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Are there any ways of getting past Measurehead if you fail the physical checks (kick him / jump from Cuno's shack) and don't want to become racist? I'm asking because my wife's starting to seem interested enough to attempt a playthrough, and I was going to go with the usual advice of 'just accept failed rolls because the outcome is usually more interesting' but when I played through I whiffed the kick AND the jump multiple times, and ended up having to savescum past it, which meant meeting Everart quite late on with a bunch of un-necessary phys points. It feels like most other major story beats in the game can be gotten past guaranteed if you get the right item, or talk to someone else or progress the story elsewhere, but measurehead just seems like more of a luck-based obstacle than anything else.
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Jul 27, 2023 12:12
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It's funny the different reasons people have for not liking games. I'm pretty sure my wife would appreciate the story of DE, but every RPG she plays she gets annoyed / upset if the choices she makes don't pan out how she wanted. I love her, but there is absolutely no way she'd be ok with failing checks 'just to see what happens,' which seems to generally be one of the things fans love most about the game.
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Aug 4, 2023 12:50
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Disco Elysium but with animal crossing babble is probably the worst mod I can imagine. It would probably do real psychological damage playing it.
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Aug 4, 2023 13:02
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Probably the most impactful moment for me was asking Kim if he could see the phasmid, because there was just something about that moment that felt like "If he says no, Harry's lost it. Like properly, fully insane lost it." And again, the fact that by that point, Kim is the person you trust the most, and you're kind of doing the acid test to see if he trusts you as well.
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Aug 31, 2023 04:38
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I think the first moment I realised 'oh this isn't just a silly little game, is it?' was managing to get the sliding drawer on the folder open, and the culmination of that line with The Dream. You get a bunch of your internal processes telling you not to do it, but I remembered the line about an ex from the intro and also at that point was still thinking "gently caress you I'm Raphael Ambrosious Cousteau, I do what I want." Just the way she talks about him, the postcard about leaving for work every day, and then the conversation in the dream where Harry is like "But I did everything right this time" and her reply is something like "I know, we're just different people, and who I am now doesn't love who you are now." It's absolutely heartbreaking.
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Aug 31, 2023 14:59
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It's an interesting one because the more 'realistic' version would be to roll, and if you fail Harry drinks and the roll gets harder each time you fail. The rare occasions you succeed on a double is the only time it gets easier. You can only 'choose' not to do it when your success is over a certain threshold. But that would suck to play as a mechanic, so the way it's done in game is about the only way of doing it without robbing the player of agency the way real addiction can. I was proud of sober Harry, prouder still when Kim pointed it out to Jean at the end.
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Aug 31, 2023 15:58
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They didn't want to read the postcard, I'm not sure they're going to be able to handle The Dream. I would absolutely recommend it in most cases but ehh, caveat about the nap. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Aug 31, 2023 |
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Aug 31, 2023 20:17
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Joe Slowboat posted:Well RIP me I guess; do you know what system or systems they're using for it? It's also hilarious, the 1st episode is on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pT1OhH3F1Y It's more like Inside Out than Disco Elysium, in that with Inside Out / Mentopolis, the characters are the emotions & conceptual ideas and the inside of the human being's head is the setting. Obviously in Disco the human is the character in the external setting and your emotions and internal processes intervene as 3rd party entities. It's always worth mentioning Mentopolis though because it's great. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 01:34 on Sep 1, 2023 |
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Aug 31, 2023 21:52
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It's a great write up, partly because it sums up most of the 2 hour PMG doc. Obviously in summarising it misses some of the weirder nuance, but it does summarise the overall conclusion, which is that a bunch of creatives signed a deal with the devil and didn't realise how badly it was going to gently caress them later on down the line.
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Sep 7, 2023 20:39
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To be fair my wife has had a switch for the last 3 years and only realised it was a touchscreen last month when I pressed something on the e-shop.
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Sep 7, 2023 22:28
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Gasmask posted:Then the game did goof on me with the ledger faint and I reloaded a save straight away instead of playing it through lmao.
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Sep 19, 2023 08:40
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He would sit in cafés complaining about it homogenising art and destroying creative livelihoods, while also using it as part of his passive income side hustle.
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Nov 17, 2023 14:47
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AI is a loving shitshow and I'm glad every time I see a crypto nonce get dragged for it.
