|
10 minutes, if that, to convert the Zwift hub from skewer and 11s to through-axle and their cog thing. Not bad. Now to give it a try. E: Zwift cog thing is good. ilkhan fucked around with this message at 02:15 on Dec 19, 2023 |
#
?
Dec 19, 2023 01:06
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 21:22 |
|
|
I've been doing most of my riding on my basement trainer since signing up for TrainerRoad in July 2023 and have been improving pretty drastically, but I'm having a hard time seeing the increases in performance transfer 1:1 to my outside riding. Trainerroad has my FTP as 246, but there is no way, short of being chased by a bear, that I could maintain that pace outside for anywhere close to an hour. I can usually hit 220 watts average up a climb, and I've hit 222 watts of average power over a 21 minute local time trial course, but that's as close as I can get. On a recent outdoor ride I was pushing myself hard and could only manage 199 watts of average power over 1:15. I'm progressing on Trainerroad, completing my workouts, and improving my progression levels, but it's just a world of difference. Admittedly, I do use erg mode on my trainer so I don't think about shifting often. It's basically just pedal, pedal, pedal. My trainer setup is an old 90s Bianchi on a Saris H3 while my outside bike is a modern Giant Defy, but I doubt the geometry/mechanicals would make that much of a difference. Should I just accept that these are two different worlds and stop trying to directly compare the two? It bugs me because I've seen a lot of people post about the opposite: riding inside on the trainer is harder than riding outside.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 18:38
|
|
|
the very short version is that TR’s ramp and AI calculations for FTP wind up giving you an FTP with a TTE of probably like 30 minutes. Can you do 3x20 or 2x30 at sweet spot without too much difficulty? If not, then it’s probably too high.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 18:56
|
|
|
TR has been giving me lots of sweet spot work lately, but I haven't done any straight-up 3x20 or 2x30 sweet spot workouts. The sweet spot workouts I'm getting are much shorter intervals (6x6 or 3x12) for my hour workout. TR has my sweet spot progression as 3.5. A 3x20 workout with 5 minute rests and warm-up/cool-down (Round Bald) would take 1.5 hours and be a 4.6, so it might be kind of challenging. To be honest, I'm not entirely certain how these progression levels and FTP interact with one another. This program definitely throws an excessive amount of numbers at you, but it's been nice to have something that tells me exactly what to do every day, especially when I can't ride outside.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 19:40
|
|
|
Hutzpah posted:I've been doing most of my riding on my basement trainer since signing up for TrainerRoad in July 2023 and have been improving pretty drastically, but I'm having a hard time seeing the increases in performance transfer 1:1 to my outside riding. Trainerroad has my FTP as 246, but there is no way, short of being chased by a bear, that I could maintain that pace outside for anywhere close to an hour. I can usually hit 220 watts average up a climb, and I've hit 222 watts of average power over a 21 minute local time trial course, but that's as close as I can get. On a recent outdoor ride I was pushing myself hard and could only manage 199 watts of average power over 1:15. I'm progressing on Trainerroad, completing my workouts, and improving my progression levels, but it's just a world of difference. Is your power meter the same between indoor and outdoor? That could be part of it. Pretty much no one does an hour long FTP test. Getting all-out pacing for an hour right is hard to do even for elite athletes, so the generally agreed upon substitutes are alternatives like the 2x8 minute test or the 1x20 test or the ramp test. None of them are perfect, but there's enough data supporting their use that they've become generally agreed upon substitutes. At the end of the day, as long as your FTP (however you measure it) is going up and you're completing harder workouts, you're improving.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 20:08
|
|
|
Residency Evil posted:Is your power meter the same between indoor and outdoor? That could be part of it. My indoor power meter is on the Saris trainer and my outside power meter is a single-sided 4iiii crank. I calibrate the power meters somewhat frequently but I suppose I could try to but the outdoor bike on the trainer at some point and see if the power meters are reading similarly. Someone on this forum said something about cycling being the best exercise for nerds and they weren't kidding. Looking at my strava/trainerroad stats tickles the same thing that liked seeing numbers go up when I played MMOs. I recently set up an intervals.icu account for no real reason and... wow... that's a whole new pile of numbers that I have no idea what to do with.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 20:22
|
|
|
FTP and Progression Level don't interact for all intents and purposes. The "better" you are at a particular type of workout the harder you'll be able to go in them. As a personal example, I'm not horrible at VO2Max and have completed upwards of level 8 workouts. I start losing my poo poo at level 5 threshold workouts. FTP is just the training number used for the watts you ride as all TR workouts are just various permutations of X% FTP for Y seconds.
|
|
#
?
