[Ukraine] Missing in Action: Western Minds

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Ukraine] Missing in Action: Western Minds

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Dixon Chisholm: Jan 2, 2020

Regarde Aduck posted:

Nonsense's style of posting is syq's but from a slightly different universe than this one

underrated poster. absolute sleeper.

but he's right abour georgia.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:23

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# ? May 17, 2024 20:38

Officer Sandvich: Feb 14, 2010

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-04-29/key-insurer-says-russia-oil-price-cap-increasingly-unenforceable

Key Insurer Says Russia Oil Price Cap Increasingly Unenforceable

quote:

A Group of Seven-imposed cap on the price of Russia oil is becoming increasingly unenforceable, an organization at the heart of the global insurance industry said, offering one of the most direct criticisms yet of measures that were meant to deprive the Kremlin of petrodollars.

About 800 oil tankers that were previously covered by member organizations of the International Group of P&I Clubs have migrated into what’s known as a shadow-fleet, the club said in a written submission to a UK government inquiry on the effectiveness of sanctions on Russia. In addition, there’s no way for insurers to check whether traders are genuinely sticking to the price cap.

The policy “appears increasingly unenforceable as more ships and associated services move into this parallel trade,” the International Group’s submission said. It “is concerned that increasing responsibility and obligations on companies in the G-7 coalition will result in a further migration of trade activities and ancillary services outside of the G-7.”

Companies in Group of Seven nations are supposed to only provide their services for Russian oil if the cargoes in question cost $60 a barrel or less.

That makes the International Group, a London-based umbrella organization for 12 individual clubs around the world, a central part of making the measures work. It still covers the vast majority of the global fleet against risks including spills.

But with Russia pushing vessels away from western oversight, the need for IG members’ services is waning. In April just 16% of all Russian cargoes were covered by members of the International Group, the lowest since at least the start of 2023, according to shipping data compiled by Bloomberg.

Where G-7 services are used, firms must obtain written documentation — called attestations — vouching that the oil being transported cost less than $60 a barrel or less.

But there is no way for the firms to know that the attestations they are genuine, and plenty of reason to suspect they aren’t.

Published prices of Russia’s flagship Urals crude has spent months far above $60 a barrel — and Russian barrels have continued to move.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:31

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

MinutePirateBug posted:

When he was like Oh loving Clinton was such a great consensus builder, so poor Clinton let the loving French prevent us from stopping the Rwandan genocide I wanted to just loving ARGH! loving gently caress this loving gently caress fucker gently caress.

Its the first in a series that outlines What Liberals Believe about Ukraine. Its frustrating to watch and full of intellectual dishonesty

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:34

Cao Ni Ma: May 25, 2010

update the thread to include the extra context added by readers

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:34

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

dk2m posted:

It's pretty interesting to see how one of the original Donbass seperatists saw Yanukovych. Here's an excerpt from Pavel Gubarev's "Torch of New Russia" - there's a very, very unkind portrait of Yanukovych that I haven't encountered until this memoir

Bold emphasis mine. Sorry for the long wall of text, but this is a really fascinating little book.

This is great, thanks for posting it

I should include some kinda search term so I kind find interesting stuff later, like bookmark

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:37

spacetoaster: Feb 10, 2014

My two aunts (one in Ukraine, one in Russia) finally started talking on the phone again today and argued so hard about the war that they both got hospitalized for chest pain.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:53

Lostconfused: Oct 1, 2008

Buy them both an account.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 03:56

Leandros: Dec 14, 2008

Was thinking about how super basic the glide bomb kits must be and found this, looks like it is mostly made from off the shelf components and would cost a couple thousands bucks max, I have the exact same $2 buck regulator for gently caress's sake. Seems like these things could be very cheaply used to upgrade the entire dumb bomb arsenal in a couple of months for maybe 10M-100M bucks?

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:21

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

Ardennes posted:

Just imagine mods arguing over case law, the site can only take so much.

yeah, imagine

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:23

Spergin Morlock: Aug 8, 2009

Leandros posted:

Was thinking about how super basic the glide bomb kits must be and found this, looks like it is mostly made from off the shelf components and would cost a couple thousands bucks max, I have the exact same $2 buck regulator for gently caress's sake. Seems like these things could be very cheaply used to upgrade the entire dumb bomb arsenal in a couple of months for maybe 10M-100M bucks?

they absolutely could not be produced that cheaply. think of all the people who wouldn't get their taste

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:28

fizziester: Dec 21, 2023

Source: Ukrainska Pravda

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/04/29/7453445/

Ukraine suspends protection of property rights and free elections under Council of Europe conventions
SERHIY SYDORENKO, ALONA MAZURENKO � MONDAY, 29 APRIL 2024, 11:52

Ukraine has informed the Council of Europe secretariat of a change in the list of exceptions to its obligations under the Council of Europe's documents, including the European Convention on Human Rights.

