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mr. unhsib posted:
Well in the books it is specifically mentioned that Hari prevented the foundation from having any psychologists or psychohistorians at all on Terminus. The whole point of the plan is that the people can't know the plan or it won't work. So I think what happened is Hari had the guy kill him and jettison the girl. Just before that he even said he had never expected that he would be on the ship. I think he completed his plan and realized that it would only work if nobody involved knew the math and so they both had to go. This was why the dude was so mad at him at dinner because Hari had told him. It's also why he asked the girl if she still believed in the math in the sim. He wanted to be sure Hari was right before he did something so extreme at Hari's direction.
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Sep 25, 2021 00:37
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Narmi posted:This fits but it's a really weird choice since he could have just decided not to teach psychohistory, or at least keep back certain parts so they can't figure it out. Instead he opts for a brutal murder that is going to demoralize everyone and make them uncertain about their mission. True but I think the idea is that him even being there is going to effect outcomes because he is looked at as a messiah/savior...which happens to fit with the whole self sacrifice thing. He thought he would be killed on Trantor before the expedition set out but since he wasn't he had to engineer his own killing.
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Sep 25, 2021 20:25
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galenanorth posted:
Same and I've heard this from quite a few people. I can't recall any adaptation where the changes from the source material were generally liked. It bodes well.
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Sep 26, 2021 03:42
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Actually, that's an all right change"
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Good episode. Things are moving faster than I thought. One thing that I really liked was the Seldon statue was barely shown and just scenery but they obviously took the time to make it look like it was 3d printed, which is a technology it makes a lot of sense Terminus would be using during this time period. It's technology that is never mentioned or shown, but somebody on the production team took the time to get little details like that right. A good sign IMO.
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Oct 1, 2021 06:16
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Ur Getting Fatter posted:
Well what about his blue eyes that he briefly showed to the Anacreon captain. To me that implied he was secretly letting her know he was on her side? Did I read that wrong?
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Oct 9, 2021 06:34
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Yeah there are large amounts of hand waving and even then it isn't really how math works, but the idea was that when a human population gets to the level of trillions of people you can make broad but accurate predictions. Like Seldon wasn't able to predict that the empire would fall on x date through y means, but he was able to say to a very high degree of certainty that the empire would fall within a few hundred years despite at the time seeming like it was stronger than ever. That being said, shortly after he is supposedly predicting what the dynamics will be between a handful of planets as well as exactly when and what type of crisis they will face, but the initial "humanity on the scale of trillions follows certain mathematical principles" isn't too far out there. Like the mathematics of schooling fish or birds would be the analogy.
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Oct 11, 2021 07:23
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Final scene speculation: were you all like doing something else during this scene? All the blood puddles disappeared. Hari was phasing in and out of reality. It was 100% a hologram recording of some kind. Why that is being shown who knows but Hari isn't secretly on the ship and it wasn't a clone. There probably is something up with his coffin though and we could get a clone in the future. The thing the dude took from behind Hari's ear could have been some sort of brain scan or download for the clone. It's pretty obvious to me that she was sent to start the second foundation. It has to be someone who understands and can do psychohistory and she is the only other person we have seen. For whatever reason the ship expected her boyfriend to be there, but this was obviously all planned in advance since the ship came for her. So if it is not the plan for her to setup the 2nd foundation it is the 2nd foundation that was setup off screen coming to get her.
