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https://twitter.com/DarrenDreger/status/1506105823109521414
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Mar 22, 2022 04:17
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fisting by many posted:I really don't understand Vancouver trading Motte for a 4th and doing nothing else. Hopefully this wasn't Aquilini's doing and we're just doomed to be lovely forever. being generous, they can do basically everything can be done in the summer which could end up being better.. just gotta get your hopes up that miller will be traded at the draft! get your hopes up canucks fans thats right have high hopes for the canucks to do the right smart thing
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Mar 22, 2022 04:19
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Cartoon Man posted:Who hosed up the worst this year? I don’t feel like anybody made any major awful fuckup trades that had us LOLing for a bunch of pages. Weeeeeeeeeeee have a winner!
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Mar 22, 2022 04:24
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I can't get my head around someone playing in Ottawa putting Anaheim on their no trade list. Is he afraid of earthquakes?
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Mar 22, 2022 04:24
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A 10-team no trade list seems like something you should check when you’re trading for a $5mil/yr winger who couldn’t hack it in a dreadful Ottawa top-6
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Mar 22, 2022 04:27
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heehee posted:being generous, they can do basically everything can be done in the summer which could end up being better.. just gotta get your hopes up that miller will be traded at the draft! get your hopes up canucks fans thats right have high hopes for the canucks to do the right smart thing In a normal year that'd be a fair reading, but this might be the most competitive season in NHL history in terms of the number of genuine contenders and their talent relative to the rest of the field, and the rental market backed that up. It's hard to imagine that the offseason will be juicier. But I guess those elite teams aren't all set to implode this summer either. The puzzling thing is that Motte was the only sale. You figure they'd either blow it all up or stand pat and try to squeak in. Seems weird to basically wave the white flag for a 4th. I guess that proves that they really don't care about making the playoffs this year -- which is a good thing because they're bad.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:30
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This is the most hilarious possible outcome and I desperately hope it's true.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:30
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Flocons de Jambon posted:I can't get my head around someone playing in Ottawa putting Anaheim on their no trade list. Is he afraid of earthquakes? Someone with family in Ottawa not wanting to take an 8 hour international flight to visit? Not sure about Dadonov's situation but it's easy to forget a lot of players are settled somewhere.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:31
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8 hours?
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Mar 22, 2022 04:33
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Flocons de Jambon posted:I can't get my head around someone playing in Ottawa putting Anaheim on their no trade list. Is he afraid of earthquakes? Somebody on Reddit suggested that some players put all of the California teams on their list for tax reasons.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:36
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Flocons de Jambon posted:I can't get my head around someone playing in Ottawa putting Anaheim on their no trade list. Is he afraid of earthquakes? Anaheim was pretty dreadful last year. Maybe he didn’t want to end up on another dead end team. Doesn’t really matter why, he put it on the list. I can’t believe Vegas didn’t ask for the list. Just because they don’t have it doesn’t mean it wasn’t contractually fulfilled by the player. Seems like someone in their front office f’d up.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:36
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I’m not sure if I’m reading it right but it sounds like Vegas is saying Ottawa told them there is no list? Vegas is definitely lovely with how it deals with players and pushes the rules, but something seems missing here. The league would have simply rejected the trade if Dadonov had a proper no trade on file. This is a very odd situation
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Mar 22, 2022 04:41
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Number19 posted:I’m not sure if I’m reading it right but it sounds like Vegas is saying Ottawa told them there is no list? lol he probably submitted his list in the proper manner to Ottawa, and then the Senators said "gently caress it, we're trading this dude anyway, we're not sending this trash to the league". Supposedly the league was unaware of the existence of the list too.
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Mar 22, 2022 04:43
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fisting by many posted:I really don't understand Vancouver trading Motte for a 4th and doing nothing else. Hopefully this wasn't Aquilini's doing and we're just doomed to be lovely forever. they waited until the 11th hour to decide to sell and ran out of destinations for their high ticket items like miller and horvat and no one wants their junk like boeser, garland, pearson and myers at a price that wouldn't trigger riots in vancouver. they probably should have tried harder to move schenn and halak tho
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Mar 22, 2022 04:43
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watch it be something incredible stupid like they wrote "Los Angeles" and "LA Kings" and forgot Anaheim
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Mar 22, 2022 04:44
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I thought NTC didn’t always follow a trade but maybe that’s only if they wave it to move?
