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makes sense. thank you for the clarification
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Apr 25, 2024 23:03
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Slyphic posted:Let's make a deal. Everyone that thinks the current state of Jones is a mockery of justice (not to be confused with American Justice™) will shut the gently caress up and stop whining about it. Why are you like this
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Apr 25, 2024 23:04
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If you're going to stan for the system, don't be a coward.
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Dang It Bhabhi! posted:Why are you like this his is the kind of alpha male, high-T posting that can only be achieved by regular consumption of quality supplements like Super Male Vitality, Prostaguard, and colloidal silver, my man you may not like it, but this is what ideal posting looks like
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Apr 25, 2024 23:09
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Daring other people to toxx over things that no reasonable person can accurately predict then calling them cowards for not doing it has strong "have you stopped beating your wife" vibes
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Apr 25, 2024 23:09
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bird food bathtub posted:That's kinda the rub though. They already have that power, they just only use it against poor and minorities. We don’t disagree. I don’t see how depriving Jones of his rights fixes the injustice problem. That’s the rub. Every thing is hosed, but you can’t unfuck it with more fuckery. That’s my argument.
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Apr 25, 2024 23:25
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The courts don't really have that power, though. It seems like it, sometimes, because the consequences of a bankruptcy and civil liability hit a lot faster when the person the court's loving has $25.40 in their one bank account and doesn't own any real estate. The process is the same as what Jones is going through.
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Apr 25, 2024 23:33
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Not like a specific date, I'm a reasonable guy. Rough years-from-judgement is good enough. 3? 12? Dang It Bhabhi! posted:Anyhow the bankruptcy proceedings are where the blood is at. SonOfGhostDad posted:I asked why he would be allowed to continue to vacation at the Four Seasons Hawaii and build a new compound, and the answer was he's probably not allowed to, he's probably breaking a ton of laws, but doesn't give a poo poo Legit followup question for your friend. Can the conservator/ bankruptcy court not stop him from doing further crimes with the things they're looking over?
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Apr 25, 2024 23:42
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Slyphic posted:Legit followup question for your friend. Can the conservator/ bankruptcy court not stop him from doing further crimes with the things they're looking over? Doing so, if it’s even in their power, likely involves a bunch of fact-finding and case-making, which would then further delay the completion of the primary bankruptcy action. The new crimes can wait.
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Apr 25, 2024 23:44
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Slyphic posted:Legit followup question for your friend. Can the conservator/ bankruptcy court not stop him from doing further crimes with the things they're looking over? Can you stop anyone doing crimes tho? They're crimes. The nature of them is that you shouldn't be doing them in the first place.
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Apr 25, 2024 23:50
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Slyphic posted:
An excellent question. I asked him and am waiting on a reply. I think it can be difficult to appreciate how long it takes to investigate financial crime. Anecdotally, I just finished an investigation involving 10 identities, two bank accounts, and with a total unusual amount of less than $50k. Investigating, cataloguing evidence, and documenting my findings took the better part of this whole month. I am at once envious of and thankful I'm not on the team investigating Jones's finances because that's a never-ending pile of poo poo seasoned with shards of glass and they will spend far too much of their limited time on this earth trying to find where Jones has hidden his wealth.
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Apr 26, 2024 00:00
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Slyphic posted:Not like a specific date, I'm a reasonable guy. Rough years-from-judgement is good enough. 3? 12? SilvergunSuperman posted:Lol the system doesn't shrug, they allow all appeals then start seizing cash and assets. (this is the beginning of people accusing me of being mentally ill for believing jones won't be absolutely destroyed by the end of 2022.) Seth Pecksniff posted:Ok, to be clear, you're saying that the J6 committee won't find anything incriminating of anyone on Alex Jones's texts, right? And you're willing to toxx and eat a ban if it's the case they find something that incriminating on someone? there's a bunch more. i'm tired.
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Apr 26, 2024 00:02
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Megabound posted:Can you stop anyone doing crimes tho? Why would an ambulance be leaving the hospital?
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Apr 26, 2024 00:50
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Slyphic posted:Not like a specific date, I'm a reasonable guy. Rough years-from-judgement is good enough. 3? 12? Have you tried not posting bad, Slyphic?
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Apr 26, 2024 00:57
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Slyphic posted:Why would an ambulance be leaving the hospital? They can't put him in jail and they already control all his assets. The money he's using for holidays must not be getting handed to him via a legal method so what can they do at all to curtail the behavior? Would you have everyone who enters bankruptcy be put on a no fly list? Give them a special card that they must use for all transactions? Anything they put on him (short of throwing him in a cell, which they can't do) is going to be worked around and more crimes are going to be done.
