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Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The Avalanche desperately need to move Girard for a Top 6 forward. But the more he plays the more obvious it is that absolutely no one should give up a Top 6 forward to acquire him.

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Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

ThinkTank posted:

I still think of him as a top quality defensive defenceman. Has he fallen off that much since he was hurt?

As it stands if he was the central return in a Horvat trade I'd be pretty pleased with that.
I recognize +/- is a pretty limited stat. That said he's a -12 and the next closest player is a -4. His most common d partner is a +2. It says he has 54 shots on the season, but I think it's grossly underestimating how many shot attempts he has. Just misty of his shots get blocked or are 10 feet wide of the net.

I was pretty done with him last year, but this year has manged to be worse, and he's got 4 more years at $5 million per. The Canucks would be getting fleeced in a Horvat-Girard trade, even with no extension.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Jamwad Hilder posted:

Yeah it's too early to say he's bust, but it is correct to note that at this point in his career he hasn't looked like much at the NHL level.

From what I've seen of him he's stuck in kind of a weird limbo. He's clearly too good for the AHL, but his NHL development keeps getting set back by COVID, or injuries, or just other random bad luck.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Jamwad Hilder posted:

Also, I know Colorado is banged up, but things are looking pretty bad for them. Are they going to miss the playoffs? They've got games in hand but they're 4 points out of the last wild card, and 7 points behind Minnesota for the third division spot. If any team is capable of a second half surge it's probably them, just seems pretty bleak right now.

Edit: also they are currently losing to the Blackhawks


For all the talk about the Blackhawks, or the Flyers, or the Coyotes, or the Canucks being dogshit garbage the Avalanche are pretty consistently finding ways to lose to those teams. With both Landeskog and Nichushkin out the Power Play is absolutely toothless. They needed to make a trade for some serious forward help like 10 games ago, but the Avs seem weirdly intent on shuttling guys back and forth from the AHL.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Colorado has a 3 game northwestern trip that I think will be pretty telling if they are in trouble, or the rest of the west is in trouble. Nichushkin was back Monday, and Manson may be back on this trip.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The long and short of it with Colorado is injuries, especially among the top 6 forwards. Even without Landeskog they're the best team in the west. Missing two guys they're still a playoff team. The problem this year is they've been fielding lineups like:

Compher - Newhook - Rantanen
A bunch of AHL guys

If you're in the west and haven't put any daylight from this team you should be concerned, or just hope that they continue to stay injured.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Jhet posted:

I do think Colorado can slide into one of the wild card spots. I don't think they catch the top 3 in the central without some injury issues showing up in those teams. With 3-4 games in hand over Calgary and Edmonton they can push into the picture when the pieces start getting healthy. I don't know that they'll be flying as well as they did the 2nd half of last season because of the injury problems, but I don't count them out. It makes me wonder just how much of a toll it took last year to win and if they didn't get quite as much rest as they really needed.

Minnesota has been playing a much more defensive game this year, and it's starting to show consistency and the points are showing up from it. This road trip through the south east will be telling. Beat Washington, but Carolina, Florida, and Tampa to come on the trip. They've also games in hand on Dallas and Winnipeg, and only one more played than Colorado. It could flip in the 2nd half of the season, but they seemed to have fixed that worrying early season form. MAF is up to a .905 sv% and Gustavsson is at .926 (t-2nd best in the league for goalies who've played more than a game). GAA is also trending down towards low 2 instead of above 3.

Colorado is 5-2-1 when they are only missing Landeskog, and 13-8 when they are only missing two guys out of their Top 6. It's a pretty big if and when, but if and when they get healthy they are going to be fine.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Does Vancouver have any big guys with no discernible skill set who take a bunch of dumb penalties? If not I don't know if Minnesota would be willing to trade.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003


Because the NHL rules are crafted to harshly punish anyone who would try, but wont do anything to punish jackasses taking cheap shots against star players.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

fermun posted:

It is completely absurd that Arizona traded away Conor Timmins for an AHL player. At least when the Avs traded him away they got what became their cup-winning goalie in return and that's a trade any GM would make, but what the hell was Arizona thinking
I think he was perpetually broken in Arizona, somehow even more than he was in Colorado.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

