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Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

OwlFancier posted:

It is international worker's day so music.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FVcWEtFXwnc&t=30s

This is my personal favourite version of the Internationale, by folk singer Alistair Hulett:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5DTbashsKic

Bragg's version is alright, wouldn't mind pulling a few lines from it, but this feels more weight-y, I think, and I think shows that the song isn't quite so hard to sing as is often made out.

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Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Failed Imagineer posted:

Posting this with the caveat that I know it's "Terrible person links to terrible article about terrible people"

https://twitter.com/darrengrimes_/status/1388912978301440004?s=19

But loving hell that's dire

I would really like to see the actual survey for this, exactly what question did they ask? As presented, it bakes in several assumptions; firstly, it suggests that dying 10 years earlier is a certainty, which is isn't, and it implies that the health risk of consuming any meat is identical; even if on average meat eaters lived 10 years less than vegetarians, the reduction in lifespan for the man who eats a t-bone steak a day and the man who eats grilled chicken breast twice a week will not be equal.

Consequently, as presented it feels a lot more like a hypothetical question that isn't actually a reliable measure of sentiment. People are really bad at assessing how they would act in hypothetical situations, especially ones which carry a risk of death (witness the third of adults who say they'd take a one-way trip to Mars, effectively saying they'd die for a unique experience and their name in Wikipedia).

Additionally, unless there was an option like "I don't believe my meat consumption will actually cause me to die 10 years early", I'd wager as many people mean that when answering "no" as do people saying "Yeah I'm totally cool with dying sooner".

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Niric posted:

Interesting to see the excuses being lined up in Hartlepool, where an impending labour thumping is being presented in very passive terms with no direct criticism at all of the leader or strategy or presentation or (lack of) policies etc. I don't recall the Guardian giving labour this much slack for bad results 2015-2019
.



Tortuous wording to avoiding blaming LOTO for bad decisions:


Also just grimly hilarious to see the kind of centrist twat who spent 5 years rubbishing Labour from the inside complaining about a lack of trust

In a sense the generational shift in allegiances is true, just not in a way that absolves Starmer and his ilk of any blame. It's been twelve years since Pasokification started, and the Labour Party under Jeremy Corbyn was one of the small handful of parties that reacted to that generational shift in allegiances...by trying to shift its allegiances. Now that wing is out of power, the faction in control wants to react to that generational shift in alleguance by doing nothing. Oh hey, look, it's Pasokification, coming right back to gently caress you up, whodathunk.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

massive spider posted:

My local candidate for Zero Tolerance Policing has been posting a storm up on Facebook today and if the choices are him the the tory I may actually ending up ticking the box for the tory for the first time in my life.

I guess at a push I could see giving a vote to the incumbent ex-Tory who got deselected and forced to run as an independent because he wasn't dealing with the "traveller incursions" to the satisfaction of his tory constituents, but in light of that fact I could not expect that the man's replacement on the Conservative ticket is going to be much better than the Zero Tolerance wacko.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

When I was a teenager I had drank deep of the internet's libertarian cup and had regular arguments with my mum about politics as a result. My mum was insistent that when I "grew up and got a proper job", and saw 99% of the money I made going into the pockets of capitalists, I'd rethink my foolish teenage political views.

So, 2-0 for mums being smarter than their teenagers, I'd call that.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Jedit posted:

There's a Starmer waiting in the sky
He'd like to set out policy, but he thinks he'd blow our minds

There's a Starmer waiting in the sky
Deep down he knows he's blown it
Cause he lost the rank and file
He told me
Let the things be changed
That need to be changed
Those changes are my duty

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

If I didn't know this man and you asked me to guess his occupation, for some reason he looks like the platonic ideal of the owner of a strip club.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
I doubt any leader is really going to have any success in turning around Labour's fortunes unless they have some actual charisma. Whoever takes over from Starmer, left or right, is just going to end up king or queen of the ashes.

Like, there's truth in that whole "any man who must say 'I am the king' is no true king" meme, at least as it applies to electability. If you're "electable" you shouldn't need to be making that case, in those terms, to your party. They should see you and just know. Electability isn't about windsocking to focus groups, it's about having a force of personality that makes people who like you, love you, makes people who were indifferent to you say they liked you all along, and makes people who dislike you say things like "well, in fairness to [your name]".

