When They Cry Diary Containment Zone

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Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Related to GM's post on Higurashi 1 but Gaius do not read this yourself yet, late Higurashi spoilers: wait does Episode 1 mention/hint at Reina? I don't remember that.

also just general kvetching here but I always hated the Rena/Reina/Rina naming thing, it tries to be too cute for no real reason I feel. In Japanese are they spelled with different kanji or something? I kinda thought all the Hig characters' names were just katakana but I really don't remember

Yeah, there's a Tip about it. The basic version is that Reina changed her name to Rena in order to more fully cut herself off from association with her mom, and Rina is just literally another person completely.

# ¿ Jun 4, 2022 07:03

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# ¿ May 15, 2024 03:26

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Oh yeah I mean I knew the second part there but in romanized/translated text it just comes across as nominative cute wordplay that for some reason grates on me a lot more than all the goroawase stuff.

I do feel that's intentional until Tsumihoroboshi or thereabouts.

# ¿ Jun 4, 2022 07:16

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Does Umineko actually (higurashi spoilers, kinda) explain the shards a bit? Or is it all just a witch's game? I'm getting so hung up on the weird Angie stuff.

If you're at where I remember you're at, it should have already come up in episodes 4 and 6.

# ¿ Jul 7, 2022 08:02

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Okay, my theory about the missing 17th person doesn't seem to jive with the witch's third letter in Episode 1, but still....I think I've got most of it...

Is there any list of red text by episode? I'm looking for 1-6 in particular, just going through those and trying to figure stuff out that way would likely be easier than just rereading everything.

Here's the one made for the LP

# ¿ Jul 12, 2022 01:20

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

More random thoughts (and at least one question) as long as I'm on a kick here having the dumbest theories ever:

First, the question. Please refresh my memory here, as this is something that is bugging me about all my theories - the future we have access to as a reader is when Game 3 takes place - all of the other games are based on bottle letters, right? Is it confirmed that Game 1 is the first bottle letter to show up? Are the rest explicitly written by Featherine/her mortal author persona, or just Game 6?

So I'll just remind you of two points here:
This chapter, Game 4

Game 6 posted:

In her latest forgery, 'End', she killed off seven of my relatives, at least during the actual story. No, if you count 'Alliance' and 'Banquet', the other forgeries she's made before now, then she's killed off most of my family in horrible ways, over and over again...

Of course I'd want to complain. However, all of her works are known for being, in both form and level of completion, the closest tales to those written by 'Ushiromiya Maria' herself. In particular, Itouikukuro's first forgery, 'Banquet of the Golden Witch', managed to show everything, including Ushiromiya Eva's escape to Kuwadorian. People wondered whether this might be the true story of Rokkenjima, and it even made it onto the talk shows...

Rockman Reserve posted:

Also, one last thing that's kind of bugging me - at the end of Episode 5 Erika says, in red, "Hi, pleased to meet you! I am Furudo Erika, the detective!! I may be an uninvited guest, but please, welcome me!! I am the visitor, the 18th human on Rokkenjima!!" But she's not - "...Sorry, but... Even if you do join us-" "There are 17 people.". Does that mean that the red text is only infallible if the person using it believes it's true? Or is that just a weird minor error as Game 5 goes completely loving bonkers at the end?

Note the distinction between "human" and "people".

# ¿ Jul 13, 2022 17:42

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Okay, please refresh my memory - is Angie's book that she shows the weird old nerd guy supposedly one of Maria's notebooks, is it something she received from Featherine, or what?

Also, it's really interesting that per Episodes 3-6, if not Games 3-6, the bodies were never found?? I really need to reread 6 when Angie goes to Rokkenjima.

It is a notebook from Maria that has a bit of writing from Beatrice at the end.

Regarding the second point, a few points of clarification: As per Episode 1, very few recognizable body parts were findable, one of the few exceptions being a piece of Maria's jaw. The part you mention also occurred during 4, as a note.

Rockman Reserve posted:

I hate this answer because it makes so much more sense if the clauses are reversed, as far as I can tell.

If it helps, the terms used for 18th human and 17 people are 人間 and 人, respectively.