I'm not going to lie. I'm finding all the wailing and gnashing of the teeth for legendary Canucks coach Bruce Boudreau pretty hilarious.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

I can't speak for Tocchet's time in Tampa Bay, but he was fine in Arizona. His style of play is boring as poo poo, but they were physical and defended hard.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Good Soldier Svejk posted:

Not exactly the style of play you want to build a team with Elias Petersson and Quinn Hughes around
they probably weigh 300lbs put together

Makes much more sense to make Ekman-Larsson and Myers the centerpieces of your system
He wasn't asking Conor Garland and Phil Kessel to take runs at his in the corner or anything like that, and those guys fit into his system fine. As a whole his style is pretty friendly to defenseman as they aren't getting hung out by the forwards, and there's always someone to pass to.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

ThinkTank posted:

If it wasn't for Eddie Shore sports wouldn't have the proud traditions of All-Star games or retired numbers, so you can thank him for that.

Piss on old time hockey.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The trapezoid is practically the Martin Brodeur rule, and practically every goalie for several generations emulated Patrick Roy's style. Those two things should probably be taken into consideration.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The Avalanche win 6 straight. Then they lose a top 6 forward and immediately drop one to the freaking Ducks.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

fermun posted:

Well if they are together roughly as good as Andrew Cogliano, JT Compher, and Logan O'Connor, then that's something

I think O'Connor is on like a 30 game goalless steak. He can definitely play on the kid line.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Esa Tikkanen is probably the GOAT chirper. Mostly because he talked in some weird half-Finnish, half-English that nobody understood what he was saying, only that he was talking poo poo.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

I don't know how the NHL has managed to make the Breakaway Challenge worse than the NBA Slam Dunk competition, but here we are. Both of them seem so simple in concept that they should be impossible to gently caress up.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

What exquisite timing for this conversation as Jeff Carter delivers a cheap shot to Cale Makar's head and knocks him out of the game.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Last night's Pittsburgh-Colorado game had the feel of two coaches who thought they were playing 5D Chess, but to an outside observer looked like two guys playing with sticks in the mud.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Eric the Mauve posted:

Yeah I'm smarter than Jared Bednar and Mike Sullivan too

It feels like a pretty uncontroversial opinion to think that you should probably play MacKinnon and Rantanen together at 5-on-5.

If you are splitting them up for matchups or whatever, you are probably overthinking things.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Yeah Tampa got poo poo on a lot for that trade last year, but this year it looks like an annoyingly good trade.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

It is pretty funny that the Kings would still be paying Doughty $11M/year when Chychrun is up for an extension. It's not all doom and gloom though, as Kopitar's contract will have expired by then.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

It's pretty amazing that St. Louis is just giving away forwards, meanwhile their back end is awful, all 30+, and locked into long term deals with no trade clauses.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The Edmonton Oilers are loving embarrassing.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

fermun posted:

It's gonna be weird on Landeskog's situation for the Avs, based on when he's expected to be back right now, it's supposed to be early April, which would be a money in money out situation, but if he's delayed just another week and a half, then the Avs have 7.1M in cap space. Erik Johnson's broken ankle in a normal recovery time would put him ready to play late in the 1st round of the playoffs, and that's 6M more, but Avs have basically no picks or prospects unless they're willing to deal a 1st round pick. Sakic wasn't a fan of trading first rounders, but now that he's been promoted and MacFarland is the GM, maybe?
The Johnson injury is almost a blessing in disguise. He's more or less been relegated to a 10 minute a night 3rd pair guy, and now the Avs have 6 million in cap space to play with. They can make a trade without adding any retained salary sweeteners.