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Mar 22, 2022 05:12
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Levitate posted:I thought NTC didn’t always follow a trade but maybe that’s only if they wave it to move? I can't be bothered to find the actual CBA text if teams themselves can't, but puckpedia says the summary is: Clauses after Trades If a player is traded before a NTC or NMC starts, the clause is removed unless the acquiring team agrees to keep it, which is rare. (e.g. Nashville didn't keep Subban's no-trade) If a player has a Modified NTC or NMC in effect, and a player is traded to a team that is permitted based on the list (no waiving of the clause is required), the clause remains in effect after the trade. If a player waives a clause for a trade, they generally agree to waive it only for the purposes of that specific trade, so the acquiring team agrees to put it back in place. The bolded one presumably applies, so either Vegas is trying to cheat here, or the NHL's faxed trade calls are not as carefully recorded as we thought.
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Mar 22, 2022 05:31
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eXXon posted:I can't be bothered to find the actual CBA text if teams themselves can't, but puckpedia says the summary is: They got rid of that in the 2020 CBA https://puckpedia.com/salary-cap/no-trademovement-clauses quote:Update in 2020 MOU: No-Trades & No-Moves travel with the Player when traded or waived. This means that if a player is traded before the clause goes into effect, the clause will no longer be removed with the new team. If players have already lost their clause due to being traded prior to it starting, they will not be re-instated.
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Mar 22, 2022 05:47
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Presumably this is a thing that appears in the contract he signed, and therefore the contract Vegas traded for, and therefore it's on them to go "hey you gave the Sens a list right? Or no?"
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Mar 22, 2022 07:44
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fast cars loose anus posted:Presumably this is a thing that appears in the contract he signed, and therefore the contract Vegas traded for, and therefore it's on them to go "hey you gave the Sens a list right? Or no?" ah but if you ask you can't selfishly circumvent their rights and wishes but yeah this, like many other things Vegas has hosed up, could have been prevented by just talking to the player and treating them like a person there's no denying they're a shrewdly run machine but... a machine is an appropriate metaphor for how they operate
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Mar 22, 2022 12:13
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Good Soldier Svejk posted:ah but if you ask you can't selfishly circumvent their rights and wishes They don't seem that shrewd this year
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Mar 22, 2022 12:15
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Lol Vegas, should’ve known the deadline wouldn’t pass without drama.
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Mar 22, 2022 12:17
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Doug Armstrong actually made a good decision: https://theathletic.com/3200002/2022/03/21/st-louis-blues-trade-deadline-nick-leddy/?source=user_shared_article “You can’t always play in that market of giving up future first-round picks, and this was a year we didn’t feel that it was important to do that. So giving up a first-round pick for a rental this year didn’t seem to make (sense), and quite honestly, the quality of player in our opinion, we didn’t view first-round assets as something that we wanted to give away at this time.” I know he’s saying it of course to defend and make himself look good, but he’s like the only executive to say Chariot was not worth a 1st are you crazy? That said, Leddy probably is not a good pickup, but honestly I was more worried the Blues would do a bunch of dumb things , so I’m just happy for not that much damage.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:24
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No one short of a genuine star is worth a 1st just to rent for six weeks.