Starmer doesn't have that. Rayner doesn't have that. Maybe Burnham has developed that, but he certainly didn't have it last time he ran. I'm not sure who in the Labour party does.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

namesake posted:

The appearance of having that personality is a social construct, don't run around looking for someone with charisma, find someone with good politics and a team of supporters willing to show up wherever, whenever and talk about how great they are.

A social construct sure, but we live in the society that constructed it, so it has utility. Someone with good politics and a team of supporters willing to show up whenever, wherever to talk about how great they are was Jeremy Corbyn, and while he stopped the bleeding in 2017, ultimately he failed to turn Labour around. Good politics make an election worth winning, but they don't actually win elections. I'm not suggesting that the only thing Labour needs is someone with charisma, and who cares what their politics are, my point is that Labour needs someone with both good politics and a massive dollop of that socially constructed personality that will make people actually vote for them.


I do wonder how 2017 would have gone with him at the helm. Maybe it would have made no difference, but I feel McDonnell projects more "authority" than Corbyn did, maybe that could have pushed us over the line. Harder to sing his name to Seven Nation Army though, so, swings and roundabouts.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

His Divine Shadow posted:

Big John was one of the people completely against Corbyns no 2nd referendum stance, saying so on twitter if I recall correctly. So if anything I hold him partially responsible for labours 2019 defeat. But it was what the party wanted as a whole. I just don't think it'd have made much of a difference, or even a positive one.


Oh dear me posted:

Nah, McDonnell looks and sounds like a politician and indulges in triangulatory political gaming as with his pledge on sticking within Tory spending rules. Corbyn had kindly grandpa appeal and seemed refreshingly different and honest, until all the political gaming around Brexit helped undermine that.

We really need to move away from suits.

Both fair points, I guess in the fog of the past I'd forgotten about his flaws, and those are large ones.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Communist Thoughts posted:

Why would you vote for raynor over butler

The Labour Party sucks

Was it maybe an insurance thing? In the sense that they'd worked out that Rayner would pick up some votes from other factions of the party, so if the Momentum vote alone wasn't enough to get RLB in as leader, they wouldn't get in Butler either, but they might get Rayner in as a compromise candidate. Better to have a soft-left deputy than a not-left deputy, essentially.

I think I went for RLB/Butler based on the advice of the thread? Memory's hazy. I can't believe it's only been a year and a bit, feels like ages ago.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Doccykins posted:

its the most recent constituency to have their MP assassinated and elected Tracy Brabin off of Corrie who now has to step down because she's just been elected Mayor of West Yorkshire

Starmer's Labour has already been accused of trying to parachute Paul Williams in again (an MP who lost his Stockton South seat in 2019 for being an arch Remain supporter in a Brexit heavy area and from a Labour candidates shortlist of one lost the contest in Hartlepool, also a Brexit heavy area, last week)

For what it's worth, I'm fairly sure the Paul Williams thing was just a joke by a twitter random making fun of Starmer.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Azza Bamboo posted:

Whoever came up with the "shedding DNA" conspiracy is a genius. It's got the nutjobs to start wearing masks.

Honestly, before the Pandemic I think I'd naively have imagined that the conspiracy nuts would be 100% all over wearing masks 24/7 to make it harder for them to use facial recognition to track you.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

forkboy84 posted:

Because the right to self-determination isn't that simple or Catalunya would be independent right now. Hell, Kosovo declared independence 13 years ago & still is only recognised by half the members of the UN. Whatever may or not be the strict case in international law doesn't matter because ultimately realpolitik & international diplomacy trumps it. Scotland wants to ensure a referendum is respected by the UK because it avoids becoming a state not recognised by half the world (including several EU members like Spain who have a iffy history on separatism)


The notion that Nicola Sturgeon does not want a referendum at the first possible moment is utter nonsense. One will happen during the parliament, unless the COVID pandemic is even worse than expected & drags on for 5 more years.

