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Hello thread, coming to this game super late. Bought it forever ago, haven't played until now because I knew it was great and saved it until I was really in the mood. So, I killed Meg within my first 10 runs so I'm not hopeless at the game. But the 2nd zone I am utterly failing at, mostly because I just cannot stop taking extra damage from stepping into the lava. Like it's a good room if I take under 5 hp from lava. Some bad rooms where I need to dash a ton due to the enemy types, but the room layout also sucks (small islands + lots of lava), I've probably lost half my health to it. I haven't gotten even close to the 2nd boss. I'm playing M&KB, and some of it feels like 8 directions are hosed in some rooms, cause dashes across the gaps doesn't line up unless you have analog movement. I have a DS4, but I am really not a controller person. Should I switch anyways and deal with learning the game again? I frequently take a HP or 3 just getting onto those goddamn boats on little docks that you can't walk straight on using a KB. 
Klyith fucked around with this message at 05:46 on May 23, 2021 |
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May 23, 2021 03:12
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Welp I hooked up the DS4 and I dunno if I'll be able to do it. The default control map was completely unusable for me, because having everything on the thumb I just can't change input fast enough. But you can't attack with triggers because they don't auto-fire, which seems like a huge oversight. Grumble grumble.Mazerunner posted:e; there's an option to enable dashing towards the curser also hmmm, that seems like it'd be a massively double-edged sword, but I may have to try it out. it'd take a bit to learn to use the mouse for both offense and defense but it might be faster to adapt to than the controller. Though that brings up another question I can't figure out: what are the exact mechanics of dash & invulnerability? It feels very tight to me, like you don't have invuln for the whole dash. I spent a bit trying to practice dashing against a single lout guy by just letting him charge me over and over, and found it surprisingly difficult to avoid damage other than by actually dodging out of the way entirely. Like, dashing through the guy wasn't working.
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May 24, 2021 20:13
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Dyz posted:M&K is a little awkward but it works just fine. Don't listen to people who say you *have* to use a controller. Use what's comfortable for you. One suggestion to to turn on the aim assist or auto aim or whatever its called in the game options. It makes aiming melee weapons a lot easier with the mouse. Yeah I've been using the autoaim the whole time (it's on by default). Possibly I could see turning it off for the bow, but it's really helpful for casts to have autoaim. Mostly I've come to the conclusion that I just kinda suck. I've been on a long run of strategy, rpg, and building games for a while now, so it's been like 3 or 4 years since I've played anything demanding on the action reflexes. The real problem I'm having in asphodel is with making fast decisions & reactions, which are just shot to hell. I wouldn't be dashing into lava so much if I was able to realize "hey idiot you're pointed towards lava" before my thumb mashes the spacebar. The first act doesn't really make you act quickly, which is why I breeze through tartarus and then hit a brick wall. Dyz posted:The i-frames for dashing are tight and they occur right at the beginning of the animation. makes sense combined with the various bonuses for dashing right before getting hit
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May 26, 2021 15:59
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Shumagorath posted:M+KB is just how my brain is wired after a lifetime of shooters. Sticks would be slightly easier in this game given that motion is linear instead of integral, and the XBox pad offset helps a little, but nothing works quite as well for me as keys and whole-hand motion. Yeah the controller thing for me is pretty dire because I never had a NES or any other console growing up, so I don't have the riding a bike level of innate ability. 8-10 years ago I had an OG xbox and PS3 and got a lot more practice, but since then I only use controllers for games that really suck with M&KB. FORUMS USER 1135 posted:Do you have God mode on? It scales up damage reduction everytime you die by 2%. It helps but doesn't make the game a cakewalk. I was in the same boat (was playing less relfex oriented games) and it helped a lot. I did not, but it's time to face the reality that all my posts ITT have been a golf guy yelling at his clubs. I'm old, out of practice, and this game is not loving around. Hades is kinda a return to Bastion, so I expected it to be similar in the difficulty department. Bastion wasn't terribly hard until the challenge or new game+ stuff. I assumed that god mode was like easy mode in Bastion, based on Greg Kasavin's prior comments about wanting their games to be accessible to everyone.