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Mar 22, 2022 13:29
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I still don't understand why Vegas traded for Dadonov in the first place. the talent deficit posted:they waited until the 11th hour to decide to sell and ran out of destinations for their high ticket items like miller and horvat and no one wants their junk like boeser, garland, pearson and myers at a price that wouldn't trigger riots in vancouver. they probably should have tried harder to move schenn and halak tho They dumped it in and went for a line change. I think no one has the patience for largely the same roster next year but they felt they were in the race for too long and didn't seriously entertain offers on their stars until this week. If you're letting major, franchise altering decisions be made based on a month or two of games you're planning wrong. They should've been creating markets for all their players and selling early to get a jump on the market (I hate trades on actual deadline day because the prices always collapse like two hours before the cutoff). The talk for the last two months was that it wouldn't be fair on the locker room to trade someone significant which is asinine because who cares what they think they're not good enough to be making demands. This team has to change and significantly if they want to get better. I'd say it's not fair on their paying customers to trot out the same rotten garbage over and over with some fresh sprinkles on top and say things are different this time. Miller's value will never be close to what it was last month again. If their plan is to trade him in the summer now it'll be a hockey trade because picks and prospects don't move at the draft like they do at the deadline. I guess their plan is to resign him. I'm fine with keeping Schenn, he never had any value and he meshes with Hughes for $850k. Dermott is an underwhelming player and I wish they'd just kept the pick they got for Hamonic. Oh well, at least they didn't go galaxy brained and trade no one for no reason like the last group. I'm less than impressed overall, but hardly surprised. It's not a bad deadline per se, but it's frustrating seeing this group getting paralyzed with indecision. They've kinda backed themselves into a corner now because they HAVE to do something at the draft or they're effectively capped out of making any changes in free agency. They're in the wholly unenviable position of having no cap space or prospects and didn't capitalize on a bunch of hyper competitive teams loading up this year. They had a chance to profit off teams being blinded by a long playoff run, no one is doing them any favours in the summer. ThinkTank fucked around with this message at 14:09 on Mar 22, 2022 |
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Mar 22, 2022 14:03
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As has been pointed out: how did nobody (the NHL, Vegas, Anaheim) know about Dadonov's NTC when it's right there on CapFriendly?
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Mar 22, 2022 14:46
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Mind_Taker posted:As has been pointed out: how did nobody (the NHL, Vegas, Anaheim) know about Dadonov's NTC when it's right there on CapFriendly? Why has no one hired the capfriendly guy? He seems to have better, more up to date sources than any media guy out there.
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Mar 22, 2022 14:48
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ThinkTank posted:Why has no one hired the capfriendly guy? He seems to have better, more up to date sources than any media guy out there. Gentleman's agreement not to hire him because the whole league uses it.
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Mar 22, 2022 15:33
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Duckman2008 posted:Doug Armstrong actually made a good decision: He's right but unfortunately he also did the 2nd part of your post which is objectively Very Bad. That 2nd rounder isn't gonna be THAT late either since they'll probably lose in the first round and are dropping easy points left and right lately
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Mar 22, 2022 15:35
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rex rabidorum vires posted:Gentleman's agreement not to hire him because the whole league uses it. It'd also involve acknowledging these nerds know their poo poo which I think a lot of the gm's and execs would rather not do
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Mar 22, 2022 15:42
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the hawks did, thankfully the overall production is just keyed in enough that one guy leaving didn't break it https://twitter.com/CapFriendly/status/1433518063710703624?s=20&t=F13ipGESmoN-29FVDbSvkA
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Mar 22, 2022 15:47
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https://twitter.com/wyshynski/status/1506281131804663820 That Bingo card makes me think we could have some sort of Deadline Bingo next year for grins and/or prizes. (I also like how Wysh seems to have gotten buddy-buddy with Torts after years of making GBS threads on him.)
