[Ukraine] vladimir putin: yiff in hell

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Ukraine] vladimir putin: yiff in hell

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tatankatonk: Nov 4, 2011; Pitching is the art of instilling fear.

if Russia actually does have a 10:1 advantage in artillery, why are they not simply launching a wider offensive now

e: not being facetious, are they just building up towards that? or are they satisfied with the attrition rates or what

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:27

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# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:09

euphronius: Feb 18, 2009

don�t want to go to fast for strategic and political reasons

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:28

VoicesCanBe: Jul 1, 2023; "Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

Dokapon Findom posted:

https://twitter.com/jurgen_nauditt/status/1780163480944877670

Yeah the west literally never gave one iota of a gently caress about the lives of Ukrainians.

Who could have predicted this besides everyone with even the slightest knowledge of US history

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:28

VoicesCanBe: Jul 1, 2023; "Cóż, wygląda na to, że zostaliśmy łaskawie oszczędzeni trudu decydowania o własnym losie. Jakże uprzejme z ich strony, że przearanżowali Europę bez kłopotu naszego zdania!"

tatankatonk posted:

if Russia actually does have a 10:1 advantage in artillery, why are they not simply launching a wider offensive now

e: not being facetious, are they just building up towards that? or are they satisfied with the attrition rates or what

Satisfied with the attrition rates. Going faster would result in Russia taking higher losses; there's no reason for it when the current pace is working and sustainable. That's why I doubt there's going to be a "summer offensive" which Ukraine and the west are hyping up.

Honestly, they're hoping that Russia speeds up for that very reason.

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:30

fits my needs: Jan 1, 2011; Grimey Drawer

didnt someone buy a ghost of ukraine shirt

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:33

Starsfan: Sep 29, 2007; This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

tatankatonk posted:

if Russia actually does have a 10:1 advantage in artillery, why are they not simply launching a wider offensive now

There are a lot of observers that think that Ukraine is playing at being weak and depleted for possibly a couple reasons

1) to try and shame their supporters into providing them more stuff
2) to try and bait the Russians into launching an ambitious offensive that they can then defeat with their remaining reserves and the supplies they've squirreled away (similar to the initial surge and then collapse by Russia in 2022), possibly leveraging that victory into a better negotiating position than the one they enjoy now.

I'm not sure that either is very likely because if Ukraine hasn't learned by now that their supporters have no shame then there's no hope for them, and I also don't believe that Ukraine is capable of concealing their true strength from Russia at this point.

The likely explanation is that Russia is still satisfied with the progress they are making from the kind of fighting that is going on now and while they may look to expand that to other areas of the front or to increase the intensity of the bombardment, they don't see any need to change things up and depart from their current approach to fighting the war.

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:33

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

Ardennes posted:

Anyway, the missing part of the puzzle about the great purge is the Soviet foreign currency crisis which started in 1929 and lasted into 1934 as well as the Great Famine itself.

Collectivization was an emergency response to the drop in commodity prices (oil and wheat being the 2 core exports for the Soviet Union) forcing the state to collectivize to lower state prices for grain, otherwise the state couldn't gain foreign currency abroad if it was paying market rate prices at home.

The famine makes this an even larger crisis (obviously) and shows how incompetent large portions of the Soviet apparatus is as it isn't accurately reporting information and that there is a ton of pseudo-fiefdoms cropping up in the grain distribution system. Also, the heavy industrial commissariat as sleep at the wheel, and by 1934, it is clear the second-five year plan is being derailed. Eventually the Soviets pull back trade altogether, and through 1935 the finger pointing gets worse essentially ramps up into 1937 as commodity prices stay low, and re-armament saps a bunch of material.

The purges initially start small and targeted, and then progressively grow in size until you start get people turning each other in etc etc.

Basically, both the 1937-1938 purge and the cultural revolution happened after a famine and when both states were facing an acute trade crisis and the possibility of war. Basically, they were the result of a internal economic crisis and arguably a way for the state to arguably reinforce itself even if it was in a bloody manner.

good post

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:33

Truga: May 4, 2014; Lipstick Apathy

fits my needs posted:

didnt someone buy a ghost of ukraine shirt

yeah and iirc it took so long to arrive nobody even remembered the joke lol

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:36

Flournival Dixon: Jan 29, 2024

Starsfan posted:

There are a lot of observers that think that Ukraine is playing at being weak and depleted for possibly a couple reasons

1) to try and shame their supporters into providing them more stuff
2) to try and bait the Russians into launching an ambitious offensive that they can then defeat with their remaining reserves and the supplies they've squirreled away (similar to the initial surge and then collapse by Russia in 2022), possibly leveraging that victory into a better negotiating position than the one they enjoy now.

I'm not sure that either is very likely because if Ukraine hasn't learned by now that their supporters have no shame then there's no hope for them, and I also don't believe that Ukraine is capable of concealing their true strength from Russia at this point.