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May 27, 2021 16:36
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100YrsofAttitude posted:It's an excellent ranged weapon and has to be played as such, and honestly ranged weapons have a big advantage in this game. Though slower, a lot of the bosses don't have great responses to you not being next to them. I can see that ranged would be good for bosses, but so far I have not enjoyed ranged weapons very much because the time to clear normal mobs is so much higher. In an average room it's not terrible, it's more time to make mistakes. But in one of the time trials or especially a 2 gods room where stuff is just spawning all the time I feel like it really sucks. Do the ranged options just not come into their own until you have the stuff that gives some control of your boons, so you be sure to add some damage? ... Anyways turning on easy mode for babbies and failing my way to over 30% DR, I reliably get through Asphodel. At which point I totally roll through Elysium -- I haven't died to a normal Elysium encounter once. So it really is something about Asphodel in particular that I suck at. For theseus & the minotaur, everyone says to avoid theseus and kill the minotaur first. Is there any way to tell what the minotaur's attack pattern will be with the axe? Because it seems like there are two openings to attack him, after the bull rush and after a full combo of axe attacks. The pause after the axe combo is short, so a safe attack is like dash in for a few hits and dash out. But that means knowing if he's actually finished or not. Basically where I'm at is that I can kill the minotaur but not without a death, then can't finish theseus.
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Jun 4, 2021 20:47
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Half of Dracula posted:if you can slip Poseidon call in there, with all those bonus talents you want for knockback effects, it will do huge damage to bosses. there's also a poseidon boon that converts knockback into extra damage for bosses Shumagorath posted:I never quit runs (though I kinda want to hear the roasting you get if you do), but sometimes I get a bow build so bad that I'm glad Boss 4 at least makes it quick. I used give up once, you don't get roasted or any commentary at all. You just get reset to the weapon room. Because giving up isn't a death. It's a go back to start button -- you don't keep any of the meta-progress stuff. It doesn't reset your random seed, so you get the exact same encounter layout & rewards the second time. So if your boons suck and make a worthless build, you could make some changes by picking the other rooms any time you got a choice. But it would have a lot of the same stuff. I'm not sure what the point of giving up even is. I guess you could totally gimmick a run by doing the first two worlds and saying "this set of gods would have been much better for a different weapon" or something like that.
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Jun 14, 2021 22:43
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Has anyone else ever had a mid-run Quit fail and reset back to the house, when it said you will resume from the current room? Just had that happen to me, when I had a really fun set of boons going and had finally met Eurydice (like 6 or 8 runs after freeing Orpheus). No chance I'm gonna remember all the room choices I made to get the same stuff. Kinda mad. I'm not fast and still take the time to listen to all the dialogue, so quitting & resuming is something I do a lot! If this happens to me again it's gonna be a major turn-off.
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Jun 15, 2021 22:25
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A good poster posted:Were you using a mouse and mis-clicked Give Up instead? Nah, give up resets you to the house rather than the main menu. I'd have noticed.
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Jun 16, 2021 01:40
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heffsay posted:I’m like 99% sure Give Up brings you to the main menu as well. hmmm so it does, but it also gives you a very distinct confirm box with dad laughing at you Anyways the next door was a trial of the gods, and on reddit someone says that there are a few chambers where you can't save (charon's shop etc) to prevent savescumming. Trial of the gods would be one of those, but menu option was still there. Dunno, could be a legit bug.
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Jun 16, 2021 02:42
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Staltran posted:Sword guys? Shield guys and bow guys are way more trouble for me, and spear guys probably are too. In fact I can't think of anything less obnoxious in Elysium than sword guys...? Definitely wouldn't call them the most obnoxious, but sword guys are pretty annoying in terms of being able to get some chip damage even when you've got a situation under control. One, they've got a varied moveset that doesn't have as much wind-up or tell that the others have. Two, they've got a sword-slash when they're close in that seems pretty instant to me. So you can't rely on stun-lock to prevent an attack, they'll use the delay at the end of an attack chain to take a swipe. (Which is like, ok just remember that when there's only brightswords. But if you've got 2 or 3 guys in a pile it can be hard to instantly identify one sword guy.) Shumagorath posted:Athena Dash will make or break a lot of my runs with ranged weapons and even some without. It gives invulnerability back to dash-attacks, so I'd say it's an even bigger deal for melee weapons than ranged. With deflect you can use dash to charge at guys while attacking, no worries.
