Timeless Appeal posted:

Hottake: I don't think Gadot's performance is actually that bad in Wonder Woman 1984, and I'm not actually sure anyone's performance is that bad in WW84. Wiig, Pine, and Pascal are definitely doing a pretty good job.

I think the problem with the movie is that the plot and theming are a mess and Jenkins just can't really direct camp. It's also a very oddly edited movie in ways that don't really account for the attempt at camp. Also the rape which honestly for all the movie's flaws, I probably would have actually kinda liked it if that wasn't there. Still would have been a bad movie though.

forest spirit posted:

have they been sentenced with anything though, or is this court of public opinion stuff like with Gal

forest spirit posted:

have they been sentenced with anything though, or is this court of public opinion stuff like with Gal

quote:

a video that appeared to show Miller choking a woman went viral. The incident took place in a bar in Iceland, and while the cops were not called, TMZ reported that Miller was asked to leave the bar. Her friends, she said, pulled the actor off, and the bartender, Carlos Reynir, intervened. Reynir told Variety that Miller grabbed him by the throat when he tried to throw them out. Miller “tells me they’re not leaving,” Reynir recounted. “They proceeded to spit in my face several times, so with the final push, I closed and locked the door.”

quote:

Earlier this year, Miller was arrested twice in Hawaii, first in March for disorderly conduct and harassment at a karaoke bar and again in April for second-degree assault after they allegedly threw a chair at a 26-year-old woman in a private residence. Miller posted bail on both occasions and was released but was charged for at least one of the incidents, and Hawaii police said in April that its investigation was ongoing.

quote:

An unnamed couple were granted a temporary restraining order against Miller, claiming that the actor, who had stayed with them in Hawaii, burst into their bedroom and threatened them. “I will bury you and your slut wife,” Miller allegedly told the male victim. The couple claimed that Miller had also stolen personal belongings including a Social Security card, a passport, and credit cards. No charges were filed.

quote:

In June, Sara Jumping Eagle and Chase Iron Eyes sought a protective order from Miller on behalf of Gibson Iron Eyes, an 18-year-old who had reportedly been living with Miller since December 2021. As originally reported by TMZ, the couple allege that Miller met the family during protests at the Standing Rock Reservation in 2016, when Gibson was just 12 years old. From then, Miller and Gibson developed a friendship. In 2017, the parents claim, Miller flew Gibson, then 14, and a chaperone to London to visit the set of Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them.

quote:

In the years that followed, Gibson’s parents claim that Miller convinced them to send Gibson to Bard College at Simon’s Rock in Massachusetts and said they would pay tuition through a foundation, an offer they claim Miller used “to create a sense of indebtedness.” They allege in legal documents that Miller provided Gibson with alcohol and drugs, including LSD, marijuana, and ketamine, and physically abused them. In December 2021, Gibson’s parents say they flew to Vermont to check on Gibson at Miller’s home after Gibson dropped out of school only to find that Gibson didn’t have their driver’s license, car keys, or ATM card. The filing also claims Gibson’s parents found bruises on their body inflicted by Miller.

quote:

They believe Gibson has been traveling with Miller since then, including on the Hawaii trip where Miller was arrested. Other legal documents say the court hasn’t been able to find Miller to serve the order.

quote:

She also claimed that Miller had limited Gibson’s phone usage, writing, “Ezra ‘allows’ Tokata use Ezra’s phone w/ Ezra control.”

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After people questioned the authenticity of Gibson’s Instagram statement, they posted a video to the same account to defend it. “Nobody is controlling my Instagram account. I don’t have a phone right now out of my own personal conviction,”

quote:

Shortly after Gibson posted the video, their uncle, Chief Bear Cross, who claimed he hosted Gibson and Miller in December 2021, released a detailed account of his experience with Miller. Speaking with Last Real Indians, Chief claimed that Miller told him they were smoking marijuana with ketamine, brought a gun into his home, and was constantly surveilling Gibson.

quote:

About a week after news broke of Jumping Eagle and Iron Eyes’ order of protection, yet another unnamed mother and her 12-year-old child in Greenfield, Massachusetts, were granted a temporary harassment prevention order against Miller.

quote:

According to the Daily Beast, which reviewed the signed order and spoke with the mother, her child, and a neighbor, Miller threatened the family and acted inappropriately toward their child, who is nonbinary. They say Miller, who shared a mutual friend with the neighbor, had several outbursts while in the neighbor’s home the evening of February 2. At some point, they say, Miller became fixated on the 12-year-old, complimenting them excessively and moving their chair closer, which the child says made them “really uncomfortable” and “scared.” Both adults say they noticed Miller’s eyes were dilated and they were wearing a bulletproof vest.