Source: Ukraine's request on this matter on the Council of Europe website, as well as in documents from the Ukrainian government, reported by European Pravda

Details: As is well known, Ukraine, as a member state of the Council of Europe, is obliged to comply with the human rights standards set out in the Convention; in case of violation, individuals or organisations may file a lawsuit against Ukraine with the European Court of Human Rights in Strasbourg (ECHR). However, the ECHR gives member states the right to declare a reasoned derogation from certain obligations due to special circumstances, including military aggression.

In a letter dated 4 April 2024, which was not reported until recently, Ukraine informed the ECHR that the Ukrainian government's obligations to comply with Articles 8 (right to respect for private and family life), 10 (freedom of expression) and 11 (freedom of assembly and association), Article 2 of Protocol 4 (right to free movement of persons), as well as three articles from the first protocol � Article 1 (protection of private property), 2 (right to education) and 3 (right to freedom of elections), were no longer adhered to within Ukraine.

It is worth noting that this is not the first notification of a possible restriction of certain rights of citizens by Ukraine due to Russian aggression. Back in 2015, Ukraine suspended its obligations to comply with certain articles of the ECHR due to the anti-terrorist operation in Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts [The ATO, or Anti-Terrorist Operation, is a term used from 2014 to 2018 by the media, the government of Ukraine and the OSCE to identify combat actions in parts of Donetsk and Luhansk oblasts against Russian military forces and pro-Russian separatists � ed.]. In February 2022, with the start of Russia�s full-scale invasion, Kyiv submitted a significant list of such deviations to Strasbourg.

Moreover, in a communication dated 4 April 2024, Ukraine announced that it was renewing its commitments to respect certain human rights. In particular, the derogations will not apply to the prohibition of discrimination, restrictions on the political activity of foreigners, the right to reparation, freedom of thought, and certain aspects of forced labour. According to the official announcement, these commitments were also suspended earlier.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:33

BearsBearsBears: Aug 4, 2022

spacetoaster posted:

My two aunts (one in Ukraine, one in Russia) finally started talking on the phone again today and argued so hard about the war that they both got hospitalized for chest pain.

Lostconfused posted:

Buy them both an account.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:33

Danann: Aug 4, 2013

Officer Sandvich posted:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/29/debris-from-north-korean-missile-found-in-kharkiv-say-un-sanctions-monitors

Debris from North Korean missile found in Kharkiv, say UN sanctions monitors

blowback russia season going to have a lot of material to work with

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:34

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

fizziester posted:

According to the official announcement, these commitments were also suspended earlier.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 04:57

DJJIB-DJDCT: Feb 1, 2024

Dreylad posted:

yeah, imagine

To prove a point (about how annoyed I was, and my endless energy to annoy people when taken away from my work) when I got dragged in as tiebreaker to some dispute between the two senior-most people in a group, I ruled according to Salic Law. Full text Here.

You make your own fun.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 05:01

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

DJJIB-DJDCT posted:

To prove a point (about how annoyed I was, and my endless energy to annoy people when taken away from my work) when I got dragged in as tiebreaker to some dispute between the two senior-most people in a group, I ruled according to Salic Law. Full text Here.

You make your own fun.

smh @ not ruling according to ius canonicum

# ? Apr 30, 2024 05:05

DJJIB-DJDCT: Feb 1, 2024

Cerebral Bore posted:

smh @ not ruling according to ius canonicum

Might as well follow Robert's Rules in that case.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 05:10

Dawncloack: Nov 26, 2007; ECKS DEE!; Nap Ghost

Salic law was at the root of Spain's three 19th century civil wars, only reason we ever studied it in school.

I am always surprised when anybody else knows it but I guess you are a pro.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 05:41

Officer Sandvich: Feb 14, 2010

https://www.dw.com/en/german-army-captain-admits-spying-for-russia/a-68946494

German army captain admits spying for Russia

The officer, with ties to the far-right AfD party, said he provided information to a Russian intelligence service out of fear of a nuclear escalation in Moscow's war in Ukraine.

quote:

A member of Germany's Bundeswehr went on trial in the western city of D�sseldorf on Monday, charged with espionage activities on behalf of Russia and leaking state secrets.

