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Maybe "cap" isn't the right word cause it's like climate change in that hotter is worse and at some point it's too hot to sustain human life, let alone civilization. If you use enough energy you would raise the average surface temperature of the earth to 100C, but its clear we'd go extinct long before that point. It's mostly useful as a sort of proof that the exponential growth demanded by capital is physically impossible to sustain, even for someone wildly optimistic enough to think climate change will be "solved" before things get too bad. edit: I guess if you wanted to imagine a cap it would be capturing and putting to productive use every last watt of solar energy that reaches the Earth's atmosphere. You'd somehow have to do this while also sustaining the biosphere within that energy budget. If you are using more energy than that, you're adding heat to the system and raising the surface temperature of the planet. bawfuls has issued a correction as of 22:31 on May 19, 2023 |
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May 19, 2023 22:19
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consider a frictionless society in a vacuum
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May 19, 2023 22:20
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yeah pretty much. The point is that even if you imagine a perfect energy source like scifi-fusion, exponential growth still results in an unlivable planet within like 400 years. sorry if you don't like my dumb nerd thought experiments, I can't help having engineer-brain
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May 19, 2023 22:28
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bawfuls posted:engineer-brain came to post this
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May 19, 2023 23:15
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it is sadly incurable but if you bully them enough and do some clockwork orange-style humanities education on us you can make engineers do productive things like design safer buildings or more efficient desalination plants instead of bigger bombs and faster jets
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May 19, 2023 23:28
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Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:what's the cap? earth receives an amount of energy X from the sun. it dissipates an amount of energy Y into space. it also stores an amount of energy Z in the form of plants, animals, coal, oil, wind, etc. X / Y+Z = A must be at most 1. that's the cap. if it's more than 1, temperature increases. because these are processes, the problem isn't the amount of humans--like all life, humans are a way for earth to store and dissipate energy. the problem is that capitalism, as a process, relentlessly digs up and burns the energy storages in order to increase profit, thus decreasing Z, a side effect of which is also decreasing Y. this makes A some humongous number instead of 1, a bit like putting the lid on a pot of water on a stove while cranking up the heat. but even with perfect magic energy technology, there would still be a bound on how much energy can be produced: X - Y+Z.
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May 19, 2023 23:32
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Honestly I think a future where there isn't the energy surplus required to have things like 300 different varieties of pasta sauce and a litany of disposable plastic poo poo doesn't sound that bad. And I don't mean to sound insensitive to all the vulnerable people in the world who will suffer proportionately greater consequences of energy scarcity but I would look forward to living in a world with less consumer excess. edit: but deep down I know I'm getting a fascist hellscape instead but I can at least dream a little about a more simple, idyllic life Kibbles n Shits has issued a correction as of 23:47 on May 19, 2023 |
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May 19, 2023 23:36
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Cuttlefush posted:i dont think the problem is even doomposting. it's stupid rear end posters who can't read or think good. like kibbles just misread f stop's post completely to post a stupid quip imo everyone wants the same thing here: a sustainable earth with the people on it living good lives that they can enjoy without exception. may never get there but it's worth pursuing as a species. problem is people don't really think about how to get from A->B too much while advocating for a serious decline in the people who are an important part of how we get to B.
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May 20, 2023 00:48
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so how many people need to die so i can keep my washing machine. just a thought experiment haha
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May 20, 2023 01:48
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:so how many people need to die so i can keep my washing machine. just a thought experiment haha If it's a rich guy only one.
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May 20, 2023 01:56
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:so how many people need to die so i can keep my washing machine. just a thought experiment haha how many kids does it take to make up for the labor saved by one washing machine
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May 20, 2023 02:18
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bawfuls posted:it is sadly incurable but if you bully them enough and do some clockwork orange-style humanities education on us you can make engineers do productive things like design safer buildings or more efficient desalination plants instead of bigger bombs and faster jets lmao at your avatar
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May 20, 2023 02:28
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i dont care what engineers do as long as it isn't applying their engineer brain to completely different topics with a stubborn desire to oversimplify and never ready up on what they're trying to turn into an engineering problem saying clockwork orange humanities education means you should just leave it alone though. it's not a humanities thing at all. you can definitely back of the napkin "what kind of energy use could we get away with per person if some of the huge inefficiencies weren't as inefficient". it's been done plenty. it's actually pretty amenable to the kind of analysis engineers get schooled in. the problem with engineer brain is that engineer brains dont go look that kind of poo poo up. at some point they just go "yeah im good i can analyze anything with my toolkit as is. probably better off not reading anything about it first. dont want the taint of prior work upon my thought experiments." not saying you did that. just... that's what engineer brain tends to do with problems outside of their field. so beware.
