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the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

it's all about Posting, the most important axis of praxis

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the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Toupee Groupie posted:

Incoming random rant:
Ugh, you want to Make America Great Again? Convince America that China is as great of a threat as Russia was previously! "Can't have the plebs see what communism might get them" (Laugh off a feudal society going to atomic super power in 32 years). Start a dick waving contest with the space race so taxes und so much science and technology to beat the USSR that HACCP food standards were developed because NASA PAID Pillsbury to figure out how to make food safe just so astronauts don't get upset tum tums (now the world standard for food safety). No one cared so much about high taxes. Local, health and industry was funded by taxes! Once the USA understood that they could temporarily outspend the USSR militarily to hasten their downfall, (sorry, doing a bit of arguing economically) exactly that happened in the late 70s through the 1980s. SO FEW PEOPLE SAW THE TRUTH IN THE 1990S WITH THE CUTS THE WELFARE SYSTEM BEING DONE ALONG SIDE THE CUTS FOR MILITARY SPENDING! NO NEED TO HELP ANYMORE!

Rant off.
Sorry, had to say it to someone other than the wife and cat.

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not normal, but right (?)

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

more likely that highwaymen make a comeback on particularly rural roads and start doing elaborate freight heists or something

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

PopZeus posted:

how do non-Labor Theory Value proponents claim profit is generated? is it only a function of price/supply/demand to them?

the going theory as I understand it is that value is added when money is exchanged, which is why GDP is measured that way. not from any consistent material basis, but because the transfer of money is a blessed ritual, and sacred to the nonsense religion of orthodox economics

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Cerebral Bore posted:

hard to educate people when their paychecks depend on being ignorant

coming back to this to point out it isn't hard to educate people because they're paid to be uneducated (???) but because:
- anyone with any exposure to institutional education public or private, or 98% of mass media, has been ideologically hardened against specifically the things you're trying to teach them, and
- working class people are insanely alienated and extremely miserable as a rule and depending on their professional status either promised Middle Class Property Accumulation as a long hard road to happiness (just work harder!), or are stuck in dead end bullshit trying to survive and using any of a dozen addictive behaviors to cope. usually media consumption and some combination of petty vice. and in either case they do not have the time or energy to read your bullshit essays or go to your stupid rallies. people need a personal reason to care

it doesn't help that the most active leftist currents that i've seen are full of nerds who are awful at talking to normal people, which is critical if you want to make any cultural impact at all

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

You can learn social graces, it's not even that hard. Just make efforts to talk to people about things that aren't podcasts or youtube videos

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

imagine telling people to vote for democrats to protect abortion rights when the democrats were already in power while conservative judges overturned roe and their only response was to give more money to cops to protect those conservative judges. you loving rube. you dolt!!

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

i learned like a few months ago there was an actual decade long maoist civil war in nepal, in the late 90s end of history no less!, in which the maoists mostly achieved their goals as far as i can tell and it blew my mind I'd never heard anything about it

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

BornAPoorBlkChild posted:

out of genuine curiosity, who exactly do Americans think put putin into power? Who helped fund the oligarchs? I need an educated mind here to explain to me in layman's terms

the average American genuinely beliefs russians have a gene that makes them love having a dictator and voting them into power

"dictator" here being every leader they've ever had, because they have always been enemies of the US or UK

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

propaganda works on americans because they are educated with complete nonsense in the fields of history, politics, and economics broadly, mostly by mass media since these are either not taught or taught very badly by the ramshackle education apparatus

indigi posted:

propaganda works mainly when you've trained multiple generations of children to understand and think about the world in very specific and limited ways

basically this

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Lenin wrote a pretty decent and short biography of both, I'm pretty sure

e: there's quite a lot of these i guess
https://www.marxists.org/archive/marx/bio/index.htm

I've only read the lenin ones but they're solid intros

the bitcoin of weed has issued a correction as of 17:21 on Mar 29, 2023

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

croup coughfield posted:

still struggling to explain how any westerners itt have class consciousness already if its so fuckin impossible!

something like 90% of the communists i know irl are autistic or have adhd or some other brain problem so i assume that must help

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Ranter posted:

I think my autism or whatever the gently caress I have made it incredibly logical and obvious, once I was actually exposed to and bothered paying attention to Marxism, that Marxism Leninism is the correct path. Like it's so logical to.me that I genuinely don't understand how so few other people don't get it. Just watch a few YouTube videos and my mind exploded with 3 dozen lightbulbs simultaneously going off, for days on end as I wrapped my head around what Class is. Being told and realizing I was neurodivergent came after my 'class consciousness' though. Maybe Marxism made me autistic I dunno.

Healthy young child goes to youtube, gets pumped with massive shot of many theories, feels empowered and changes – MARXISM. Many such cases!

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Wealth is the biggest indicator of class and in the US that is probably your home and how much of it you own
but then there are a variety of working classes that have no hope of owning their own home, there are legacy rural working classes that technically own their home but it is a dump in a dead town, there's however ownership works in trailer park situations where you technically own the trailer and pay rent for the lot space, etc. it goes in many directions

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Child labor expands the labor pool and abortion bans expand the child pool it doesn't seem very complicated

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Abortion is actually a pretty interesting issue from a material standpoint because the primary intent of restricting it in our specific case (many soviet countries also restricted abortion because of their specific history with the Actual Nazis, interesting historical study) is to shore up the patriarchal hierarchy, reinforce that the purpose of women is to bear children and they get little say in the matter. This is interesting because the material basis of the patriarchal family structure - one man working to support one housebound mother - was more or less eradicated by capital over the last 50 years by demanding more women in the workforce to keep wages down, and by housing prices inflating so severely that you need multiple working class incomes to afford a home large enough for children. The base was eroded decades ago but the superstructure is still catching up.

