Guide to Making Paladins Fall”.txt

Like, game begins, the local ruler is brutally oppressing the peasantry, do you wanna fall because ACAB or fall because you broke the Thin Blue Line? Either way, gently caress you, you’re a worse fighter now :smug:

(Isn’t this the Order all PCs are required to start in, too?)

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Zereth posted:

Yeah but the Dragonlance setting doesn't seem to be aware that that's what it's doing.
See now that is Dragonlance.txt, above and beyond the railroading

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

joylessdivision posted:

And the mistake got me to finally put together a spreadsheet for all the games and what I have physically and digitally so I don't accidentally double order books from Ebay.
White Wolf put out a full WoD list with boxes you can check off during Time of Judgement that is nearly perfect as far as I remember - I know the copy I printed off nearly two decades ago loving christ OW psychic damage has some addendums of things they missed (a few in Wraith iirc) and crossed-off some books they never finished, the wrote them in again underneath when they DID release in the runup to 20th Anniversary.

I have no idea if that PDF is widely-available anymore, but still have it if anyone needs it.

do not ask how much of the list I have checked off please and thank u

90s Cringe Rock posted:

gygaxian prose is perforce held to be the antithesis of weal
Gygax is that special Sterling level of pretentious, where the $10 words aren’t even used correctly but a generation of nerds raised on D&D thinks they were. :allears:

It’s very non-Euclidean, which means “spooky” according to this Howard guy

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 06:53 on Oct 3, 2022

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

joylessdivision posted:

Also don't feel bad about how many you had checked off photo won't load but my physical collection is sitting at nearly 120 books, core and source for WoD
my brother in caine

i even have the Wyld West/Deadlands crossover:


(Sorry that image is fuckoff huge, I’m on mobile)

Edit: to further self-immolate, I started that checklist after an old roommate ran off with a bunch of my collection. The lines that are 100% complete? Hunter: The Reckoning, Mummy 1/2/3e, and Kindred of the East. Next closest is either Werewolf or Changeling, and I’m not about to double check.

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Oct 3, 2022

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Tsilkani posted:

If my memories of awful CtD bits are correct, Redcaps are usually A Problem.
I hate that I immediately know why, thanks internet

Too bad, I remember their splatbook getting me hyped to play one, “I am literally the conservative nightmares of Antifa Supersoldiers made manifest and pointed at the sidhe” is a hell of a pitch

AmiYumi fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Feb 19, 2023

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

MonsieurChoc posted:

I just can't get over how the moment they returned the Nobles conquered the Changelings who'd stayed on Earth, and even shanked them all in the Night of Cold Iron.

That'S the kind of thing that creates lasting grudges!
Accurate! There’s an entire book about it (one of the last in the line unfortunately, iirc)! Sidhe are the villains of any proper CtD game.

From what I remember, Changeling particularly suffered from 1/early 2e WW’s “all the bad guys teams know each other and work together” mandates; “Seelie/Unseelie” are supposed to be a facets of your character they swap between (some more frequently than others), yet right out of the core book we get into “Unseelie is a permanent state and makes you BFFs with Sabbat vampires, Black Spiral Dancers, Pentex, and The Technocracy - all groups that naturally make sense working together, yes”

Even the core book wasn’t immune, presenting only the “Seelie” noble houses as options, which only calcified with the house splatbooks.

Dawgstar posted:

(More would come later, including House Scathach, which is basically the house of brooding loners with trenchcoats and katanas.)
Wasn’t Scathach the one whose deal was “we’re House Liam, but moreso”? I remember there being at least two “we’re the sidhe that stayed on Earth with the commoners” houses, which is A) confusing, B) heavily dilutes the concept, and C) probably shouldn’t be recognized by the returning sidhe as a noble house at all*?

*although this opens up a whole other :can: in that, iirc, part of the success of the returning sidhe was exploiting dormant Oaths and magics - swinging in and saying “I’m in charge” works better when The Dreaming itself says “it’s true, that dude’s in charge, your great x5 ancestors said so” and your freehold and own will respond as such
(and then where that doesn’t work, they shank the leaders with soul-killing iron and gaslight the rest with magic; sidhe are bastards**)

** this is without even starting on their “version” of the changeling way ritual

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Did 1e have the “by the way, all Changelings can use the kaioken” rule hidden randomly and never referenced again, or was that a 2e thing? I never actually got the 1e core.

[Fake edit: I looked it up, “The Dragon’s Ire”, not “Call Upon the Wyrd” as I initially thought - that’s another different system hidden away in the middle of a chapter.]