quote:

On June 23, Rolling Stone reported that a 25-year-old mother and her three young kids (ages 1 to 5) have been living on Miller’s 96-acre farm in Stamford, Vermont, in unsafe conditions for the past few months. According to the report, Miller met the woman in March in Hilo, Hawaii — the same trip on which Gibson joined them and during which they were arrested twice for assault and disorderly conduct. The children’s father says Miller flew his family out of Hawaii without notifying him and that he hasn’t been able to see or speak to them since they left.

quote:

Speaking to Variety, a woman who identified herself as Nadia said Miller displayed alarming behavior while visiting her Berlin apartment in February 2022. Nadia said she had been friends with Miller for two years but hadn’t seen them in person since the pair had had sex in 2020. She invited Miller over and says their mood changed abruptly when she asked them not to smoke inside. “That just set them off,” Nadia said. “I asked them to leave about 20 times, maybe more. They started insulting me. I’m a ‘transphobic piece of poo poo.’ I’m a ‘Nazi.’ It became so, so stressful for me. They were going around my house, looking at everything, touching everything, spreading tobacco leaves on the floor. It felt disgusting and very intrusive.”

While Nadia clarified that she did not believe Miller would sexually assault her, she still feared they “could somehow attack me physically.” Five people Nadia spoke with after the incident confirmed her account, and in April, she filed a criminal complaint. “I totally felt unsafe,” she told Variety.

quote:

A new report detailed allegations of grooming and manipulation.

A new in-depth report from Business Insider shed more light on Miller’s alleged behavior during their time in Iceland in 2020, including local rumors that the actor had started a cult. According to the report, Miller stayed at an Airbnb, where they invited artists and other young people to join them. Unnamed witnesses who spoke with Insider claimed that Miller would hold court with their guests every day and “alluded to possessing supernatural powers.”

Another young woman quoted in the story claimed that she met Miller during a kind of musical retreat organized by the actor. She was there for almost a week, during which she alleged Miller was psychologically abusive and “super manipulative.”

The report also included detailed allegations from Oliver Ignatius, identified as a former music collaborator of Miller’s. Ignatius alleged that he witnessed Miller’s controlling demeanor toward Gibson, which included the actor’s insistence that they change her name from Tokata to Gibson. Gibson denied the allegations. Ignatius further alleged that Miller took Gibson’s phone once they returned to Vermont in May and yelled at her for wearing makeup. Gibson, however, pushed back on the allegations, telling Insider, “That was queer dialogue about a badly applied rouge on my part, which I appreciated. I think the fact that a catty comment made by a queer person about makeup being considered abuse is actually quite homophobic rhetoric.”

Rosie D’Ercole, a 24-year-old fashion designer and yoga teacher, also defended Miller in the article. Responding to claims from Ignatius that Miller yelled at her for putting a feather in her hair while on a beach in Hawaii, allegedly accusing her of appropriating Native American culture, she called Ignatius’s claims “drastically overexaggerated.” Her email continued, “Ezra has done nothing other than try to protect people close to them despite the onslaught of press and defamation.”

Gibson also confirmed to Insider that Miller has been wearing a bulletproof vest in recent months, calling it “a fashionable safety measure in response to actual attacks and death threats.”

quote:

According to a Vermont State Police report reviewed by Variety, Miller has been charged with felony burglary in Stamford, Vermont. Police weren’t able to locate Miller until Sunday, when they were issued a citation to appear in Vermont Superior Court on September 26.

MechanicalTomPetty posted:

So do they just keep handing out court dates expecting them to show up every time they get charged or arrested? Past a certain point it must be common knowledge that Ezra is not acting in good faith or anything approaching rationality, I assume sooner or later they would have good reason to detain them for an extended period.

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

Jimbot posted:

EZRA MILLER GOES BY THEY/THEM PRONOUS

Timeless Appeal posted:

It's going to be really frustrating when Ezra Miller blows up a hospital and I have to be like, "Yeah, I know... but it's still they/them."

forest spirit posted:

Yeah I'm going to wait for everything to shake out because if they've been showing up to scheduled reshoots they can't be unhinged from reality if their handlers can wrangle them to a set and production doesn't seem to be held up by them.