Jan 4, 2024 20:50
|
|
|
How are your times changing outside on that climb? Are you getting any quicker?
|
|
#
?
Jan 5, 2024 05:18
|
|
|
vikingstrike posted:How are your times changing outside on that climb? Are you getting any quicker? I am yes. I'm definitely improving, it's just not a 1 to 1 between inside and outside.
|
|
#
?
Jan 5, 2024 14:07
|
|
|
Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:Just buy an Elite Direto and save $500 Been thinking about getting into Zwift to mitigate my lack of time for actual riding and cultivation of dad bod mass.
|
|
#
?
Jan 5, 2024 20:55
|
|
|
My friend is going to loan me his Saris H3. I think I'll enjoy Zwift. I've done some indoor Kaiser bike sessions at the gym mid winter. Did one drill I called "around the clock" which basically I would ramp up the resistance for 15-30 seconds and then wind down. Gave myself a minute and a half of rest then cranked it up again. I think I was trying to replicate a fast rotating pace line. Id do that for 20 minutes and be wrecked. Always did 15 minutes warm up to steady and then a proper full resistance sprint at the end. I had a massive pool of sweat to clean up by the end of that. Any ways my training had always been low tech, but I think the zwift will keep me interested. The whole point is to be able to show up for the group ride and not just get ejected out the back on the first climb.
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2024 05:10
|
|
|
The organized rubber band rides are pretty good for that . I’d been playing with the pace partner robots, but haven’t had the best time with those lately . Zwift has bugged out and suddenly the robot is +4 sec , or it hits and incline and slows way down so you blow out of the pace group forward . That and when you start it , it drops you in with only a few seconds to speed up . Club based rides from ZER or Herd are my preference if they sync with my schedule .
|
|
#
?
Jan 7, 2024 15:23
|
|
|
Doing the ~12wk "Build Me Up" Zwift workout plan has added around 10% to my FTP both times I've done it. Highly recommend (with a proceeding FTP test of course).
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2024 05:08
|
|
|
Just race all day every day.
|
|
#
?
Jan 8, 2024 05:27
|
|
|
So the trainer I'm borrowing from my friend has a 12 speed 11-34, which doesn't work with either of my bikes. Boo, I was hoping to get it set up last night. Speaking of cassettes it probably makes the most sense just to put an 11 speed 11-28 on there, same as my road bike and my babby mommas road bike, even though I might use my CX bike on there sometimes. I guess it's splitting hairs to put an 11-30 as that's the max for my road bikes RD any ways. Not even sure how gearing works in Zwift. I'm such a noob. I know with ERG stuff it doesn't really matter.
|
|
#
?
Jan 10, 2024 18:30
|
|
|
It works the same as it does on the road - change gears to meet your desired cadence or output when the difficulty changes . The H3 I am using and probably others have some slop if you shift down the power output will drop off briefly then come back up . Usually doesn’t make a difference but I found it took some getting used to in workouts with short intervals to make sure you have the segment count as completed .
|
|
#
?
Jan 11, 2024 12:44
|
|
|
turned out my friend has a 11-30 that i could borrow as well so im all set just finished my first zwift sesh. 23 km around zwiftopia. graphics are poo poo even on my 3070 RTX. lots of sweat even though my house is freezing due to this arctic outflow nonsense. would zwift again. 
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2024 12:19
|
|
|
Having a good fan goes a long way indoors. Otherwise you just stew in your own heat. I use a little woozoo thing that works for me, but some people use these industrial strength lasko fans
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2024 14:34
|
|
|
I'm rocking a headband and recently switched from wearing wristbands to fingerless cycling gloves, works better for me re: sweat. Also climbed Alpe de Zwift twice yesterday and got the drat gloves both times 
|
|
#
?
Jan 13, 2024 15:08
|
|
|
I think I climbed adz 25 or so times before getting those dumb wheels.
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2024 00:35
|
|
|
Usually whenever I want to do some specific workout I'll do it while climbing adz. Goes toward getting the tron bike too (make sure you have the climbing challenge selected). Really cold here. guess i'll do about the last big dumb long route i have left.
|
|
#
?
Jan 14, 2024 19:25
|
|
|
Failed my first trainer workout in a bit. The columbine workout is threshold over unders with some of the overs 2 minutes at 110% . Feels bad man.
|
|
#
?
Jan 20, 2024 18:47
|
|
|
drat that bonus climb got me grinding at like 50 rpm at 300+ watts.
|
|
#
?