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Nov 18, 2023 19:31
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Nov 19, 2023 18:20
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the artist works for years learning the techniques of the masters in order to adapt them in creating their own style, something original that could not have existed before was the artist earning while they were practicing and producing? no they were not. in a basic understanding of economics, a person whos work has value to you must be compensated for that work, or they will stop doing it. happy to explain other basic concepts such as maslows hierarchy of needs, the monetary cost of art supplies and empathy by the way so you pay your artists, we understand that in under a minute a thousand art pieces can be fed into the black box of machine learning which can then replicate and spit out common features of the patterns it has observed. but it only asks the 'what' of the stylistic choices, and not the 'why' of the composition: why do human beings get a pang when they see the smile of the mona lisa? why do breugel's works fill us with dread? why should you just put a happy little tree right there? that is what we mean by soul-less, you dipshit. a machine does not have emotions or existential questions to resolve. it just spits out an iteration of a pattern it observed; but so stupid is the replication and observance of patterns that you have to add negative prompts like "too many teeth" and "extra limbs" for the result to actually resemble anything meaningful the resulting work is the haphazard result of a random number generator that bashed it out in about a minute, hosted on server farms whos environmental impact is becoming more and more catastrophic the more the required network of computing power expands worse, every time ai art is used in place of human art you are taking money out of the hands of the actual artists whos work is stolen to produce this generic trash. every book cover, every celebrity feet pic, every piece of background music is another artist who will have to give up to get a second job, further stagnating the available pool of styles for the ai to draw from, so well done on having gone and hosed yourself in advance of us asking you to a human being producing art adds value to the world. an ai producing 'art' homogenises its genre and drains value from the world. and a human being who stans for ai is a loving idiot feeding the tiger who will eventually eat him, because he believes against all reason and logic that somehow he will end up on the side of the tigers even if you aren't on the artists side, even if you see prompt creation as a valuable side hustle, ask yourself this: how long before they automate prompt creation? it's even simpler than producing the eventual art, after all in summary, the difference you loving idiot is that we compensate artists for the time and labour undertaken because they are a human being with human needs. a computer is not how are you aware enough of the concept of disco elysium to find this thread and you don't even understand this basic concept also gently caress off with that noncery about 'art is only good if it upsets people,' a statement dreamed up and propogated by arseholes gluing dolls together to get in on russian money laundering scams
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Nov 20, 2023 17:07
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Escobarbarian posted:Oh my god just shut up everyone, AI art is stupid but nobody is going to give you a medal for writing several paragraphs and making GBS threads up the thread about a good video game because you just hate it soooooo much  is already open, I just put it all in one post so we don't have to go through multiple pages of that guy rebutting point-by-point. I don't want a medal, I want him to shut the gently caress up as well.
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Nov 20, 2023 17:31
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Civilized Fishbot posted:I think the obvious solution here is that all art should be purchased into the public domain - and going forward artists should work for the public: creating art independently, releasing art to the public, and getting the money they need to lead lives of meaning and dignity. In the meantime, we have to look at AI in the context of the hellish capatalist nightmare we live in, and in that context it is impossible to reconcile AI stealing from artists; both in terms of scraping the results of their labour without compensating them, and also robbing them of opportunities for work.
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Nov 20, 2023 18:20
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Rogue AI Goddess posted:But that's the thing: the AI is not the problem here, the capitalist hellscape is! Without the hellscape, mainstream artists and AI-assisted ones can coexist and thrive. Without the AIs, the capitalists will continue to gently caress over all artists. ZA/UM's investors did not use any AIs to shut out Kurvitz et al, after all. If we are planning a perfect future without economic considerations, I will still probably be against AI, because I am at heart a creative person who resents the idea of a computer randomly generating something I would quite like a chance to do myself.
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Nov 20, 2023 19:46
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An admin has twice now quoted the mod saying to cut the AI talk, even I'm not dumb enough to keep going with it. Suggested topic change: Your hottest Disco Elysium take. Garte did nothing wrong.
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Nov 21, 2023 13:14
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roomtwofifteen posted:Just looked up Garte on the wiki to refresh myself on the Sylvie situation and was surprised to see that you can reconcile them and she actually was interested in Garte, but left because of Harry. Never knew that, even after 3 plays!  E: If I remember rightly telling Garte makes him much nicer to you.
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Nov 21, 2023 14:14
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I don't know, I think the contrast you're supposed to see is that Joyce is a friendly and helpful individual, but represents a nightmarish system that's wilfully destroying everything (and she's aware of this contrast); whereas Evrart is an unhelpful and exploitative individual who represents an ideology that is supposed to be for the better for everyone (and seems not to care about the contrast). Like a lot of other things in Disco, the point is in the comparison between ideology and the individual. They deliberately build up the union and the ideals it espouses, knowing you'll assume yhey're the good guys, and then you get to the end of the track and it's a smarmy shithead who's chair kills you.
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Nov 21, 2023 16:40
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That's sort of the 'devil you know' conundrum though. You barely find out anything about his brother, other than he's away sorting out other union stuff, but the implication is if you got Evrart kicked out, his brother is popular enough to just step right in his shoes. So the fear is the absolute unknown taking over, particularly knowing that this unknown will start off knowing that you personally are responsible for his brother getting the boot.
