Trad Games and TGR suggestions, feedback, and community thread

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Trad Games and TGR suggestions, feedback, and community thread

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Fajita Queen posted:

It is not even remotely difficult to say "if you want to talk about or post AI content do it in debate and discussion instead" and then enforce that, if you are not bad at moderating. This does not need to be more complicated than that, it is helping nobody.

We are not going to ban discussion of ai on the something awful forums.

# ¿ Jun 13, 2023 06:07

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# ¿ May 15, 2024 01:03

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

PurpleXVI posted:

I see you're still not engaging with why one of the two is theft and the other is not. Copying a .jpeg is not theft, copying a .jpeg and then using it for raw materials in a commercial product without consent or attribution, is.

So yes, I think everyone here would be happier if you copied a .jpeg you googled up and sourced it.

copying a jpg is in fact copyright infringement lol

nearly everything on this forum is copyright infringement including all quotes, and nearly all images. that doesn't mean there aren't some murky issues with the legality of AI stuff, but they absolutely pale in comparison with the routine infringement we all take for granted.

# ¿ Jun 13, 2023 13:41

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

ravenkult posted:

The entire AI thread in TG is currently going "lol those IDIOT MORON LUDDITES in the feedback thread suck poo poo" but you don't see me being a tattletale.

This is nonsense.

# ¿ Jun 13, 2023 21:50

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Quit the sniping. This issue has been thoroughly canvassed, leper and anti v have put together an approach that takes painstaking efforts to recognize all the sides, and now we can give it some time, please.

# ¿ Jun 13, 2023 23:30

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Yes. Nothing has changed in how we decide whether someone can keep posting on these forums.

# ¿ Jul 3, 2023 00:04

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Ominous Jazz posted:

You should be meaner to the user base here because look at their posting

gonna just ban everyone soon, just checkin with jeff

# ¿ Jul 7, 2023 15:00

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

whydirt posted:

Just chiming in to say that I stopped reading the MTG thread because of Toshimo and similar folks running rampant with hostile/aggro posting with no repercussions.

I�m happy to approve a more rigorous set of �please shut up� probes because of this kind of thing, we are all here to post together in nerdhood, not flip out like assholes.

# ¿ Sep 11, 2023 11:26

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Feels Villeneuve posted:

it is also low stakes. a 6 hour probation isnt something which needs too much explanation and nobody should think it is a big deal.

It is absolutely a fact that the most insane inbox-filling freakouts all come from sixers

Spanish Manlove posted:

I don't find the MTG threads enjoyable to post in. I love MTG and wish I could have fun talking about it.

Ok, so I went about 20 pages back in the mtg thread and I'm really not seeing this unreadable pit of toxicity. It's nerds talking about cards. caring about them a lot; possibly too much? Not for me to judge. Cards are important.

Framboise made roughly the right call, which is all an ik can reasonably be expected to do, and toshimo can consider himself on notice to chill out going forward as he clearly gets people's backs up.

Pm me if you think there's bad behaviour that's going unnoticed.

# ¿ Sep 12, 2023 20:34

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

kalel posted:

the main mtg thread is currently fine and is a lot better from even six months ago

the commander-specific MTG thread, however, was a toxic cesspit last I checked

This is like that scene in the horror movie when the guy checks out the noise and it's nothing and relaxes then looks in the mirror

E: no, phew, the commander one is the thread I looked at. I'm just not seeing it, if I'm just being dumb feel free to pm me what I've missed.

# ¿ Sep 12, 2023 20:44

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Feels Villeneuve posted:

this is technically true but i mean more in the sense that like - other people in the thread or whatever shouldn't really be freaking out if someone gets a cool-off timeout for getting too mad at the MTG Modern banlist or whatever, and there's really not much need for an IK to hem and haw over giving someone a time-out.

100% yes, it's just a funny mod truism

# ¿ Sep 12, 2023 20:48

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Framboise posted:

I meant what I said when I said I would be more strict on hostile posting in the future though. Even though I've decided to step down as IK I'll be making a point of reporting what I see, when I see it.

yes, there's a clear message from this thread that hostile posting is driving people away so report it, pm me if it's not being addressed, and if you are personally feisty please dial it back or there will be consequences.

# ¿ Sep 12, 2023 22:09

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Tarnop posted:

He was thread banned from Path of Exile video game thread for recommending unplayable builds

he made his own PMF thread for posting terrible builds into the ether

# ¿ Sep 13, 2023 01:12

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Fantastic Foreskin posted:

Rutibex (at least as I heard it) demanded to be perma'd because people wouldn't believe current AI is sentient.

Honestly I'm not sure where that falls on the rankings of crazy goons. Probably not especially high, tbh.

that is correct, and i'd say it's at least up there

# ¿ Sep 13, 2023 03:53

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Fuego Fish posted:

Genuinely I do not know. The first time I tried to refute those accusations I ate a sixer for my trouble, so I just put her on ignore and trusted that everyone else wouldn't automatically trust her word that I was the next Hitler.

You just made me read an irc log from 2016 where you joked about spear chucking jungle bunnies.

I�m gonna close up this thread for a bit, i think any pressing tg drama can wait until tomorrow, or next year or whenever.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2023 08:47

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

traditional games has been temporarily renamed to keep it in line with ISO standards.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2023 00:20

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

fr0id posted:

This is a unique subforum. It is one that anyone outside of the culture would think (d&d, board games, Magic the Gathering, and warhammer painting) would be the most easy going forum possible, outside of maybe magic.

I am asking for extra accountability from you because in my experience of the past few years people have felt like you are not doing anything when you have in fact been doing so. Again, if someone should get a PM from a mod, they should get a sixer imo. It’s not a black mark. Any personal mod action outside a post should get a sixer.