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Jun 17, 2021 03:39
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100YrsofAttitude posted:I'm leaning Achilles then Hidden for Spear, Have you tried Achilles spear yet? It's fun on a bun. And you don't need to feed a ton of blood into upgrading it, because the mobility is IMO just as big a deal as the bonus. Though I could also see it being less amazing at high heat levels, because it's way better vs bosses than normal enemy rooms. Shumagorath posted:I finally used Give Up on run 88 because I missed a fish in the first chamber. It lead to my best bow run by a huge margin. I have still never beat hades with the drat bow, my luck is just cursed with it. I finally had a good run going but then ruined it at the very end by buying a hammer when I got to the temple, and taking Explosive Shot. It was good for clearing the temple rooms but against Hades the slooooow charge time completely hosed me. And I had most of my upgrades on the main attack. Was pretty mad about that. (The one thing I really wish is that they'd be a little more explicit about effects, particularly for some of the hammer upgrades like that. "Charges slower" is all that one tells you, when "charges half as fast" would be much better info. I kinda hate playing this while constantly alt-tabbing to a wiki. It's a flow state game and that kills flow.)
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Jun 19, 2021 19:50
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Shumagorath posted:Styx shop anvil is something I leave alone unless I absolutely hate my build and need to shake it up, because I will take hammers 100% of the times they're offered and disrupting that late game can have dire consequences. It was a normal hammer not the random swap. I hadn't found two yet so it was just in the styx rooms. I actively picked the explosive arrow, so it was me that hosed me, not chance! And bow lagging behind is mostly because it's my least-used weapon. I generally just go with whichever weapon has the darkness boost, and bow hasn't had the dice roll it's way. The new thing I learned today: do not piss off Demeter in a trail of the gods. Especially not in a small, tight room. Jesus christ I went from full health to losing a defiance and nearly losing a second. Those ice vortexes are huge, there was nowhere to stand! My new nightmare is the thought of seeing a Demeter + Aphrodite door.
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Jun 20, 2021 03:59
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Shumagorath posted:Doesn't that mirror setting cap out at 2.5%? No, goes up to 5%. I see how privileged status is totally the stronger skill, but my gosh it is also way more annoying to use. You really need to get picky about gods & boons to keep enemies cursed up. Because if enemies spend just 1 in every 4 attacks un-cursed, you're probably back to even with family favorite.
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Jun 20, 2021 07:07
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MrL_JaKiri posted:Depends on the enemies. Trash you're blasting through? Not so important. Keeping up PS on bosses? If you can do it consistently there, it doesn't matter on the other stuff. So my other line of thought is that there's a potential opportunity cost to keeping privileged status applied. Generally you have a buffed-up attack or special that's your main damage and the other one is comparatively weak. So even against a boss and with perfect play, actions spent keeping them cursed are likely a damage deficit that eats into your bonus a little bit. Not always the case though. If you're using a melee weapon, some of the dodges are really effective at keeping enemies & bosses perma-cursed just as a side effect of movement. Dionysus, demeter, & poseidon w/ rupture takes care of one curse for zero effort, so if your main attack takes care of the other you're done. So that's why I still think it needs some boon consideration to be truly, vastly superior. But keep in mind that I completely suck at this game, so this is theory noodling of someone who is thinking about something they can't do. One of the reasons I was thinking through this stuff is that I was using privileged and figured out that my lovely skills made more like 50% of my attacks un-bonused. So it's a terrible choice for me almost always. One time I got the ares-aphrodite duo boon, that makes doom repeat, and had a really high-damage doom. That would make privileged work for me.
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Jun 20, 2021 17:31
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Poseidon cast does not embed the crystal in a target, I'm pretty sure? I feel like I tried it once a long time ago, and have avoided it since then because it didn't. Losing the bonus damage from boiling blood is a big deal. Festive fog also has that problem, but at least that one does a ton of damage.
