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Cyouni
Sep 30, 2014

without love it cannot be seen
I've been really enjoying this, but I absolutely cannot blame you. Going around Crossbell for text broke me.

Hwurmp posted:

I don't blame you in the slightest; going all around Crossbell hit me hard even in Reverie where you only do it like, twice

*laughs in CS4*

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Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender

Level 1 Thief posted:

Alright, so this LP hasn't really been coming together as I'd wanted. We're still enjoying the game, and I'm happy with how the videos have turned out, but working on it has really been starting to drag over time and there's still so much left. I'd been expecting it to run shorter than the CS games, but now we're pushing 60 hours recorded with three full chapters still to go in Zero and unfortunately I'm gonna have to call it.

Fair enough, these are a lot of work, and you shouldn't feel obligated to keep doing it if it's not enjoyable. In my notes to claw game handjob, I had been passing along specific NPC conversations which are interesting, as a way to help cut down on the long rounds of NPC chatter. Falcom definitely cut back a lot more on the NPC dialogue in the Cold Steel games compared to earlier in the series. Cold Steel absolutely had smaller NPC counts, and tried to update dialogue less often.

Zero Chapter 3 is probably the longest chapter with, I believe 5 city dialogue updates and 4 updates for the outskirts, and it took me about 22 hours for all the city/outskirts stuff.

I'm not sure, though, how well switching to a podcast format will work. While talking to NPC's wouldn't be much of a problem, there are a lot of things in the games which are intended for a visual medium and would require a lot of pausing to describe the scene, and there are occasional bits where the action and text happening automatically advances and can't be paused.

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.
Thanks all, I've been chewing on this for a while now so I really appreciate the support.

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

I'm not sure, though, how well switching to a podcast format will work. While talking to NPC's wouldn't be much of a problem, there are a lot of things in the games which are intended for a visual medium and would require a lot of pausing to describe the scene, and there are occasional bits where the action and text happening automatically advances and can't be paused.

Oh, I don't mean like switching to an audio-only LP, that'd be really weird*. Just us talking for a while about a chunk of the game we recently played, still a lot and in-depth but just not ... real-time 130 hours' worth.


* we actually tried that once as a commentary track for an FMV game with very strict video policy. it didn't really work so it never got posted anywhere.

Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

there's something grating about the way the Crossbell games get multiple lines of text out of phrases like "Ii ne" or "HAWWWW?!?!"

I wonder if I'd feel the same way about the Sky or Cold Steel games if I'd played them with Japanese audio

Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 17:48 on Oct 23, 2023

claw game handjob
Mar 27, 2007

pinch pinch scrape pinch
ow ow fuck it's caught
i'm bleeding
JESUS TURN IT OFF
WHY ARE YOU STILL SMILING
It might be better to think of it this way: an actual discussion of a day/chapter between the two of us can go so much smoother if we just dig in on the characters who we notice, enjoy, or remember as opposed to three horndogs in each district and 12 old folks who might be spies battering on about "did you know? Blatant foreshadowing!" that we then have to pretend we have much to add to. Especially since a lot of our wildest theorycrafting comes between sessions, after we chew on things or the both of us revisit material in editing/listening to the latest release.

Also it means we can play at our own pace instead of block chunks on a schedule.

Level 1 Thief posted:

* we actually tried that once as a commentary track for an FMV game with very strict video policy. it didn't really work so it never got posted anywhere.

Oh yeah, I don't think we ever said this anywhere: we also just have this unspoken policy of "if one or both of us don't feel like something worked, we scrap it" ever since some of our older material? So we promise there will be quality control. Tech tests and experiments happen all the time for "is this a thing? No." reasons. It's why as much as I tease it, we'll never have that Neptunia thread with me at the controls: the vibes are incredibly off.

claw game handjob fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Oct 23, 2023

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
- Pearl's fiancee is Scott, yes he really is a bracer, yes he really knows about her, yes they really are engaged.
- The switch from "Gin" to "Yin" happened after Grimwood said it was an Eastern name, therefore everyone started using the Chinese pronunciation.

- Re: Yin's supposed immortality - Dread Pirate Roberts is probably on the right track, if I'm remembering correctly.
- There was mention of a legend of white-colored Divine Wolves. I don't recall the legend mentioning they talked.
- It's obvious that Cao Lee was not even trying to pretend that he doesn't know about Calvard's favorite assassin. It seems to me that Randy was right - Heiyue sees the cops and SSS as so little of a threat that Cao could smugly come right up to the line without crossing over into an actual admission which could be used in court. Cao is also smart enough to know that the police coming by to ask him means they already suspect the connection anyway.
- I'm pretty sure Lloyd had to tell Cao about the threat letter to explain why he's visiting, and he asked questions about Yin, so even if Lloyd didn't show Cao the signature, it's not an unreasonable assumption for Cao to make.
- It's true that Heiyue knows what Lloyd knows, but Dudley is still correct that it's good practice to at least make sure to be out of immediate earshot of the building.
- Re: Dudley mentioning foreign intelligence agencies: Dudley wasn't calling Yin, Revache, or Heiyue foreign intelligence agencies or working for them, he was explaining that it's the responsibility of the First Division to keep tabs on foreign intelligence agencies, in addition to their other law enforcement responsibilities. In fact, I think that they're the closest thing Crossbell has to an Intelligence Division.

Stabbey_the_Clown fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Oct 23, 2023

Cyouni
Sep 30, 2014

without love it cannot be seen
I'm not going to lie though, I'm going to miss things like "please don't say something about getting off trains" *sudden, abrupt, 30 second long silence*

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.

Z25. Rooftop Rendezvous

It Wasn't a Date: 2010 Edition

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Huh. I just realized something about Elie that makes me like her a bit more. I mean, she's still my least favorite of the 4 but something worth noting much MUCH later on

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
- If this was Trails in the Sky FC, the window for obtaining the book wouldn't be that long.
- Trails loves its maids who are so utterly (and unhealthily) devoted to serving their master that they never reach self-actualization.
- Odds for cooking are definitely lower in this game than Cold Steel, even taking into consideration the lack of unique dishes (because there aren't enough different cooks). There's also the "Failure" outcome which no longer exists in Cold Steel.
- There are only three points in the game where you have to choose a single party member to go with Lloyd for something. One was the prologue boss battle, the other two are near the end of Chapter 3 and right after Chapter 3 ends. If you pick Tio for either, she'll probably end up being the one whose ending you get. To be honest I found Tio's ending to be the least interesting. Randy's is both the most interesting and has actual backstory which you can't see elsewhere. Elie's ending is fine, somewhere in the middle.

- Some character reminisces in Zero/Azure do get Sepia flashbacks, but Elie does not.
- Randy would absolutely NOT have said "if you run away, you're just your Dad."
- "I definitely want to hear about Randy's dark past." You should definitely take Randy for the next two events which make you choose so you get his ending.
- I am sad to announce the death of Lloyd's romantic self-awareness. It was with us in this world only about 10-ish hours, but it will live on in our memories.
- Standing up animations arrive in Cold Steel 3.
- Ailment protection can also be found at the weapon shop.
- Combo Crafts are really strong. They only appear in the Zero/Azure games, likely because as the cast size increases, the difficulty of coming up with unique moves quickly gets out of control.

Prowler
May 24, 2004

I made a small minigame out of running around with Elie on high speed and shooting mofos.

Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

the difference between Department Store Times and Times Department Store depends on which time zone you're in

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
I've seen Elie and Tio's Combo Crafts but I usually stick with Randy's. The girls have better things to use CP on

Cyouni
Sep 30, 2014

without love it cannot be seen
One thing to note about what Elie said is what you mentioned last time: Cao practically flaunted "hiring an assassin" in their face knowing they could do gently caress-all about it since Heiyue's basically backed by the Republican Faction. Garcia did something similar, but Revache's backed by the Imperial Faction, specifically the Speaker, co-head of the government (which is why the guys arrested at the end of the last chapter were bailed out immediately).

Erpy
Jan 30, 2015
(insert title here)
It was possible, btw, to at least enter the premises of the MacDowell estate before. (though not the actual home) I believe that while you were doing the subquest with the cat that Ryu and Anri found (that was secretly adopted by Sunita without Bond and Creil being aware), it was possible to enter the gate and knock on the door of the MacDowell estate and the butler would answer the door and mention the kitten didn't seem familiar. The reason he didn't react to Elie's presence? Because while your party was facing the door, Elie "subtly" moved to the back of the group and hid behind the gateposts before Helmer could open the door and after he closes the door, she walks back up to the group before they could turn around.

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.

Z26. Secrets of Self-Defense

The first lesson for improving your self-defense is learning that you need it in the first place.

Erpy
Jan 30, 2015
(insert title here)
- Remiferia is DEFINITELY not like Spain. You've met a handful of people who were born there, like Lucy Seiland (the transfer student who was on the Jenis student council together with Kloe), Aeolia and one more prominent character in Zero. None of them would be mistaken for Hispanics.
- Scott's fiancee is the dark-haired receptionist of the Times Department store. You've definitely spoken to her before.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
- I don't know who the Thunder Bringer or Ocean Crasher are.
- Re: Derek's Ominous Food Stall: Things don't necessarily have to go wrong for them to be mentioned. Sometimes it's just background for NPC's to say because the dialogue has to update a lot.
- Kienz is the son of Dr. Gailey, head of Surgery at St. Ursula. So yes, one of the hallway brawlers
- Even a single Enigma unit is well out of the price range the delinquents can afford, never mind enough for all of them.
- Flash grenades are probably more within the price range of the delinqents.
- The Moonlight Butterflies recipe is learned pretty late in the game.
- I don't think Abbas is blind. Other blind characters get acknowledged as such. I think Falcom just liked Morpheus's pince-nez sunglasses.

Yes, talking to the NPC's in the game can be an issue because the size is so large. Falcom refines the formula of the games as they go on, and one thing which got refined after Crossbell was more consistency in dialogue updates, and reducing the amount of times you have essentially the entire world available for which dialogue updates are needed. It does still happen, but usually only in Finale chapters instead of 80% of the game like Zero/Azure.

Cyouni
Sep 30, 2014

without love it cannot be seen
The Church's "stupidest weapon in the game" functions probably not that far from an urumi.
You actually have spoken to Scott's fiancee, and gone "does your fiance actually exist" to her.

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.

Z27. The Wolfgrass Delivery

This quest did not end with Dr. Lago getting into another fistfight, with the Archbishop this time, and I feel this is a missed opportunity.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
- There were definitely a few choice NPC interactions here. I liked Lloyd getting information out of the bartender at Garante.
- The prison is right beside the police academy. Yeah, it's strange, but I don't think they wanted to make an additional road dungeon section. They're both the dot at the bottom. The one just south of the road is the gate leading into Knox Road.
- The dot on the left is Garellia Fortress. The one on the right is Altair city.
- Presumably spies caught attempting to travel from Erebonia into Calvard (or the other way around) are sent back to the country they came from, I don't think they just keep them all, although the prison IS bizarrely spacious for a place where foreign nationals don't really get jailed for many crimes.
- Randy's reputation for being good at combat is not hot air.
- I think Randy lied about being fired for being a womanizer possibly because giving the real reason would make people ask more questions which he'd rather not answer.
- Dahlia is referring to a different incident. The event from Cold Steel 1's prologue remains in the future.
- Not all maids and butlers are ninjas, it's just rare enough to be surprising when it actually happens. Take Lila from Sky, or any of the hotel maids, or Jusis's butler Arnaud, or the MacDowell estate staff - all normal.
- YOU CAN WALK INTO ILYA'S APARTMENT NOW? I didn't know that! Wow, I've never seen that place so clean.
- Dudley asking about "possible ties" is not unreasonable. He's the one asking questions, it's good practice to seem to know less than you do, and to not be inadvertently giving out what you do know by what you say when gathering information. I have no doubt Dudley talks to the Garante bartender, he has other contacts as well.
- Summon Zeit can do two things, a no-damage debuff (which does nothing once many enemies start being immune to everything) and damage + AT Delay. It can't fail, but sometimes you just can't use it at all.
- Poor Gaius. He gets a bird, but all everyone can remember was that Kloe already did the bird companion bit much better.
- How do I not rememeber the dance?
- Colin is 5.
- I think Harold is probably in Mainz.

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.
Hi! Hope you all have a good holiday season!


Z28. The Ideal of Justice

We go to the bank and learn more than we could have possibly wanted to know about Elie's strong friendship. Her incredibly powerful friendship. Her friendship that will throw you out the window if you don't shape up.

Prowler
May 24, 2004

Merry holidays!

I missed that scene with Joshua and Estelle. This series has a lot of faults, but one thing it tends to do well is build up side stories and side characters.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Ugh, Mariabell. Easily my least favorite character from the series for a whole list of reasons I won't get into. I can handle "evil and malicious" far better than I can handle "obnoxious"

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
- I'm not sure whether crystalization is a "real" disease in-universe or not (but I presume yes), since it's never come up outside of this novel.
- Indeed, Rosenberg studio is involved with many of the special effects used in Arc-en-Ciel productions.
- The First Division would likely be Crossbell's CIA if they had enough of a budget for it. They do keep tabs on all kinds of international stuff, but I don't think they go outside Crossbell State very much.
- There's also Emma the hotel maid in Zeiss who has too much energy.
- Ernest is at least 10 years older than Elie, and I don't think he has romantic feelings for her.
- I don't think Grace would get much out of Dudley, he's too sharp. She'd quickly get bored and leave.
- There are achievements for getting a million mira in the series, and your inventory definitely holds much more than that. They're not hard, you just get to the late game and trade in all your sepith, which should put you over the top. If not, sell your non-equipped quartz.
- The Crois sprites are certainly at least strawberry-blonde.
- Many character introductions start with the character at 11 before toning it down to more reasonable levels, to give a stronger impression. Mariabell does tone it down in future appearances, but I did not like her from her initial impression. Whether that was the intent of the writers or not, I leave to your imagination.
- I have no idea what Mariabell's mother is like, she's never mentioned, much like a lot of mothers in the series.
- There's an important quote from Trails in the Sky FC about justice:
-- Aina: ...There are as many forms of justice as there are stars in the heavens.

Rabbi Raccoon posted:

Ugh, Mariabell. Easily my least favorite character from the series for a whole list of reasons I won't get into. I can handle "evil and malicious" far better than I can handle "obnoxious"

I'm not a fan of her either, but I can think of several other characters I dislike more than her. She's not even my least favorite character from this game.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
I'm sure I know who beats her and that's absolutely fair

Mariabell is Penny from Inspector Gadget if she grew up to be one of these girls who says "I'm a bitch and I don't care; I own it"

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.
Hey, let's finish this thing. I put more detail in a YT community post but it's not too different from what I already posted here a while back. I'm feeling better again, sorry this one took so long.


Z29. Jona Sacred Has Committed No Crimes

The SSS will probably not be regaling their grandchildren with tales of this day's events.

Level 1 Thief fucked around with this message at 23:50 on Apr 23, 2024

Erpy
Jan 30, 2015
(insert title here)
- "Kitty" kinda already revealed herself last chapter (and it's exactly who you think it is) when she mentioned she was going to amuse herself by "messing with Freckles".
- By "gearing yourself up", the game means (but does not say) something along the lines of "make sure you have deathblow accessories unlike you enjoy cursing at the Random Number God".

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
Just in time to finish my playthrough of the "official" version

Mariabell is the anti-Penny from Inspector Gadget and no one can convince me otherwise

Prowler
May 24, 2004

Welcome back!

I love the trope in RPGs where enemies waste a turn hurting themselves, taunting (with no gameplay impact), fighting amongst themselves, etc.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender
After March rolled around, I sincerely had expected that 28 was going to be the last video.

- Elliot can't do that. The key word used was "Aeon system," which is something Tio has specifically.
- "Is this a server or a coffin?" I can kinda see the resemblance to a coffin, but I think it's just decoration.
- Crossbell's diet has become pretty partisan and deadlocked in recent years, cutting the number of laws which actually get passed a lot. That combined with the fact that the orbal network is still in the testing stage is one reason why laws against hacking haven't passed yet.
- There were only new scenes with Grace and Ernest because they were coming out of the IBC when the plot sent the SSS in.
- It's pretty funny having Shion say "be careful with that key, we've lost it a few times already," because spoiler alert - Lloyd never gets around to returning it.
- The trick with speed-running is not just bee-lining for the fastest mandatory stuff possible, but knowing what optional stuff you can get which ultimately will help you beat the game faster.

- At least one of those locked doors in the start of Geofront B is for (more trivia than spoiler) the NG+ only bonus dungeon. It's not recommended for a first-time playthrough because the enemies inside give so much XP it'll unbalance the intended difficulty for the final chapter.
- Pom Pom Party is a real minigame (beginning in Azure) which I'm told is a clone of someting called Puyo Puyo.

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.

Erpy posted:

- By "gearing yourself up", the game means (but does not say) something along the lines of "make sure you have deathblow accessories unlike you enjoy cursing at the Random Number God".

I can't check the recording right now, but I believe Deathblow fans should be pretty happy coming up.

Prowler posted:

I love the trope in RPGs where enemies waste a turn hurting themselves, taunting (with no gameplay impact), fighting amongst themselves, etc.

FF13 had an interesting take on it where some encounters would be two factions of enemies in the middle of battling with each other. The idea was that you'd pick the more dangerous side to take out while they're on the back foot, though more often than not every enemy would just immediately target you when you got into the fray.

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

- Elliot can't do that. The key word used was "Aeon system," which is something Tio has specifically.

All Mariabell said was "orbal staff" so I choose to believe Elliot is holding back due to his self esteem issues (and Emma was keeping it secret, of course).

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

- Pom Pom Party is a real minigame (beginning in Azure) which I'm told is a clone of someting called Puyo Puyo.

So we didn't actually get one called Puyo Puyo until Puyo Puyo Tetris in 2017, but they'd made a few attempts to bring it over before. The most notable ones you might've heard of were Dr. Robotnik's Mean Bean Machine (Genesis/MD) and Kirby's Avalanche (SNES). They also tried to market it as Puyo Pop around the early DS days but it didn't catch on.

Admiral H. Curtiss
May 11, 2010

I think there are a bunch of people who can create trailing images. I know some who could do this as if they were just going out for a stroll.

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

- Pom Pom Party is a real minigame (beginning in Azure) which I'm told is a clone of someting called Puyo Puyo.

I really despise this minigame and I really hope they won't bring it back in any more games. It's like a bad combination of Panel de Pon and Puyo Puyo (which are both great puzzle games!) that completely misses the point of either, and on top of that it's extremely colorblind-unfriendly because all tiles are only differentiated by color.

And yes, I realize that you can't expect a minigame in a giant JRPG to have the same level of depth as an actual standalone puzzle game but ugh, it just feels impossible to set up any intentional combos in it and that pulls the entire fun out of this type of game.

claw game handjob
Mar 27, 2007

pinch pinch scrape pinch
ow ow fuck it's caught
i'm bleeding
JESUS TURN IT OFF
WHY ARE YOU STILL SMILING
As a longtime Puyo sicko I cannot wait to encounter this and, if it's as bad as this sounds, savage it.

Stabbey_the_Clown
Sep 21, 2002

Are... are you quite sure you really want to say that?
Taco Defender

Admiral H. Curtiss posted:

I really despise this minigame and I really hope they won't bring it back in any more games. It's like a bad combination of Panel de Pon and Puyo Puyo (which are both great puzzle games!) that completely misses the point of either, and on top of that it's extremely colorblind-unfriendly because all tiles are only differentiated by color.

And yes, I realize that you can't expect a minigame in a giant JRPG to have the same level of depth as an actual standalone puzzle game but ugh, it just feels impossible to set up any intentional combos in it and that pulls the entire fun out of this type of game.

It sincerely feels like victory or defeat is entirely luck-based - regardless of the supposed escalating difficulty of your opponents. In one game, you can pull off a bunch of excellent clears and build up points and drop lots of blocks on your opponent... to no effect, yet in another game, you can struggle through and bumble, not getting much cleared at all, only to unexpectedly be greeted with the victory screen.

Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

the seven tools of a detective:

-recipe book
-cellphone strap
-dog whispering
-fishing pole
-hot-blooded courage
-ancient weapons of mass destruction
-maid costume

Cyouni
Sep 30, 2014

without love it cannot be seen

Stabbey_the_Clown posted:

It sincerely feels like victory or defeat is entirely luck-based - regardless of the supposed escalating difficulty of your opponents. In one game, you can pull off a bunch of excellent clears and build up points and drop lots of blocks on your opponent... to no effect, yet in another game, you can struggle through and bumble, not getting much cleared at all, only to unexpectedly be greeted with the victory screen.

I feel like pre-Reverie I had much more control over the outcome.

After Reverie my wins became much more hit or miss.

Rabbi Raccoon
Mar 31, 2009

I stabbed you dude!
One thing I wasn't a fan of was how ingrained the minigames became to completion as the series went on. Vantage Masters, Pom Party, all that. Hell, even cooking. Sure, put stuff behind it, but don't make it 25% of the game.

Fishing (barely) gets a pass for being so easy after Cold Steel II

Level 1 Thief
Dec 17, 2007

I'm busy, and I'm having fun.

Z30. (Another) Afternoon in Crossbell

Look, the stall's right in the middle of a major street. We can't assume that Lilly didn't see anything. Thoroughness is next to godliness.

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Hwurmp
May 20, 2005

A lot of earlier Falcom games have that sort of fucky animation for anything spinning in a circle. Instead of actually rotating an object, they'll just keep it static and slap a bunch of animated sliding textures on it. Nayuta takes place in a lost city full of giant magical gears and they're all like that.

No, I don't know why.

e: Lou is Sergei's last name

Hwurmp fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Apr 30, 2024

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