At the start of the trial, the defendant admitted that he had spied for Russia. He said his actions were driven by a fear of a nuclear escalation amid Russia's war in Ukraine.

The officer was arrested on August 9 last year and the charges against him were made public on March 19.

The defendant is accused of making repeated and unsolicited offers to cooperate, starting in May 2023, at both Russia's consulate in Bonn and its embassy in Berlin.

He allegedly already provided some sensitive information during these meetings.

According to prosecutors, he also photographed old training documents related to munitions systems and aircraft technology and dropped the material into the letterbox of the Russian consulate in Bonn.

Prosecutors say there's no evidence of him receiving payment.

The 54-year-old man said that the accusations against him were "broadly" accurate.

Content he saw "presumably on TikTok" had prompted him to contact the Russian consulate. He said he had followed on TikTok a pro-Russian influencer affiliated with the far-right party Alternative for Germany (AfD), although he wasn't sure which content it was.

According to his account, he was concerned about his family's safety in the event of a nuclear attack. The officer said he therefore sought contact with Russian authorities to get a heads up on "when it was going to go off."

"I only saw this way," he told the court.

The officer added that he regretted his actions and that he was in a bad mental state at the time.

The man, with a rank of captain, had worked at the Bundeswehr's equipment, technology and in-service support facility in Koblenz.

The facility is responsible for equipping Germany's armed forces, as well as for developing, testing and procuring new equipment and technology.

Around the same time as his cooperation with Russian authorities, he had also applied for membership with the AfD. The court said his application was authorized in July 2023.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 05:53

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

dk2m posted:

It's pretty interesting to see how one of the original Donbass seperatists saw Yanukovych. Here's an excerpt from Pavel Gubarev's "Torch of New Russia" - there's a very, very unkind portrait of Yanukovych that I haven't encountered until this memoir

Bold emphasis mine. Sorry for the long wall of text, but this is a really fascinating little book.

Yeah, there's a reason no one bothered to keep the democratically elected president of Ukraine around, despite that being the standard move. Also aligns with Ischenko's take, that the 'pro-Russian' side had no developmental project to offer at all.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 07:23

Starsfan: Sep 29, 2007; This is what happens when you disrespect Cam Neely

shocking news: American GPS guided artillery shells actually worse than much cheaper and more plentiful "dumb" shells:

https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2024/04/another-us-precision-guided-weapon-falls-prey-russian-electronic-warfare-us-says/396141/

quote:

Another US precision-guided weapon falls prey to Russian electronic warfare, US says
A U.S. defense official would not provide specifics, but is likely referring to Boeing�s Ground-Launched Small Diameter Bomb.

BY SAM SKOVE
STAFF WRITER
APRIL 28, 2024

U.S.-provided precision-guided munitions have failed in mission after mission in Ukraine, taken down by Russian electronic warfare. On Wednesday, the Pentagon revealed the latest casualty.

A new ground-launched version of an air-to-ground weapon developed for Ukraine on a rapid timeline failed to hit targets in part because of Russian electro-magnetic warfare, Bill LaPlante, the Pentagon's acquisition chief, said at an event held by think tank CSIS.

LaPlante suggested that Ukraine may no longer be interested in the weapon. �When you send something to people in the fight of their lives that just doesn�t work, they�ll try it three times and they�ll just throw it aside,� said LaPlante.

The weapon LaPlante is referring to is very likely the Ground-Launched Small Diameter Bomb (GLSDB) based on his description, according to Bryan Clark, a senior fellow at the Hudson Institute.

A Boeing spokesperson did not confirm that LaPlante was referring to GLSDB, but said the company is �working closely with the [Defense Department] on spiral capability improvements to the ground-launch SDB system.� Spiral capability improvements refers to an iterative software development process.

The GLDSB boasts a range of 90 miles�double the range of the Guided Multiple Launch Rocket System (GMRLS) missiles Ukraine previously used to wreak havoc on Russia�s logistic centers. Funding for the weapon was approved in February 2023, and Ukraine was reportedly using the weapon by February 2024.

The weapon relies on GPS to navigate to its targets. It also has an inertial navigation system, which navigates to a target by estimating its position through the use of accelerometers and other devices.

But it is not the first GPS-guided weapon to fall afoul of Russian electronic warfare.