Rockman Reserve posted:

Anyway, this has been a massive wall of spoiler blocks again, and I apologize for it, but I've bookmarked the "my posts in this thread" link as a way to organize my thoughts while showing my whole rear end to everyone about how completely off-base I'll end up being. :P To anyone that actually bothered to read it all, please feel free to refute/argue/clarify any of the points I tried to make.

I decline to refute or argue because it's funnier that way.

# ¿ Jul 15, 2022 07:51

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Nyoro posted:

Of course I was lying, the best written character ever is yasu

This is umi 7 spoilers for everyone else

# ¿ Sep 28, 2022 07:04

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Nyoro posted:

episode 5 is the best episode by far

but episode 7

# ¿ Sep 29, 2022 04:18

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Umineko, surface level kind of thoughts:

Okay it�s a huge tragedy that stems from the conspiracy to hide Kinzo�s death, specifically between Natsuhi, Krauss and Shannon, going wrong and getting found out by Eva. Most of the scenes with Kinzo are really Krauss as the acting Headship, outside of scenes where that�s denied by something red. The revival of Beatrice he is looking for is a way to legitimately end up as the heir and Head, while escaping from the curse of Kinzo�s shadow that he finds himself stuck with.

Is it mentioned when the epitaph was written (specifically before or after 1984) anywhere?

The epitaph was written in April of 1984, as per Episode 1.

# ¿ Oct 3, 2022 08:45

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

So story/arcade modes do 10000% casual spoiler drop.

So avoid that. There's also certain ep8 references in characters...sort of. If you know you know.

# ¿ Oct 17, 2022 21:16

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

I recall there are non-zero visual spoilers.

# ¿ Oct 19, 2022 04:19

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Gaius Marius posted:

I've never read the manga, but the placement of where he talks about the letters seems suspicious otherwise because why would they even mention it if it wasn't important. More importantly we're taught to view motive in Umineko instead of just what we see on screen by Umineko. George is incredibly jealous of Battler and feels stifled by his own inability to talk to girls, by destroying the letters he's effectively denying Battler his own advantage over George and dragging him down to his level, while also in his mind opening up his own opportunity for a relationship with Sayo.

It's presented ambiguously, and it's up to you to decide which interpretation is correct. Just like a lot of the rest of 7. (Also because Yasu has absolutely no idea of the truth there.)

# ¿ Oct 21, 2022 01:28

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

ahaha.wav

# ¿ Oct 25, 2022 19:57

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

is that a "she's so close" ahaha" or "she's so dumb" ahaha, i'm dying here

ahaha.wav

Rockman Reserve posted:

I have to assume I'm close in some respect because it feels like someone would stop my ramblings if I was completely off in the weeds somehow....

bernsip.png

Cyouni fucked around with this message at 21:36 on Oct 25, 2022

# ¿ Oct 25, 2022 21:32

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

bernsip.png

# ¿ Oct 25, 2022 22:35

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Nyoro posted:

Episode 1 owns!

The stageplay adapts episode 1, and does it in a way that I honestly consider the stageplay the best way to get people into Umineko.

(That's why I started up a translation group for it.)

# ¿ Nov 6, 2022 07:39

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

To all the speculation in the thread, I have but one thing to say:

ahaha.wav

# ¿ Nov 8, 2022 01:24

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

I am incredibly entertained, and cannot wait for Scrree to read ep 5 of Higurashi.

# ¿ Nov 15, 2022 22:29

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

VostokProgram posted:

big big umineko Episode 8 spoilers with an important question I need clarified:

You are generally correct in your interpretation of the purple truth there. If it also helps there, you can consider Gohda's statement to be a "physical alibi", whereas Jessica and Battler's is a "mental alibi".

Each culprit does need at least one unique kill. There are no shared culprits.

# ¿ Nov 20, 2022 22:50

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Since I don't know what exactly you think you've been spoiled on, I can't comment on that.

I will say, however, that what you think you know is leading to a very interesting reading of it.

# ¿ Nov 21, 2022 20:50

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

VostokProgram posted:

Umineko ENDING spoilers do not read

1. What actually happened on the island? I think there's no 100% exact definite answer because that's the whole point of the Single Truth being not worth learning. My guess is it was something like a freak accident with the explosives and nobody was actually at fault. That's why Ange was so sad about reading it, an accident reduces everyone's death to meaningless bad luck.

