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warch
This poll is closed.
warch 68 44.44%
warch 85 55.56%
Total: 153 votes
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Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

haveblue posted:

What's the incredibly bad tweet

I guess this probably has Wandavision spoilers so I won't embed: behold, the tweet

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Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Ever since Scorsese landed some pretty mild burns on the MCU all the superfans have been going into overdrive to prove that MCU stuff is Real Art and Real Important Cinema and it is very tiring.

Can't we all just enjoy our dumb superhero trash for the dumb superhero trash that it is? There's nothing wrong with liking stuff because it's entertaining!!

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Disco Elysium on console is new and worth getting (though if you already have it on PC you get all the new features as a free update :hellyeah:)

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

The way the Yakuza: Like a Dragon PS5 upgrade is working is really dumb and probably means I won't actually take the upgrade and just stick with the PS4 version. I was gonna do an NG+ playthrough after the upgrade but apparently my PS4 version save won't work in the PS5 version, even though I was already playing on a PS5 and it's like, right there

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

oh gently caress I forgot Rise comes out this month

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Spider-Verse is my favorite superhero movie and it isn't even close

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Elden Ring is now officially joining Death Stranding and Cyberpunk 2077 on the list of games that I reached hype fatigue for and entirely stopped caring about before even a single gameplay trailer came out

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

hatty posted:

Seems like the solution is to never get hype or listen to those that are in the midst of hype

Yeah, really to be clear it's not that I was mega-hyped and burned out on it or something. It's more that I was interested, and now I'm just tired of hearing people talk and speculate about it and all the hype surrounding it and by this point by the time we see an actual trailer I'm not sure I'm going to care

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

CharlieFoxtrot posted:

I feel like however 7 Remake 2 chooses to address this is going to be jarring. How much of an abstraction was that world map? Are they going to keep the representation of every continent being two towns, a miscellaneous location, and thousands of square miles of empty space

My preference would be to do something like what FFXII does, where there are overworld zones you travel through and the implication of a lot of space between them so you're only seeing the interesting bits.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

https://twitter.com/Nibellion/status/1366798721653092356?s=20

https://twitter.com/Nibellion/status/1366800085531713538?s=20

I've been wanting a new actual RPG from Mistwalker for a while but why does it have to be for Apple Arcade, c'mon now :negative:

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

I said come in! posted:

This is a cute looking jRPG! I hope it eventually comes to Steam.

The 7th Guest posted:

it was known to be an apple arcade title since the service was originally announced, this is just the first actual gameplay reveal

i love the hand-crafted physical environments

Yeah it looks really neat. Assuming it actually does come somewhere other than Apple Arcade (I know games aren't always forever exclusive but I don't know how often games are released elsewhere) I'll be really excited to play it.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Back to the new Mistwalker game real quick: I didn't catch that the environments are actually hand-crafted dioramas, as in they were physically built in real life

https://twitter.com/Nibellion/status/1366805251827900418?s=20

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

ShallNoiseUpon posted:

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?

It's insanely cool!!

I'm hoping the Apple Arcade exclusivity is real short or an iPhone just magically appears in my hands when it comes out, one or the other

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

I would insta-buy a port of Lost Odyssey to PC and/or modern consoles

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Yeah, FF7R's hard mode is explicitly a "designed to challenge a max-level, fully-geared group on NG+" mode.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Rinkles posted:

How many good games has Mistwalker made? I haven't actually played any (Mistwalker games, good or bad)?

The only one I've actually played is Lost Odyssey and it's extremely good.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnAWQz34PJs

New Jacob Geller video does a way better job of explaining why Dark Souls 3 sticks with me than I ever could. Really interesting video.

It's fun to see an interpretation of the story based entirely on what you get by playing through, taking it all in, and "running on vibes" as he puts it.

Harrow fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Mar 3, 2021

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

My advice for Romancing Saga: Minstrel Song: enjoy it, because it is extremely good

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

I loved both BotW and HZD for different reasons. Of the two I think BotW was the more memorable experience and the one I'm more likely to replay someday (on account of I've already played through twice and only played through HZD once), but HZD is also extremely good and has much more interesting combat.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Kerrzhe posted:

i thought this post was about BotW cause this is how i felt about that game

what kind of zelda game gives you all of your toys at the beginning???

One that doesn't want to put any barriers in front of your exploration and let you do things in any order you want. Definitely a trade-off--there's a lot of satisfaction in getting new tools as you go--but I thought it was fun. It's not necessarily the blueprint I'd want for every Zelda game but I liked it in the two games that have it (Link Between Worlds if you pay rupees, and BotW).

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Read an article about the popularity of Genshin Impact and now I'm feeling bummed about, like, the very existence of gacha games again.

