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thespaceinvader posted:Well it won me 3 games this draft. Which makes it my first one to do better than 1. no its for sure a good card. i just think people need to recalibrate a bit in this set because otherwise it will feel like you are constantly drafting "bomb" laden decks and getting housed. the reality is cards like jasper could easily be a top 5 card in some formats but dont even get on the leader board in this one. this is a modern horizons style set with power
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Apr 18, 2024 15:20
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Simply Simon posted:If a card doesn't give you immediate value, you should be wary of rating it too highly. "I just need to untap" is not a sentence you should have to say about a modern day bomb - every serious opp will have plenty of removal in their deck, in any color, especially with this set's bonus sheet. True, it does in fact, die to doom blade. But if it doesn't, it does a lot, very early in the game. It's also a mana cheaper than a lot of removal, which matters on the play. Its a hell of a 3-drop
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Apr 18, 2024 15:28
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A Moose posted:True, it does in fact, die to doom blade. But if it doesn't, it does a lot, very early in the game. It's also a mana cheaper than a lot of removal, which matters on the play. Its a hell of a 3-drop dies to removal without value is a real critique and dismissing it as the old "dies to doomblade" thing is indicative of not being in touch with how modern formats play out. immediate value is important the card is good but there are 5 green commons and uncommons im snap picking ahead of it without thinking twice. if we are counting green multicolored cards that number goes to like 15
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Apr 18, 2024 15:48
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Jasper Flint is not a bomb and BR has the 2nd worst winrate atm (tied worst excluding splashes). Time mentioned this but there are a lot of uncommons that perform better than it, and in actual good colours
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Apr 18, 2024 15:48
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lmfao the timing on this rules - my opponent just lost this game after dropping jasper on curve
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Apr 18, 2024 16:08
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Time posted:lmfao the timing on this rules - my opponent just lost this game after dropping jasper on curve
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Apr 18, 2024 16:11
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I was happily drafting a RB crimes deck, seemed wide open, and then I opened a pack 2 Dust Animus. Unfortunately I didn't get good fixing, just two deserts and a couple incidental treasure producers. I feel like it's probably still worth splashing though. And maybe Kambal?
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Apr 18, 2024 16:19
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Not worth it for either card imo. Play the second desert's due! Don't know about the Pyromancers.
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Apr 18, 2024 16:30
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The problem with the Jasper Flint deck is that he's kill on sight. Need more ways to protect his smile.
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Apr 18, 2024 16:51
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big scary monsters posted:I was happily drafting a RB crimes deck, seemed wide open, and then I opened a pack 2 Dust Animus. Unfortunately I didn't get good fixing, just two deserts and a couple incidental treasure producers. I feel like it's probably still worth splashing though. And maybe Kambal? You're not making many tokens so I'd cut Kambal and the Pyromancers for Quilled Charger and yeah, the second Desert's Due. Justin_Brett fucked around with this message at 17:24 on Apr 18, 2024 |
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Apr 18, 2024 17:22
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wei posted:Jasper Flint is not a bomb and BR has the 2nd worst winrate atm (tied worst excluding splashes). Where are you seeing this? 17Lands stats say Jasper Flint is the 16th-winningest card in the set, better than any uncommon. I'm not good enough at the format to have an opinion worth sharing, but I'm curious where your data is coming from. I just lost a game with a sweet UG deck when my opponent's Jasper Flint stole my Bonny Pall.
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Apr 18, 2024 17:22
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Doing pretty 'eh' so far with drafts, averaging 2-3 wins, but set seems to rule. Very MOM in that there are just so. many. bombs. Tons of uncommons that go off if you don't respond immediately or force bad blocks. Reanimator seems like the deck to beat maybe? Seems to regularly outpace removal on a good draw. Wondering how the format will evolve, as the games go very, very bad if you don't get enough enablers in your deck. And as the set ages, those will become way more obvious. At the same time, there's just so many of them. Wicked stuff.
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Apr 18, 2024 17:23
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Chamale posted:Where are you seeing this? 17Lands stats say Jasper Flint is the 16th-winningest card in the set, better than any uncommon. 17 lands has it in the thirties - look at game in hand win rate
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Apr 18, 2024 17:28
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Time posted:17 lands has it in the thirties - look at game in hand win rate I usually go by Improvement When Drawn, is GIH a better metric? I guess GIH is better to use unless you're already committed to a colour pair.
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Apr 18, 2024 17:34
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I think those are both important metrics. I don't think it's fair to say that Laughing Jasper isn't a bomb. The issue is that, very early returns, BR is performing very badly, so that BR with one of its very best cards is only performing about as well as a completely average GB/GW deck. So I think (based on very, very early numbers) it might be right to hesitate to see if green might be open before devoting oneself completely to a B/R card, Jasper is still going to have bomb-level results in any deck that uses it.