The question is what happens now with all these contradictory forces in play? Women are capable of fully financially supporting themselves and are still being educated at rates better than men. Housing prices are never going down ever. Greater numbers of people are abandoning patriarchal social structures and living in queer flophouses with 6 people to a home. Men Going Their Own Way was a funny 2010s meme but ever larger numbers of people, hetero and otherwise, are just forsaking relationships entirely because they're all driving themselves insane through media consumption and the basic material circumstances are adjusting everyone towards living in a bunker, barely interacting with other meaty humans, terrified of the people delivering all your necessities to your door. We're hardly likely to see any "breaking points" here because for most people the breaking point is just offing themselves, outside of the one in a million that chooses to off themselves by first gunning down a couple of strangers

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

cybernetics is a weird term for it considering the modern understanding of the term (=robot arms, mostly) but it makes sense to conceive of the new social order enabled by the automation/mechanization of information, as an extension of the industrial social order enabled by the automation and mechanization of production

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

genericnick posted:

Not 100% on this. Are NYT oped writers really payed for their labor or is the relationship more akin to a minor second cousin of the house of Winsor getting a stipend?

it's an interesting question on account of a big Old Money thing is to get your kid a post at some nonprofit where they attend banquets and fundraisers as a celebrity in exchange for a bloated paycheck (see: clinton, chelsea; biden, hunter) and I feel like that's a fundamentally different relationship than actually being expected to provide some form of labor for a paycheck. I'm not sure there's a term for this particular social class in modern capitalism but it comes across as more of a minor nobility role

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

mods change my name to vagabond geomancer

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

croup coughfield posted:

all land is common if the cops are unwilling or unable to enforce property rights

This is like the number one priority for the cops today

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

actionjackson posted:

does capitalism require infinite growth by definition?

you could theoretically come up with an economic form that both allows capitalists to maintain control of production and doesn't require their profits to increase year over year to the end of time, but the system we're operating inside of is reliant on interest rates to secure the social position of banks and bankers, and on population growth to fight and win wars. both of these forces predate capitalism by thousands of years

there's probably a better explanation of the process in Capital or something but that's what I, an idiot, think

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

In Training posted:

i been reading short book about the transitional stage of capitalism and it's been helpful to clarify some distinctions between feudalism w/ commerce & a market, and capitalism, where social relations changed completely to make everyone depend on the market to survive, and all the coercive laws that arise from that relatioship.

since it was short it kind of glosses over "enclosure of the commons" as a well understood historical development. But well, I don't know much about it other than generalities. Any good recommendations for a deeper dive into that period of England.

In addition to others given Caliban and the Witch is entirely about this historical period, enclosure and dispossession, the social changes that came with it, the early urban working class and the horrific conditions they were in and all the rebellions they did, and how witch hunts were employed by the aristocratic and mercantile ruling classes to disempower women who had previously enjoyed somewhat better rights under feudalism of all things. Its a very good read

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the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

the bitcoin of weed posted:

In addition to others given Caliban and the Witch is entirely about this historical period, enclosure and dispossession, the social changes that came with it, the early urban working class and the horrific conditions they were in and all the rebellions they did, and how witch hunts were employed by the aristocratic and mercantile ruling classes to disempower women who had previously enjoyed somewhat better rights under feudalism of all things. Its a very good read

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I've been super busy the last week did i miss something

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

stumblebum posted:

proletariat is just a fancy word for working class, of which there has always been only one.

just an absolute blowout on the bingo card of western "leftists"

proletarian is french for propertyless. it specifically means a working class that has been enclosed and dispossessed of land and commons and forced to work for necessities, which is a very different power dynamic and mode of coercion than the peasantry faced

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

Mushika posted:

Maybe I could phrase it better.

Capitalists have business schools or MBA programs in universities where they teach a very skewed economic system as writ from god from adolescent lit to doctoral level, with loads of intermediate levels in between.

Where should I start, and what path should I pursue?

Jose Maria Sison the founder of the communist party of the philippines wrote a pretty short but comprehensive summary of the basic ML terms and concepts

https://foreignlanguages.press/colorful-classics/basic-principles-of-marxism-leninism-a-primer-jose-maria-sison/

free in pdf and audiobook format from the publisher

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

crepeface posted:

does anyone have a concise summary of luxemburg's criticisms of the USSR?

talking about this:


this is a funny concept to me bc the soviet government basically didn't exist by the time Rosa was killed. it was a series of wartime revolutionary councils that wouldn't really form a stable centralized government for several more years

the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

BillsPhoenix posted:

Tristeham specifically has told me to gently caress off a dozen times,

he's right and should say it more

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the bitcoin of weed
Nov 1, 2014

i'm fetishizing the anti-coat. i'm alienated from its lifecycle. the anti-labor involved in the production of such a thing is a complete abstraction, to me

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