I've known more than a few kooky people who have gotten into arguments and thrown out of bars, sometimes people getting shuffled out of bars are being shuffled out because they can't stand and some are because they're rowdy or poo poo like Ezra. I'm not going to condemn someone for "lovely" behaviour that tantamounts to being a rowdy drunk

All of the other stuff is SUPER sketch, the thing for me is that all of what we're hearing is the parents and some of that stuff is written it seems for maximum shock factor.

HE SCOOTED HIS CHAIR CLOSER TO THE THEY/THEM CHILD. HIS PUPILS DILATED LIKE DINNER PLATES. HIS BULLET PROOF VEST ETC

BiggerBoat posted:

Maybe IIRC Kevin Spacey had a film in the can at one point?

forest spirit posted:

Wait, the parents had that entire exchange, and then Ezra, friend of the kid next door, was allowed by them to spend the night?

forest spirit posted:

I am not defending a groomer

BiggerBoat posted:

WB is in a weird spot with Flash and I'm hard pressed to recall a situation really in line with it. Maybe IIRC Kevin Spacey had a film in the can at one point? If the film has wrapped and, from all accounts, at least appears to be decent, they obviously want it out and hope to make some money off it. But releasing it in the wake of all this Ezra poo poo is for a sure a weird look and strange conundrum. Dude has major issues and I suspect things are going end badly there.

Then again, the public loves a train wreck and I could honestly see the box office actually being driven UP if they just go ahead and bill it as "starring Ezra Miller" and see what happens. So I dunno. If they have a good film locked and loaded then just burying it doesn't make a ton of sense but they're not going to re-shoot the entire thing to edit out the star either I wouldn't think.

My money is on them releasing it with an aggressive PR campaign surrounding it and then forgetting who Ezra Miller even is. If it's successful or if they're worried about it, all they have to do is tack on a death scene or something and then shift to Wally West via some time travel poo poo or whatever and slap a bright yellow costume on a dude in the post credits talking to Michael Keaton. If it tanks, they can blame that on Ezra.

I doubt they'll just eat it but then again: Batgirl.

Splint Chesthair posted:

Excited for The Flash red carpet:

“Ezra! Who are you wearing?”

“It’s actually from several different people sewn together!”

Megaman's Jockstrap posted:

Anyone who is calling someone a groomer is just riding an internet fad at this point. Before 2 years ago this just wasn't a thing and now suddenly it's everywhere. Learn to spot a moral panic.

thrawn527 posted:

A post credit Wally West scene would actually be a pretty smart idea, now that you bring it up. Problem is, most people only care about one Flash, and that's Barry Allen. So maybe an alternate universe Barry Allen, since Marvel has already softened the ground there with Spider-Man: No Way Home?

BiggerBoat posted:

I think if the movie is good it won't matter and, from what I've heard, it's already a time shifting alternate universe reboot thing and I doubt anyone will care if a dude in a bitching yellow costume shows up and Poochie left for his home planet here. Is the divide from a character identification standpoint between Wally and Barry all that large really? I honestly don't know since I don't read DC nor The Flash much but I thought it was about on parallel with Jon Stewart and Hal Jordan as far as who the "real" character is and I honestly doubt most fans would give a poo poo, especially as a graceful way to wash their hands of Ezra Miller now and forever.

We don't have to recast Bruce Wayne, Clark Kent or Diana Prince here exactly.

forest spirit posted:

Yeah I'm going to wait for everything to shake out because if they've been showing up to scheduled reshoots they can't be unhinged from reality if their handlers can wrangle them to a set and production doesn't seem to be held up by them.

I've known more than a few kooky people who have gotten into arguments and thrown out of bars, sometimes people getting shuffled out of bars are being shuffled out because they can't stand and some are because they're rowdy or poo poo like Ezra. I'm not going to condemn someone for "lovely" behaviour that tantamounts to being a rowdy drunk

All of the other stuff is SUPER sketch, the thing for me is that all of what we're hearing is the parents and some of that stuff is written it seems for maximum shock factor.

HE SCOOTED HIS CHAIR CLOSER TO THE THEY/THEM CHILD. HIS PUPILS DILATED LIKE DINNER PLATES. HIS BULLET PROOF VEST ETC

I'll be honest if I was dummy rich I would absolutely have a bulletproof vest in my wardrobe. There would be a better, more sturdy and military tested vest for actual bullet-stopping use, but that one stays like, under the bed and in the car.

forest spirit posted:

Wait, the parents had that entire exchange, and then Ezra, friend of the kid next door, was allowed by them to spend the night?