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Apr 26, 2024 00:59
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Megabound posted:They can't put him in jail and they already control all his assets. The money he's using for holidays must not be getting handed to him via a legal method so what can they do at all to curtail the behavior? Would you have everyone who enters bankruptcy be put on a no fly list? Give them a special card that they must use for all transactions? Anything they put on him (short of throwing him in a cell, which they can't do) is going to be worked around and more crimes are going to be done. Not at all. If they were ordered by a court to pay out damages to people they harmed, though, I would expect the court to enforce those payments, especially if they immediately start publicly shouting that they never intend to make those payments at all.
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Apr 26, 2024 01:21
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That is what they're doing tho. In order to enforce payments you need to figure out where all the money is so you know how much money there is to go around and how it should be divvied up. You think AJ will just hand over financials and go "Yep, that's all of it I swear" and be telling the truth?
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Apr 26, 2024 02:13
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anyone dumb enough to still help Jones with dark money is probably dumb enough to be the courts next nail to hammer
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Apr 26, 2024 02:19
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Why are people still responding to this like it's going to change something? They just came here to whine and act superior.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:28
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Megabound posted:That is what they're doing tho. In order to enforce payments you need to figure out where all the money is so you know how much money there is to go around and how it should be divvied up. You think AJ will just hand over financials and go "Yep, that's all of it I swear" and be telling the truth? Of course not. It would be nice if he got some sort of penalty for making it so loving difficult to do by intentionally loving around with his finances to hide everything, though. Regrettable posted:Why are people still responding to this like it's going to change something? They just came here to whine and act superior. Really, I just take offense at people pretending this is at all how the courts treat normal people. I've seen how the courts treat the poor. They are terrifyingly swift in dealing with you if you aren't worth millions, and they don't give one single poo poo if you can pay your judgment, or if doing so will significantly worsen your quality of life. The Bible fucked around with this message at 02:32 on Apr 26, 2024 |
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Apr 26, 2024 02:30
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You reckon there might be a fundamental difference when working out the finances of a poor person who owes money and a rich person who owes money? One of those people has far more methods available to them of hiding their money.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:39
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Megabound posted:You reckon there might be a fundamental difference when working out the finances of a poor person who owes money and a rich person who owes money? One of those people has far more methods available to them of hiding their money. Yeah, but why can't the courts be as mindful of how damaging the fines can be for the poor like they are for the rich? Why does Jones get to keep enough money to build a compound and maintain his preferred level of comfort while some poor regular Joe gets steamrolled? Why can't Joe also maintain a decent standard of living? I'm not even saying treat the rich worse. Just... treat the poor better. The Bible fucked around with this message at 02:47 on Apr 26, 2024 |
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Apr 26, 2024 02:42
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I also don't think anybody said that 'normal' people get the same kind of treatment from the system.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:42
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If poor people got the same kid gloves treatment that the cheeto and chilimans are getting, we wouldn't be doing half as much bitching.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:45
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The Bible posted:Yeah, but why can't the courts be as mindful of how damaging the fines can be for the poor like they are for the rich? They're not being mindful. They have teams of people on finding out where AJs money is. During this phase he's difficult to curtail because they don't know where his money is. How can you punish someone for hiding money when you don't know where the money is hidden and how much of it there is? AJ will continue to reap the benefits of all his devious dealings until it's found and then the he will be able to be punished to the full extent.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:51
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Megabound posted:They're not being mindful. They have teams of people on finding out where AJs money is. During this phase he's difficult to curtail because they don't know where his money is. How can you punish someone for hiding money when you don't know where the money is hidden and how much of it there is? AJ will continue to reap the benefits of all his devious dealings until it's found and then the he will be able to be punished to the full extent. Let's forget the punishment for a minute, and assume that he isn't hiding poo poo. They are still letting him earn an income that maintains his current lifestyle and eventually make restitution. I find it distasteful in his case specifically, but I'll admit, applied to everyone, it would be a humane system. All I'm asking is why the courts can't do that for a poor person too.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:53
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The Bible posted:Just... treat the poor better.  
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Apr 26, 2024 02:54
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The Bible posted:Let's forget the punishment for a minute, and assume that he isn't hiding poo poo. Well talk about that in a loving criminal justice thread instead of one about Alex Jones
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Apr 26, 2024 02:55
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Malachite_Dragon posted:If poor people got the same kid gloves treatment that the cheeto and chilimans are getting, we wouldn't be doing half as much bitching. Yeah, let’s dwell on that actual problem rather than litigating our revenge fantasies.
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Apr 26, 2024 02:55
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Megabound posted:Well talk about that in a loving criminal justice thread instead of one about Alex Jones I thought Jones' case was a civil case.
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Apr 26, 2024 03:20
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Slyphic posted:Why would an ambulance be leaving the hospital? Because dispatch is mean and tells us when our allowed time at hospital has expired. 
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Apr 26, 2024 03:23
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The Bible posted:I thought Jones' case was a civil case. I'm pretty sure that's what they were getting at.