Additionally, it's not like in a UDI situation the British establishment would just be sitting back doing nothing. They'd be screaming bloody murder to every other country about sedition, illegality, etc. You'd expect British ambassadors in Spain to be pushing the Scotland-Catalonia comparison super hard, and meanwhile they'd be over in America pushing a narrative that an independent Scotland plays right into Russian interests, British intelligence services would be calling in every favour they could with Five Eyes, etc.

Stereotypically in the west, the English are hated and the Scots well liked, but the cold realpolitik is that existing economic, political, and intelligence ties with the UK are probably not worth jeopardising to recognise an independent Scotland, if established without Westminster's consent. That changes if you're willing to do an Ireland and have a war over it, but nobody in Scotland is picking up a gun over independence.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Communist Thoughts posted:

Why is this?
I basically accept it since I don't know the SNP that well but in terms of personal material incentives they win just as much by getting permanent huge majorities in Scotland as they do by risking a referendum.

More, really, if you consider they currently get the pensions, wages and attention of a government despite being LARPers who can wash their hands of any responsibility if it suits them since they don't really control very much.

It's actually a real nice situation for them atm

I know that right now British politics is fully dominated by people who relentlessly triangulate for political power and their own personal enrichment, but it wasn't that long ago that Labour had a leader who genuinely believed in something. The reason the SNP wants to have a referendum in the next parliament is that they really are Scottish Nationalists.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Communist Thoughts posted:

I absolutely don't believe this virtuous idealist politician narrative. But I am willing to be proven wrong! I don't know poo poo

Just when I analyse politics it's a) whether there's a route for it to happen and b) whether the people who can do it are incentivised to do so

If the incentive here for an incumbent government with no rivals is just idealism it seems like it would be outweighed

Especially trying to do something really hard that the UK is probably willing to kill to stop

I mean, I don't fault you necessarily for being cynical, but I think it requires jumping through a few too many hoops to assume that people can't have terminal goals other than their own personal advancement. It becomes, in my view, too hard to explain for many people. Like, to take an example from Irish independence, Constance Markiewicz was born into the Anglo-Irish nobility, her father was a baronet, she married a Polish count*, and she could have lived out her life happily as a member of the Anglo-Irish nobility. Instead, she became a revolutionary socialist and was one of the leaders of the Easter Rising (and was upset that her death sentence for it was commuted purely on account of her sex). Later, she became the first woman elected to the House of Commons (though she never took her seat) and later Ireland's Minister for Labour, only the second woman in European history to hold a cabinet position.

Now, arguably she had more personal power and influence as a revolutionary than she would have as a high-society lady, so it's conceivable that she was acting in this way purely because she was materially incentivised by the promise of that power. But does that seem more likely than the alternative explanation, that she truly and genuinely believed in the cause of Irish Independence? Not to me, at least.

For a more recent example, what better explains the more recent example of Catalonia? Did their politicians hold a referendum because they were materially incentivised to do so? I don't think anyone was truly surprised that Spain forcefully shut down any avenue for independence, nor do I think it was a major shock when they indicted the senior members of the Catalonian cabinet for Sedition. So I think we can certainly say that whatever the intent, the leaders of Junts pel Sí were not enriched by their decision. Maybe they were acting purely in their own interest and it all blew up in their face, but I think it's more likely that their terminal goal was Catalonian independence, and they took actions which they believed would bring them closer to that goal.

*Actual title disputed

Reveilled fucked around with this message at 14:13 on May 14, 2021

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Camrath posted:

Ah, but there’ll be more new hotness then! I’m building up stock levels atm hence the frequency of releases.

Have you ever done a maple syrup flavour? I used to buy tablet from a guy who sold in our office canteen, and that was far and away my favourite.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

The Question IRL posted:

So remember those two guys held in Glasgow?

Looks like they were legally entitled to be in the country.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/immigration-raid-home-office-glasgow-b1848079.html

Might be a case for unlawful imprisonment. As well as Defamation of their character.

I don't really get that from the article:

quote:

Director Robina Qureshi said: “The Home Office have referred to these men as illegal. Well they are wrong, and we are now investigating legal action against the Home Office for casting such aspersions.
“The term ‘illegal’ in this context is part of the hostile environment. It’s not appropriate to use it for people who have lived in the UK for several years and are part of a community.”