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Jun 21, 2021 17:07
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minya posted:I can’t tell if this is a legitimate mistake or some kind of underhanded (but effective) troll or some demented misreading of cardinal direction. Either way, good stuff What, so you aren't playing Hades in portrait mode?  It's the secret way to unlock an extra +2 Heat!
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Jun 22, 2021 06:39
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Vandar posted:and then he hits me out of nowhere for eighty damage and that's that. Out of nowhere like when he's invisible? You can see his footprints for a hot second if you pay attention, that shows which direction he's going to attack from. Then there's a tiny delay between the footprints and the attack. I'm pretty sure he always does the straight-lunge attack out of invisibility. Dodging directly away from that doesn't work because t has longer reach than 1 dodge. Dodging to the side is safest, but if you get the timing to dodge directly through it he leaves his back wide open and has a bit of recovery time, so it's a great opportunity to lay in some damage. Other note, if you get directly hit with a skull you want to be super defensive until the boiling blood effect goes away, because that's +100% damage on you from all sources.
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Jun 27, 2021 02:37
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MrL_JaKiri posted:The satyrs have one of the most obvious tells in the game The HWUAAAGHK means you're never surprised, but they have enough range to attack you from offscreen in the large rooms. Between not knowing direction and exact timing the dodge can be a bit of a guess. In the little chambers the satyrs are no problem (rats otoh...)
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Jun 27, 2021 15:59
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100YrsofAttitude posted:Dark Regeneration (vs Chtonic vitality)- I gives you a second source of healing and makes Darkness doubly useful. When re-doing a heat level that you lost once in you are almost guaranteed full health after a boss fight between this and the fountain. I find the +3 health is rather meaningless. It helps with chip damage, but most enemies hit you for well over this amount especially later on so you're really not gaining a lot of health. I haven't done the math but maybe you get as much as a small healing item after a whole area is done, which is hardly worth it. Dark Regen is definitely good if you've beaten all 3 bosses and then failed in the temple / vs dad. Also good for healing after chaos gates since darkness is plentiful early. But otherwise I think strict math summed over the whole run isn't the right way to look at it. Normal room darkness peaks in asphodel, is smaller in elysium, and absent in the temple. So the giant weakness of dark regen is that it loses steam in the harder half of the run. Whereas chthonic vitality is excellent in the temple, and I think a big difference-maker for whether you can afford to be greedy with extra rooms if you find the bag quick. It's like, the +3 is less than the damage from a hard hit, but it means you get gradual recovery after a fuckup without needing to force it by buying a healing item / switch to a health keepsake. 100YrsofAttitude posted:Deep Pockets (vs Golden Touch)- I think you need to have at least 220 gold at the end of each area for the latter to get you equivalent to the flat 100 gold Deep Pockets grant. That's rare since I tend to spend the money on the Charon before the boss. 15% isn't a lot of money honestly. Already at 500 gold you're only getting 75 which is fine, but it took ages to save up that 500 you know? quote:Thick Skin (vs High Confidence)- This maybe makes me play worse but I like the insurance of 50 health. I've noticed that the final boss will beat me if I go in with less that 200 health, and I don't want to have to always take Centaur Hearts. It's cool to start with 100% more health than you would otherwise. High confidence is a definitely good damage boost, but I don't think I would maintain over 80% steadily especially in the later areas and with later bosses. I imagine that High Confidence (plus other damage boost options) is completely amazing with the feather, because who needs health if you have 75% dodge? But I'm not good & fast enough to do it myself.
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Jul 18, 2021 18:16
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In other news Hades got the Game of the Year award at GDC, and also Best Audio and Best Design. Pretty amazing what supergiant has done in the 10 years they've been around, and still with a tiny team. (I hope Hades has given them enough money that they feel good to step up a notch in ambition & size. I like their storytelling a lot, and would love to see their next game tie gameplay & story together a bit more.) ApplesandOranges posted:Posiedon goes really well with fists because they're all about constantly getting in your opponent's face anyway. Huh, I've always turned down the poseidon normal attack with fists. I figured knockback would just push enemies out of the tiny attack range. Does it wait until the end of the combo to do knockback? For me the poseidon dash definitely has that problem: dash at an enemy and they get knocked out of attack range. ApplesandOranges posted:Honestly fists go well with just about every Attack boon other than maybe Ares. If you get Dire Misfortune it turns back around to great since you can stack up 5 doom combos -- if you like fat damage numbers it's a lot of fun. Aphrodite is the one that seems the most meh since weak has zero further effects that make multiple hits more effective. I'd much rather have her on the special than the attack.