Jan 28, 2024 02:43
|
|
|
i gotta say so far i prefer the climbing stuff over the rolling terrain ive been playing around with the trainer difficulty setting and im pretty sure i should back off 100% because some of the dips put so much resistance into the trainer so fast my pedals come to a halt lol any ways, the portal climbs rule, love that you can see what grad to expect and know what to shift into. i find the japanese themed world so hard to read what the terrain is supposed to be, and again with 100% trainer difficulty set it slams you with so much resistance. im training at my target weight of 190 lbs in game, not sure it knows that big guys dont just drop momentum that fast. 
numberoneposter fucked around with this message at 02:49 on Feb 7, 2024 |
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2024 02:46
|
|
|
Yeah I don't like how 100% feels. Maybe because you can't really see the little changes on the screen so they're kind of unexpected. I keep mine a little under half. I also only have a single 50t ring on the trainer bike so going too high doesn't work great on the steeper bits. Lower setting also lets you maintain a more even effort and pedal a little harder on downhills.
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2024 02:55
|
|
|
I'm a runner, but my annual battle with impact-related injury has me considering cross-training on a bike. I have a $300 Diamondback front-suspension mountain bike I picked up a few years ago and I've considered picking up a cheap Saris/Cyclops Fluid trainer. How miserable am I likely to find this experience as someone just looking to hit a specific HR zone for a period of time?
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2024 09:29
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:I'm a runner, but my annual battle with impact-related injury has me considering cross-training on a bike. I have a $300 Diamondback front-suspension mountain bike I picked up a few years ago and I've considered picking up a cheap Saris/Cyclops Fluid trainer. How miserable am I likely to find this experience as someone just looking to hit a specific HR zone for a period of time? If you're like me it will spiral into a Zwift addiction on a direct driver smart trainer. And make you question why you run so much. A buddy on the other hand tried a setup similar to the one you pose and was a firm "no thanks" after one go. So I guess, "it depends"
|
|
#
?
Feb 7, 2024 15:31
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:I'm a runner, but my annual battle with impact-related injury has me considering cross-training on a bike. I have a $300 Diamondback front-suspension mountain bike I picked up a few years ago and I've considered picking up a cheap Saris/Cyclops Fluid trainer. How miserable am I likely to find this experience as someone just looking to hit a specific HR zone for a period of time? I'm a newbie at this but here's my two cents. If you're not riding already your butts going to be sore initially. It becomes a non issue with time but I've noticed an hour on the trainer vs an hour outside is way worse about this since you're not moving around or standing as much. Also I find it way more boring. How do you feel about a treadmill vs outside? That being said it's ok and I'd rather stick with this than have to build back up from scratch in the spring. Also watching number go up works for me.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 01:50
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:I'm a runner, but my annual battle with impact-related injury has me considering cross-training on a bike. I have a $300 Diamondback front-suspension mountain bike I picked up a few years ago and I've considered picking up a cheap Saris/Cyclops Fluid trainer. How miserable am I likely to find this experience as someone just looking to hit a specific HR zone for a period of time? I started with what you described and it didn’t work for me. It was indeed miserable. Switching to a wheel off smart trainer + trainer road + seinfield on a separate monitor is a much better fit.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 03:52
|
|
|
At the very least I can’t imagine the ride with a MTB tire will be particularly enjoyable for both rider and anyone in the vicinity
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 05:01
|
|
|
Thanks everyone for the responses. amenenema posted:If you're like me it will spiral into a Zwift addiction on a direct driver smart trainer. And make you question why you run so much. I'm assuming there's two things at play here, the improvement in experience from a direct-drive trainer and the addition of Zwift interactivity. I'd love a direct-drive trainer, but I believe that's a pretty significant investment ($500+?) and that's a lot more than I'm willing to invest in something that I might barely use. honda whisperer posted:Also I find it way more boring. How do you feel about a treadmill vs outside? Yea, I figured it'd be like a treadmill, which is far, far from my favorite but I figured I could watch video on a tablet to help reduce the boredom. I guess I'm mostly wondering how miserable the fluid trainer is. It seems like there are a lot of them for sale which doesn't bode well. Freaquency posted:At the very least I can’t imagine the ride with a MTB tire will be particularly enjoyable for both rider and anyone in the vicinity This "mountain bike" did come with pretty smooth tires, so I can always swap those on. In retrospect I wish I'd just bought a gravel bike since the roughest thing I ever ride is logging roads, but I didn't know those existed years ago when I picked this thing up.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 20:16
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:Yea, I figured it'd be like a treadmill, which is far, far from my favorite but I figured I could watch video on a tablet to help reduce the boredom. I guess I'm mostly wondering how miserable the fluid trainer is. It seems like there are a lot of them for sale which doesn't bode well. It’s not really miserable but it’s not as good as direct drive. I rode a Saris Fluid trainer for 2+ years before upgrading and it got the job done. Running video on a tablet or using something like the Peloton app or the Apple Fitness bike classes to give you something to focus on helps a lot; just raw-dogging an hour on a dumb trainer is not a good time.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 21:34
|
|
|
I have a zwift hub and ride it with zwift on an iPad and TV or youtube or something streaming running on a giant TV in front of me. It works fine.