You’re asking why I think this should be outside regular SA rules. I am going to give you some mean advice but something I am basing 2-3 years of feedback on that I’ve read.

First, leperflesh, you work very hard and it’s very obvious. You have stuck around very long because everyone respects that. You really try.

Second: you are Wishy washy about almost everything. Like the board game thread. We had two new users one of whom everyone hated and you decided the best action was a new ik that lead to one of our best posters leaving. That was a wrong decision entirely on you that you need to deal with. If you had just forum banned the user that all the thread regulars hated, that would not have happened. They still post to this day btw. None of their posts add anywhere near the value that the actual board game designer did. YOU hosed THAT UP. THATS ALL YOU. I’m doing all caps because I’m loving angry that you being wishy washy lost us a literal game design god.

And yes. Leperflesh. You should feel like you lost us those posters. You did. Bad modding. Lack of support. And knowing not to give them Modship in the first place.

Third: again just loving document every mod action you take. And do it publicly. Like it’s not much to ask. Document every pm.

This is pompous nonsense lol. decisions are made by consensus and after consultation, there aren't any mods going crazy at the switch.

And no we aren't going to start sixering people whenever we pm them that's insane.

To be clear there are any number of people posting in this thread right now who could easily be banned on the standards being proposed (aggressive, annoying, long rap sheets), but we aren't going to because they also often post well, make funny, thoughtful, good posts.

That's what this place is, it's a machine for making good posts.

When the balance shifts enough, sure, then they have to go. But until that time mods will keep doing what they can to foster good posts and deal with bad ones, whether that's comments, probes or pms.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2023 08:57

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Ominous Jazz posted:

It really feels like every time the moderation staff here get any sort of feedback they read it in the worst possible light and insist that actually things are fine the way they are. Give more sixers about aggro posting. Nobody except the very worst this board has been cultivating through inaction will be mad about that. Don't overthink it.

Yeah this is going to happen, feedback from the thread is clear and it's a reasonable and appropriate change.

# ¿ Sep 17, 2023 20:03

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

fr0id posted:

First, I apologize for being too aggro myself with leperflesh. Like I said in that post, myself and folks around here respect you and the work you do. I was being a pompous rear end.

I brought up the whole thing with Mayveena because it was a case that in my opinion showed that the mods not being harder on someone that resulted in far better posters leaving. I don�t want that whole thing to be relitigated, but just want to note that it�s a case of what I think was a bad outcome that, it could be argued, could have easily been avoided through stronger mod action.

As far as documenting every PM, what I meant was that when someone makes a post warranting a �knock it off� PM, to accompany it with a sixer. A multiple PM conversation or the contents of that conversation have no need to be documented. Neither do PMs that aren�t related to specific post issues. Leperflesh mentioned that they document notable actions taken or decisions made in some of the mod tools, so I was going off of that. Leperflesh also has said in the past they prefer to resolve stuff through PMs, so this is kind of a personal recommendation that if they do that it helps to have a sixer to show the community something was done.

Leperflesh also mentioned that they see a flaw with the probation system being that the person might be asleep during the probe. I think that reflects a fundamental disagreement on what a sixer means. A sixer, in my opinion, is not usually a time out like you would give a toddler, where the poster must frustratedly wait before being allowed to have fun again. A sixer is instead, as others have said, a cool off period to stop an argument, a firm reminder of what the rules are if they�re broken, a way to document a mod having to edit something out of a post, or sometimes just a goof. Myself and others want leperflesh to be more liberal with probations because in most cases they�re not punishing people for posting, they�re just reminding them of the rules or stopping silly arguments.

Edit: posted before seeing what sebmojo said. Sounds good, then!

Also, again, I apologize for going off on leperflesh in my previous post. It was uncalled for.

Thanks. Shall we draw a line under this topic? Message received about slanting moderation more towards visible probes rather than less visible forum management, and I'm always happy to get pms if you think reports are being ignored (I can't guarantee I'll agree with you, but I'll listen)

# ¿ Sep 17, 2023 21:33

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

sasha_d3ath posted:

I think the modmins should be allowed to push the button that hatches all the ant eggs in every modem and floods the users' houses

oh that button (laughs politely) do you take me for a villain in a Republic serial

# ¿ Sep 17, 2023 23:29

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Tekopo posted:

if I get a cool-off sixer that ruins my perfect, spotless, 15-year old rap sheet, i'm declaring vendetta on that mod, admin, or ik

I have a monkey paw that just turned into a tiny blackened fist

# ¿ Sep 19, 2023 20:03

sebmojo: Oct 23, 2010; Legit Cyberpunk

Raenir Salazar posted:

It'd be nice if "cool off" sixers didn't stay on the rap sheet.

I think the important thing that if it's a cool off sixers it should be clear, "take a break" or similar doesn't imply that you did something wrong on its own, but that it just happened to be the straw that broke the camels back. While if it's unclear then I have no idea what I'm supposed to do with this information, did I do something wrong? Was there a better combination of words that wouldn't have been wrong? Was the buttons pushed because of some other reason? Some sixers I've gotten were like this and factor into me deciding not to post in a particular thread because that's basically the message I got, and if I remember correctly PMing the mod for clarification didn't clarify things. Ultimately I stopped going there because it was toxic af but the random sixers were the straw that broke the humpy Cr 1/8 creatures back.

So that'd be the tldr, sixers that feel like the weather suck, be clear, maybe try to de-escalate first "hey people cool down a little please" if it doesn't seem urgent though but ultimately distinguish between a "don't do this specifically thing" and a "take a break" so the intent is clearly communicated.

Fwiw this is exactly the opposite message from the recent course of the thread, which has been saying don't de escalate, jump straight to probations lol

# ¿ Sep 19, 2023 20:05