Something like Genshin is a really interesting case. From what I've played of it, I would happily spend $60 on a version of it that wasn't designed around being a gacha, and I'd pay for Smash Bros-style DLC character packs, too. It has a lot of really cool ideas and fun combat. It's just that, like every gacha game out there, even if you can finish the story and a lot of side stuff without ever spending money, the very design of the progression systems just sucks all the fun out of it for me. Gacha games tend to have these multi-layered progression systems where you don't just level up your characters and learn skills, but you also use a bunch of different currencies to rank them up, and do the same to gear a lot of the time. And then there's just the sheer randomness of which characters you even have access to. Even if you can get plenty of stuff without ever paying money, the way you do it, and the way you progress, is just inherently unsatisfying to me.

It's obvious that the gacha design makes a ton more money than selling a full-priced game, even with DLC and microtransactions, or Genshin wouldn't do it. Maybe it's just because it's also available on phones and people seem completely repelled by games that cost even $10 on a phone no matter what the game is.

(I also recently tried Dragon Quest Tact which is another part of this. I very much want a tactics-RPG about Dragon Quest monsters! That is very cool, cute, and fun! Why does it have to be a gacha?)

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

The more I think about it, it's not even just the randomness that does it. Like, getting random blades in Xenoblade Chronicles 2 was honestly fine. I think it's the rest of the multi-layered, multi-currency progression systems that really kill gacha games for me. A hypothetical version of Genshin Impact where you still get characters randomly, but equipment and character progression are more standard action-RPG systems rather than tied into the gacha, would probably be just fine by me.

Khanstant posted:

Square or somebody made a fun game a while back I liked the strategy of but the mtx poo poo became too overwhelming too quickly. You like, lined your characters up on squares and you would attack stuff wedged between two of your characters. Can't reven remember the name now, but it was a cool strategy game puzzle concept.

Was that Terra Battle? That was the Mistwalker phone RPG where you had to arrange and move your characters around on tiles to do attacks. I thought it was a really cool combat system and I would've happily paid for a non-gacha version of it.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

grieving for Gandalf posted:

what's wrong with it other than being nothing xenoblade characters

They swapped their color schemes so Mythra has Pyra's hair/clothing colors and Pyra has Mythra's. It's one of the alternate colors for them in Smash.

Khanstant posted:

Yes! That was it, I was having a blast and then hit a wall. Tried looking up strategies or whatever to beat it and they were basically all "oh it's easy, just use this rare thing, this OP lady, and this golden idol and bim bap it's done!" I don't think there was a way to beat it with the options I had.

How bout they just make a jRPG but instead of random menu-based battles, each enemy type throws you into a different good gacha game puzzle core.

Yeah, I'd love that! I had a ton of fun with Terra Battle before I started hitting all the gacha stumbling blocks. A full JRPG with that combat system would be fantastic.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

homeless snail posted:

I don't think that really applies to genshin tbh, most of the progression is not particularly tied into standard mobage systems. there is a stamina system that gates some character upgrades, but a lot of the most impactful stuff comes from raids on weekly lockouts as if it were a mmo. much of the stuff you need is just stuff you accumulate by playing the game normally which is not at all how most gacha games work

That's good to know if I ever try to get back into it. I think I saw that weapons are part of the gacha and that just kind of shut me down right there.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

I would love to try Dragon Quest X. It looks like a really chill MMO that I'd enjoy.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

homeless snail posted:

there's a weapon banner but it's a whale trap and most of the time it's full of garbage. they also give you trash weapons as condolences on the character banners that are largely useless

the consistently useful weapons in the game are either crafted or from the battle pass which is a much better return on investment than actually paying for gacha

Oh, it's good to know my initial impressions of how much one needs to rely on the gacha were off, then. I assumed all the good weapons came from gacha pulls.

How grindy is the crafting and the battle pass leveling? I'm willing to give the game another shot and I'm less annoyed by battle passes in free games (depending on how much grinding they take to level versus how long the battle pass lasts) than I am with gacha because at least the rewards are deterministic.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

homeless snail posted:

the battle pass is pretty easy to level if you're playing consistently, I generally just do the easiest daily/weekly quests and skip some of the more annoying ones and still cap the bp when I try, my tip is just look at the list and do the math and figure out what you the bare minimum you need to do each week. also, you don't level it any faster if you buy it, so you're better off waiting until the end of the season and seeing if you reached a high enough level to bother spending money

crafted weapons are gated by weapon prototypes, you can get at least one of each type from npcs to get started, and then they're a somewhat rare drop from the weekly bosses after that. it's tight but only really a difficult grind if you care about fully upgrading weapons, which isn't very necessary

Thanks, I'll probably redownload the game and give it another go this weekend. I'll drop by the thread when I inevitably have more questions. I watched some youtube videos of high-level gameplay and the combat looks like a blast so I want to give it a real try at some point.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

homeless snail posted:

I've used essentially the same crew since launch, and three of them were freebies, just because I like the way they play. I haven't even bothered to fully upgrade them even though I'm at max world tier because if you are good at the game you can punch way above your weight, which is not something that is generally true for gachas

That's encouraging, too. I'm concerned I'll see videos with gameplay of certain characters who look really cool/fun and then get frustrated when I don't pull them (like I just watched someone kick rear end with Diluc and he looks real strong and fun to play as because I'm a sucker for big phoenix flame attacks), but I'm hoping that I enjoy the characters I do get enough that it doesn't end up mattering.

