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Amy Pole Her
Jun 17, 2002

Scipiotik posted:

Patricia is the OC, but not in title. I think it has something to do with allowing him to get his full payout from the Lions for getting fired. If he was the OC I think he'd lose out on some of the salary. At least that's a rumor I heard.

I heard the same rumor. Just above your post.

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Scipiotik
Mar 2, 2004

"I would have won the race but for that."

Amy Pole Her posted:

I heard the same rumor. Just above your post.

I'm as good at posting as Patricia is at coaching... perhaps worse.

Amy Pole Her
Jun 17, 2002
You’re being *way* too hard on yourself. You actually managed to post it, so compared to Matt Patricia you’re a rockstar

Diva Cupcake
Aug 15, 2005

Patricia himself wouldn't lose out on any money IIRC but the Patriots would have to pay him OC salary instead of letting the Lions cover it while they pay him for "Senior Advisor" duties. It's just the Pats gaming their titles to save a million dollars or so? Breer went into it.

Breer posted:

You’ll notice with titles for Patricia and Joe Judge this year, not only aren’t they coordinators, they aren’t even officially position coaches. Judge’s title is offensive assistant/quarterbacks. Patricia is senior football advisor/offensive line. Why would this matter? Judge is still being paid by the Giants, Patricia by the Lions, and whatever the Patriots pay those two comes out of what their old teams pay them.

The NFL created rules to avoid teams paying coaches like interns and letting their old teams pick up the tab (which in a lot of cases, the coaches are fine with because their old teams fired them) dictate that these guys have to be paid at a rate commensurate with the established pay scale for their role. There’s a pay scale for coordinators. There’s one for position coaches. There isn’t one as much for guys with vague titles. So, in a roundabout way, this all allows the Patriots to keep Judge and Patricia on the meter with other teams.

Amy Pole Her
Jun 17, 2002
Cheat down to the last penny. They’ve got their ethics and they’re sticking to em, dammit

God I’m so excited for that lovely tarnished legacy to just gently caress off

Impossibly Perfect Sphere
Nov 6, 2002

They wasted Luanne on Lucky!

She could of have been so much more but the writers just didn't care!
It's just so very cheap and dumb. Robert Kraft is not a good owner. People think he's patient and hands off but he never was - it's just that there's been two decades of wild success to keep him mostly at bay.

Grittybeard
Mar 29, 2010

Bad, very bad!
It's all very shady but to bring it back to the point for this thread it also seems ridiculously dumb to have Patricia as the OC if he has the title or not, but here we are :shrug:

He's got a couple of years of assistant OL experience in his coaching resume on that side of the ball. Not that his numbers coaching defense look a lot better to be fair. I really don't understand why he's employed even if it weren't for the *waves hand* other things.

Ehud
Sep 19, 2003

football.

I believe in Matt Patricia

Acebuckeye13
Nov 2, 2010

Ultra Carp

Ehud posted:

I believe in Matt Patricia's ability to get fired

Impossibly Perfect Sphere
Nov 6, 2002

They wasted Luanne on Lucky!

She could of have been so much more but the writers just didn't care!

Grittybeard posted:

It's all very shady but to bring it back to the point for this thread it also seems ridiculously dumb to have Patricia as the OC if he has the title or not, but here we are :shrug:

He's got a couple of years of assistant OL experience in his coaching resume on that side of the ball. Not that his numbers coaching defense look a lot better to be fair. I really don't understand why he's employed even if it weren't for the *waves hand* other things.

It's an indictment of Bill's decision making.

I get the situation with his kids. It totally sucks, but I can understand why he's doing it. He wants his kids to succeed and to learn how to coach in the NFL and follow in his footsteps. But what the gently caress is his obsession with losers like Patricia and Judge? I could understand if he hired those two and made Judge ST coach again, or gave Patricia some bullshit assistant role in the defense. Whatever. But he must *really* believe they are capable coaches, otherwise why would he put them in charge of an entire side of the ball. For me this is a major red flag of just how bad Belichick has become at evaluating not just players, but also coaches. I think he may be so far up his own rear end, and may have bought into his own legacy too much, that he can't even see another way of operating.