The likely explanation is that Russia is still satisfied with the progress they are making from the kind of fighting that is going on now and while they may look to expand that to other areas of the front or to increase the intensity of the bombardment, they don't see any need to change things up and depart from their current approach to fighting the war.

i feel like there's no way russia could be stupid enough to fall for bait that badly but also they were stupid enough to let this whole thing happen in the first place rather than stopping it 10 years ago so i guess anything's possible

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:36

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

Starsfan posted:

There are a lot of observers that think that Ukraine is playing at being weak and depleted for possibly a couple reasons

1) to try and shame their supporters into providing them more stuff
2) to try and bait the Russians into launching an ambitious offensive that they can then defeat with their remaining reserves and the supplies they've squirreled away (similar to the initial surge and then collapse by Russia in 2022), possibly leveraging that victory into a better negotiating position than the one they enjoy now.

I'm not sure that either is very likely because if Ukraine hasn't learned by now that their supporters have no shame then there's no hope for them, and I also don't believe that Ukraine is capable of concealing their true strength from Russia at this point.

The likely explanation is that Russia is still satisfied with the progress they are making from the kind of fighting that is going on now and while they may look to expand that to other areas of the front or to increase the intensity of the bombardment, they don't see any need to change things up and depart from their current approach to fighting the war.

I guess armies change very slowly. The Russians had quick and easy wins in Georgia, Ukraine and then Syria. Took them most of a year to reorient themselves for a long and slow war. Even if you could do dashing breakthroughs now they might be institutionally wary of over committing now.

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:51

Virtual Russian: Sep 15, 2008

BearsBearsBears posted:

I've been thinking about the shed tank. There is a lot of talk about the end of tanks, I'm not sure they are done for yet. I think people see tanks getting knocked out and forget that tanks get knocked out in war. The shed tank is the product of troopers knowing they need more protection when leading a column, but not having the equipment to do the job. IF the shed was successful, someone is taking notes somewhere. Maybe we'll actually see the return of heavy tanks?

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:51

1stGear: Jan 16, 2010; Here's to the new us.

Better generals than Russia's have been tempted to shoot for the quick victory, but there's usually an element of political pressure. Putin seems content to let his army push slowly. Ukrainian sources are claiming that he's ordered Chasiv Yar captured by May 9th, but I haven't seen any source other than Ukrainian claiming that.

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:57

CongoJack: Nov 5, 2009; Ask Why, Asshole

1stGear posted:

Better generals than Russia's have been tempted to shoot for the quick victory, but there's usually an element of political pressure. Putin seems content to let his army push slowly. Ukrainian sources are claiming that he's ordered Chasiv Yar captured by May 9th, but I haven't seen any source other than Ukrainian claiming that.

genius move to put a due date in your opponent�s mouth. Just have to hold out until after the 9th to turn another defeat into a victory.

# ? Apr 16, 2024 23:59

Orange Devil: Oct 1, 2010; Wullie's reign cannae smother the flames o' equality!

Regarde Aduck posted:

lol that they waited till now to say this because of their dumb nazi pride

where's your ghost of Ukraine now, dipshits

Ghosted of Ukraine.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:00

Starsfan: Sep 29, 2007; This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

CongoJack posted:

genius move to put a due date in your opponent�s mouth. Just have to hold out until after the 9th to turn another defeat into a victory.

I remember when they tried to do this for Avdiivka ("Putin has ordered his army to capture Avdiivka ahead of his election") and then when Avdiivka collapsed and was actually captured ahead of the supposed schedule the Ukrainians switched up to claiming that Putin had just ordered his generals to capture the remainder of Luhansk oblast in the week that was left prior to the election...

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:06

supersnowman: Oct 3, 2012

DeimosRising posted:

does anyone here know much about the soviet education system?

I don't know much about it but the number of stuff they managed to invent/build mean the education system could not be 100% poo poo for sure.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:09

Atrocious Joe: Sep 2, 2011

https://twitter.com/ChicagosMayor/status/1780371595531345945?t=fl6c6MCHw85lXkmEgX_kYA&s=19

Shoring up the support from Chicago I guess?

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:14

Freezer: Apr 20, 2001; The Earth is the cradle of the mind, but one cannot stay in the cradle forever.

If the Russians were planning some kind of big offensive, they wouldn't announce it with fanfare months in advance and claim they're staking everything on it.

Because who would be dumb enough to do that?

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:25

supersnowman: Oct 3, 2012

Starsfan posted:

There are a lot of observers that think that Ukraine is playing at being weak and depleted for possibly a couple reasons

1) to try and shame their supporters into providing them more stuff
2) to try and bait the Russians into launching an ambitious offensive that they can then defeat with their remaining reserves and the supplies they've squirreled away (similar to the initial surge and then collapse by Russia in 2022), possibly leveraging that victory into a better negotiating position than the one they enjoy now.