I am not defending a groomer. I don't think queer people generally need to be helping other younger queer people, but from my understanding (and I could be completely wrong) it's a difficult and problematic situation to be in - a lot of queer youth are abused by family and the lifeline thrown to them is usually thrown by older queer people who have an understanding of those situations. The problematic part is sometimes the youth are going from one trap to another. Sometimes this isn't the case but I am not about to draw a line on the sand when I don't know the whole story.

I think this is as nuanced as I can make it, so if we want to move the discussion to the sexual abuse in Hollywood thread I'm game. I don't want to excuse anyone's bad behaviour but everyone's got a shaky hair trigger

The Flash is pretty cool tho.

forest spirit posted:

Yeah they are a menace. Last time I'll say anything but it seems like all of this has happened in the past 4 months. I think they are going through some sort of mental health meltdown, either not taking drugs or taking the wrong drugs, and it's causing harm to many people.

forest spirit posted:

I think they are going through some sort of mental health meltdown, either not taking drugs or taking the wrong drugs, and it's causing harm to many people.

BiggerBoat posted:

...I honestly doubt most fans would give a poo poo, especially as a graceful way to wash their hands of Ezra Miller now and forever.

Xealot posted:

Oh, I want them to make this movie an even bigger mess. They should deepfake and redub every scene Ezra is in with a new actor. Use Robert Sheehan or someone. Send him to the premiere and press tour, claim he's always been the star of the film, and never admit anything. WB should gaslight all of society.

And the deepfake should be Cats-level bad, completely uncanny and unconvincing effects work.

One More Fat Nerd posted:

The crazy part is WB waiting a year to release the movie. Every month they wait is another month for Ezra to get caught doing some new, worse, criminal thing, or get killed, or get killed doing some new worse criminal thing.

Their trajectory is steeply downward, given the latest was apparently breaking into some randos house to steal booze.

Smart thing would be release the movie now, while your star isn't on trial/dead.

BiggerBoat posted:

I guess but I don't know. If Miller crashes and burns in spectacular fashion from an OD, a suicide or a car wreck, the Flash movie could very well generate its own ridiculous level of morbid hype. Not saying I'm hoping for that or that it's a healthy thing to even think about but America is gonna America and we, as a nation, love a spectacular sensationalist and tragic train wreck. See: reality TV. Or even Heath Ledger's death, which undoubtedly added to the hype for TDK, for better or worse.

The way our society is so horribly constructed, a high profile terrible conclusion for this actor is basically free publicity that I have no doubt would drive ticket sales and I can easily see it raking in millions while many of us wring our hands about it. I know that sounds cynical.

One More Fat Nerd posted:

The crazy part is WB waiting a year to release the movie. Every month they wait is another month for Ezra to get caught doing some new, worse, criminal thing, or get killed, or get killed doing some new worse criminal thing.

Their trajectory is steeply downward, given the latest was apparently breaking into some randos house to steal booze.

Smart thing would be release the movie now, while your star isn't on trial/dead.

live with fruit posted:

Ledger wasn't a trainwreck, he was a tragedy. It wouldn't be the same thing.

Spacebump posted:

https://twitter.com/phil_lewis_/status/1557444793265000449?s=21&t=lyBnZcAD0H0V5N9iMvINhg

quote:

"You cannot touch me I am in another universe.”

thrawn527 posted:

There really isn't a similar situation. This is new territory for Hollywood, and could set a precedent for how things are handled in the future, for better or worse. The closest two are the Kevin Spacey movie that you mentioned, All the Money in the World, where they were either done filming, or almost done filming and digitally replaced Spacey with Christopher Plummer, and I guess the Zack Snyder Vegas zombie movie, Army of the Dead, where they (loving seamlessly) replaced Chris D'Elia with Tig Notaro. But those aren't really the same, because the replaced actors weren't really the lead in either movie (Plummer might have been top billed, but that's more because he's Christopher god drat Plummer. He was not the main star of the movie), and this is a movie called The Flash. I imagine it would be a much bigger deal to replace the lead in a super hero movie, both in regards to time/effort, and potentially in contracts. Also, it's a much bigger event movie than either of those.

I agree that I think WB's big game plan here is to push hard on releasing the movie and then ignore Miller moving forward. It's not the best plan, morally, and may in fact be a terrible plan, but it may also be the only plan they have, barring scrapping the entire movie and eating $200 million.

BiggerBoat posted:

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