That strikes me as more of a defamation or human rights claim along the notion that referring to people as "illegal immigrants" is inherently dehumanising and alienating. Which I agree with, but otherwise that would be a really circuitous way to say that they're legally entitled to be in the country vs just saying exactly that.

Legal or not, of course, the home office should get hosed.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

OwlFancier posted:

I was never sure if pratchett made that name specifically to make fun of boris because I can't remembr when he first shows up.

I think it was possibly Men at Arms, which would be 1993 and so technically possible by being around the time Johnson had his column as the Telegraph's Brussels correspondent, but I believe the name is a play on "Capability" Brown, the landscape gardener. Johnson could still be a reference, but nothing else really fits, Bloody Stupid was an inventor of ridiculous things, while Incredibly Stupid Johnson hasn't invented anything, and wouldn't get a reputation for dumb ideas like bridges to Ireland for a few decades yet.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Regarde Aduck posted:

problem is what do you call it? If you're trying to keep the public informed you can't call it varient 1N1BC-1UC1F3R. They'll never remember it.

I’d give them increasingly superlative names. We start with regular COVID, then it’s super COVID, then ultra, then hyper, then turbo etc etc.

Who wouldn’t want to see headlines like “Does the vaccine protect against the new Super Ultra COVID 2 Turbo EX Gaiden & Knuckles featuring Dante variant?”

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
The other important thing to consider with a vaccine resistant variant is that it matters how that variant behaves in vaccinated individuals. There's a very long way between "can infect vaccinated individuals" and "triggers infections of similar severity to unvaccinated individuals". If the infections vaccinated people get are flu-like or weaker in severity (as in, it can leave you bedridden for a week, but if you're not at risk for other reasons, will not require you to visit ICU or be at serious risk of death), then that still resolves the main reason for the lockdown--to prevent a collapse of the healthcare system. Right now as I understand it, that appears to be the case with the indian variant--even in places where cases are rising, ICU admissions are remaining relatively stable.

It's entirely possible there will never be a fully effective vaccine against Covid. We could see it become a seasonal disease like flu where the vulnerable population needs a new vaccine every single year.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
Poetry's the extreme of language, you get utter dross, and you get some of the most impactful and emotive turns of phrase you'll ever hear or read, often from the same author, sometimes in the same poem.

Like Shakespeare though, I think modern English lessons seriously damage appreciation the art, because we put some really great poems in front of kids who don't have the emotional experience to relate to them, and then ask them to read aloud stuff they can't relate to. I do hope that the pandemic forcing more technology into teaching will lead to teachers using videos of plays and poetry recitals instead of just having Steve, age 13 and a half, read a passage with the passion of a particularly boring accountant.

Here's one of my favourites, a classic:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB4cdRgIcB8

I'm also very fond of this stanza from Emily Dickinson's untitled poem 372, about what it feels like to go numb after suffering a great loss:

quote:

This is the Hour of Lead
Remembered, if outlived,
As Freezing persons recollect the Snow
First chill, then stupor, then the letting go

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

goddamnedtwisto posted:

I have to admit that I'd never heard of that until today either, and I'm intrigued as to whether jab or jag came first, if they're descended from the same root (and if not how suck similar words got into each language).

Unfortunately the temptation to poke a little fun at my Caledonian comrades won out. The flaps comparison wounded me though.

Apparently the first recorded usage of both in the sense that would ultimately come to mean an injection is from the 16th century. Jab as an injection derives from jab as a strike, particularly with a thrusting point. Meanwhile jag as injection derives from jag as a spike, particularly the kind you get on plants (which can stick in your skin). It looks like the etymologies going back further are unknown, but you can see how both words could be analogised to an injection.

EDIT: Incidentally this is why Partick Thistle are nicknamed The Jags, because thistles are jaggy.

Reveilled fucked around with this message at 15:57 on May 24, 2021

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Mugsbaloney posted:

drat, blew it at the end there, you have to pronounce it more-eye otherwise it doesn't rhyme with lie. Doesn't count as a poem.