I'm not sure that either is very likely because if Ukraine hasn't learned by now that their supporters have no shame then there's no hope for them, and I also don't believe that Ukraine is capable of concealing their true strength from Russia at this point.

The likely explanation is that Russia is still satisfied with the progress they are making from the kind of fighting that is going on now and while they may look to expand that to other areas of the front or to increase the intensity of the bombardment, they don't see any need to change things up and depart from their current approach to fighting the war.

The only other thing I could see for the Russian is they might want to increase the tempo but are taking them time to do it right. Amass the troop and supplies before even getting massed on the starting line and then start another slow moving wood chipper. Rushing led them to ATGM loving poo poo up in their lines and the plan failed because the Ukrainians won't take the L to save their people's lives so why bother? If they have the resources, turning on another slow front would just lead to more pressure on Ukraine dwindling forces as long as they don't push too hard. Some SU-25 have been spotted operating over Chasiv Yar so they probably feel like the AA need really is suffering. They might intensify the sortie rate or start making more sortie which up until now were just suicide runs. Turning the SU-25 from overpriced low impact low accuracy MLRS to actually aimed rocket fire for example.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:28

supersnowman: Oct 3, 2012

Freezer posted:

If the Russians were planning some kind of big offensive, they wouldn't announce it with fanfare months in advance and claim they're staking everything on it.

Because who would be dumb enough to do that?

They don't have the backing of the west to finance a teaser film...

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:28

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

tatankatonk posted:

if Russia actually does have a 10:1 advantage in artillery, why are they not simply launching a wider offensive now

e: not being facetious, are they just building up towards that? or are they satisfied with the attrition rates or what

In addition to being loss averse as mentioned, I think Russia is content to wait until the Ukrainian military collapses through attrition. Remember, Russia's target here is not to take and hold land, but to effect regime change so their neighbor isn't a pawn of the west with a Bandera fetish. Part of that project is destroying military equipment and killing anyone willing to take up arms on behalf of Ukrainian nationalism, so waiting for the Ukrainian state to do the work of getting everything together and delivering it to the front lines for Russia to explode is just working smarter instead of harder.

The more kicking and screaming conscripts Ukraine delivers to the front lines to pointlessly die the less anyone is going to mourn the Zelensky regime when it gets ousted, and the more cautious whoever comes after is going to be to trust promises from western backers. Hopefully the lesson proliferates beyond Ukraine and the rest of eastern Europe finally understands the west will happily use them as cannon fodder but is incapable of actually supporting them, but that seems like a long shot.

The war is also good for Russia economically, so there may be some internal incentive to drag it out as long as possible instead of risking disaster with a 'knock out blow'.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:35

yellowcar: Feb 14, 2010

Atrocious Joe posted:

https://twitter.com/ChicagosMayor/status/1780371595531345945?t=fl6c6MCHw85lXkmEgX_kYA&s=19

Shoring up the support from Chicago I guess?

large ukrainian community in chicago

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:41

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

yellowcar posted:

large ukrainian community in chicago

With a lot of political influence

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:44

Weka: May 5, 2019; That child totally had it coming. Nobody should be able to be out at dusk except cars.

Still catching up but

Ardennes posted:

The official numbers on the great purge were about 680,000 in terms of executions, and dekulakization was maybe 250-350k. Otherwise, there is the Great Famine and the the deaths during the war including the high death rate in the Gulag, but arguably there is a lack of intention there.

The moving barn is suppose to draw fire either on the field or back at base. It seems like it had become a direct nemesis to the Ukrainian state is not the entire free world.

When I say nazis, I mean German soldiers killed by the USSR. I give Stalin more credit than I would usually give a head of state because, as someone mentioned, he rammed through industrialization faster than the other likely options indicated they would have.

Thanks for the shed facts.

supersnowman posted:

More details on the guy's death Ukraine's Telegram was kinda mad about.

https://t.me/DDGeopolitics/107840

quote:
Early April: Successive reports reveal that in 2023, the Ukrainian gambling industry saw a 28-fold revenue increase, generating a record income of 54.92 billion hryvnia, while only paying 486 million for licenses. Calls in Ukraine emerge (https://www.gazeta.ru/social/news/2024/03/30/22670551.shtml) for the dissolution of the Gambling and Lotteries Commission.

If that's true, then many of Ukraine's soldier are pissing away their soldier pay on top of fighting a losing war.

Hot take, this is mostly money laundering.

Also, thanks to you too for shed facts.