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Jul 22, 2021 20:18
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100YrsofAttitude posted:Aphrodite makes it up for being the boon with the most oomph percentage wise given to attack/special etc. She gives you an immediate 50% if its basic, it goes bonkers when Rare/Epic etc. Right, but the fists normal attack starts with only 15 damage, meaning that an epic version +100% damage is only adding 15 more. That's not vastly superior to other attacks that add less % boost but have secondary effects that scale with the fist's rapid 5-attack sequence. Epic zeus also adds 15 damage per hit, plus zaps extra enemies. The Dire Misfortune add-on for doom adds a similar amount. Heck, a common artemis is +20% damage + (300*.15 = +45%) = +65% damage. Aphrodite gets the most bonus damage to attacks because the weak effect has no stacking and no inherent upgradability from poms / levels. (OTOH I'm not saying that I would turn it down, because Aphro+Ares Duo is goddamn close to an instant-win button for me and I'd be happy to get even the less-than-optimal version of it.)
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Jul 22, 2021 22:48
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indigi posted:I almost never use my cast unless it gets a good rear end boon, is that a mistake? Yes. Using your cast for the damage boost to normal attacks is a big deal for bosses & mini-bosses, even if you have the generic cast with no boon. If you have the alternate mirror switches unlocked, switch your cast type from the Infernal Soul +ammo version to the Stygian Soul regenerates every 5 seconds version. That's a great way to get more active on using the cast. I found that the really bad habit I had about casting was being choosy about which enemies to use it on. The extra steps of being out of ammo -> needing to retrieve the stones -> can cast again just made me either overthink it, or try to "save" ammo for harder waves (then forget to use it). Switching to the auto regen for a while made me way more proactive about it.
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Jul 29, 2021 20:20
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indigi posted:hmm. a dangerous decision, because I suck at video games and cannot aim properly without assistance….. what to do…. for real don't be ashamed to turn on god mode if it's frustrating, I did. The effect of it at first is you get a lot more time to study & practice the boss attack patterns. The whole genre of boss pattern learning isn't my thing so getting 1/3rd more "demonstrations" was totally what I needed. Then you can turn it off again to reset it, if you feel like it's becoming a crutch. (or if you're on PC, someone made a save editor that exposes the DR. so what I did is use that to subtract 5% off the DR any time I got 2 clears in a row.) Wildtortilla posted:Can you progress through heat faster than one at a time? If I have cleared heat 6 can I set my next run to heat 10 and get rewards for the heats I skip? no, you don't get any rewards for the heat levels you skip
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Jul 30, 2021 03:33
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Mescal posted:Ahhhh got it now. Thanks a lot! I guess I didn't understand the instructions before, I thought they said something different. The aspect of Guan Yu puts chaos boons out of the question, eh? glass cannon why not! Chaos's keepsake is no damage going through chaos gates. edit: surviving some of the chaos effects otoh is your own problem. World Famous W posted:Do health boost Chaos boons get the penalty? Cause if not, it would be probably be worth dipping in for yes, all health gain is penalized. Klyith fucked around with this message at 04:01 on Aug 2, 2021 |
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Aug 2, 2021 03:58
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To unlock the erebus gates as soon as you they appear would require trading stuff for extra diamonds, since you need 2 to upgrade the contractor and 5 to unlock gates (plus one to free orpheus if you're not a monster). Having 7 or 8 diamonds without completing some heat is not super likely. They probably should have made it a tiny bit more descriptive, or they could have made the unlock in the shop require completing a run at 3-4 heat. Buuuuuut there's also a meta-rule in games of this style that you should generally buy cheap things before expensive things. It's an action-with-upgrades game, not a full-on RPG / strategy / economic game where making choices about purchases is a real mechanic. Buying stuff out of order is never gonna be a sequence break or anything super-useful. So I would say that if you looked at all the other stuff you can buy for diamonds from the contractor -- which all have defined benefits to them -- and took infernal gates, you were kinda saying "game too EZ, I'll buy the mystery box". edit: waaaait a minute Hyper Crab Tank posted:Sure, but you can't even play with heat before you beat the game and you unlock Erebus gates almost immediately after unlocking the Contractor. Klyith fucked around with this message at 15:04 on Aug 2, 2021 |
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Aug 2, 2021 14:54
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Hyper Crab Tank posted:there are numerous sources indicating that the contractor upgrade used to have another name ("Alternate Exits") and used to cost only 2 diamonds, which is more in line with what I remember. Yeah that makes a ton more sense, must have been what happened to you & red oktober. And as a 2 diamond unlock with no pre-req it's very much a trap pick, kinda surprising that they'd drop the ball on bad game design like that. (Though I guess in early access you might do some weird intentionally-bad decisions because you want people to beat on the out-of-the-way stuff earlier than they might otherwise. Test gameplay first, then worry about costs & sequencing.)