Bismack Billabongo
Oct 9, 2012

Wet

Diva Cupcake posted:

I just don’t see any realistic scenario outside finishing with a top 3 pick where Saleh’s seat starts getting warm. And that would come from ownership not Joe Douglas probably and even then he’d probably get a 3rd year depending on the scenario (like massive injuries again like last year).

They’ve done a good job building the roster from nothing and I think 7 wins with a healthy Wilson would be a good step.

My point is I think if they bottom out again he’s gone. Not that they necessarily will but that I think they would pull the trigger if he does.

Mega64
May 23, 2008

I took the octopath less travelered,

And it made one-eighth the difference.

Impossibly Perfect Sphere posted:

It's an indictment of Bill's decision making.

I get the situation with his kids. It totally sucks, but I can understand why he's doing it. He wants his kids to succeed and to learn how to coach in the NFL and follow in his footsteps. But what the gently caress is his obsession with losers like Patricia and Judge? I could understand if he hired those two and made Judge ST coach again, or gave Patricia some bullshit assistant role in the defense. Whatever. But he must *really* believe they are capable coaches, otherwise why would he put them in charge of an entire side of the ball. For me this is a major red flag of just how bad Belichick has become at evaluating not just players, but also coaches. I think he may be so far up his own rear end, and may have bought into his own legacy too much, that he can't even see another way of operating.

The worst part is that this could very well gently caress up the development of Mac Jones, who looked promising enough as a rookie and could be in an excellent position to take a huge step forward his second year the way other rookie QBs like Burrow, Goff, and Wentz did. But instead of trying to find a promising OC candidate in his organization or on another team that got overlooked, Bill decided to go with two egomaniacs who bombed as head coaches and have no real experience on the offensive side of things.

I really wonder what went on behind the scenes with McDaniel that made him wait for another HC shot and then choose the Raiders. Of course the backing out from the Colts job is well-documented, and he did stick around in the post-Brady era and prove he was a fine OC on his own (even if he had little to work with besides the corpse of Cam Newton), but I wonder if he really was sticking around to take over the Patriots and then just got impatient that Bill was still going. Also makes me wonder how much the Bucs SB win may have affected Bill.

But hey, all empires must fall.

Impossibly Perfect Sphere
Nov 6, 2002

They wasted Luanne on Lucky!

She could of have been so much more but the writers just didn't care!
The McDaniels thing makes sense if he found out that Andrew Luck was not committed to playing. Why get stuck in QB purgatory if you can run back to New England and wait for a better opportunity while padding your resume more.

Benne
Sep 2, 2011

STOP DOING HEROIN
Nobody knew Luck was retiring until the day it came out. That was just McDaniels being bitchmade as always.

fartknocker
Oct 28, 2012


Damn it, this always happens. I think I'm gonna score, and then I never score. It's not fair.



Wedge Regret
Also Luck retiring was 18 months and a full season later. McDaniels bailed on the Colts in February 2018, after Luck had missed the entire previous season. The Colts hired Frank Reich, Luck ends up having a really good comeback season, and then he decided to retire the following preseason in August 2019.

sweet thursday
Sep 16, 2012

It's ironic that Luck, not knock for his legs, ran out

Mega64
May 23, 2008

I took the octopath less travelered,

And it made one-eighth the difference.
From what I remember from past threads, the official word was something about McDaniels not getting to have control over small things that coaches usually get control over, just weird semantics like that, and that's what caused him to bail. Who knows how accurate any of that is, but it's all we really have to work with.