0/10

I know you're kidding, but it does actually rhyme!

My friend, you would not tell with such high zest
To children ardent for some desperate glory,
The old Lie: Dulce et decorum est
Pro patria mori.

One thing I really like about the poem is how it broke the entire meaning of that phrase. Before it was published people would use the line without a thought of irony or self-reflection. Now you basically can't use it like that any more, it lives on only as the lie it's called out as in this poem.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Doctor_Fruitbat posted:

That has to be made up to annoy foreigners, there is no throughline between those two words.

I believe it's speculative, but messages as a term for groceries likely derives from the Old French "mes" meaning a small amount of food. This was borrowed into English as the term "mess", see "eton mess" and "mess hall", and also into Scottish English as "messages", with mess-age being the thing you would need to make mess.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

crispix posted:

doing your messages is a NI thing as well

"redding up" meaning tidying up seems to be more localised to the bit i'm from but is apparently also somehow a thing in pittsburgh, PA

getting a skelf meaning a splinter, calling a woodlouse a slater. i could go on but it would most likely be very boring for everyone else

Never heard it before, but "redding up" makes sense, from the Old English raede meaning "to arrange or prepare".

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Total Meatlove posted:

Now do squinnying and dinlo.

Not from my area, but I'd guess squinnying to be either onomatopoeic for the sound of moaning/crying, or related to the word squint in the literal sense of doing that being the face you make when you cry or complain. Dinlo I have no idea. *googles* Apparently it's a Romani word meaning fool?

but I cheated for that one so 0 points.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Aramoro posted:

I had heard it was from going and getting things from messenger boys.

Perhaps not impossible, but that seems more likely to be a folk etymology to me. If we're talking literal messenger boys (carrying written messages), it would have to be a cross-class borrowing since you could imagine a merchant or an officer having to get messages from messenger boys, but not so much Peggy from the Gorbals "getting the messages" in 19th-20th century Scotland. If we're talking messenger boys that are carrying "messages" in the sense of groceries, that just moves us back one step and we'd want to explain why the groceries the boys carried were called messages in the first place.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
One year I got an extra week's holiday because of a glitch in the work's timekeeping system. Our shifts would show on the system about 12 weeks out, and any date after that would show blank on the calendar. The system was designed to deduct a standard day's hours if you booked a holiday for an unpublished shift, while if you booked a holiday on a published shift, it would deduct exactly the number of hours scheduled for you that day. Once, I noticed that for some reason I was showing as not having a shift for an entire week about 9 weeks out, and tried to flag it up to the shift planning lady, who skimmed my email and responded back that it was perfectly normal for shifts to show blank when nothing had been published for them. I emailed again pointing out that the shift for this week didn't look like how the system looks when a shift is unpublished. She replied assuring me that the shift would show up when the shifts eventually got published for that week.

I booked the days off on holiday, deducting 0 hours from my holiday balance and never mentioned it again. Anyone else who looked at my shift would just see I was on holiday that week.

Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles

Bobstar posted:

I have evidence for the court thread!

It's the same in Dutch, the word boodschappen means messages and "the shopping", e.g. boodschappen doen means to do the shopping, hier zijn de boodschappen means "here is the shopping [that I, the delivery driver, have brought you]". If the online supermarket needs to contact you, they'd send you a boodschap about your boodschappen. I noticed this when I moved here, and recognised it from my random knowledge of Scotland, mostly picked up from reading my mum's Broons and Oor Wullie annuals as a child.

Interestingly this is the same word as the German Botschaft(en) meaning messages (or embassy), but it doesn't mean shopping in German - for that they say einkaufen which is just in-buying.

Oh, that's very interesting! Well, that pushes in the direction of it being literally messages too for Scottish English, which is surprising, though it does still raise the question of why one was analogised to the other.

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Reveilled
Apr 19, 2007

Take up your rifles
I made a strap for my golf umbrella to carry on my back hands-free and felt like a genius. Apparently such things already existed, but exclusively in a weeb format that included an umbrella designed to look like a katana and left the holder on your back, while mine was just a simple strap with a key ring and carabiner clip, held on by tension.

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