In congressional testimony in March, Hudson Institute Senior Fellow Daniel Patt said the targeting system for the GPS-guided Excalibur round �dropped from 70 percent effectiveness to 6 percent effectiveness over a matter of a few months as new EW mechanisms came out� in Ukraine. Patt cited the work of Jack Watling, an expert at think-tank RUSI who has traveled to Ukraine multiple times to interview Ukrainian commanders.

Russian electronic warfare attacks have also directed GMLRS missiles off course, CNN reported last spring. The missiles are similarly guided by a GPS. Russia has also successfully used electronic warfare against GPS-guided Joint Direct Attack Munitions (JDAMs), which are retrofitted aerial bombs.

Russian electronic warfare on the U.S.�s �more precise capabilities is a challenge,� the commander of the chief U.S. aid coordinating group told an audience in December.

Clark, citing a presentation by Ukrainian soldiers, said the Russians use GPS spoofers to throw off the munitions.

GPS spoofers work by sending false location data to GPS navigation devices. Because GPS signals are weak, a stronger, false signal can be sent to override the correct inputs. Russia has used GPS spoofing in Ukraine since at least 2018. But advancements in technology mean spoofers can be created cheaply with just a software-defined radio and open-source software.

The weapons the spoofers are working against, meanwhile, are anything but cheap. A GMLRS missile costs around $160,000, while an Excalibur round can cost as much as $100,000. The GLDSB costs around $40,000.

However, the weapons were largely designed for a period before spoofers were so easy to set up, Clark said. �You didn't really see the advent of miniaturized, capable GPS spoofers until the last ten years or so, because you needed the micro-electronics to be able to do it,� Clark said.

Russia has saturated the front with electronic warfare, Clark said. Truck-mounted electronic warfare systems primarily focused on jamming drones are located every six to nine miles on Ukraine�s frontline, he said.

But Ukraine could use other U.S. munitions that are not susceptible to GPS spoofing, Clark added, citing the Harpoon missile.

The U.S. could also provide more sophisticated munitions, like the JASSM (Joint Air-to-Surface Standoff Missile), but Clark discounted that possibility because of its range. The Biden. administration has sought to limit Ukraine�s use of longer-range weapons that could target Russia directly.

Another solution might be to launch weapons from F-16s. Ukrainian pilots currently launch JDAMS from Soviet planes that can�t pass navigational data to the JDAMS, whereas F-16s can, Clark said. Ukrainian pilots are training on F-16s and will be ready to fly them by the end of this year.

Ukraine can also work to jam Russia�s systems, Clark added. Russia has mostly been using an analog of the JDAM, the KAB, which can also be misdirected by spoofing its guidance system.

And Ukraine is �fielding some systems now� for electronic warfare targeting of satellite navigation, Clark said. Still, since Russia is targeting civilian populations, �they may not care that much if they get spoofed.�

This is your monthly reminder that NAFO optimism about Ukraine's successes on the ground in winning the attrition war with Russia are largely built upon the belief that the smart shells and other similar weapons are like 50x more effective and accurate than anything Russia is using.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 07:28

netizen: Jun 25, 2023

miniaturized GPS spoofers, advanced radar jamming, mobile tank sheds. It seems like Russia is learning a whole lot about modern warfare.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 07:41

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

Starsfan posted:

shocking news: American GPS guided artillery shells actually worse than much cheaper and more plentiful "dumb" shells:

This is your monthly reminder that NAFO optimism about Ukraine's successes on the ground in winning the attrition war with Russia are largely built upon the belief that the smart shells and other similar weapons are like 50x more effective and accurate than anything Russia is using.

utter vindication for comrade ff-thought, another victory for the immortal science

# ? Apr 30, 2024 07:51

Cheatum the Evil Midget: Sep 11, 2000; I COULDN'T BACK UP ANY OF MY ARGUEMENTS, IGNORE ME PLEASE.

How much could it possibly cost to temporarily capture a small eastern European hamlet, Michael? Twelve leopards?

https://twitter.com/MilitarySummary/status/1785089323173286114#m

# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:02

Ardennes: May 12, 2002

Also, even if F-16s/F-35s have their own GPS unit and could guide the bomb, that signal could also be possibly jammed on close approach. Laser guidance can't but also you need to be close enough with the right conditions.

I also assume they don't want to send the LASSM out there because they just don't have that many and it is one of the US' prime standoff munitions.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:16

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

genericnick posted:

Yeah, there's a reason no one bothered to keep the democratically elected president of Ukraine around, despite that being the standard move. Also aligns with Ischenko's take, that the 'pro-Russian' side had no developmental project to offer at all.