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Mar 22, 2022 15:59
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Mind_Taker posted:As has been pointed out: how did nobody (the NHL, Vegas, Anaheim) know about Dadonov's NTC when it's right there on CapFriendly? Because it’s just a modified NTC with the list required. The league checker probably looked at the deal, saw that Dadonov had the 10 team NTC, didn’t see the list of teams and signed off because as far as they are concerned it didn’t exist. I think the likely series of events is based on the NHL working like any semi-functional beauracracy: 1. Dadonov submits his list 2. Ottawa looks at it and files it away 3. They don’t bother forwarding it to the league because they know who’s on the list, so they just won’t trade him to them so who cares, sending paperwork is tedious and boring. And people being people, skipping a generally useless step probably happens league wide. 4. Ottawa trades him to Vegas, a legit trade based on the list so Dadonov doesn’t question it. 5. During the league call, the league person checks off that Dadonov isn’t on the non-existent to them NTC list, Ottawa doesn’t bother mentioning it and Vegas doesn’t ask. I would guess that at this stage, if the league had the list or if it was a full NTC, they would have asked Ottawa for something from Dadonov signing off on the trade, but it’s not the league dudes job to check that the Ottawa guys did their job a month ago. 6. I’m assuming at this point, the league would forward all the contract details they have on file to Vegas. The contract includes the NTC but no list, so Vegas looks at everything and is like “Cool, no NTC for the year” Basically general laziness and people just assuming stuff is other people’s responsibility
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Mar 22, 2022 16:30
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pseudodragon posted:Because it’s just a modified NTC with the list required. The league checker probably looked at the deal, saw that Dadonov had the 10 team NTC, didn’t see the list of teams and signed off because as far as they are concerned it didn’t exist. In this case, the onus is on Vegas (imho) to request the list prior to completing the original trade. It behooves them to ensure that the NT list wouldn’t be a millstone for them in several ways (only can trade to divisional opponents, etc.) Vegas not asking for it, and subsequently not following it, is either gross incompetence or as others have stated plausible deniability to hopefully press the player to accept his new team.
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Mar 22, 2022 16:39
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It is my understanding and correct me if I'm wrong but the NHLPA isn't super great, but regardless, this is the sort of thing that should cause actual hell-raising if they really try to make Dadonov go to Anaheim
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Mar 22, 2022 16:44
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Good Soldier Svejk posted:the hawks did, thankfully the overall production is just keyed in enough that one guy leaving didn't break it this fact alone probably makes this guy the most qualified person at his job in the entire NHL
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Mar 22, 2022 16:50
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pseudodragon posted:Because it’s just a modified NTC with the list required. The league checker probably looked at the deal, saw that Dadonov had the 10 team NTC, didn’t see the list of teams and signed off because as far as they are concerned it didn’t exist. I have no doubt this is basically what happened except that Vegas was 1000% trying to exploit the situation to unload his contract. Come to beautiful Las Vegas, where we'll try our damnedest to get around honoring our contract with you and if we decide we don't want you around anymore you'll learn what city you're moving to on Twitter!
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Mar 22, 2022 16:53
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I think its more likely that Vegas didn't realize that teams still had to honour NTCs after a player is traded.
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Mar 22, 2022 17:08
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Wonderllama posted:In this case, the onus is on Vegas (imho) to request the list prior to completing the original trade. It behooves them to ensure that the NT list wouldn’t be a millstone for them in several ways (only can trade to divisional opponents, etc.) Vegas not asking for it, and subsequently not following it, is either gross incompetence or as others have stated plausible deniability to hopefully press the player to accept his new team. It's also interesting that the sources reporters are relying on so far appear to be from Vegas, and all lay the blame on Ottawa for not sending the NTC. He's been on Vegas for the past 8 months, Vegas would have received a copy of his contract with the trade, and every NHL team must have a lawyer or AGM on staff who reviews contracts after trades. This is a $10,000,000 transaction, they didn't do any diligence on it, and their position is that it's not their fault? And on top of that, the writing's been on the wall for Dadonov since the Eichel rumours started, and if they'd talked to Dadonov or his agent at any point about a potential trade, they'd have learned about the NTC. e: I love the idea that Pierre Dorion screwed up and really sens'd 'em (and there isn't a team that deserves to be Sens'd more than Vegas does), but if Ottawa did something wrong, it would likely fall on Ottawa's AGM, Peter MacTavish, who was a labour lawyer and player agent at Norton Rose before joining the Sens. bub spank fucked around with this message at 17:30 on Mar 22, 2022 |
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Mar 22, 2022 17:26
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Again, why on earth did Vegas trade for Dadonov in the first place?
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Mar 22, 2022 17:37
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