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Nov 21, 2023 17:08
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The interesting thing about unions is the difference in how they are percieved, particularly among people who grew up during generations when they were active, but also across different countries. In the UK, they are kind of viewed as a nuisance by a lot of the general public who remember the 70s (unless they were involved in one). Kind of a 'why do they have to make such a fuss' vibe. In the US however I can imagine someone growing up in NY in the 70s and 80s probably has an entirely different threat level going off in their head when they hear 'dock workers union.' Even now whenever there is mention of the docks on American crime procedurals there's usually a heavy implication of organized crime links etc. Makes me wonder how much of it was influenced by the Americans who were drafted in, the English who hosted the studio and the Estonians who were largely in charge of writing. How do Estonians generally view unions and how does that affect the writing?
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Nov 21, 2023 20:14
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In a lot of underfunded areas community centres running things for kids to do is the only thing stopping them getting bored and getting themselves into trouble. It's possible Evrart is 'genuinely angry' at the idea of kids in the area he sees himself as having domain over growing up bored and hopeless.
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Nov 21, 2023 22:27
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^^ If you talk to the kids on the other island I'm pretty sure Harry definitely broke the bird. She left because of your last drunken rampage, Garte is just putting 2+2 together and getting 5 because like you say, Harry has guided him in the direction of misogyny and either forgotten or omitted that he did it. There are a bunch of outcomes that rely on this kind of unreliable narration and it's one of the many things that is interesting about the game - a lot of the things Harry did, you only remember if you go down the sorry cop route, and often they're pretty serious but played for laughs in game - like the precinct doctor as well as your own brain kind of shrugging and telling you that even if you somehow quit cold turkey, you've likely done irreperable damage to your body and are probably dying. Like a lot of things in the game, if you consider them in an abject sense they become kind of horrifying. Ghost Leviathan posted:And the strong themes that with enough money, you can pretty much buy your way out of the consequences anyway, see Revachol's kings being downright admired for their drug habits that make Klassje, Lely and the protagonist look straight edge in comparison. Hence the difference between the portrayal of (for example) Cuno's drug taking and Klaasje's drug taking - like the difference between a clubgoer taking a bump of cocaine to feel sharper, and the raged up cokeheads who descended on the cenotaph last week. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 13:49 on Nov 23, 2023 |
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Nov 23, 2023 13:33
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Zulily Zoetrope posted:Disagree, I think it's a lot more compelling than the alternative A: pet the puppy and the good man will help you later, B: kill the puppy in exchange for money from the bad man, C: rough the puppy up a bit and then congratulate yourself on a fair and balanced decision." The only other game I can think of off the top of my head that has this nuanced a set of faction choices was Pillars 2. There's no good faction, they are all little shits in their own way but they also all have their arguable merits. I ended up fully upgrading the ship and going it alone, which I found out is the coward's choice because the inter-faction fighting (and therefore the civilian toll) gets exponentially worse.
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Nov 23, 2023 16:49
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I mean the other angle on that is that outside of theory, socialist movements generally aren't supported or understood by the general population. You can go into a deep dive about the theoretical motivations and political outlook of someone like Manana, but that's not the point - the point is that he's someone who is just living his life, doing his job, and will ally with whatever power structure promises to put food on the table. In a way he perfectly demonstrates the difference between the communist students and someone like Evrart: the students are stuck at the furthest point on the map from everyone else, discussing what they would do in a theoretical perfect world and getting into slapfights over which branch of theory they subscribe to; while Evrart is actually doing the work of providing jobs, fighting for better conditions and trying to get a community centre built (admittedly at the expense of the people living in the shanty village across the river).
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Nov 24, 2023 20:02
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The jacket is also censored, at least in the final cut version.
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Nov 26, 2023 14:36
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The other thing is that it really doesn't feel linear, and they do a good job of hiding it when you're playing until you get to the point you've played it multiple times in multiple ways and can spot the beats as they come up. The game works best trying to find out more and more about the investigation, which does kind of lend itself to repeat plays in terms of finding out different things and ending up with different conclusions, but there's also the problem that you also end up seeing the framework it's hanging on. Either they do it this way where the story is branching linear but excellent, or the clues and the people holding them would have to be randomised, which is going to be valley-of-1000-heads level of effort and isn't going to be anywhere near as coherent. I ended up going back and forth between Klaasje and the Hardies at the end and it felt like the only frustrating un-natural beat in the game.
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Nov 27, 2023 00:04
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And then rewards almost every single instance of chaotic behaviour that follows.