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May 20, 2023 02:49
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I’m saying you need to force engineers to also take humanities and social science courses in school so they gain a basic understanding of the world around them and develop things like ethics and a moral sense of duty to their community this is helpful in reducing the number of them that are cool with making weapons and giant forest-eating machines like in Fern Gully or whatever engineers are afflicted by an obsession with efficiency and you need to give them some social grounding so that they ask themselves “wait to what end am I trying to make this process more efficient exactly?” bawfuls has issued a correction as of 04:52 on May 20, 2023 |
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May 20, 2023 04:50
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oh, no. i dont think that's the problem at all with engineer-brain. also sincerely doubt that is how someone can develop ethics or morals. also not all engineers have engineer-brain. just the ones that do.
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May 20, 2023 04:51
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I didn’t say THE problem it’s just A problem with engineers. And shoving their noses into fields beyond their expertise is certainly not limited to engineers, it’s pretty common among many specialized fields. People joke about it with doctors all the time (famous marks for financial scams). The only engineers I’ve ever met who didn’t have engineer-brain ended up not being engineers eventually. They end up in management or leave the field all together. bawfuls has issued a correction as of 05:00 on May 20, 2023 |
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May 20, 2023 04:54
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babies are pure though. more babies, fewer engineers.
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May 20, 2023 04:58
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looking at this guy's posts im becoming sympathetic to what pol pot must've been dealing with
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May 20, 2023 05:08
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croup coughfield posted:looking at this guy's posts im becoming sympathetic to what pol pot must've been dealing with he geniunely thought he could do socailism by copying stalin, tahts kind of tight
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May 20, 2023 05:10
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https://twitter.com/Votto007/status/1658668772788432899 
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May 20, 2023 05:12
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wasn't pol pot an op
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May 20, 2023 05:22
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Even outside of socialist scientists and engineers there are tons of examples of people who understood there is a greater good. Only American ones seem to make excuses for themselves.
AnimeIsTrash has issued a correction as of 17:41 on May 20, 2023 |
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May 20, 2023 17:10
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for each baby born, the least productive engineer will be executed. this is called stack ranking, and engineers love that poo poo anyway
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May 20, 2023 17:38
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Okay I changed my mind again, people should be alive
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May 20, 2023 20:21
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Crazypoops posted:Okay I changed my mind again, people should be alive Thankfully, we are all immortal here on the SomethingAwful forums, because you cannot kill that which has no life.
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May 20, 2023 20:29
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SorePotato posted:Im the chad childless father and youre the virgin Pussy Toucher
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May 20, 2023 21:36
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Koishi Komeiji posted:Onion Kelly cartoon with a school shooter standing in an empty classroom crying lady liberty behind him "Huh? Guess I'll just go home then"
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May 20, 2023 21:37
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SorePotato posted:natalist horseshoe theory
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May 20, 2023 21:40
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AnimeIsTrash posted:how do you make a child?
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May 20, 2023 22:05
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Pepe Silvia Browne posted:i'm antinatalist because my dick is too big to have sex sorry
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May 20, 2023 22:10
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F Stop Fitzgerald posted:the most badass anti natalists are the ones who clearly just have clinical depression and resent their parents for having been born
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May 20, 2023 22:18
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PsychoInternetHawk posted:When you give birth to a kid, they're gonna eventually die. But if they're never born they'll never die either. So you plan for a pregnancy you're committing murder in the first degree but if the condom breaks it's just manslaughter.
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May 20, 2023 22:19
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I’m not an antinatalist but I am subject to it because I can’t realistically afford children or give a child a good life, thus I don’t have children
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May 20, 2023 22:28
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being pregnant is the same as being fat. thumbs down for me
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May 20, 2023 22:30
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bawfuls posted:I’m saying you need to force engineers to also take humanities and social science courses in school so they gain a basic understanding of the world around them and develop things like ethics and a moral sense of duty to their community ive met more than a few 'leftists' who machine parts for bombs lol if you bring it up you get some version of "oh what? so leftists cant have jobs now??"
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May 20, 2023 22:34
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people gotta eat
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May 21, 2023 00:14
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croup coughfield posted:people gotta eat - Cormac McCarthy, The Road
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May 21, 2023 00:28
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Fat-Lip-Sum-41.mp3 posted:- Cormac McCarthy, The Road No I'm pretty sure that's "gotta eat people"
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May 21, 2023 00:31
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people who want to have children should, people who don't shouldn't be forced to existing owns though, hellscape or not
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May 21, 2023 04:28
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Stinky Wizzleteats posted:The only real good reason to be anti natalist is if there is a prophecy one among your offspring shall usurp and overthrow you have hundreds of children so they spend all their time plotting against one another, at least that way when you go down you can be confident it was to someone worthy
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May 21, 2023 04:42
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