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Apr 26, 2024 03:23
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The Bible posted:I've seen how the courts treat the poor. They are terrifyingly swift in dealing with you if you aren't worth millions, and they don't give one single poo poo if you can pay your judgment, or if doing so will significantly worsen your quality of life. How does it work? Give us some anecdotes. Like what happens when a poor person gets a judgment against them and declares bankruptcy? bird with big dick fucked around with this message at 03:55 on Apr 26, 2024 |
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Apr 26, 2024 03:53
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The Bible posted:Let's forget the punishment for a minute, and assume that he isn't hiding poo poo. They can't legally stop him from working based on a civil penalty. At this point, everything he's grifting is going to go to the SH families, barring whatever he spends on consumables and travel. The poo poo he is doing now with regard to hiding the money and trying to play a shell game with his assets is criminal and, I can't believe this needs to be repeated, cannot be prosecuted while the bankruptcy is still pending. I get what you're saying, but it's not apples to apples. His current lifestyle is not some special condition of the court. They're not giving him an allowance. They're not treating him any differently from a poor person. It's taking longer to go through his finances because of the various levels of obfuscation he's set up specifically to achieve this result, not because the courts or their agents are giving him any special consideration. To put it another way, do you think it would take you longer to eat a chicken wing or an entire elephant?
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Apr 26, 2024 04:00
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Megabound posted:Boy I hope this argument goes on for 3 more pages No you don't! Relatedly: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uLlv_aZjHXc (The first door is CSPAM.)
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Apr 26, 2024 04:11
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Regrettable posted:Why are people still responding to this like it's going to change something? They just came here to whine and act superior. It's rare for a thread to be about something which I have some level of expertise and can genuinely contribute to, so I'm talking about financial crime, as a treat
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Apr 26, 2024 04:12
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SonOfGhostDad posted:It's rare for a thread to be about something which I have some level of expertise and can genuinely contribute to, so I'm talking about financial crime, as a treat So you're a professional embezzler?
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Apr 26, 2024 04:17
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SonOfGhostDad posted:It's rare for a thread to be about something which I have some level of expertise and can genuinely contribute to, so I'm talking about financial crime, as a treat I wanted to be a forensic accountant but there's just not that many jobs.
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Apr 26, 2024 04:22
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I'm not as specialized as a forensic accountant. I started as a fraud investigator, but started specializing in anti money laundering and financial crimes investigation. Most of my day is spent evaluating credit disputes claiming identity theft, but sometimes I'll get a juicy money laundering case.
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Apr 26, 2024 04:44
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SonOfGhostDad posted:I'm not as specialized as a forensic accountant. I started as a fraud investigator, but started specializing in anti money laundering and financial crimes investigation. Most of my day is spent evaluating credit disputes claiming identity theft, but sometimes I'll get a juicy money laundering case. How knowledgable are you about the case? Because a common assumption has been that Jones took the default instead of revealing some financial crimes in InfoWars’ books. In both cases he was an unhelpful rear end in a top hat all the time, but absolute stonewall on anything financial. To the point that he got a default judgement and both trials were just for damages. Assuming that supposition is correct (for argument), it’s gotta be something pretty bad to make you do that. Even if he didn’t expect the judgement to be that big ; knock a zero off the end and it’s still a lot of money. As someone who’s never had enough money to crime with it, I’d love to get a vague idea of what kinds of things that could be.
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Apr 26, 2024 04:58
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Xiahou Dun posted:How knowledgable are you about the case? Because a common assumption has been that Jones took the default instead of revealing some financial crimes in InfoWars’ books. In both cases he was an unhelpful rear end in a top hat all the time, but absolute stonewall on anything financial. To the point that he got a default judgement and both trials were just for damages. I'm about as knowledgeable as anyone else in the thread about the defamation cases. I listened to the KF episodes and the depositions. I don't think AJ pulled any kind of chess move in defaulting; I think he's just a massive, incompetent shithead who surrounded himself with others of his kind and they simply refused to participate in the trial. He filed for bankruptcy as a way to preserve his wealth, thinking that he could fool the courts if he signed over his assets to friends and family immediately prior or if he created a network of LLCs which he owns and is in debt to. It's Baby's First Financial Fraud stuff. It's the kind of thing stupid people think rich geniuses do to hide money in movies. Filing for bankruptcy triggered a deep dive into his finances that he probably did not anticipate, and that should tell you everything you need to know about his criminal acumen. As for crimes I expect he'll be charged with, I would put money on fraud of various flavors. If I'm speculating, I'd guess that there's also money laundering on behalf of some shady benefactor given the mysteriously timed "donations" of crypto funds whenever FSS is in trouble. Edit: To answer your question more succinctly, any financial privacy he might have preserved through defaulting during discovery was immediately tossed the second he filed for bankruptcy. SonOfGhostDad fucked around with this message at 05:17 on Apr 26, 2024 |
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Apr 26, 2024 05:14
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