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Dec 3, 2023 04:59
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Alchenar posted:The first conversation with Klaasje is to teach you to maybe not run down every dialogue option you have, E: although I absolutely did not pursue the last conversation check while dancing in the church. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 16:48 on Dec 3, 2023 |
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Dec 3, 2023 16:45
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I am not ashamed of basically never being able to bring myself to make the mean choices in video games, because I just don't enjoy doing it. Yes I know I'm missing out, but I just find it unpleasant in the same way as watching awkward comedy is viscerally unpleasant to me. It's different in some games like Mass Effect where the choice is between virtuous boyscout and rebellious badass, but when it's straight up just 'here is the good path and here is the bad path,' I can never really bring myself to be bad guy. E: which is the thing about Disco's choice to present different political ideologies. I've seen enough reddit posts asking about why the game was mean to them when they 'just made the logical choice' to know that everyone thinks their ideology is the 'right' one. Bobby Deluxe fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Dec 4, 2023 |
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Dec 4, 2023 00:31
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I don't know how the game calculates things for certain, but I feel like "I had mostly equal points in everything" doesn't matter if key decisions were done in a fascist way - internalising measurehead's theory and calling Kim a slur or agreeing with the racist cab driver are in no way made up for by saying a few commie things to Arnoux or agreeing with the Deserter. E: either within the game's metrics or in real life, to be clear. Like the whole point of Gary being explicitly signposted as the worst kind of fascist is that he has such a nice affect, and he never directly does anything nasty that you see, but his outlook and internalised logic are very much bigoted. I don't know how you miss that unless he didn't find Gary or he basically is Gary.
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Dec 4, 2023 16:43
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I think i played 2/4/3/3 and can't remember what I specialised in, something dumb like I think I guessed which skill lockpicking was because I thought this would be a more typical RPG. I had no idea what I was doing and had terrible stats but still had fun. Probably don't want any stat lower than 2, but basically you can't go wrong unless you give yourself a 1 or all 3 stats, and then just accept that whatever the dice rolls, goes. E: Don't skip hand/eye co-ordination. There's a check later on. It's important. 
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Jan 22, 2024 18:06
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That's weird because I associated rhetoric with debate bros and therefore libertarians.
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Jan 22, 2024 21:50
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This is a weird thing to ask but I'm talking to someone on a facebook page who's panicking because (endgame spoilers) Joyce has left the fishing village, and is no longer available to hand in the Jam Mystery quest. He's concerned because it means he doesn't have her info or the tattoo info. I said not to worry about it, that it helps but it's not vital, but now I'm just checking that's not load-bearing info to stop Kim getting shot at the tribunal. I could probably find out by trawling a bunch of wikis, but I just thought someone might know off-hand.
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Feb 7, 2024 16:19
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Cool, I just didn't want to find out I gave him bad advice (the standard "don't worry about it, it helps but it's not vital, sometimes failing checks can lead to more interesting outcomes" etc etc).
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Feb 7, 2024 16:32
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Mystic Mongol posted:There is exactly one vital check in the game, the check to get the necktie off the fan. Everything else is tone.
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Feb 8, 2024 00:53
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Jacob Wysocki would be good, but a bit young. I'd prefer to see someone in their fifties who looks absolutely wrecked. I also feel like English rather than American, but maybe that's just me. Otherwise I would say Willem Dafoe would be incredible to see. Fancasts can be weird, especially Kim. There a bunch of asian actors who would be great, but people on reddit sometimes just name whatever Asian actor they last saw. I saw someone saying Daniel Dae Kim and he does have the calm, confident vibe, but he would be terrible physically unless he lost a ton of weight and jaw and height. James Kyson could pull it off I reckon.
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Feb 12, 2024 18:05
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| # ¿ May 15, 2024 23:15 |
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I feel sad for the people working there who have lost their jobs. Some of them are in the PMG documentary, and while one comes across as a bit self-righteous there is a dude there who was convinced to move to the UK (surely the worst part) with his wife and has a kid now, among many others. I feel sad for Kurvitz, Rostov and Hindpere having their creative entity taken from them through a series of [possibly] legal but nevertheless lovely maneuvers. Without them, no matter how arsey they were to work for, a DE sequel or DLC would not have been the same. I do not feel sad for the investors who hosed both groups, and I understand a boycott of the studio's further efforts as any future funds going into the DE pot will benefit mostly those arseholes. I doubt this will be the last round of layoffs, nor do I doubt that once they poison the name completely and the investment dries up, they will happily sell everything off and walk away; still millionaires, still not feeling a second of guilt. It is possible to think all of these things at once! The situation is complex, horrible, multifaceted, angering and sad, all at once. Capitalism's victories are never without a body count. In summary, I make you feel sad now with music: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-dhSWZTpwyE A beautiful eulogy, that ends too abruptly. 
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Feb 16, 2024 17:03
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