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Aug 2, 2021 16:32
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Mescal posted:Can I only get duo boons from the god who's providing the secondary effect? Like Zeus for lighting in my festive fog, but it won't come from Dionysus? No, a duo comes from either god and both gods have the same duo for each other.
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Aug 4, 2021 03:47
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Mendrian posted:I think Elysium is kind of a gear check zone in that enemies suddenly have way more hp and so much of the survival there is just about not being sloppy. I had a lot of difficulty with Asphodel. While I kinda agree with your assessment of Elysium, I think that makes it easier, because those are things you can control. The gear check aspect is just "did you pick some complimentary boons that reinforce an action to be very good?" Most of the time the answer's gonna be yes. If the answer is no, you were probably trying to get a specific setup and the dice didn't work out. And true, the punish for mistakes is much worse. The damage is higher, enemies have faster recovery, traps are way nastier, etc. But you can handle all of that with cautious play. Asphodel is just chaos. The enemy variety is the biggest in the game IMO, in terms of having very different behaviors & patterns. Most of them play keep-away with what are effectively teleports (jump, fly, or burrow) so you have to charge in and get them locked up. That makes playing it safe around the lava difficult. What I've concluded is that I didn't have the skill to be both very aggressive and highly aware at the same time. In elysium I can easily back off on aggro to keep more defensive awareness. In asphodel that doesn't work for me, I end up taking more damage than going balls-out. I almost always equip the duster for asphodel to hit the hydra with good health, whereas for elysium I can take a damage or boon item.
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Aug 4, 2021 22:37
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Mescal posted:If I keep a god's keepsake after a boss do I get their boon again or does it just increase rarity after the first? The forced-next-appearance works once per run. The rarity works every single time you get a boon from that god.
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Aug 5, 2021 02:49
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How to Guan Yu: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kgeijiLRy4E The thing that makes it a good weapon isn't the healing, it's the damage output of the normal and special attacks. The standard 3-hit attack combo does 40-60-100 damage right out the gate! The special is fast and has pierce by default, which is great for mob packs. It's an extreme glass cannon weapon. The ranged spin-blade isn't your main attack, it's what you use to recover. The fact that they've needed to nerf it multiple times since they added it says it's not underpowered. (IMO they should have made the life penalty static and had the titan blood upgrade damage or something else, because the -70% health when you start is just too much. You need to put a lot of blood into it to make it usable.)