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Apr 18, 2024 17:54
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Stagger_Lee posted:I think those are both important metrics. I don't think it's fair to say that Laughing Jasper isn't a bomb. The issue is that, very early returns, BR is performing very badly, so that BR with one of its very best cards is only performing about as well as a completely average GB/GW deck. So I think (based on very, very early numbers) it might be right to hesitate to see if green might be open before devoting oneself completely to a B/R card, Jasper is still going to have bomb-level results in any deck that uses it. a card is only as good as the deck it can make. a bomb is a card you build a deck around and force a color pair for. ergo,
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Apr 18, 2024 17:59
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look we really need a new thread title y'all. this poo poo is embarrassing. I nominate this:Rap Game Goku posted:Stupid Sexy Oko
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Apr 18, 2024 18:05
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Eeevil fucked around with this message at 18:37 on Apr 18, 2024 |
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Apr 18, 2024 18:34
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Chamale posted:I usually go by Improvement When Drawn, is GIH a better metric? I guess GIH is better to use unless you're already committed to a colour pair. IWD is basically useless because what it represents is how good a card is to the deck around it, or how load-bearing a card is for an otherwise mediocre deck that didn't draw it. ie, IWD represents how much better a card is, compared to the cards around it. For example, remember this bozo?   Fairly powerful card if you untapped with it, but your deck was absolute garbage if you built your deck around it and didn't draw it. Very high IWD, immensely medium GIH win rate. Currently, Black Red is the second lowest performing two colour pair so yeah your deck which is already underperforming will play much better when you draw the best card in your deck (and probably the main reason you got into BR in the first place).
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Apr 18, 2024 18:40
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The best metrics to use are OH and GIH if you want one number to reference. IWD doesn't really indicate much when comparing cards with very different in-deck winrates (GP on 17lands).Time posted:a card is only as good as the deck it can make. a bomb is a card you build a deck around and force a color pair for. ergo,
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Apr 18, 2024 18:43
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My impression of this format so far is that your deck building really does not matter. It's just what bombs did you open and did your opponent get better ones. It's so absolutely bomb heavy in a way that even MOM wasn't.
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Apr 18, 2024 18:49
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my trophy decks have had 2, 2, 1, 3, 1 and 0 rares. There's a lot of power and buildaround potential in the uncommons
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Apr 18, 2024 19:03
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wei posted:my trophy decks have had 2, 2, 1, 3, 1 and 0 rares. There's a lot of power and buildaround potential in the uncommons yeah im trophying with basically this deck over and over again. like 1-2 rares each time. i think people just see a rare that has a splashy effect in this set and think it must be a crazy bomb 
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Apr 18, 2024 19:13
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kalel posted:look we really need a new thread title y'all. this poo poo is embarrassing. I nominate this: Support this because I got a Thief of Crowns p2p1 in my first draft. First time getting to play with it and it is indeed very stupid.
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Apr 18, 2024 19:14
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First time really diving into Arena and first limited format I've given a shot since pre-pandemic. So far I'm really digging this set. Through 3 sealeds and 2 drafts, GW seems like clearly the best combo and can easily support splashing for haymakers like Make Your Own Luck or Badlands Revival that aren't hard to come by. Just went 7-1 in a draft with GW and I think the only rare I had was Primal Command which might have been one of the worst cards in the deck.
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Apr 18, 2024 20:07
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Time posted:a card is only as good as the deck it can make. a bomb is a card you build a deck around and force a color pair for. ergo, I think that's a good metric for what you take p1p1, but I think it's actively unhelpful as an attempt to center terminology, and strange to assert it as a fact. A common guideline for weaker color pairs is that you should avoid them in the absence of bomb rares. If you change "bomb" so that it doesn't apply to cards in weaker color pairs you're just leaving a semantic gap that's going to need to be filled by another word.
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Apr 18, 2024 20:30
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Lone Goat posted:IWD is basically useless because what it represents is how good a card is to the deck around it, or how load-bearing a card is for an otherwise mediocre deck that didn't draw it. ie, IWD represents how much better a card is, compared to the cards around it. It does not follow that IWD is useless. It should not be used very highly to determine P1P1 decisions, to the degree that any single stat should, but it tells you a lot of information about what's working within specific archetypes and what's not!
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Apr 18, 2024 20:31
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Stagger_Lee posted:I think that's a good metric for what you take p1p1, but I think it's actively unhelpful as an attempt to center terminology, and strange to assert it as a fact. A common guideline for weaker color pairs is that you should avoid them in the absence of bomb rares. If you change "bomb" so that it doesn't apply to cards in weaker color pairs you're just leaving a semantic gap that's going to need to be filled by another word. sure lets use bomb another way - top 10 cards in the format. its not that either, there are multiple commons in more than 1 color that are better. using whatever terminology you want, the card isnt something that draws me into drafting it unless somehow i have finagled my way into a splash that doesnt hurt me. people shouldnt be in black red at all, definitely not for this card. maybe later in the format when green and white are more contested we can revisit the pairing, but as of right now that card is a siren call to a 2-3 drop. i want a card that is actually ending the game when it comes down to be drawn into a pairing like that. a dreamtrawler, bonny pall, whatever. this is just a guy that requires a lot going your way to come online
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Apr 18, 2024 20:55
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Do you guys think new Jace + disinformation campaign could be something? it's never been easier to surveil.