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Oct 15, 2021 19:55
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I'm pretty sure that Gaal is starting the 2nd foundation. She just got picked up by a ship specifically looking for her cryo-pod with a destination to a dark star already set. Seems like the ship was also expecting her boyfriend, but whatever is going on was planned before Hari's death so that's what makes sense to me. Or she could be being sent to the 2nd foundation that is already setup because of her psychohistory and mental skills. Regardless I think we are getting the 2nd foundation this season instead of where it was revealed in the books
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Oct 16, 2021 03:11
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Regarde Aduck posted:how do people like you enjoy anything? Welcome to TV/IV. But if the lifeboat was meant for Raych and he didn't make it then obviously the plan didn't work? Which is the opposite of what you are complaining about? And space navigation is math? I get the feeling in this forum a lot that a poster just doesn't like/click with something, which is perfectly fine, but then are unable to articulate why that is and it ends up sounding like a high school freshmen's English critique report. D-Pad fucked around with this message at 05:10 on Oct 16, 2021 |
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Oct 16, 2021 05:07
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Thorn Wishes Talon posted:Individual actions clearly do matter for psychohistory, since they are how the prophecies get realized. It's just that psychohistory cannot predict them, and doesn't have to because it's about the big picture. The things it prophesizes come true one way or another. This is true, but the book fucks this up by making the vault open at specific times rather than based on conditions. In such a scenario the specific date a crisis is resolved would be unpredictable. Also another important point is, at least in the books, everything psychohistory predicts has probabilities and is not absolute. So it is possible for an individual action to gently caress the whole thing up in some way but not likely.
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Oct 16, 2021 06:00
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Glimpse posted:I guarantee you've put more thought into this than the producers of this show. If you listen to the podcast they put out, they're all like "Wow science crazy, idgi lol" Maybe in this specific instance, but I do think a lot of details and background stuff is being considered by the producers. One great example is a few episodes ago there was a statue of Hari in Terminus. It was only briefly in two shots, never mentioned or referred to by any characters, but when you looked closely at it you could see it was obviously 3d printed because of the ridges. No character has referred to 3d printing so far nor have we been shown it, but it makes complete sense that Terminus would be reliant on 3d printing in the early years of setting up the colony. I thought that was a neat, thoughtful detail.
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Oct 17, 2021 19:04
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My guess is that the religious crisis gets worse and the empire is unable to respond to their lost ship even though they want to. Basically the start of the empire losing the ability to police/control the outer reaches.
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Oct 20, 2021 06:40
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That was the best episode yet.
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Oct 22, 2021 07:34
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LinkesAuge posted:If that was true there would be no Second Foundation. It seems people often like to make the same mistake with Psychohistory as they do with the three robotic laws, they take the premise as "truth" instead of realising that Asimov's whole point is that the story is about the flaws of the premise. This. Also don't forget that none of psychohistory's predictions are 100%. They are probabilities. Often very high probability but they aren't 100% because an individual in the right position can make a decision that drastically changes things. It's why the 2nd foundation is also created. The further the seldon plan goes in the future the lower the probabilities get. This is all canon in the books.
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Oct 22, 2021 21:36
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Lmao does Lee Pace have no clue how a real person limps?
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Nov 5, 2021 19:45
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Charles 1998 posted:I like both very much. But Foundation's first season kept on being far interesting. I remember being bored by Donnager battle in The Expanse, because it was yet another space battle where the ships just fly straight at each other going pew pew. I don't think there was any space battle like that in the first season of Foundation which felt refreshing for a sci fi space opera. That episode of the Expanse is the highest rated of the first season on IMDB though, so IDK. I guess people just can't get enough of drawn out space ship battles in tv and movies, which all seem to be exactly the same. If you think the space battles in the expanse are like all the other space battles in science fiction TV/Movies you need to get your brain checked. It's one of the few series that does it realistically with the actual physics correct.
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Dec 2, 2022 21:29
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It's very different but to be expected because the source would be almost impossible to adapt as is
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Jun 13, 2023 17:20
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Sure and just because you can tell the story on TV doesn't mean it would be good. I just don't think it would translate well to TV as is. Not that what they've done is any better lol
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Jun 13, 2023 17:47
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Notes: - Cleon assassin fight should have had Pace sporting a massive and visible erection - The new Cleon with the gene changes seems to call for Pace hamming it up even more so I'm in for the season even if the show is bad - This is the type of sci-fi written by writers who only understand popsci articles written on ilovescience
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Jul 14, 2023 07:24
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Caros posted:The worst adaptation, but the best naked Lee Pace fighting Ninja show on TV. I mean the real reason is that there isn't any executive in the industry who will put that big of a budget behind an original scifi show but will take the risk for an existing IP. Its dumb but that is where we have gotten to. It's the same in the game industry.