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Everyone posted:

Changelings aren't really trying to save the world or humanity. They're just trying to survive them. Glamour is as important to them as oxygen or water is to us.
I’ll admit it, I’m someone who really enjoys the prose from the later (2e?) Changeling books. The ones that really emphasize how bad things got for them to do the Changeling Way ritual in the first place, and how now they’re creatures with dual identities, both strangers in their native lands. The Dreaming is an intoxicating and unsafe land of nightmares where the “laws” of the universe you thought you knew break down the farther you go, while the regular World of Darkness is literally crushing your soul and trying to destroy who you are deep down, because it’s incompatible with the modern world.

Not for nothing, but my favorite books of the line are the ones that say “gently caress sidhe and their foppery” and drill into wild poo poo from the Deep Dreaming that’s just as scared of where it came from as you are, and the worries that the end times will either make the world we live in just as bad, or force everything chimerical to go back without a banal shell to hide in or a trod to protect them.

Contrasting Jenna Moran nightmare realms with our post-capitalist hellscape and having to choose which is worse, that’s Changeling.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

MonsieurChoc posted:

Centennium sounds like what eventually became the Trinity Continuum.

Which rules and is White Wolf's most underrated game imho.
To be unnecessarily technical and pedantic, I believe the project it’s actually referring to became Exile (the game/system MRH took with him), which was then replaced by Æon (which was changed by lawsuit into Trinity).

I don’t think anything ever came out of Exile other than a few manuscripts; MRH was talking up crowdfunding for it a few years back, but iirc that was right around when he suddenly had to lay low with the nü-wolf unpleasantness.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Okay, a school all about viewing The City as having a natural order, or being a greater organism of its own in a way. I wonder if the taboo is about ignorance (leaving the city) or disrespect (treating the city as artificial)?

mellonbread posted:

  • Vagrant Urbanomancers aren’t allowed to seek shelter within the City. They can’t hide from the elements or sleep inside a building. They can go indoors, but never for the purpose of sheltering from the weather.
Sure, a bit odd, but I still get it - they have to live in the “nature” of the city, and are incentivized to make the city streets more welcoming and protective, which fits in with the whole “foot traffic” way of charging thing.

mellonbread posted:

  • A traditional Urbanomancer loses all their charges if they touch the bare earth the city is built on. You can wear shoes to avoid this, but if you fall over you lose all your charges. It’s not clear if someone else pocket-sanding you with a fistful of earth sucks away your charges. It says that touching gravel on the roadside counts, which is bullshit because gravel is as artificial as asphalt.
I…what? Why does the same school swerve wildly in both directions? “The city is nature, one taboo reflects this, the other takes your charges if you touch nature.” I’d get it if the other taboo weren’t there; you’re interested in the man-made “nature” of the city, but now I just feel like this school should have been split in two, or split off into a “sub-school” with a related but different enough to note purview.

Also the “traditional” school highly incentivizes characters people-watching while wearing a full suit, leather gloves, and a spooky mask, to leave as little exposed skin as possible; if that’s not describing a specific anime character, that’s only because it’s too many of them.

I get it, the dichotomy of magic, if it made perfect sense it wouldn’t be a taboo, :witch: That only gets you so far when we’re in this thread to, y’know, look critically at these published works of gameable fiction (and actively discussing buy-in, with regards to UA).

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
Fire Emblem wouldn’t even be in my first 5 thoughts for a JRPG series, but drat if it doesn’t work as good inspiration here

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

joylessdivision posted:

As previously mentioned, there are four paths in Thaumaturgy, Blood, Fire, Telekinesis and Weather Control. One of the forms must be chosen at each new level of the Discipline, and the form chosen at Level 2 is considered the casters Primary Form. At each rating thereafter, the player chooses one of the remaining forms that become Secondary, Tertiary and Subordinate Forms. When a new Form is learned, the first power listed under it is gained, with additional powers gained through XP expenditure. Additional Primary From powers cost 2 XP, Secondary and Tertiary powers cost 3 XP and Subordinate costs 4 XP. Each time these powers are used, a Willpower roll is made. Failure indicates that the action was still successful but the WP point is lost.
They got rid of this, like, immediately, right? I don’t ever remember Path magic requiring you to spread thin (or being ritual-only at L1!), rather that each tradition had a Path you had to take as your primary - Blood, for Tremere Thaumaturgy.

[Edit: meant to edit this in and ended up double-posting, whoops]

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Lemon-Lime posted:

It's essentially FF14 fanart, so not really hitting Fire Emblem notes.

Dawgstar posted:

I get what they're saying. Fire Emblem does love (or at least did before Three Houses when everybody wears a uniform) for its characters to dress for the job they want. It works on both levels.