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Aug 7, 2021 22:27
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Mescal posted:Well, it hits pretty hard. I thought it was a glass cannon. The description doesn't say it heals The vague descriptions of various effects on weapons, boons, etc are my one major criticism of the game. Sometimes they're just totally inadequate, especially weapons. I suppose that's why Skelly is there -- you might try it out and notice that the charge-spin makes a little +1❤ on you when you use it. Ooooor you might not. And some of the more complex boons are hard to understand from the 1-sentance description. There's a good wiki if you care more about hard info than spoilers. Ultima66 posted:Guan Yu is a good base weapon due to the numbers being good for a spear, but the HP penalty is a really serious drawback. It's the only spear I like at all because I think spear as a base weapon feels very weak, but I still feel like it's one of the hardest weapons because of the huge drawback. Yeah no argument that it's a hard weapon to use. It's gonna be a very different weapon in the hands of normal person rather than the godlike I-do-100-heat-speedruns skills. If you need the healing to keep your life up, it becomes a much more slow and methodical weapon. The spear in general is one of my favorite weapons, but I can't get anywhere with guan yu myself because I don't have enough blood to reduce the health penalty.
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Aug 7, 2021 23:42
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Draadnagel posted:I got a question. If I find a chaos gate and the other gates are great choices (hammer/duo gods) do i lose the normal gate choices if I choose the chaos gate. I've skipped the chaos gates because of the risk but how does it work? Is the chaos realm just a stand-in and are the rest of the choices kept or is it completely random what choices you get in the chaos realm? Choosing a chaos gate turns down the other choices, and I don't think the doors out of chaos have anything to do with the doors in the room you came from. Chaos counts as a room (towards the room number where you find each boss: 14, 24, & 36). So for the duo gods example, you're turning it down and won't get it back. Hammer is special though: if you are in tartarus or asphodel, it should be offered to you again in a future room if you take a different exit. The game tries to make sure you get 1 hammer before elysium. Choice between chaos or your first hammer is kinda tough. Doing chaos earlier is always nice, because even the worst penalty is not hard to overcome in tartarus. OTOH hammers can be the thing that totally defines your build, so taking that early and choosing boons that combo is important. No right choice, which to pick is highly situational.
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Aug 8, 2021 00:16
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Mescal posted:I mean some of them deflect, some of them don't. With the boon. Is it heavy attacks? Whatever's doing more damage? All of them can be deflected. There's a timing window that's tighter than you might think at first. If you have deflect on attacks, the deflect is not active during any wind-up or cooldown part of the full attack -- only the part that's actually the damage-dealing "attack". Projectiles make the deflect seem really easy. Deflecting melee attacks is a lot harder because the window of the enemy attack and your deflect have to line up. Fists with a deflect on the normal attack are really good because they have no pause between attacks in a combo string.
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Aug 8, 2021 15:09
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Sanctum posted:Is Hermes' Swift Flourish special attack speed boon actually good for the Zeus Shield? I would not have assumed that, and in fact would generally assume the other way: that it only makes it move faster. Pretty much everything in the game that does damage over time has a set hits/second, and I don't think effects change that timing. Sanctum posted:there's 3 ways to deal damage with the Zeus shield special So the blitz disc doesn't go forever, so you can also just throw it into the center of a room and fight in open space near it. That way you get plenty of room to dodge, and can easily kite enemies into it (which doesn't really work when it's against a wall). Also you can use the knockback of the standard attack to push enemies into the disc. Doesn't work in small rooms & areas with non-kiting enemies (ie most asphodel ones) ofc. Sanctum posted:I guess Swift Flourish is good if there is some enemy just standing still next to a wall? That's not really a thing though. That's a lot of ranged attackers (witches, strongbows, theseus) that have "avoid player" AI -- they tend to back up until they're on walls. I'll toss a blitz disc at a corner where some ranged guys have collected while I'm taking care of the melee ones. Getting out damage, even inefficient hopeful damage, is great if it's attention-free. I think if the Swift Flourish worked on the hits/second of the blitz disc it'd totally be worth using, but I'd need to see evidence to believe it did more than speed up the movement.
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Aug 9, 2021 15:47
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Zeus chain lightning cast is definitely only one hit per target, no bounce-backs. There's a secondary boon that upgrades the number of bounces up to +8, which if it could hit more than once would just be totally broken. What it can do is bounce off walls when it hasn't hit anything yet. Not massively useful, but in a situation where you want to shoot around a corner it's one of the few attacks that can. Worth remembering when you're hiding behind a pillar during beam spam you can possibly get a hit or two in by reflecting bolts if the geometry works out.