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Jul 16, 2023 03:58
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stephenthinkpad posted:My theory: a secondary show writer wrote a "3 Cleons" book but couldn't get it published. And he was hired to write for this show, which is showrun by an industry failson and a complete moron. Probably Tim Cook's nephew. Yeah the 3 cleons really seems like something made for another show or book they took to add to this. It just doesn't seem like something you would come up with for this show on it's own.
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Jul 16, 2023 04:47
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Rappaport posted:I don't disagree with this at all, but my question is, who exactly is the big market for this idea? Asimov is one of the big three, sure, but how popular are the big three these days? I realize us goons are olds now, but why exactly does it seem safer to make a show that isn't actually an adaptation of the IP except in name only, rather than make Three Cleons loving Around and Lee Pace Is Naked A Lot show? I just don't understand it. I would guess it's a CYA thing. If I'm a big executive trying to get a show with a massive budget approved by the bosses if I have an existing IP I can point to some marketing data for the IP: ratings on the book, how many people have read or heard about it, what a focus group says about it etc. If it's an original you've got to spend most of the budget and make it before you can focus group it. Then if it fails I can point to the marketing data and say "foundation is greatly loved by the general public, the show runner hosed it up not me."
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Jul 16, 2023 15:29
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I actually really enjoyed that episode. Even the Gaal Salvor parts weren't that bad.
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Jul 28, 2023 19:45
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Cojawfee posted:Memory wiping has been a thing since the defective Cleon was allowed to choose a concubine to plow and was told their memories would be wiped so they'd never remember it You know they are supposedly different Seldons but in this episode he said the two prime radiants were quantum entangled so I wonder if they are going to say that actually the two Seldons are the same or at least in communication?
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Aug 4, 2023 21:45
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Data Graham posted:She's really good at flaring her nostrils in moments of stress. Pretty sure asimov had spacers in his robot novels before Dune was ever written
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Aug 25, 2023 23:22
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Combat Pretzel posted:I wholly expect this getting the two into the vault was solely to make Demerzel's inhibitor go away. Her odd behavior near the end of th episode was her finally noticing it (similar to the first act, her noticing what it does). Her inhibitor is keyed to the person of Cleon, the assumption that it's his DNA since they are clones. I think the vault scene was Hari speaking to Demerzel the entire time even when his words seemed to be for empire. He was trying to convince her to act. And the interesting thought is that since Day's genes were tampered with she may not be inhibited from harming him, and if she is she may have subtly manipulated him to end the genetic dynasty so that she won't be inhibited from harming his offspring in the future when they take over.
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Sep 9, 2023 00:46
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I'd be surprised if next season didn't jump to the mule timeline. Most TV shows don't have the patience to show a big bad that's more than a season away. Although with only one episode left I'm not sure how they'd pull it off unless gale and daughter go into cryosleep again.
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Sep 11, 2023 01:58
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Cojawfee posted:One thing I didn't get is that the mule shouts "TELLEM" or whatever her name was as if he knows who she is and is upset at her. But now she's dead with her head bashed in. Does that mean the mule is alive now and knows her? No, it was established that when Gale has her visions her consciousness is actually traveling to that time period. So since Tellem was riding Gale he was able to identify her. Hence why Gale said "she was stupid to bring them here"
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Sep 11, 2023 04:41
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Loved it. A lot of it was stupid if I look at it objectively, but I loved the whole episode and season. Lee Pace was incredibly epic in all of his scenes and chewed the gently caress out of that scenery, especially in this finale. I'm glad they really leaned into the spectacle of it all. I can't remember the last show that had such a good turnaround from season 1 to 2, but I am very excited for 3.
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Sep 15, 2023 06:00
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Rectal Death Adept posted:don't rantshame No they keep coming in here posting long screeds that go nowhere and are poorly written and show little understanding of the show. It's like the spirit of TV/IV has an account and must post about how bad they are at watching TV and saying anything coherent.
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Sep 17, 2023 21:43
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