And probably why the secession was limited to the most 'Russian' zones and didn't spread. They left solely in opposition to the Maidan coup, not *for* any rival nationalist project. Imagine if Putin had been half the plotter the west makes him out to be and had seeded 'greater Russia' as hard as western NGOs supported Ukrainian fascist revisionism

# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:25

Ardennes: May 12, 2002

I wouldn't say that necessarily, Yanukovich was talking about possibly joining the Eurasian Union. A lot of it was that even in the areas that voted for Yanukovich, there was anger, but the events in Kiev happened pretty swiftly. You went from large protests and riots in the capital to him fleeing over the course of a day or two.

There were Russian agents on the ground in the east in response, but they only really got local support in the Donbass, and that is how the conflict started.

Ardennes has issued a correction as of 08:38 on Apr 30, 2024

# ? Apr 30, 2024 08:30

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

Nix Panicus posted:

And probably why the secession was limited to the most 'Russian' zones and didn't spread. They left solely in opposition to the Maidan coup, not *for* any rival nationalist project. Imagine if Putin had been half the plotter the west makes him out to be and had seeded 'greater Russia' as hard as western NGOs supported Ukrainian fascist revisionism

Yup. Still wondering what they taught in KGB school. Not sure about the greater Russia idea, really. Seems like whatever the contents the obvious way to go was to lean into soviet esthetics. That's when you beat the US into space! When you rolled tanks into Berlin! All the poo poo that gets blown up in this war was built during soviet times!
Who is even the target audience for your list of top ten white generals?

# ? Apr 30, 2024 09:39

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

quote:

Stop Comparing Ukraine to World War I]None of this guarantees that Ukraine will achieve its own Normandy breakout in the coming weeks. But the World War II analogy is an argument for patience and persistence. Nearly eight decades ago, the United States faced some of the same challenges that Ukraine faces today. But the U.S. Army persisted, and its slow, daily advances wore down the German defenders. The cumulative attritional effect proved decisive in the end. Today, the Ukrainian military is making progress, albeit slowly. Whether this halting progress ultimately grinds the Russian military down�or grinds to halt�will only be revealed in time.

The time factor is perhaps the most important reason why it�s misleading to compare Ukraine today to World War I. Back then, after four years of fighting and millions of casualties, Britain and France arguably didn�t have time on their side, even as the Americans finally entered the fray in the last six months of the war. The British and French watched as an entire generation of young men was decimated and the prewar global order they led was upended. Not so with Ukraine and the West today. The United States and its allies have only invested treasure�not blood�in Ukraine. The West has time on its side, and it can afford to be patient. Bad analogies that ignore this fundamental truth only serve to undermine one of West�s biggest strategic advantages.

Lmao, great stuff from great brains at RAND.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:27

Pistol_Pete: Sep 15, 2007; Oven Wrangler

genericnick posted:

Lmao, great stuff from great brains at RAND.

Lol, this article rules:

quote:

Ukraine still needs a way of clearing minefields, breaching Russian trenches, and blunting Russian air power. Some of this may come from getting the right weapons in sufficient numbers. In this respect, the U.S. decision to provide cluster munitions�which are designed to attack infantry troops and vehicles�should help. But gains will also require continued tactical innovation.

How is Ukraine expecting to breach Russian defenses? Don't know yet, but they'll think of something!

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:35

Skaffen-Amtiskaw: Jun 24, 2023

netizen posted:

miniaturized GPS spoofers, advanced radar jamming, mobile tank sheds. It seems like Russia is learning a whole lot about modern warfare.

I think of Sir Michael Gambon�s character in the film Toys a lot and how he nailed how modern warfare would happen in 2024 with drones.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:37

genericnick: Dec 26, 2012

Pistol_Pete posted:

Lol, this article rules:

How is Ukraine expecting to breach Russian defenses? Don't know yet, but they'll think of something!

Anyway, no spoilers, still clearing my old bookmarks

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:43

Nix Panicus: Feb 25, 2007

genericnick posted:

Yup. Still wondering what they taught in KGB school. Not sure about the greater Russia idea, really. Seems like whatever the contents the obvious way to go was to lean into soviet esthetics. That's when you beat the US into space! When you rolled tanks into Berlin! All the poo poo that gets blown up in this war was built during soviet times!
Who is even the target audience for your list of top ten white generals?

Putin is a lib, he can't lean into Soviet aesthetics

genericnick posted:

Lmao, great stuff from great brains at RAND.

