Earwicker posted:

to be fair, while part of that is due to Amsterdam's superior infrastructure and engineering, there's also the fact that it's completely flat while SF has a bunch of steep hills in the middle of it, which adds to the difficulty in both urban planning and biking.

also biking in Amsterdam can still be pretty drat stressful at times, even if not as deadly as in an American city. the sheer volume of bikes on the road especially in rush hour traffic can be overwhelming. biking in the Dutch countryside however is amazing.