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Apr 18, 2024 21:06
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flatluigi posted:sounds like someone making poo poo up to force a meme 
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Apr 18, 2024 21:20
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Milling away an opponents Oko thief of crowns feels real good lemme tell you
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Apr 18, 2024 21:30
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Ono Grief of Frowns
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Apr 18, 2024 21:40
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I'm Loco for Oko
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Apr 18, 2024 22:36
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Pocky In My Pocket posted:Milling away an opponents Oko thief of crowns feels real good lemme tell you Have done it twice this run. Trophied in Grixis. deck was fun y'all. Got off cruel ultimatum three times, one time someone conceded and i'm pretty sure they had a very obvious play (Had the cheap dragon but no cards in hand and the mythic red mount, I was at like nine so I think if they'd saddled and swung I'd have just died). At Knifepoint also did a lot of work for me in multiple games as well, especially if you do have tinybones on the board
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Apr 19, 2024 01:09
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So I was told to ask here even though I was mostly asking about Standard, but: I'm realizing I'm gonna need a white deck for when those daily challenges roll around; I've got a black-green Sheoldred-centric Phyrexian deck that rolls pretty well, and a red-blue pirates/artifacts deck that... kinda doesn't but it handles well enough. But for white I don't have anything that holds up. Is an Eriette-focused auras deck, probably including both Eriettes, actually viable in Standard or Alchemy, and if so, is there a decent build for one I can find somewhere? And if not, is there an appropriately stupid deck at least partially in white that is viable? So far my decks are too honest, I think a white deck should add some bullshit.
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Apr 19, 2024 04:09
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Cleretic posted:So I was told to ask here even though I was mostly asking about Standard, but: I'm realizing I'm gonna need a white deck for when those daily challenges roll around; I've got a black-green Sheoldred-centric Phyrexian deck that rolls pretty well, and a red-blue pirates/artifacts deck that... kinda doesn't but it handles well enough. But for white I don't have anything that holds up. If you just need to clear the daily 500/750 gold quests with a white deck, you can do so by replaying the Starter Deck duel. No need to craft a separate deck just for dailies. The R/W starter deck is also probably the strongest one so you can even clear out a few daily wins with it.
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Apr 19, 2024 04:25
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Cleretic posted:So I was told to ask here even though I was mostly asking about Standard, but: I'm realizing I'm gonna need a white deck for when those daily challenges roll around; I've got a black-green Sheoldred-centric Phyrexian deck that rolls pretty well, and a red-blue pirates/artifacts deck that... kinda doesn't but it handles well enough. But for white I don't have anything that holds up. i don't think it's viable, but i do highly recommend throwing all your favorite cards into a historic brawl deck and using that queue to get color challenges down, especially if you already have a buildaround you want to try out
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Apr 19, 2024 04:26
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Cleretic posted:So far my decks are too honest, I think a white deck should add some bullshit. You run a Sheoldred deck, you're already at peak bullshit. But if you want to run a white deck that's an absolute misery to play against for some reason, try the Three Blind Mice/Dedicated Dollmaker combo, or the Ratadravik+Boromir+any death trigger (Elas il Kor is the most popular) infinite combo in Alchemy. If the opponent allows the combo to go off, they're both highly non-interactive past that point and there's basically nothing the opponent can do to stop it once it's going (literally nothing in the case of the Boromir combo, in fact, you just play Boromir and that's game). The TBM combo even recovers more or less instantly from board wipes unless paired with an enchantment wipe (and the only enchantments wipes in Alchemy are Fade from History and Cease/Desist, neither of which see much play). I don't play either, personally, so I can't speak to their consistency, but my impression is the TBM combo is pretty brainlessly consistent, while the Boromir combo is less so, but slots into the Aragon/Jodah all-legendaries deck effortlessly and is impossible to stop once you start it. In any case, neither deck ever feels fair to play against and your opponents will hate dealing with them. Given that TBM will, sadly, still be Alchemy-legal come September, that's probably your best bet for something to knock out missions with.
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Apr 19, 2024 04:30
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anakha posted:If you just need to clear the daily 500/750 gold quests with a white deck, you can do so by replaying the Starter Deck duel. No need to craft a separate deck just for dailies. To be clear I also want to make a white deck, it's just that the challenges are the main motivation. And yeah, the Rebel Armory deck is really good, but it's still the weakest of the decks I complete challenges with. Also, where do I actually find some decent brews? Three Blind Mice or Elas il-Kor seem like they're right up my alley for 'gently caress it I'ma play frustrating', but I don't know where to actually find good decks to plug into this, especially if I'm opening the door to Alchemy format.
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Apr 19, 2024 05:28
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The mono-white deck I have seen in the queues the most has been the one that loops Restoration of Eiganjo to get a bunch of Plains and recycle the value creatures, sorta a throwback to Martyr Proc or Sun Titan decks of old. Serra Paragon is the Sun Titan, and you get to play Lay Down Arms because you're just running Plains. https://mtgdecks.net/Standard/mono-white-decklist-by-yucrack21-1974991
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