|
|
#
?
Feb 8, 2024 21:49
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:Thanks everyone for the responses. If the fluid trainers are cheap start there and you can always upgrade. Good news is you're not bouncing around so watching something works well. Watching a good show goes a long way. Fair warning if you do like it it'll turn into becoming a cyclist.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 01:29
|
|
|
BeastOfExmoor posted:Thanks everyone for the responses. What I was saying is that I started w a fluid wheel-on trainer watching Sufferfest videos. Which over the course of a few years resulted in a much better setup. In other words, give it a shot with what you've got and I bet you'll know soon if it's for you.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 06:12
|
|
|
If you're interested in Zwift finding a "two way smart" trainer is more important than whether it's direct drive, wheel on, magnetic or fluid. That's the magic phrase which means the app can control the trainer's resistance and the trainer can report back how hard you're working. I hate running on a treadmill and just about tolerate it with Zwift on days when it's the only way I can get a run in but I find Zwift cycling really engaging. A lot of that is because of the direct feedback you get from driving the game with your legs rather than having to set the pace/elevation manually as you do on a treadmill.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 11:00
|
|
|
Yeep posted:If you're interested in Zwift finding a "two way smart" trainer is more important than whether it's direct drive, wheel on, magnetic or fluid. That's the magic phrase which means the app can control the trainer's resistance and the trainer can report back how hard you're working. I hate running on a treadmill and just about tolerate it with Zwift on days when it's the only way I can get a run in but I find Zwift cycling really engaging. A lot of that is because of the direct feedback you get from driving the game with your legs rather than having to set the pace/elevation manually as you do on a treadmill. Maybe I'm in the minority, but most of the time I don't even pair the resistance unit in Zwift. For me the immersion from Zwift is from chasing rabbits, not from experiencing rollers or steep climbs. I actually find gradient changes detrimental in Zwift racing. I want to shift on my own terms, not when the resistance unit suddenly starts kicking my rear end or drops out from underneath me. I have not heard the term "two-way smart trainer" before. I can't think of any app-controlled smart trainers that don't report data back to a recording device. They all have built-in power meters, that's what a magnetic braking unit is...it applies braking power.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 11:29
|
|
|
TobinHatesYou posted:Maybe I'm in the minority, but most of the time I don't even pair the resistance unit in Zwift. For me the immersion from Zwift is from chasing rabbits, not from experiencing rollers or steep climbs. I actually find gradient changes detrimental in Zwift racing. I want to shift on my own terms, not when the resistance unit suddenly starts kicking my rear end or drops out from underneath me. I hadn't thought of just leaving the resistance disconnected. Does that just give you a linear resistance depending on the gear?
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 12:29
|
|
|
TobinHatesYou posted:Maybe I'm in the minority, but most of the time I don't even pair the resistance unit in Zwift. For me the immersion from Zwift is from chasing rabbits, not from experiencing rollers or steep climbs. I actually find gradient changes detrimental in Zwift racing. I want to shift on my own terms, not when the resistance unit suddenly starts kicking my rear end or drops out from underneath me. If I am just watching a video or listening to a podcast, I will sometimes not pair the resistance of my trainer. I think some early trainers would report power but not change resistance, but that's not really a smart trainer.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 12:32
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 27, 2024 21:22 |
|
|
Heliosicle posted:I hadn't thought of just leaving the resistance disconnected. Does that just give you a linear resistance depending on the gear? I leave it disconnected and let trainerroad control my workouts. That way I get my desired workout in while zwift provides the motivation to catch rabbits, occasionally look at people chatting, etc. Back when I was first in to road biking in the late 2000s, I had a regular dumb trainer that I despised. Now I’m at the point where indoor biking is in some ways better than outdoor cycling.
|
|
#
?
Feb 9, 2024 15:05
|
|