According to the manga, exactly what was presented in 7 as the truth. You'll notice that during the events of 7, what happens to Battler is never detailed, and Beatrice's body goes mysteriously missing before Eva wakes up. This links back to the ending of 8, in the Magic ending, where Shannon guides Battler to the hidden cave.

# ¿ Dec 1, 2022 19:37

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Nyaawn posted:

I mean Ryukishi did say the manga is "an official answer from him"

I'm not surprised he did it either, there is def a chunk of people who would just not fully understand the game's mysteries (or, the game) unless they had it explained to them frame by frame like that.

There are a chunk of people that insist that even the manga is just Ryukishi fooling you and pulling the wool over the eyes of those who can't see the real real real truth.

So yeah, probably necessary.

# ¿ Dec 2, 2022 05:48

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

VostokProgram posted:

Did you mean for episode 5? Or are you re-reading or something? Unclear if I can post at you with full story spoilers or not

They know random bits of spoilers from future episodes and are under the impression that they understand far more than they do as a result.

# ¿ Dec 3, 2022 21:12

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

VostokProgram posted:

Spoilers for all the episodes:

The hints for the whydunit feel pretty subtle in the question arcs. I didn't really remember anything pertinent for Battler's sin. My sister thought of the conversation on the beach where Shannon mentions how Battler left saying he would be back and stuff, but we were very unsure if that was actually it. It's a very minor line that you can read as just establishing Battler's personality. I don't even think there was anything to suggest that Shannon took it seriously. I believe it's the only scene in 1-4 that establishes this.

Because of how subtle it is, even though we knew about that conversation, we couldn't really believe that it was the motive for everything. Partly this is from being unfamiliar with Ryukishi's style. I didn't know how far he'd go to bury the mystery. If I were to read another mystery he wrote I think I would get it sooner because now I know he's willing to do crazy poo poo.

I'll just say that if you read it again, you can catch a lot more than just that. Fun one is now rethinking the boob grab scene from episode 1.

# ¿ Dec 8, 2022 01:04

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

So Math posted:

Here's an alternate interpretation. Beatrice never wanted to be mean to Battler at all. However, Lambdadelta would only allow her to be a witch as long as Beatrice acted cruel, so she went along with it and tried to give Battler the most comfortable and romantic eternal torture she could come up with. She can be in the story only if she is a villain, so she was trying to be a convincing villain but pining for Battler the whole time. Possibly she's inept at pulling her punches. A similar vibe to (a 2022 RPG with a meta twist) the ending of that FF1 remake where you're Garland.[/spoiler]

You may wish to reread the ending to 3 with Beato and Ange and think about what it might mean.

# ¿ Dec 11, 2022 08:47

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

jesus loving christ what the gently caress - kinzo -

Umineko.txt

# ¿ Dec 12, 2022 02:01

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Final thought: Doctor Nanjo just gives zero fucks, huh. At least Kumasawa and Genji are directly employed by Kinzo and are ostensibly trying to do the right thing in an awful situation, at least on some level. I'm not sure what mandatory reporting laws there are in Japan but christ Nanjo, you're a loving doctor, why are you covering any of this poo poo up.

Those gold bars won't just launder themselves, y'know. He's gotta pay for his granddaughter's medical bills somehow, obviously.

# ¿ Dec 12, 2022 23:02

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Advising you to wait for the end of episode before further commenting.

# ¿ Dec 15, 2022 17:55

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

How long is Episode 8? I have some thoughts (and lingering questions) and am wondering if I should just power through to the end first. It seems to be pretty straightforward so far in what it's trying to do, although I'm still waiting for Bernkastel to throw a horrible wrench into everything somehow.

One little comment on probably my favorite minor detail of Episode 7: I loved the scene where Gaap/Beatrice/Lion/???? uses 'magic' to make the new servant's key end up in her locker. Even without any red truth, the way it's presented it's still pretty easy to figure out, it's fun and low-stakes (nobody got murdered!!) and works great as a little wink-wink-nudge-nudge 'do you understand' check for the reader.