I have some morbid curiousity about the behind-the-scenes stuff for the Pats the past couple years though, particularly why McDaniels chose now of all times to get a HC job again after bailing on the Colts a few years prior. Not like he needed to prove he could run a competent offense without Brady, he's a Belicheck assistant so he's pretty much guaranteed a job.

Impossibly Perfect Sphere
Nov 6, 2002

They wasted Luanne on Lucky!

She could of have been so much more but the writers just didn't care!
I think it's totally plausible that during interviews McDaniels found out Luck's injuries had been much worse than were let on, perhaps even to the point that he had already considered retirement. Obviously this is conjecture, but it makes way more sense than the excuses we've heard, none of which have been completely confirmed.

Diva Cupcake
Aug 15, 2005

Other than the Browns gig, which by all reports he really wanted, didn’t McDaniels pull out of most of the jobs he interviewed for? Or am I misremembering.

Nissin Cup Nudist
Sep 3, 2011

Sleep with one eye open

We're off to Gritty Gritty land




Impossibly Perfect Sphere posted:

I think it's totally plausible that during interviews McDaniels found out Luck's injuries had been much worse than were let on, perhaps even to the point that he had already considered retirement. Obviously this is conjecture, but it makes way more sense than the excuses we've heard, none of which have been completely confirmed.

Go relisten to the Luck podcast. There is no way loving Josh McDaniels knew any of that

Luck didn't even think of retiring until his niggling 2019 calf injury

Probably Magic
Oct 9, 2012

Looking cute, feeling cute.
I'll be honest, I always assumed since all of Bill's assistants are so dogshit on any other team that Bill must be a total micromanager and to a point it doesn't matter who his assistants are. I think him constantly drafting from Rutgers will probably catch up with him more than making Patricia a nominal OC.

Nodoze
Aug 17, 2006

If it's only for a night I can live without you
Breer is the one who has said that McDaniels didn't take the Indy job because of smaller behind the scenes stuff, but Kraft also was paying him about 4-6 mil a season since then too according to what I've heard. Given the "I'm gonna show him how I do everything" stuff from Bill it seemed pretty apparent at the time he was being groomed to take over, until Patricia came back anyway

Flikken
Oct 23, 2009

10,363 snaps and not a playoff win to show for it

Diva Cupcake posted:

Other than the Browns gig, which by all reports he really wanted, didn’t McDaniels pull out of most of the jobs he interviewed for? Or am I misremembering.

I always thought it was Cleveland media lusting after a local boy to coach the Browns not any real desire from McDaniels.


Cleveland media similarly wanted Mitch Trubisky really bad for the same reason, we drafted Myles Garret instead

Ches Neckbeard
Dec 3, 2005

You're all garbage, back up the truck BACK IT UP!

Flikken posted:

I always thought it was Cleveland media lusting after a local boy to coach the Browns not any real desire from McDaniels.


Cleveland media similarly wanted Mitch Trubisky really bad for the same reason, we drafted Myles Garret instead

He was in Cleveland for almost a week during that attempted woo'ing

Benne
Sep 2, 2011

STOP DOING HEROIN
Wasn't Luck still in Europe when the McDaniels thing went down? I don't think they talked together even once.

Eifert Posting
Apr 1, 2007

Most of the time he catches it every time.
Grimey Drawer
McDaniels could win six super bowls in a row and I would still think of him first from the Slow Getting Up excerpt where he cut Nate Jackson (the author) in absentia via some intern with candy strewn all over his desk.

Diva Cupcake
Aug 15, 2005

https://twitter.com/theMMQB/status/1568292903020990464

quote:

IN QUESTION
Mike McCarthy, Dallas Cowboys: Let’s be honest: If Jerry Jones has a crack at Payton, he’s taking it. He also has one of the most sought-after young offensive minds in football, Kellen Moore, on staff, and Dan Quinn as his defensive coordinator. If the Cowboys marginally underperform, there’s no way this doesn’t get complicated.