Landeskog is supposedly back skating this week, so I think he'll be back well before early April.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

You can't win hockey games unless your team is stupidly running around trying to cheap shot Nazem Kadri while letting him score a hatty. Sorry, but that's the type of grit you need to win in the playoffs. Look the other team may have a 50% power play, but they'll know that you showed up to play

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

I'm sitting back, having a hearty chuckle reminiscing about how Claude Giroux rejected going to Colorado and would only go to Florida.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

grack posted:

Avs traded something called a Shane Bowers to Boston for Keith Kinkaid


Okay

Bowers is a former 1st round pick the Avs picked up as part of the Duchene trade. He's been farting about in the AHL and got injured immediately when he finally got his first NHL call up. He played college hockey in Boston.

Kincaid is kind of an odd pickup for the Avs, as I think he's really only useful for the next couple of weeks while Francouz is out.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

If things go according to plan Jack Johnson isn't going to see the ice in the postseason. Otherwise
I would much rather have him out there than Andreas Englund or Brad Hunt.

I am getting kind of nervous about the trades the Avs are making though. Surely they don't think everything will be fixed by Landeskog returning to the lineup?

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

fermun posted:

Avs emptied the cupboard for last year's team and most GMs aren't comfortable with trading for picks too far out because they know those players won't possibly develop before their time as GM is over. The Avs have 3 good non-roster prospects left in Olausson, Beaucage, and Foudy, 2 decent ones in Ranta and Behrens, then either their 1sts, late round picks, or 2025 picks.

The needs right now are a 2C and a 3rd line forward maybe a 7th defenseman (JJ can be a 7th but I'd prefer him at 8th). EJ is out until the playoffs so there's 6.3M cap space to work with, so it's possible, but I don't see many options out there unless they want to spend a 1st and some prospects to get a guy with some term, but the rentals market is about spent right now.

I definitely think they should have been in for Barbashev, and Vegas didn't really pay a whole lot for him. But, I don't know, maybe St. Louis wasn't interested in dealing with Colorado.

As a whole I think their AHL guys are poo poo, and the Avs should move them before anyone else figures out they're poo poo. If Nick Schmaltz or someone can be had for a first and any of those guys, I would get that done ASAP. Instead every trade Colorado has done has more or less been a depth move to shore up the 4th line, which you would think those guys from the Eagles could play a role right now.

Simplex fucked around with this message at 06:44 on Feb 27, 2023

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Jamwad Hilder posted:

I feel like Colorado is fine once everyone gets healthy. I know some people think their 2C is a weak spot but it seems like JT Compher has done fine to me.

Compher is fine, and can play anywhere up and down the lineup in a pinch. But he's really not a long term solution at 2C. At the moment he isn't even the 2C, as Rantanen has been bumped down to center the second line.

Plus they are just brutal on faceoffs which is causing problems especially on special teams.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

There are a whole lot of quotes in that TSN article that I'm not sure why anyone would want their name attached to.

quote:

We also feel the timing is not good both on the perception front and for the survival of what we hold dear.

Is something that somebody felt comfortable writing in an email.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

News: Alex Tuch - 57 games played, 28 goals, 34 assists
Jack Eichel - 47 games played, 20 goals, 23 assists

Views: :lol:

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

eXXon posted:

They're going to closely scrutinize trading for injured players how and do what about it? Actually verify that players on IR are injured, something that they're presumably already supposed to be doing?

My guess is the league caught wind that someone was going to try to trade future considerations or some bullshit for Toews.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

The Kings gave Cal Petersen a contract extension and a 12-team no trade clause, and he proceeded to stink up the joint to the point that they had to send him back to the minors, so the Kings would have to pay someone to take his contract. Moving Quick was really their only option to improve their goaltending.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003


That's pretty common now with teams trying to scrape together cap space. The Avalanche are doing the same thing at the moment with Brad Hunt and Ben Meyers.

Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Avs could use a penalty killer and face off guy. A 2nd round pick is ? unless there is a lot of contract being retained by someone.

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Simplex
Jun 29, 2003

Darude - Adam Sandstorm posted:

A 2nd in 2025 might turn into a player by 2030!

I don't mind them moving picks, I just think moving a 2nd for an expiring contract who is going to be a 4C for you is maybe not prudent asset management. Especially since Washington is only retaining 31% of his $3.5 million contact.

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