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Aug 10, 2021 14:58
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My entry for fastest boss melting: one time I had a sword run that wasn't a hyper-specific combo, just a generally great set of boons from aphrodite, artemis, and demeter: +damage (aphrodite secondary, double nova hammer, ravenous will, privileged status) +crits (nemesis blade, pressure points, artemis cast & call, heart rend duo) +long duration curses (weak, chill from dash & snow burst, killing freeze) so priv status was easy Plus I was using a more offensive set of mirror options like ruthless reflex, when I'm normally way on the defense side. Basically once it unloaded a full set of everything to trigger the conditions and turn on the nemesis crits, the damage was stupid 300-600 numbers all over the place. It was the first time that I was like, yeah I can just DPS-race Hades and win easily. I hadn't been counting wins, that was my 10th.
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Aug 10, 2021 23:26
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Mescal posted:If I use a loaded cast in a weapon, does it proc synergistic things, like the cast gives them a status effect, the attack does bonus against baddies with that status effect? So the sequence of events for a standard attack is: 1. OnHit (which triggers things like enemy stun, revenge boons, etc) 2. CalculateDamage 3. DamageEnemy (which is also where status effects are applied) This is all from game code, which SuperGiant has helpfully left as plain text LUA files in the scripts directory. So normally you can never proc a bonus or synergy in the same hit. Buuuuuuut casts loaded into the bow or shield aren't one hit. From what I can tell those casts are triggered in OnProjectileDeath, which is a totally separate path from engine code into the scripts. I expect, based on what it looks like in the game that the attack hits, followed by the cast. If that's the case then you could proc bonuses for the cast with the attack, but not the other way around. But I'm not sure about that, going by looks can be deceiving. It might be happening simultaneously enough that it works out like a single attack. (The script code is applying effects during damage, but the engine might be queuing those all up until the next frame.) The way to find out for sure would be aphrodite attack + artemis cast + their duo boon that does extra crit damage to weak. If a single attack with 1 cast loaded can get the bonus damage on a crit, that's proof. But there's no way to tell with skelly.
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Aug 12, 2021 19:02
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Mescal posted:Update: Athena's cast does simultaneously trigger attack damage, cast damage, and doom damage on Ares' attack with merciful end on Hera's bow. Nice! So an attack hits, followed by OnProjectileDeath triggering a cast like I thought. Glad I could help point the right testing conditions. I suck way too much to actually do the in-game experiments myself! Mescal posted:Unfortunately, even with an epic +3 Ares attack with +85% doom bonus, along with some other damage bonuses you pick up along the way, it was not doing great damage. Not anywhere near the melting that usually comes with merciful end. I will inspect my screenshots to see if there is some behind the scenes nerfing, but I think it only has to do with Hera's bow's non-atmospheric base damage. Hera bow has the same base damage attack as the normal bow though? But that's also probably part of why it felt weak. In addition to what the other posters said about merciful end being all about rapid triggers while the bow is kinda slow, the other thing is that doom on the bow main shot is kinda a waste. A charged bow-shot is 60 damage and a good doom is only adding 120. That's not super great compared to stacking up percentage bonuses to base damage. Aphrodite weak attack + artemis cast + heart rend would work, that's hitting in the correct order to trigger... but loading artemis into the bow is just about the silliest use of the hera bow possible.
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Aug 13, 2021 17:07
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Mescal posted:What's the most you can slow down enemies? Abyssal blood (-30%) + Demeter Chill ( -4% ^ 10 = -33% ) + Killing Freeze (-25%) + Numbing Sensation (-35%) + Targeting System or Rending Claws (-30%) = 16% of normal speed I think that's how chill stacks work out.  I wanna see that now.
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Aug 16, 2021 15:42
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Red Oktober posted:What about adding aspect of Arthur with greater consecration on that? That slows enemies as well as projectiles, right? Targeting System (gun upgrade) & Rending Claws (fists) are both better, Arthur w/ Greater Consecration is only -10% VVV edit: the standard arthur consecration only slows projectiles, not enemies Klyith fucked around with this message at 17:48 on Aug 16, 2021 |
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Aug 16, 2021 16:17
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