Matt Rhule, Carolina Panthers: Rhule returning in 2022 was a bit of a surprise, personally. While the Panthers easily could make a low-seeded playoff run in the NFC, this seems like one of the safer projected openings at this time. While Rhule missed out on a mind-boggling college carousel, his name was certainly bandied about for some of the top openings. He may prefer the NCAA atmosphere.

Arthur Smith, Atlanta Falcons: Smith said it himself: “If you don’t win games, there are going to be consequences.” To his credit, he’s not just a Kyle Shanahan copycat and he may very well have something unique planned for Marcus Mariota. Realistically, though, he’s low on firepower in a tough division.

Pete Carroll, Seattle Seahawks: Carroll turns 71 next week. While he is more spry and youthful than many half his age, one has to wonder what kind of appetite exists for a short-term rebuild.

Ehud
Sep 19, 2003

football.


quote:

Mike McDaniel, Miami Dolphins: Assuming ownership doesn’t stumble into another tampering scandal, McDaniel will get his shot. Here’s hoping his mindful, personable approach catches on around the league.

:unsmith:

tarbrush
Feb 7, 2011

ALL ABOARD THE SCOTLAND HYPE TRAIN!

CHOO CHOO

Hell of an assumption...

C-Euro
Mar 20, 2010

:science:
Soiled Meat
NGL I completely forgot about all the Urbz drama last year. Also lmao at Matt Patricia running the Pats offense, that must be a truly dire sight.

The fun part about not paying attention to the NFL off-season is that I get all of its fun surprises all at once when the season kicks off proper!

Nervous
Jan 25, 2005

Why, hello, my little slice of pecan pie.
It's going to feel like a down year for this thread after the hilarity of both Gruden and Urbz late year isn't it?

Kalli
Jun 2, 2001



You say that but like one of Andy Reid's kids will probably do a hate crime or something and some wild coaching poo poo will happen.

Chris James 2
Aug 9, 2012


Nervous posted:

It's going to feel like a down year for this thread after the hilarity of both Gruden and Urbz late year isn't it?

It's going to take something special and rare to surpass the Urban ride, I don't think it happens ever let alone this year

But this year could still rule just for the possibility of at least one of Pete/Bill not sticking around

Ehud
Sep 19, 2003

football.

tarbrush posted:

Hell of an assumption...

*lamar jackson's phone buzzes on the nightstand*

[new text from Stephen Ross] : "u up?"

Docjowles
Apr 9, 2009

Urban was all the stars aligning for a spectacular meltdown. That level of comedy doesn’t come around often. I do feel like we could get some solid lols out of Josh McDaniels, though.

King Hong Kong
Nov 6, 2009

For we'll fight with a vim
that is dead sure to win.

The idea that McDaniels knew anything about Luck considering retirement was always apologia to make what he did look better. It never had any basis in reality.

Acebuckeye13
Nov 2, 2010

Ultra Carp

Docjowles posted:

Urban was all the stars aligning for a spectacular meltdown. That level of comedy doesn’t come around often. I do feel like we could get some solid lols out of Josh McDaniels, though.

I feel like there's a 50/50 chance between McDaniels either having learned his lesson and becoming boringly competent, or going completely off the rails into a spectacular meltdown.

Kurgarra Queen
Jun 11, 2008

GIVE ME MORE
SUPER BOWL
WINS

Docjowles posted:

Urban was all the stars aligning for a spectacular meltdown. That level of comedy doesn’t come around often. I do feel like we could get some solid lols out of Josh McDaniels, though.
Basically everyone knew Urban would be a spectacular trainwreck, and he still far exceeded expectations! :magical:
It's safe to say we won't see anything quite like that in a long while.

Kalli
Jun 2, 2001



if McDaniels wanted to go ahead and have a complete meltdown and get fired by say, the middle of October that'd be cool

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Pimpcasso
Mar 13, 2002

VOLS BITCH
I believe the man that drafted Tim Tebow in the first round is still a moron and will fail

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