Runa posted:

To second your post, not only is that illustration directly emulating the art style of the official art that gets posted on the ffxiv official community news site, players familiar with the game can actually see what armor pieces inspired which outfits. Including a white-dyed 2B dress from the Nier crossover alliance raid.

It's very cute

Lemon-Lime posted:

The artist (Catthy Trinh) does FF14 comms and her art generally owns: https://twitter.com/CatthyTrinhArt

But yeah, it's mostly just funny. The Fabula Ultima iconics are a PLD/WAR/WHM/SCH*/NIN/BLM/BRD/DNC static, and two thirds of them are just wearing their AF sets.

*counting what's probably a Tinkerer as the second healer because that's obviously a carbuncle stand-in.

I'm fully capable of admitting when I'm wrong, especially considering I've never played FF14. Hell, my only experience with Fire Emblem is from seeing all the clones of swordy guys in Smash and also lately from playing that phone game that gives a brazilian Nintendo points for very little effort

Gotta say, though, I'm also kinda not wrong? Unreasonably quick-and-dirty MS Paint job, because I'm on a laptop that's loudly protesting having wiki pages open:

Eh, it's all pulling from the same "Western fantasy seen through decades of iterative JRPGs" design lenses in the end, I just felt like defending myself. Y'all enjoy the rest of your weekend.

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Kurieg posted:

Iirc there are tzmince ant's but they don't have vicissitude so they're just weird Gangrel in practice.
The “Old Clan” Tzimisce, which depending on the book are either militant holdouts fighting against the sentient Vicissitude demonic infection that has taken the rest of the Clan, or “get off my lawn” crotchety elders so insular that they have no time for fleshcraft because they spend all of theirs ruling over a big Castlevania mansion. Dracula himself was (the most important) one of them, iirc.

The books I remember said there’s no such thing as “Tzimisce antitribu” partly from pride and tradition etc, but mostly because they aren’t numerous or organized enough.

[:ninja: Edit:] Oh right 5e, I guess they would mechanically be weird Gangrel at that point.]

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG
I liked the implied setting details comparing some Dark Ages stuff and later releases like Kindred of the Ebony Kindoms - where in DA 12th gen is the debased new limit to the line of Caine, and stretching it further just doesn’t work, then in the modern nights it’s 13th, no wait 14th, or maybe 15th? Neat for hammering home that vamps don’t understand their own situation, it’s politics and supernatural curses and the zeitgeist.

Not to get all Mage-chat but it fits in with a general paradigm shift over the editions that was AFAIK intentional; you used to be able to store vitae in clay pots and drink from it or Embrace with it, now as the world is less magical that doesn’t work and it has to be “fresh”.

IIRC one of the Giovanni Chronicles books said outright “[whatever] used to work, now it doesn’t, blood is just less supernaturally potent in this debased age”

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

Kurieg posted:

The implication is basically that every time a new generation shows up the princes killed them on sight, until enough sires were canny enough to hide them that it became unfeasable. Lather, Rinse, repeat with the next ones down the line.
Sure, but also

Dark Ages: Vampire, p.303 posted:

13th Generation (2-pt Flaw)
Your sire was of the 12th generation, long thought unable to sire. The fact that you rose from the dead may even have come as a shock to him, and it certainly concerns any elders who put stock in prophecy (in other words, most of them).

Thirteenth-generation vampires must at least take the Cannot Embrace Flaw, but almost all suffer from Weak Blood
Which, along with the text of the other flaws mentioned, spells outright that 12th used to be the hard line, something changed and now it’s 13th where the blood is so weak they can’t successfully embrace and (usually) have to pay double costs for everything (which later becomes the territory of the 14th generation).

I think it was the Revised VtM ST Handbook (one of my favorite supplements of the line, weirdly enough) that said “sometimes changes happen and we pretend it’s always worked that way, sometimes it’s Thaumaturgical ritual, sometimes it’s Malkavians, whatever it is it’s not like Elders are sharing notes or letting on that some enemy’s plot has succeeded and left them weaker”

[:ninja: Edit: as the in-game explanation for edition stuff like Malks coming down with Dementation or discipline dots working differently, to be clear]

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

AmiYumi
Oct 10, 2005

I FORGOT TO HAIL KING TORG

SirPhoebos posted:

Time Wizards! has the same manic but very stupid energy that gave life to Zybourne Clock. At least they managed to fart out a pdf.
It honestly loses a lot of charm by being rendered in English - there’s a je ne sais quoi to “iiiMientras tanto, los MAGOOOOS DEL TIEMPOOOO!!!”

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply