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Hell yeah if you're gonna stick Erza naked in chains in a dungeon then I better see some got dang barely censored chained down adonis belts
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Jan 12, 2021 04:05
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The problem always is that the fanservice usually diminishes the female character. They did the same thing in Kill la kill where the supposedly badass protagonist kept ending up in compromising "sexy" positions against her will. It'd be like if every other battle Gokus pants would be destroyed and he'd fall down on all fours and the camera would zoom in on his sexy sculpted rear end and cock bulge while he looks embarrased.
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Jan 12, 2021 09:10
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Zzulu posted:The problem always is that the fanservice usually diminishes the female character. They did the same thing in Kill la kill where the supposedly badass protagonist kept ending up in compromising "sexy" positions against her will. That's a bad example to choose. Kill la Kill did that to make a point specifically on the matter and it didn't diminish any of the main characters to end up mostly naked and in sexy positions when they're still being gigantic badasses. Ryuko is only embarrassed about it for the first few episodes and then learns that she shouldn't care about that and just focus on kicking rear end. Nephthys fucked around with this message at 11:05 on Jan 12, 2021 |
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Jan 12, 2021 10:59
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lol
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Jan 12, 2021 11:02
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Nephthys posted:That's a bad example to choose. Kill la Kill did that to make a point specifically on the matter and it didn't diminish any of the main characters to end up mostly naked and in sexy positions when they're still being gigantic badasses. Ryuko is only embarrassed about it for the first few episodes and then learns that she shouldn't care about that and just focus on kicking rear end. Nah it's still a good example.
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Jan 12, 2021 11:16
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jassa posted:Nah it's still a good example. It's literally the only example you could choose where the characters being half-naked in public is a major plot point and it's trying to make a statement about it. You could just point to Fire Force or something instead of the only show that actually justifies the fanservice.
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Jan 12, 2021 11:26
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Kill La Kill is a really weird one in that is definitely is doing a Thing with its nudity & fashion theme but it also incredibly horny about it too. I absolutely would not hold it up as a fanservice free anime
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Jan 12, 2021 11:27
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Any point it was trying to make about fanservice and nudity as nonsexual is extremely undercut by the show also having a mother bad touching her daughter on screen solely to emphasize to the viewer that she's bad
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Jan 12, 2021 11:32
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Nephthys posted:It's literally the only example you could choose where the characters being half-naked in public is a major plot point and it's trying to make a statement about it. This is true. Zzulu posted:The problem always is that the fanservice usually diminishes the female character. They did the same thing in Kill la kill where the supposedly badass protagonist kept ending up in compromising "sexy" positions against her will. But this is also true. The two aren't mutually exclusive.
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Jan 12, 2021 11:51
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I don't think Fairy Tail is a good example of equal opportunity fanservice because even if you find the guys attractive, they're not drawn in sexy ways, they just stand there, occasionally topless. Whereas the girls' boobs and butts are constantly emphasized. It doesn't have to be sexy torture times even, it's more as if Mashima was unable to draw women and not be horny
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Jan 12, 2021 11:59
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I remember the good old days when One Piece was just a manga about pirates with little to no fan service. Then Oda met his wife and he’s been horny ever since.
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Jan 12, 2021 12:07
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jassa posted:This is true. In this case they are. Ryuko's embarrassment about nudity is presented as an obstacle holding her back in combat, and after overcoming it in episode 3 she starts cutting buildings in half and whooping rear end even harder. It doesn't diminish her as a character, it's actually a part of her character development that makes her more of a badass.
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Jan 12, 2021 12:55
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I mean, even within MHA, you've got a variety in fanservice. For example, when the girls are in cheerleading outfits, that's presented as awkward and embarrassing for them. Meanwhile, Toga can be naked as the day is long and not even blink, and Mirko shots are treated as a coincidence of camera placement while she's kicking rear end. Or, to go with a series with a cameo in MHA's manga, you can look at Chainsaw Man, which is very, very horny, but it gives the female characters agency. Instead of a "Eeek! You saw me naked!" reaction scene, it's "So... you wanna get naked?". A lot goes into how skeevy a scene feels beyond a simple "Fanservice: Y/N" mark. I know that sometimes just sighing, wiping your hands of the whole affair, and moving on is best, but going into more detail can sometimes make it easier for you and others to understand why something works or really, really doesn't. (Like "This scene feels skeevy because it's just Momo being taken advantage of." or "It feels like the joke here is less about Midnight being scantily clad, and more about how awkward that makes other characters in the scene, while she's having the time of her life.") In conclusion, Libya is a land of contrast. Thank you
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Jan 12, 2021 12:55
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Nephthys posted:In this case they are. Ryuko's embarrassment about nudity is presented as an obstacle holding her back in combat, and after overcoming it in episode 3 she starts cutting buildings in half and whooping rear end even harder. It doesn't diminish her as a character, it's actually a part of her character development that makes her more of a badass. lol
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Jan 12, 2021 13:12
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Much like in anime, everyone got fixated on the boobs-and-butts part of my post and nobody's talking about how amazing the concert was or debating the quirk rankings 
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Jan 12, 2021 14:11
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I'm glad the concert got a lot of love in terms of animation. Also Fujimoto ran pretty obviously ran into editor fun, because I don't think it's going to Jump+ because of a lack of popularity.
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Jan 12, 2021 14:21
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Nephthys posted:In this case they are. Ryuko's embarrassment about nudity is presented as an obstacle holding her back in combat, and after overcoming it in episode 3 she starts cutting buildings in half and whooping rear end even harder. It doesn't diminish her as a character, it's actually a part of her character development that makes her more of a badass. Do you think Kojima's justifications for why his characters have to be naked are real, too?
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Jan 12, 2021 15:42
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PMush Perfect posted:You do know Ryuko isn't real, right? She's a fictional character. Made up. Real people decided to make her naked and give her that conflict, and only draw her cutting buildings in half after she "overcame her embarrassment" with being naked. Who cares why Kojima justifies his characters being naked, "I like big naked titties" is enough of a justification to draw big naked titties. Everything else is set dressing.
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Jan 12, 2021 16:24
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Onmi posted:Who cares why Kojima justifies his characters being naked, "I like big naked titties" is enough of a justification to draw big naked titties. Everything else is set dressing. I care, because justifications make it even more pathetic and embarrassing
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Jan 12, 2021 17:30
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Yeah Kojima kinda set himself up for that with that 'you will be ashamed for your actions and feelings' crap
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Jan 12, 2021 17:37
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See also: kill la kill
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Jan 12, 2021 17:40
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Eej posted:One guy getting naked all the time for a joke doesn't balance out one girl getting naked against her will for horny tho Which is why I compared it to Erza's powerarmor with the open torso, rather than the entire treatment of her or all women in Fariytale. Gray's stripping is a joke, but its one that's been used in service of getting girls naked/sexualized for the audience forever. Something happens that results in nudity or a compromising position so no one is at fault for it, and then everyone is upset and/or embarrassed so we know they aren't enjoying it (but you the audience are, aren't you?) MHA's done it with Momo's top coming off. The thing is, Gray is explicitly framed as an attractive guy and they don't give him silly underwear or something to counter the impression that you're supposed to be enjoying this on some level beyond just humor. It's fan service, not super egregious and still a little wanting compare to the girls, but it's there. MHA by comparison is just crumbs, which would be fine because it's a show about kids and not a romance, but that's not the case with the girls. If you're going to have Midnight running around as a walking sex joke, then there should be some Adonis-pro whose shtick is a skimpy costume and having a bunch of female fans. surf rock posted:Much like in anime, everyone got fixated on the boobs-and-butts part of my post and nobody's talking about how amazing the concert was or debating the quirk rankings Much like Bakugo when he's a total rear end in a top hat but right, I shall never apologize for leading a thread own the road of feminist discourse.
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Jan 12, 2021 17:41
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Onmi posted:Who cares why Kojima justifies his characters being naked, "I like big naked titties" is enough of a justification to draw big naked titties. Everything else is set dressing. Broke: Kojima's endless in universe excuses for horny Woke: Yoko Taro just saying he does it cause he thinks it's hot
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Jan 12, 2021 18:19
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there wolf posted:Much like Bakugo when he's a total rear end in a top hat but right, I shall never apologize for leading a thread own the road of feminist discourse. I appreciate it, because when I stop to think about it, it's bullshit that the Big 3 get focus fights except for Nejire who gets a beauty pageant. Froppy's biggest contribution to the Overhaul arc is pointing Aizawa's face the right way. The girls all show up with their top-10 hero mentor, a woman who turns into an actual dragon, and their fight happens almost entirely off screen. I like that Ochako is a close combat gravity grappler and that she takes her crush on Deku and sets it entirely aside because she has more important poo poo to worry about. Eri is built up as this helpless little girl who needs saving, but ultimately she is the one responsible for her own rescue. She chooses to be rescued in the end, and without her power Deku doesn't win that fight. MHA is ultimately neither the best nor worst for this kind of thing. surf rock posted:Much like in anime, everyone got fixated on the boobs-and-butts part of my post and nobody's talking about how amazing the concert was or debating the quirk rankings I adored the concert, especially after how it originally looked in the manga. The timing of it meant that Horikoshi had to do like 2 whole chapters in the span of 10 days, and the concert chapter was basically just rough scribbles at certain points. I still got choked up at the end of it, and always will:  The song they came up with is super catchy, and I was caught a bit off guard by how emotional Jiro's little quick backstory thing was, she has great parents.  FWIW I'm also glad you liked Gentle. When reading that weekly as it came out, it was definitely my favorite arc at the time. I don't necessarily think the anime did it justice, but I still enjoyed experiencing it again all the same.
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Jan 12, 2021 18:30
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Also, fun fact: the song is entirely in English even in the Japanese version (not sure why though but it was good). An American singer named Chrissy Costanza provided Jiro’s singing voice: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrissy_Costanza
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Jan 12, 2021 18:35
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PMush Perfect posted:You do know Ryuko isn't real, right? She's a fictional character. Made up. Real people decided to make her naked and give her that conflict, and only draw her cutting buildings in half after she "overcame her embarrassment" with being naked. Yes that's why I called it 'character development', a literary tool by which the writer portrays people in a work of fiction in such a way that the reader or audience seems to learn more about them as they develop. The real people making the anime chose to do so because A) They are horny, no big deal but also because B) They're making a point that a (fictional) character can be nude and offer fanservice* but also be a huge badass without the former diminishing the latter. It seems that a fair number of people have missed the frankly quite obvious and simple point they were making based on this thread though. So far no one has actually said why the characters in Kill la Kill being sexy and naked diminishes them as characters yet. Is there an actual reason this is such a big deal that it ruins Ryuko as a character? *Note that there's not actually much fanservice in this show after episode 3. The nudity is presented without comment or focus to the point where I personally stopped even noticing it very quickly.
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Jan 12, 2021 21:32
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Either someone post the butt slap post or let this conversation die Ideally both
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Jan 12, 2021 22:27
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Isn't she only 17 as well? Like cmon there is no defending the show
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Jan 12, 2021 22:32
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Larryb posted:Also, fun fact: the song is entirely in English even in the Japanese version (not sure why though but it was good). An American singer named Chrissy Costanza provided Jiro’s singing voice: Yeah, it was pretty funny when Jiro started singing in English (and suddenly had a different voice). And the lyrics were even written by someone from Japan. I didn't like the song very much though. It was catchy but not what I had in my head when I was reading the manga
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Jan 12, 2021 22:35
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgwUenaQqlM this is the fanservice I want. This and Mina breakdancing and deep dope shirts.
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Jan 12, 2021 23:26
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But it's a satire/joke/subversion is not a get-out-of-jail-free card for doing something, at the very least because it relies on the audience picking up on the recontextulization which doesn't always happen, particularly when it's something an audience is already inclined to ignore and reject. Pickle Rick anyone? Your fav is problematic. It's ok! A lot favs are; this whole discussion was set off by pointing out a problem in MHA, a show we all think is pretty good. Now I'm going to work on my fanfic about All Man, the sexy hero all the ladies love. So far he's a bad All Might copy with some generic super-strength powers. Deku has an elderly aunt who's always gifting him embarrassing merch because she gets them confused.
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Jan 13, 2021 05:30
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there wolf posted:Also Mineta gets eaten by a bear and is never mentioned again. Mineta is sufficiently unbearable that it's unlikely, but it would improve the show. surf rock posted:Much like in anime, everyone got fixated on the boobs-and-butts part of my post and nobody's talking about how amazing the concert was or debating the quirk rankings The concert is easily one of the highlights of the show  Did you see that there's a music video to go with it on Youtube? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GgwUenaQqlM
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Jan 15, 2021 07:28
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Bofast posted:The concert is easily one of the highlights of the show As if I haven't watched it a dozen times in the last week  Also, I watched the OVAs. They're pretty blah, the first one especially. I did like Froppy's family and mongoose friend. I also liked in the two-part Survival Training OVA that the class is split between Team A and Team B, and Team B is almost entirely the class's jobbers (plus Ashida and and Jiro) and Team A is almost entirely the class's stars (plus Denki). What insanely unbalanced teams! Team B literally never appears, ha.
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Jan 16, 2021 17:40
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66E7MpTGygs You can't tell me all might didn't gently caress up enormously making midoriya his successor rather than lemillion lol Is that a bigger thing in the manga or no
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Jan 16, 2021 17:58
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Tatsuta Age posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66E7MpTGygs He met Midoriya first
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Jan 16, 2021 18:08
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Tatsuta Age posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=66E7MpTGygs No it all pretty much goes down exactly the same in the manga as I recall.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:12
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MonsterEnvy posted:He met Midoriya first no, he knew about togata well before bumping into midoriya. midoriya just had that heroic je ne sais quoi that made all might jump into giving him one for all instead
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Jan 16, 2021 18:12
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I will never not point to the scene where Deku and Lemillion encounter Eri the first time. Deku's first instinct was to protect the child while Lemillion's first instinct was to give the obviously terrified child back to her abuser. Mirio has his moments, but his decisions show that he's mostly the same kind of costumed supercop that "heroes" tend to be. Deku's decisions are based on saving people so he has better potential to be a real Hero.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:27
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Mirio proved he wasn't One For All material in the alleyway.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:27
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Oxxidation posted:no, he knew about togata well before bumping into midoriya. midoriya just had that heroic je ne sais quoi that made all might jump into giving him one for all instead He heard about him along with other students at UA. As he was going there to look for a successor. But he met Midoriya first and gave it to him. He says upon meeting Mirio he probably would have given it to him had he not met Midoriya first.
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Jan 16, 2021 18:36
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