BrotherJayne posted:

CRAB

TANK

CRAB TANK

No thanks to you and your Kremlin misinformation. That shed obviously moves forwards not sideways.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:47

sum: Nov 15, 2010

Russia isn't on the offensive because breakthrough offensives cause high casualties and they haven't so far re-established the necessary firepower and manpower advantage to ensure that that operation would destroy the Ukrainian army. Also, it's mud season. If they can build a significant reserve force I would expect them to go on the offensive on a quiet part of the border (towards Sumy? Down the M-02 towards Kiev?) and try to inflict a decisive defeat.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 00:59

my bony fealty: Oct 1, 2008

fits my needs posted:

didnt someone buy a ghost of ukraine shirt

best I can do is a gang tag

you have to send 25 bucks directly to Azov Batallion to get it

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:06

Cao Ni Ma: May 25, 2010

tatankatonk posted:

if Russia actually does have a 10:1 advantage in artillery, why are they not simply launching a wider offensive now

e: not being facetious, are they just building up towards that? or are they satisfied with the attrition rates or what

Large offensives kick start in late spring / summer because general mud can still gently caress you up. Probably the best time to push is mid may throughout summer.

That being said there has been sustained movement on russias part and it really does feel like the current lines are very precarious. Like the movement isnt fast or anything, but I dont think that ukranians being realistic with how they are getting mulched is a ploy. They are throwing bodies to hold land and units are fraying at the seems.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:08

mila kunis: Jun 10, 2011

Russia can't do an offensive because their army sucks rear end and lacks the elan of the NATO trained AFU. All they can rely on is attrition and brute force manufacturing and material advantages to win

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:12

Lostconfused: Oct 1, 2008

But they are winning?

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:12

DaysBefore: Jan 24, 2019

Regarde Aduck posted:

lol that they waited till now to say this because of their dumb nazi pride

where's your ghost of Ukraine now, dipshits

The ghost of Ukraine is the tens of thousands of men on both sides killed in a worthless unwinnable NATO proxy war. And all those who will die after the war when all the political regiments come back from the front with NATO weaponry and hero status

Just loving surrender already

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:13

mila kunis: Jun 10, 2011

Lostconfused posted:

But they are winning?

Only because they have more people, resources and industry

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:14

Starsfan: Sep 29, 2007; This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

mila kunis posted:

Only because they have more people, resources and industry

also a far sexier leader, but people don't want to talk about that.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:17

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

I will kiss both Putin and Zelensky for world peace

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:20

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

But I will be thinking of Putin while I am kissing Zelensky

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:20

mila kunis: Jun 10, 2011

And they're only "sort of" "winning" in the immediate military sense. In reality, they've created a festering sore on their western border that isn't going away for a generation and are shut out of Europe. America win.

Russia is basically banking on their pivot to brics/Asia working out long term while America crumpling the EU from within + America's own internal fails and imperial decline is enough to balance that out.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:24

mlmp08: Jul 11, 2004; Prepare for my priapic projectile's exalted penetration; Nap Ghost

Maybe China and/or India will win this war.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:26

Phigs: Jan 23, 2019

AFancyQuestionMark posted:

yeah but why did the hardliners need to wrestle for power? what made liberals so appealing in comparison? that's where the major economic pressures and class composition factors come in, and that's the actual root cause imo

The liberals existed from the beginning and just continued to exist. Just as there were still royalists in France after the revolutions (and there are still active royalist groups in France even today).

During Khrushchev and especially Gorbachev there was a sustained campaign to repudiate the hardliner communists. There was a power struggle between the old guard and the reformist faction which saw Gorbachev's reformist faction win. Under Gorbachev the head of propaganda was a liberal (Alexander Yakovlev) under whom the editors of all the major news networks were replaced by liberals. Hardliners were shifted out of power and declared enemies of the perestroika. Etc.

Oh, and basically every Gorbachev ally I've read anything on seemed fully fixated on the secret speech and Khrushchev's efforts to completely repudiate the Stalin years. They came to believe that the USSR had to be drastically reformed. Basically they had a crisis of faith and turned to liberalism because of it.

Phigs has issued a correction as of 01:35 on Apr 17, 2024

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:26

sullat: Jan 9, 2012

mlmp08 posted:

Maybe China and/or India will win this war.

In the sense that the only winning move is not to play, yes

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:27

mlmp08: Jul 11, 2004; Prepare for my priapic projectile's exalted penetration; Nap Ghost

sullat posted:

In the sense that the only winning move is not to play, yes

Sure, that, but also in the meantime cheap oil prices and fairly exclusive trade deals, competitors fighting each other, etc. As long as it doesn't get out of hand someday.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:28

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# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:09

mila kunis: Jun 10, 2011

India is benefiting from cheap oil and gas and some western deshoring. Too bad they have a neolib reactionary government and it's all going to be wasted and extracted away long term though; maddening to think of what an opportunity this would be if they had like dengists at the helm.

# ? Apr 17, 2024 01:35

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