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On Terra Firma posted:"Alright you can't or won't quit, so why don't you use this thing that's way safer and also doesn't smell like rear end." That is a very subjective assertion at the end there, my personal experience is quite the opposite. Which incidentally is my big beef with smoking/vaping as a vice: it pollutes the poo poo out of my environment and I have to breathe and smell that poo poo users are dumping into our shared air.
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Oct 2, 2019 17:27
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WAR CRIME GIGOLO posted:At some point we must accept annoyance to stop a crime. The crime is killing humans with cigarettes But stopping people from loving up the air by smoking in public is removing annoyance? Telling people to gently caress off and vape inside just means it becomes as socially unacceptable as smoking currently is and then the only people doing it will be the literal addicts, whose numbers will start dwindling as they die off and aren't replaced in equal number.
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Oct 2, 2019 22:09
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Like all this stuff about it being better for an addict is great and all, but its brought up in this thread that the people making these things fought in court to let it be known they are a tobacco product and not a method for quitting. They've flat out stated in a public court that they're selling a vice to addicts and not trying to make their lives better. It's not entering our culture as a means to quit smoking, but as a means to return smoking as an acceptable hobby. gently caress. That.
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Oct 3, 2019 04:21
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enraged_camel posted:What I meant is that if I had a kid, I would choose to not have anything blown in their faces. Woah there. Look at this rebel.
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Oct 3, 2019 05:00
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On Terra Firma posted:So you think my concern for hundreds of thousands in the US and millions worldwide dying needlessly is a front? I think you yourself have pointed out that the companies responsible for this new way of smoking have flat out won in court the fact that it is recreational and not a means to quit. The fact is that vaping is new enough that nobody knows the long term effects yet; because nobody has been vaping long enough to have any data on that. For all we know 50 years of vaping causes your kidneys to start dancing the two step together.
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Oct 3, 2019 05:13
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On Terra Firma posted:They sued to prevent the FDA from seizing products since they didn't have the authority if they were tobacco products and not cessation aids. It was also two relatively small companies at the time. The FDA eventually agreed with the ruling then did nothing for years. Context matters. The context being that both the FDA and the company agreed it wasn't the thing you keep claiming it is, because if it were a cessation device it wouldn't legally meet standards and could be seized? That does not speak well for them as a cessation device. At all.
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Oct 3, 2019 05:27
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ErIog posted:The companies weren't interested in selling a cessation product specifically, and so weren't interested in certifying it as such or being forced to certify it as such. They were selling a nicotine product for recreational use. That was exactly my point. They are not intended to be a tool for quitting. Which is a thing terra has insisted multiple times now.
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Oct 3, 2019 05:46
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On Terra Firma posted:I've already addressed my thoughts on the FDA. Nobody knows what they are doing. Fixed that last part for you though. Not approving the stuff these guys are selling. The fact that it continues to get sold is kind of a red flag.
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Oct 3, 2019 09:06
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I'm not against harm reduction, I'm against vaping being more socially acceptable than other methods of smoking. It's still not something I want to see on the streets, less dangerous than cigs or not. I'm also opposed to people selling chemical compounds unapproved by the FDA. Because a lack of disapproval here is not the same as approval.
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Oct 4, 2019 03:16
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It's probably because they are, in fact, literal children whose bodies, notably their brains, haven't finished forming.
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Oct 5, 2019 14:37
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Not to interrupt the slapfest between you two and inkblot occasionally jumping in, but it's... kind of hosed up the way the vapes that are killing kids are being dismissed because it's not the legal stuff. That stuff is directly correlated to vaping becoming popular, and it's reputation for being safer than smoking. It's like saying liquor laws should ignore underage drinking because it's illegal anyways.inkblottime posted:^^^ My vaping does not equal children smoking anymore than your drinking habit equal child alcoholics. See I made a statement on false pretenses that you are drunk. ^^^ I can't make a judgement on it without knowing you, but yeah unless you only do it at home and don't have any kids to say, "yeah my dad vapes" then you are part of vaping getting normalized and that little stuff adds up into kids thinking it's cool and good. And yeah, kids seeing adults drinking and wanting in on it is exactly why underage drinking is so prevalent.
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Oct 24, 2019 13:53
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inkblottime posted:Is your objective to shut this thread down or turn it into anti-smoking/anti-vaping? Shut the thread down? 90% of the thread is him and the op arguing past each other. For better or worse, he and the op ARE the thread.
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Oct 24, 2019 19:25
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On Terra Firma posted:He's not even arguing. He's just making poo poo up and hoping I don't notice he's ignoring most of what I and others have said to him. 90% of this thread is the two of you going "no, you're stupid" at each other. That's kind of arguing. Also, you missed my point earlier. The THC vapes killing kids are a completely different product, I am aware of that. But your insistence that your vaping stuff exists in isolation from that denies it's role in kids dying to what was almost certainly described to them as "vaping weed." Vaping becoming normalized allowed that experimentation.
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Oct 24, 2019 19:42
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