Arzaac posted:

I've probably posted this before but I legitimately like gacha systems; I think if they're done right you can have a lot of fun with having to figure out how to complete challenging content with just the characters you pull instead of whatever the current OP meta team is. The problem of course being that a lot of gacha games don't work like that, in fact most of them are designed to make you constantly wanna spend money in order to beat the next weekly event or whatever. But still, there are a few here and there where you can have a bunch of fun without spending a dime.

This is why it actually kinda worked in Xenoblade Chronicles 2 for me. Obviously there's no money pressure there, you couldn't pay for more blade cores even if you wanted to, but it still has the "randomly acquire characters" aspect. It was fun to put together strong teams with the blades that I happened to have.

gently caress now I kinda want to replay XC2

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Jay Rust posted:

Do phone games still do that “watch this ad and earn 1,250 platinum gems” thing?

You can get currency by watching ads in the Romancing SaGa one, I know

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

100 degrees Calcium posted:

Oh, does that work now? When I played the ads would fail to load or I'd get a sniper game ad that I couldn't escape from.

Yeah, it worked when I tried it, though it gave so little currency that I never did it again. Dunno if that's intended or not, or maybe it gives you more if you watch more ads.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

From what homeless snail said, it really sounds like a lot of the "bullshit" in Genshin (in as much as it, like every "forever game" or service game, has bullshit) is closer to MMO bullshit than mobage bullshit. It clearly has some of each but most of what was described sounds more like MMO or even like Destiny-like endgame stuff.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

cheetah7071 posted:

I can't speak for all MMOs but at least in ffxiv most endgame stuff is closer to stamina, in that things have weekly or daily locks on them

Well that's because FFXIV is relatively light on MMO bullshit. Like it doesn't tie your overall progression to world quest and daily/weekly quest grinds the way WoW does. If you just wanna progress one job you can just get your weekly tomes and do your weekly raid lockouts playing a few hours a week and you're good. It has MMO bullshit for sure but it's lighter on it than WoW or even like GW2 sometimes (even if most of GW2's rewards are cosmetic there's a lot of grind to get the fancier things).

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Khanstant posted:

the wholesome business model of noah's ark 3d cannot save you from gamergod

if the thread title wasn't already perfect I'd be changing it to this

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Zaphod42 posted:

I dunno, MMO style "you can do this all you want but you only get loot the first time for balance" feels like a good thing to discourage poopsocking.

In MMOs it's definitely a good thing, or at least it can be. Sometimes that kind of thing is just done as time-gating, which sucks--if there's ever a task in an MMO that'd take you like two hours to do all of but the game makes you take three weeks to do the whole thing, that feels really bad. But for things like raid lockouts, it's definitely an anti-"kill yourself playing the game all day or you get left behind" mechanic and is good.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

I'm a little bit intrigued by Outriders, if only because I've heard it's closer to Borderlands in structure than Destiny/The Division/etc. (as in, it's being released as a full game that might get DLC/expansions later rather than an intentionally-incomplete live service)

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Khanstant posted:

This is an odd thing to balance since they're the ones wanting you to be coming back every week. My dream MMO you kill a raid boss once and everyone gets the cool treasure from it and now it's dead, for y'all anyway. Then also there's a last boss and you can beat the game.

Honestly the closest you're ever really gonna get to this is FFXIV. The game's generally really good about not making you grind for stuff if you're just there for the story. You do quests and dungeons as you level, you beat story bosses, you come back when there's more story to do and just keep on going. If you sit out a couple patches it might take a couple play sessions to get caught up on gear.

But yeah MMOs always want you to repeat content because otherwise there's no way they'd have enough content to keep people playing for longer than a couple weeks at a time and there goes the whole house of cards.

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Kerrzhe posted:

that's correct. people compare it to destiny because it's got elemental-themed classes and the UI borrows very heavily (it looks nice) but the structure is more Borderlands with a story campaign progression and endgame repeatable content. also no pvp.

That sounds like it could be fun, then. I watched some gameplay videos and the Trickster class looks like it's pitched directly at me, too.

You're telling me I get a time/space magic themed class that is also basically the Mass Effect 2 Vanguard???

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

warch is unimprovable

Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

Lurdiak posted:

How can you tell lol

I played Xenoblade 2 and I know what those characters look like :v:

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Harrow
Jun 30, 2012

What happened with that bad alt-right Google guy who got fired for a hosed-up company-wide email and tried to grift off it for a while? Troy Leavitt here seems like he's just gonna be a dumber and even less successful version of that dude.

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