Episode 8 is decent length and uh, includes a few puzzle elements you probably want to get right.

# ¿ Dec 19, 2022 17:54

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

oh, (Higurashi and Umineko spoilers), is it interactive like the meat of Higurashi 8? Can I go through it blind and then reload a save and do it with a guide, or is it like Bernkarika discussing the boxes in the TIPS in Higurashi where if you reload to open the other box she calls you out on it?

e: ama about Higurashi crashing *twice* towards the end when I tried to speed through 8 in the correct order for the hidden scene, except actually don�t because it really sucked.. Ironically 07th-Mod seems to make them WAY more stable.

You can fail to get the scenes and the game will continue.

# ¿ Dec 19, 2022 23:34

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

Posting about this in hopes something shakes loose in my brain �cuz I�ve figured out all these drat riddles so far until Kanon�s and I sure don�t wanna cheat myself out of a good riddle.

Oh duh lmao

That one is hilarious because of how some people get it instantly and some people just get stonewalled, and you can tell why.

# ¿ Dec 21, 2022 09:12

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

VostokProgram posted:

Rockman do not read this yet

They're definitely being confused by the select culprit screen since they think they can only pick one. Should we tell them or let them figure it out?

Just let them figure it out, I think. It's not too bad.

# ¿ Dec 28, 2022 17:18

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

(in all seriousness I'm looking forward to finishing this and reading All Of The Spoilers sometime soon and I genuinely appreciate people putting up with my rambling stream of sorta-consciousness theory posts)

Incorrect!

(You can read this)

# ¿ Dec 29, 2022 03:40

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

I might get them on Comixology or something, I generally tend to shy away from digital for stuff I really like but 1) the volumes are loving huge and 2) hahaha over $100 per volume are you kidding me

I have 8 volumes 1 and 2 and have read a few pages in 8v1 and the scenes of Battler freaking out on the boat, and Kinzo being a big dumb goofy Halloween nut make me really wanna see the rest fully illustrated.

I bought them at ~$40 CAD each from my local Indigo. When I moved, it took an entire box to move my Umineko volumes.

# ¿ Dec 30, 2022 23:58

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Rockman Reserve posted:

At what point should I check the Hints section? How much does it give away? I'd like to engage with it on its own terms but also lol.

Every time you get it wrong you get another hint. There are something like 20 in all, but by around 12 they outright start giving you hard answers piece by piece.

# ¿ Jan 6, 2023 08:23

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

(Ep 8, no Akarshi) Wow that's an interesting attitude to start off ep 8 with.

# ¿ Jan 13, 2023 17:27

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

Golden Fantasia is a legit fighting game.

Note that you build meter only for your partner, by the way.

# ¿ Feb 16, 2023 09:04

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

MegaZeroX posted:

https://twitter.com/Uminetta_/status/1671955525586616321

Oh yeah, I could have posted that here too. Feel free to yell things about it at me, such as "qc pls".

# ¿ Jun 23, 2023 02:33

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

ymgve posted:

Umineko 5th episode: Not sure it's just something that's been misinterpreted by the game creator/translator or a clue, but the game says Knox's 3rd rule is that no hidden passages can exist in red, while the actual real-life Knox's rules said that at most one hidden room or passage can exist

Also this meta-not-meta section is stupid and confusing. And the bunnies are back.

Though I guess:

If we're being specific, the full text also includes "I would add that a secret passage should not be brought in at all unless the action takes place in the kind of house where such devices might be expected."

# ¿ Jan 20, 2024 18:51

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# ¿ May 15, 2024 03:26

Cyouni: Sep 30, 2014; without love it cannot be seen

ymgve posted:

But Battler wasn�t the one that announced in red that the guest house seals were unbroken. He didn�t get to decide.

He was. That was the whole point. You can see it here and in the previous update.

ymgve posted:

That whole part was bad and contrived to reach certain plot points. Erika should have been thrown out of the game for claiming she cut the heads off everyone retroactively without ever having announced it in the first place.

Note that it already happened, which is why it could be said in red. It's the equivalent of revealing you already removed the card that makes the magician's trick work while they're presenting it.

# ¿ Jan 24, 2024 18:21

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