Is Ukraine making progress on *any* front that isnt lobbing missiles at ships and refineries?

Randomly, whatever happened to that Belgorod thing? There was so much propaganda around it I couldn't really make heads or tails out of how big it actually was or how quickly it was repelled

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:44

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

genericnick posted:

Lmao, great stuff from great brains at RAND.

"the west can afford to be patient because it's only a generation or two of ukrainians who are being ground into dust and not real people"

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:52

samogonka: Nov 5, 2016

Nix Panicus posted:

Putin is a lib, he can't lean into Soviet aesthetics

Is Ukraine making progress on *any* front that isnt lobbing missiles at ships and refineries?

Randomly, whatever happened to that Belgorod thing? There was so much propaganda around it I couldn't really make heads or tails out of how big it actually was or how quickly it was repelled

The Belgorod incursions were a PR stunt to embarrass Putin during the elections

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:53

Cerebral Bore: Apr 21, 2010; Fun Shoe

with friends like the big brain dudes at rand ukraine really doesn't need any enemies

# ? Apr 30, 2024 10:53

Orange Devil: Oct 1, 2010; Wullie's reign cannae smother the flames o' equality!

supersnowman posted:

The west is so drat angry against a country who still want to join them through the EU.

It's such a weird lack of patience.

The whole mechanism is supposed to work by getting these countries in, tangling them up in an ever increasing web of EU regulations and slowly delegating more and more powers to Brussels to the point where basically parts of the state wither away (see for example the UK not having any negotiators for economic treaties after Brexit because that was all handled at the EU level). Meanwhile you sent their promising youths on Erasmus programmes all over Europe to make sure they identify with the EU, and through that the cybernetic empire, and then these people get into the administration of the country at all levels and it just become more and more common sense to turn your countrymen over to be devoured by the empire.

But even that's not enough now. The entire country must prostrate itself willingly before the empire immediately and all in one go, or else.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 11:34

Skaffen-Amtiskaw: Jun 24, 2023

Orange Devil posted:

It's such a weird lack of patience.

The whole mechanism is supposed to work by getting these countries in, tangling them up in an ever increasing web of EU regulations and slowly delegating more and more powers to Brussels to the point where basically parts of the state wither away (see for example the UK not having any negotiators for economic treaties after Brexit because that was all handled at the EU level). Meanwhile you sent their promising youths on Erasmus programmes all over Europe to make sure they identify with the EU, and through that the cybernetic empire, and then these people get into the administration of the country at all levels and it just become more and more common sense to turn your countrymen over to be devoured by the empire.

But even that's not enough now. The entire country must prostrate itself willingly before the empire immediately and all in one go, or else.

Actually, the EU is cool and good, OP. The Internet and media told me this regularly since 2016. All problems in the UK now are purely down to leaving the EU. So rejoining would naturally make all problems vanish.

It�s simple, really.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 11:47

cock hero flux: Apr 17, 2011

Orange Devil posted:

It's such a weird lack of patience.

The whole mechanism is supposed to work by getting these countries in, tangling them up in an ever increasing web of EU regulations and slowly delegating more and more powers to Brussels to the point where basically parts of the state wither away (see for example the UK not having any negotiators for economic treaties after Brexit because that was all handled at the EU level). Meanwhile you sent their promising youths on Erasmus programmes all over Europe to make sure they identify with the EU, and through that the cybernetic empire, and then these people get into the administration of the country at all levels and it just become more and more common sense to turn your countrymen over to be devoured by the empire.

But even that's not enough now. The entire country must prostrate itself willingly before the empire immediately and all in one go, or else.

after a few generations of refusing to say the quiet part out loud more and more of the machinery ends up in the hands of people who have never actually heard or figured out the quiet part, and their attempts to make it do what they believe it is supposed to do instead of what it is actually designed to do cause it to break down.

# ? Apr 30, 2024 11:58

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# ? May 17, 2024 20:38

Endman: May 18, 2010; That is not dead which can eternal lie, And with strange aeons even anime may die

DJJIB-DJDCT posted:

To prove a point (about how annoyed I was, and my endless energy to annoy people when taken away from my work) when I got dragged in as tiebreaker to some dispute between the two senior-most people in a group, I ruled according to Salic Law. Full text Here.

You make your own fun.

drat that�s a blast from the past; I remember Salic Law being a great part of an undergrad unit I did on Early Medieval society and culture

# ? Apr 30, 2024 12:07

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Ukraine] Missing in Action: Western Minds

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